Scream 4!!!!! - Part 4

[bullets]

It is starting to get tiresome to keep seeing these three characters live again and again.It could be the thing that kills the franchise.

That's why I wouldn't mind seeing a new group of characters. I'm starting to feel too bad for Sidney. Imagine everyone you know getting killed in a murder spree every couple of years.

 

[DACrowe]

It is starting to get tiresome to keep seeing these three characters live again and again.It could be the thing that kills the franchise.

I don't think it will "kill the franchise." Four films is a good run, especially when three of them were actually good (even if the first is the only truly great one). I think you are on the right track though. Keeping the same three protagonists as untouchable for five films is boring and takes away suspense. You can get away with that lack of suspense in, say, Star Wars or a superhero movie. But a horror/suspense franchise? It's a problem. People forget that after SM1 it wasn't a "trio" but the original/final four. Randy was right up there with those three until he got it in a van in Scream 2. That made the rest of the movie more suspenseful (and also plodding a little, as it lost its fun, IMO).

Anyway, the options are to kill them off, not focus on them at all or repeat them surviving....again. Neither of those sound appealing for a fifth film. If they've survived four times, it would feel wrong to see one of them die now--think killing off Laurie Strode in the first 10-15 minutes of Halloween 8.

That's why I think it may just be time to put the series to bed. I loved Scream 4, but I think it's time to let it all rest.

 

[Homer J. Fong]

That's why I think it may just be time to put the series to bed. I loved Scream 4, but I think it's time to let it all rest.

Yes, that. There is a solution that doesn't involve killing off Sidney, or Dewey, or Gale, or any combination of these, or all of these, or bringing in a new cast of replacements, and it's this: Leave it alone. I thought this before Scream 4, and I was actually proven wrong, but I really don't think there's anything left to say. Okay, 4 was a satire of/commentary on remakes, and a skewering of a youth culture that's perhaps-dangerously obsessed with being famous - not with earning stardom for any sort of talent, but just for being famous. That was great, and it was all executed very well. So now what? We've had this series take on formulaic slasher flicks, formulaic sequels, trilogies, remakes, and itself, so where could we possibly go from here? I have no clue - if Kevin Williamson does have a great idea, cool, but I feel like by this point, that is a big If, and the last thing I want to see is this franchise, which has stayed creatively intact more or less, go downhill into utter formula drivel. "Utter formula drivel" in this case probably wouldn't mean the same thing "utter formula drivel" means in the case of, say, the Halloween or Friday the 13th franchises; what it would surely mean for the Scream franchise is being overly clever to the point of desperate, repetitive preciousness. (I thought the opening of 4 was a little too clever.) Look, it's easy to suggest that someone in the big three needs to die, and I get it - it was originally the big four, and Randy's death was a brutal, heartbreaking, and truly shocking game-changer, so I see why one would want a similar throwing-down-the-gauntlet move. I see why one might be disappointed that none of our principles bit the bullet in 4. I, however, was hugely relieved. I'll be yet another to point out how unique the Scream series is in that it has three principle characters that return in each installment, and that we actually have a real investment in, and that have actually developed. I know them. I like them. Actually, Scream 4 leaving all three of them alive? THAT was the film subverting expectations; most of us expected at least one of them, probably Sid, to meet their end, and this time the only one that didn't face a close call was Dewey. I don't want to see any of them killed off simply for the sake of doing something shocking and killing them off. More than that, I don't want to see Scream 5 - so, I guess, if there is one, I just won't.

 

[Matt]

I don't think it will "kill the franchise." Four films is a good run, especially when three of them were actually good (even if the first is the only truly great one). I think you are on the right track though. Keeping the same three protagonists as untouchable for five films is boring and takes away suspense. You can get away with that lack of suspense in, say, Star Wars or a superhero movie. But a horror/suspense franchise? It's a problem. People forget that after SM1 it wasn't a "trio" but the original/final four. Randy was right up there with those three until he got it in a van in Scream 2. That made the rest of the movie more suspenseful (and also plodding a little, as it lost its fun, IMO).

Anyway, the options are to kill them off, not focus on them at all or repeat them surviving....again. Neither of those sound appealing for a fifth film. If they've survived four times, it would feel wrong to see one of them die now--think killing off Laurie Strode in the first 10-15 minutes of Halloween 8.

That's why I think it may just be time to put the series to bed. I loved Scream 4, but I think it's time to let it all rest.

