Season 6, Episode 7 "The Broken Man" Discussion Thread

[Matt]

It's fun to read so please continue. t:

I agree that with the amount of screentime rumoured to be left, now is not the time to be introducing any new side plots. Should be all about resolving earlier side plots and moving everything else towards end game (and most of those pieces seem to be moving in the right direction at least).

Another possibility, of course, is that the Hound becomes Lady Stoneheart, or at least the show's equivalent. When we last saw Beric and the Brotherhood, they had gone from honorable men, hunting the Mountain on Ned Stark's behalf, to thieves and hostage takers. They sold out Gendry to the Red Woman without a second thought. They'd kinda lost their way and their leader Beric said that every time he died and came back, he lost a piece of himself (and seemingly with him, so did the Brotherhood). The last thing Beric told the Hound, when they fought in trial by combat was that God had a purpose for him; basically the same exact thing that the Septon told him last night.

Last night, the Hound was set on a path of vengeance. Lady Stoneheart is a character who is driven by desire for revenge. Perhaps, in his quest for revenge, the Hound is going to kill Beric, once and for all, assume command of the Brotherhood, and the Hound will turn on his old masters, the Lannisters. In essence, becoming the show's version of Stoneheart.

 

[Iceman]

Another possibility, of course, is that the Hound becomes Lady Stoneheart, or at least the show's equivalent. When we last saw Beric and the Brotherhood, they had gone from honorable men, hunting the Mountain on Ned Stark's behalf, to thieves and hostage takers. They sold out Gendry to the Red Woman without a second thought. They'd kinda lost their way and their leader Beric said that every time he died and came back, he lost a piece of himself (and seemingly with him, so did the Brotherhood). The last thing Beric told the Hound, when they fought in trial by combat was that God had a purpose for him; basically the same exact thing that the Septon told him last night.

Last night, the Hound was set on a path of vengeance. Lady Stoneheart is a character who is driven by desire for revenge. Perhaps, in his quest for revenge, the Hound is going to kill Beric, once and for all, assume command of the Brotherhood, and the Hound will turn on his old masters, the Lannisters. In essence, becoming the show's version of Stoneheart.

Interesting. So would you think the Hound would have any undead/supernatural qualities to him like LS? A showdown between Frankenstein versions of The Hound and The Mountain would be a great payoff (would be great regardless). I could see it ending in a similar way to the Oberyn Mountain fight, with a double KO and The Hound dying of his injuries even if he wins. And I don't know who else is going to take out this new Mountain.

 

[Matt]

Interesting. So would you think the Hound would have any undead/supernatural qualities to him like LS? A showdown between Frankenstein versions of The Hound and The Mountain would be a great payoff (would be great regardless). I could see it ending in a similar way to the Oberyn Mountain fight, with a double KO and The Hound dying of his injuries even if he wins. And I don't know who else is going to take out this new Mountain.

Nah...I think the Hound would probably be as he is. His return from the dead would be far more figurative than Lady Stoneheart's in such a scenario. We presumed him dead, he returned from "the dead" and took the leadership of the Brotherhood.

I'd agree that he will kill the Mountain (and probably die in the process). If he takes over the Brotherhood and uses it as a way to seek vengence against the Lannisters, then conflict with his brother seems inevitable.

 

[Iceman]

Nah...I think the Hound would probably be as he is. His return from the dead would be far more figurative than Lady Stoneheart's in such a scenario. We presumed him dead, he returned from "the dead" and took the leadership of the Brotherhood.

I'd agree that he will kill the Mountain (and probably die in the process). If he takes over the Brotherhood and uses it as a way to seek vengence against the Lannisters, then conflict with his brother seems inevitable.

Yeah that sounds right.

 

[Victarion]

Nah...I think the Hound would probably be as he is. His return from the dead would be far more figurative than Lady Stoneheart's in such a scenario. We presumed him dead, he returned from "the dead" and took the leadership of the Brotherhood.

I'd agree that he will kill the Mountain (and probably die in the process). If he takes over the Brotherhood and uses it as a way to seek vengence against the Lannisters, then conflict with his brother seems inevitable.

The Hound could also get revenge for the Brotherhood murdering those innocents, get noticed by a Sparrow (that's one of many proselytizing in the Riverlands), and presented to the High Sparrow as a possible leader for the Faith Militant. An honor for wiping out a coven of bloodthirsty heathens.