Well said.

 

[The Dark Defender]

It breaks my heart to see a series I once loved end like this. A year ago I would've thought it impossible to ever hate a Scream film as much as I do Scream 4.

I'd like them to make another one if for nothing else just so the series doesn't go out in such a disgraceful way, but I'm not really convinced they'll improve much anyway unless Kevin does all of the writing.

It's obvious that all Wes or Kruger are capable of doing with a Scream script is a ridiculous, unfunny parody of Kevin's style that doesn't even remotely stand up as a genuine horror film.
This is the worst movie of the year for me, and it takes a hell of alot for me to say that in a year that I saw a Michael Bay Transformers film.

I think they're 2 and 2...not all that great of an overall run. Whatever good the first two did they've very effectively run into the ground like a railroad spike since.

 

[DACrowe]

I cannot fathom how anyone could prefer Scream 3 to Scream 4 (Scream 2 I can understand, but 4 is a lot more fun and less uneven) for anything other than nostalgia, but to each their own.

Just FYI, one of Williamson's drafts of Scream 4 is online and it is honestly inferior to the finished film, but is still the template of almost everything you see in the final film....only worse. So, if you disliked Scream 4, I doubt KW will save a fifth installment for you, as S4 was his movie as well.

 

[The Dark Defender]

I can't fathom how anybody can dislike Scream 3 because it's too silly and meta and lacks what made the first two great, then say they love Scream 4.

Perhaps it is, I know the script leaked online but haven't read it, I just know that the first two were great and the two since which (based on the shooting scripts anyway) he didn't write range from bad to terrible.

I figured Scream 4 would offer more of what I loved about the first two, instead it just gave me more of what I already disliked about Scream 3 10 fold.
I can't stress enough just how much this feels like a silly SNL skit of a movie. 3 does too, but not THIS bad. I don't find a bunch of unfunny jokes (including even turning deaths into an excuse to cram more stupid jokes into a film) or bland characters (which in Scream, even includes Sidney) to be 'fun' at all.

And trust me, 3 doesn't have much nostalgic value for me at all since I've never really liked it. Saying it's better than this isn't saying it's good, it's just saying they f***** up less.
I don't think a film has ever pissed me off so much in my entire life. Craven pissed on everything he good he did with the first two here.

 

[Marx]

I think Scream 4 is the best one since the original and I am a long-time Scream fan.

 

[Punisher Rising]

I found Scream 4 much better than 2 and 3 combined. 2 has grown on me and I think it's decent but it still suffers from being too long and slow-paced and lacking the energy of the original, and 3 suffers from being not only too long and slow but also goofy and silly, almost like a Looney Tunes version of Scream. Scream 4 for me was very back to basics as to what made the first one so great for me. I think the long gap between 3 and 4 really gave the crew time to craft a solid script and not rush the movie as they clearly did with 2 and 3.

 

[Matt Mortem]

I think Scream 4 is the best one since the original and I am a long-time Scream fan.

Same here

 

[The Dark Defender]

The only way I can understand someone loving Scream 4 is if they wanted Scream to be what a good version of Scary Movie would've been like...actually scratch that, I still can't understand because Scream 4 wasn't funny, it just wanted to be.
Other than a little bit during the opening, none of the excessively stupid "humor" even got a chuckle out of me, and I think Spongebob episodes could do a better job of keeping me on the edge of my seat if we're looking at the so called suspense/thriller aspect.

I still remember how awestruck I was with the awesomeness of the first two when I saw them in theaters, comparing that feeling to the feeling I had leaving this is the finest example of how far the mighy can fall that I've ever seen in cinema.

I really can't believe people like this thing so much, especially considering the reasons most dislike Scream 3.

 

[Marx]

I'm not quite sure how Scream 4 wanted to be funny. They did what they do best - lampoon the horror industry. It looked like Scream and it truly felt like Scream.

 

[The Dark Defender]

If you're having people say "**** Bruce Willis!" and "Uh, you can't kill me, I'm gay!" WHILE dying, you're trying to be funny...all that idiotic Alison Brie dialogue was trying desperately to be funny, and wasn't at all, same with the stupid American Pie style lemon square rant by Marley Shelton, the goofy Tropic Thunder style opening (and they actually shot a genuinally good horror opening, but didn't use it because they wanted to go with the "funny" one)...

They didn't lampoon the horror industry very well at all except for the two remake references toward the end, they spent most of the movie just turning the whole thing into one big self parody.

This is Stab, it's not Scream.

If Scream 5 does get made, I think they'd have to be consciously trying to make a bad movie for it to be worse than this, and it still wouldn't be easy.
Scream 4 is a film that reached the lowest possible point for its series and said "You know what, we need to find a way to keep digging!"

 

[The Joker]

I don't find Scream 4 as good as 1 and 2, but it's leaps and bounds better than 3 for me.

 

[DACrowe]

I can't fathom how anybody can dislike Scream 3 because it's too silly and meta and lacks what made the first two great, then say they love Scream 4.

Well I'll give it a shot!

-S3 tried to be both funny and scary, but was neither (S4 at least was very humorous and entertaining, even if you don't think it was scary).

-S3's chase scenes felt by-the-numbers, dull and like Wes Craven was bored by the whole process--which he was. He made Scream 3 solely to get financing for Music From the Heart. At least in S4 there was an edge to scenes like when Olivia died or the Kirby-Charlie scene that left audiences literally upset that she died. Which leads to....

-S3's new characters were all dull and vapid characters that while witty parodies of Hollywood archetypes (sleazy/hedonist producer, whiny-hack director, self-centered diva movie star, two-faced ingenue, etc.) were utterly boring and unlikable thus making them dying pointless and uninvolving. While Trevor and Olivia weren't ones to write home about, Kirby was the first sequel-created character who lived up to the original cast and then there's Jill and Charlie....

-S3's villain motive relied on a Days of Our Lives revelation in that Sid had a long-lost half-brother who is evil and wants to kill her....and who then retconned the near-perfect first film by revealing he manipulated Billy and Stu into killing Maureen, frame Cotton and then everything else. Meanwhile, Jill had the best motive since Scream 1 in being the poster child of the Facebook/Twitter/Jersey Shore/Kardashian/Me Generation.

Perhaps it is, I know the script leaked online but haven't read it, I just know that the first two were great and the two since which (based on the shooting scripts anyway) he didn't write range from bad to terrible.

Trust me, while he didn't write the "shooting script," the entire plot (save for the final scene in the hospital) is his and so is about 70% of the dialogue. And the roughly 1/3 to 1/4 of dialogue that wasn't his was mostly an improvement. As were the chase scenes, or lack thereof in the script that can now read.

.all that idiotic Alison Brie dialogue was trying desperately to be funny, and wasn't at all

Oh, c'mon! Besides sounding exactly like Gale from the first movie, who can't love the line "**** Me Wow!" ?!?!

 

[DACrowe]

I don't find Scream 4 as good as 1 and 2, but it's leaps and bounds better than 3 for me.

It's not nearly as good as Scream 1, but I honestly prefer it to Scream 2. Yes, Scream 2 was more of a horror movie with a few great suspense sequences (Cici's death, Randy's death, the car crash scene)....but it is very uneven. Mickey being the killer was obvious when he disappeared for the second half of the movie. And while when it was a broad comedy with horror scenes in the first half with Randy's monologues and Jerry O'Connell pulling a My Best Friend's Wedding, once Randy died the movie loses all its steam and kind of limps on until the killer's reveal a half hour later. Scream 4 kept its roller coaster momentum for the whole runtime and has a great ending, in my opinion.

 

[The Joker]

It's not nearly as good as Scream 1, but I honestly prefer it to Scream 2. Yes, Scream 2 was more of a horror movie with a few great suspense sequences (Cici's death, Randy's death, the car crash scene)....but it is very uneven. Mickey being the killer was obvious when he disappeared for the second half of the movie. And while when it was a broad comedy with horror scenes in the first half with Randy's monologues and Jerry O'Connell pulling a My Best Friend's Wedding, once Randy died the movie loses all its steam and kind of limps on until the killer's reveal a half hour later. Scream 4 kept its roller coaster momentum for the whole runtime and has a great ending, in my opinion.

I couldn't disagree more. In fact after Randy dies, it's one exciting scene after another. Cotton's creepy confrontation with Sid in the library, then Gale and Dewey's thrilling run in with Ghostface in the Film School, Sid and Hallie trapped in the Cop car with Ghostface, and then you get the killers' reveal. The movie retains that momentum.

Top notch stuff.