 

[Fist of Khonshu]

The thing I assumed, going by the books, was that they were going to more or less give Stannis' arc of becoming the liberator of the North set on rescuing a Stark child to Jon this season. They cut out all of the Northern support Stannis accumulated in order to have Jon fill that role, but it seems like that's not really the case either. I mean yeah, he has House Mormont like Stannis did, but otherwise it seems like they're choosing to approach the Lords of the North as not particularly loyal to the Starks, nor do they seem to hold that same vehement desire for revenge after the Red Wedding.

We need Big Bucket Wull, dammit!

They seem "burned out", jaded, and rightfully-fearful of Bolton power. And all of their manpower must be depleted from Robb's war as well. Everyone sent so many forces South before that they were all left vulnerable to the Ironborn -who they know are still out there, so I can see the hesitation in contributing more troops and unmanning their defenses.

 

[Fist of Khonshu]

You're right, she doesn't know she is being spied on. But at this point, after all the training, you'd think she would realize the people would know she didn't do her job. She's walking without a worry.

And... well... she does realize they are going to hunt her down... which is why she gets he sword and goes into hiding in that small corridor or whatever last episode.

Exactly right. The lesson behind the Meryn Trant slaying is that she can be found and observed without her knowing that since the Faceless Men can wear faces to disguise themselves. She would not have forgotten that and thrown caution to the wind so recklessly when she knows how deadly this group is.

 

[Greens]

Enjoyed the episode.

There has to be more to the Arya scene. Everyone expected Waif to show up, maybe Arya did as well.

 

[Fist of Khonshu]

I think he said Snow. Do ya'll think the High Sparrow can get the Queen of Thorns if she flees to Highgarden? Remember last season, how he talked about controlling the people that harvest the grain. I took that as him having done some preaching down there at some point.

Olenna confronted the High Sparrow to get Loras back. She tried bribing him, then threatened to cut off the food imports to King's Landing and letting the people know that he would be to blame for that. The Sparrow asked her if she and her house had ever planted and reaped their own crops followed by a parting shot about what happens when "the many stop fearing the few."

I took this as meaning that the people in the Crownlands can grow their own food if they have to and break their dependency on the Reach, not that he has Faith Militant in High Garden. After what's happened in the Capital, I doubt any such seeds have been allowed to germinate in the Tyrell's own home.

 

[Fist of Khonshu]

Arya is a Stark. Starks are stupidly naive.

They were. The survivors should be less so from their experiences now.

 

[Fist of Khonshu]

I think Stoneheart's return is inevitable. Not to become a Stoneheart conspiracy theorist, but last night we saw the Brotherhood Without Banners hang a man. A self-proclaimed former soldier who committed atrocities in war (including killing a boy in front of his mother...seems like the type of thing that would spark an interest from a revenge driven mother). We don't know what house he fought for, but I will bet it was the Freys, the Boltons, or the Lannisters.

GRRM shot that down last week. The show is not adapting her.

 

[Fist of Khonshu]

she had no idea the Waif was watching her at the play... so no, she wasn't wrong...

it's a bit of a dumb scene really... she looks like a dumb ass one way... and if we are to pretend it's part of her plan... its beyond silly, even for D&D.

I didn't know what to make of it and didn't know why the **** it was even there. Next episode she is seen jumping off rooftops... so Arya has Wolverine healing abilities.

pretty sad when the most logical way to think of it was a joke from earlier tonight regarding Arya and hidden blood packs in her shirt.

Welllll Jaqen did say this was a shame because she had "so many gifts": warging, telepathy, and regeneration!

 

[Matt]

The Hound could also get revenge for the Brotherhood murdering those innocents, get noticed by a Sparrow (that's one of many proselytizing in the Riverlands), and presented to the High Sparrow as a possible leader for the Faith Militant. An honor for wiping out a coven of bloodthirsty heathens.

Could be. But if that is the case, why tease Stoneheart as relentlessly as the writers have been doing? Do they want to kick their fans in the balls?

GRRM shot that down last week. The show is not adapting her.

Jon Snow also was not dead. GRRM trolls the fanbase with false information just as much as the show's actors and writers do.

That said, I don't buy it. There have been too many hints in the past 3 or 4 weeks for there not to be some variant this season.

 

[Fist of Khonshu]

Could be. But if that is the case, why tease Stoneheart as relentlessly as the writers have been doing? Do they want to kick their fans in the balls?