 

[DACrowe]

Maybe it's because I first saw that movie 13-14 years ago and I know the plot beats so well, there's no tension for me. But the same goes for the first Scream and even though I know who lives and who dies and what will happen next, the movie is still a lot of fun and attention-grabing. When I rewatch Scream 2 now, I lose interest and start zoning out after Randy dies in the movie.

 

[Punisher Rising]

I agree DACrowe, I find parts of Scream 2 are very tedious, which is probably more due to it being overly long. IMO it would've benefitted from being at least a good 10-15 minutes shorter to keep it from lagging.

 

[bullets]

Well I'll give it a shot!

-S3 tried to be both funny and scary, but was neither (S4 at least was very humorous and entertaining, even if you don't think it was scary).

-S3's chase scenes felt by-the-numbers, dull and like Wes Craven was bored by the whole process--which he was. He made Scream 3 solely to get financing for Music From the Heart. At least in S4 there was an edge to scenes like when Olivia died or the Kirby-Charlie scene that left audiences literally upset that she died. Which leads to....

-S3's new characters were all dull and vapid characters that while witty parodies of Hollywood archetypes (sleazy/hedonist producer, whiny-hack director, self-centered diva movie star, two-faced ingenue, etc.) were utterly boring and unlikable thus making them dying pointless and uninvolving. While Trevor and Olivia weren't ones to write home about, Kirby was the first sequel-created character who lived up to the original cast and then there's Jill and Charlie....

-S3's villain motive relied on a Days of Our Lives revelation in that Sid had a long-lost half-brother who is evil and wants to kill her....and who then retconned the near-perfect first film by revealing he manipulated Billy and Stu into killing Maureen, frame Cotton and then everything else. Meanwhile, Jill had the best motive since Scream 1 in being the poster child of the Facebook/Twitter/Jersey Shore/Kardashian/Me Generation.

Good answer. I had a lot of issues with Scream 3 but thought Neve did a great job and carried the film.

I couldn't disagree more. In fact after Randy dies, it's one exciting scene after another. Cotton's creepy confrontation with Sid in the library, then Gale and Dewey's thrilling run in with Ghostface in the Film School, Sid and Hallie trapped in the Cop car with Ghostface, and then you get the killers' reveal. The movie retains that momentum.

Top notch stuff.

I was on the edge of my seat the whole time in the theater. I had forgotten about Mickey though. I had kind of dismissed him as too obvious.

 

[Jennifer Walters]

I'm probably one of the biggest damn Scream nerds on the planet and I'd rank them..

1. Scream (Original will always be best. Started it all.)
2. Scream 4 (Fun story, fun lampooning, great new characters, fun cast. Just a good movie that pokes fun at all that is wrong with horror and horror remakes like a Scream film should. The plot makes sense. Feels modern and brings the remake trend into light. Pokes fun at itself in all the right places and takes itself seriously in all the right places. And the motive of the killer is honestly probably the best one in the entire series.)
3. Scream 2 (I feel like this one mostly gets by as being a fantastic sequel because it had the balls to kill probably the most popular side character in the franchise so regretlessly and then that ending showdown is still possibly the best ending show down.)
4. Scream 3 (There's seriously so much more wrong with this movie than is right and the plot is the plot of a really really really really really low grade direct to DVD movie. None of the new characters are all that memorable. Nothing makes all that much sense or rings true when you connect it to Scream 1 and 2. It's just more of a mess than an actual good film. It's only in my collection to complete the series and the fact there's one or two small moments that feel like Scream.)

 

[kickass]

Scream 2 is the least watched Scream in my household.

 

[Punisher Rising]

I'd rank them:


Scream
Scream 4
Scream 2
Scream 3


I do enjoy them all but to me the original is a genuine classic and 4 is a great sequel. 2 is decent and has it's moments but is bogged down by a plodding pace and not being as entertaining as 1 and 4 are. 3 suffers from a similar poor pace and also being overly goofy. But none of them are truly bad films in my book.

 

[Jennifer Walters]

I'm sorry 3 is just such a disaster and it's not Ehren's fault. I truly don't think it is. It was just a rushed production because the Wiensteins wanted that money and they wanted it now.

At least 2 has a comprehensible story. 3 doesn't even have that. But I will agree that at parts 2 can be a bit of a chore to watch. I feel like the scene with Sid being attacked on stage at her play could've been cut entirely as well as the ''I'm a fighter" monologue.

 

[kickass]

I don't blame Ehren either. He was doing the best he could under the circumstances. He sure helped a lot with Kevin's Scream 4 script.