Jon Snow also was not dead. GRRM trolls the fanbase with false information just as much as the show's actors and writers do.

That said, I don't buy it. There have been too many hints in the past 3 or 4 weeks for there not to be some variant this season.

I do buy it, and I don't see the alleged "hints" the way you do. The time for her re-entry would be somewhere in season 4 and it didn't happen. And I don't think the showrunners want too many characters coming back from the dead. Doing that ruins the sense of peril because it undermines the permanency of death.

But we'll see. We've witnessed a few other insane things from D&D so far so I guess we shouldn't put this past them either.

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[Matt]

I do buy it, and I don't see the alleged "hints" the way you do. The time for her re-entry would be somewhere in season 4 and it didn't happen. And I don't think the showrunners want too many characters coming back from the dead. Doing that ruins the sense of peril because it undermines the permanency of death.

But we'll see. We've witnessed a few other insane things from D&D so far so I guess we shouldn't put this past them either.

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Indeed we have. The crazy thing is, I wouldn't put it past them to just straight up troll the fanbase with all the hints that ultimately lead to nothing.

That said, while I agree that it would be overkill in terms of undoing death, I don't think that the moment has past. In terms of narrative progression, Jamie, Brienne, and Podrick are just reaching the point in the story where Stoneheart comes into play. No narratively it could work.

That being said, I think it is far more likely that the Hound becomes some sort of composite character for Stoneheart (a presumed dead character rising back up to wreak havoc on the Lannisters) than Stoneheart herself appearing.

 

[Verick808]

It feels more likely that Barric died a few too many times and is taking the place of Lady Stoneheart himself.

 

[Rowsdower!]

I'm confused a bit about the Brotherhood. When did they say that those three riders were members of it? Did I miss something? And if so, why the hell are they just slaughtering innocent people now?

 

[Victarion]

I thought the one with the yellowcloak was Lem.

Maybe they wanted to punish the Septon from his warcrimes? Or its a matter of holy war - the Lord of Light vs the Faith of the Seven.

 

[Matt]

It feels more likely that Barric died a few too many times and is taking the place of Lady Stoneheart himself.

Has there been any indication that Beric is returning this season? I know that Thoros was seen on set. What about Beric?

I'm confused a bit about the Brotherhood. When did they say that those three riders were members of it? Did I miss something? And if so, why the hell are they just slaughtering innocent people now?

It wasn't outright said, but hanging people is consistent with their behavior in the books (under the leadership of Lady Stoneheart, that is) and the rider we saw said "the night is dark and full of terror" indicating that they worship the Lord of Light. So riders, with no banners, who worship the Lord of Light...its not hard to reach the conclusion that they are part of the Brotherhood.

 

[Rowsdower!]

Has there been any indication that Beric is returning this season? I know that Thoros was seen on set. What about Beric?



It wasn't outright said, but hanging people is consistent with their behavior in the books (under the leadership of Lady Stoneheart, that is) and the rider we saw said "the night is dark and full of terror" indicating that they worship the Lord of Light. So riders, with no banners, who worship the Lord of Light...its not hard to reach the conclusion that they are part of the Brotherhood.

Thanks, yeah, I just looked it up and read the theory that Lady Stoneheart may be appearing. It certainly would line up with everything that's happening in the Riverlands right now. It would also make the Brotherhood seem a lot more interesting that they did initially, lol.

 

[Xrated48]

Solid episode happy about

Spoiler

the hound's return

 

[Ezio Auditore]

I'm confused a bit about the Brotherhood. When did they say that those three riders were members of it? Did I miss something? And if so, why the hell are they just slaughtering innocent people now?

The Hound says they are from the BwB to septon Meribald

 

[Lencho01]

Really liked the episode except for the ending with Arya and the Hound's new people being killed off so fast.

The little girl should be on the Iron Throne.

 

[Matt]

Really liked the episode except for the ending with Arya and the Hound's new people being killed off so fast.

The little girl should be on the Iron Throne.

I liked her too. I especially liked the way that Davos dealt with her.

Speaking of Davos, the only thing worse than constant victim Sansa is bratty Sansa when she has a bit of power. It returned again last night. Her pointed comment to Jon about Davos, her attempt to demand House Glover comply with her, her still not trusting Jon regarding Littlefinger...it seems to me that the moment she is out of captivity, rude, demanding, brat Sansa of season one returned.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Liked the episode a lot, surprised at the bad reactions, and agree with some others there has to be more tithe Arya ending scene.