Should Fox just focus on R rated Marvel Movies?

[TheVileOne]

"sitcom tone enjoyed by Marvel Studios films so often".
Even if Deadpool is the tour de force of said declaration, the MCU is still more known for it. That's what I understood.

In any case, Fox does R-rated cbm's like no other as they're about to be 3 for 3.
More often than not, those either tank with critics and/or the box office.

Kick-Ass 2.

 

[BlackFox]

No but they should use the R rating where it is necessary for the character to show their true potential and fits their nature. Deadpool, Wolverine, X-Force should be R rated without question but the main X-Men films dont need it to make a great movie X2 and DOFP have proven that so no point forcing something just for the sake of it.

More importantly they need to continue to be diverse with their director choices to get more unique and interesting films out of it. What the MCU is doing is great and working for them but there is no way they would produce a Deadpool or Logan, as for one it wouldnt fit in with their overall tone and plan, maybe after Infinity War they might change a bit (but maybe not even then) but thats another discussion, its both a strength for them and also part of their small weakness, so there is no point Fox trying to "copy" them in that regard anyway they have that market cornered.

The R rating allows a greater range of themes to be explored by a director and to touch on subjects that wouldnt be possible in a PG13/12A film as well as the obvious action benefits of showing the violence on another level. FOX should and will continue to use that where possible as they reaping the rewards from it already. Heck we only got Logan because in part of Deadpool so its already happening, even though the only thing in common between the two films is the rating, they polar opposites in terms of style and tone, which is the great thing about it.

The only thing I think FOX should really do is give back or strike some deal to get FF back to the MCU. It fits in with what the MCU have created way more than X-Men overall tones anyway because that is in a complete mess at the moment I dont think anyone would argue and not really doing anyone any favours at the moment.

 

[MadVillainy]

X Rated X-Men films only

 

[2kt09]

Kick-Ass 2.

Great example of an r-rated cbm that tanked with critics.

 

[The Endless]

Only when necessary. The main X films don't need to be R. But films involving Deadpool or Wolverine or X Force? Yes. And it's not even just about the gore and swearing.

Suicide Squad should've been R. No world ending threat. Have the Squad saving the President from the Joker or something.

 

[MadVillainy]

Rating doesn't matter much. Making a good film does.

I think Logan wouldve been great regardless of the R rating. The story and the acting was what made it great to me. The other stuff was just a small bonus.

Deadpool is a little different. But they could have fun with a PG13 Deadpool movie. But comedies are just better when rated R

 

[The Endless]

Wolverine has knives in his hands. He's an inherently violent character. And the depth of the character comes from the man vs animal conflict within him. Not showing the full brutality of the character has always been a hindrance I think. How can you show that conflict without the animal side? How can you show the animal side properly with age limits? There never being any blood is contrived and it takes away from the impact of his plight.

For me it's no coincidence that the R rated Logan is being touted as one of the best comic book movies ever. It allows more freedom for the story teller. A character like Wolverine could never really be done full justice if it's gotta cater for kids. Same as your Deadpool and your Blade etc.

 

[Zarex]

Well partially, yes, it's humor was not aimed at all quadrants of audiences and trying to appeal to everyone, which Marvel movies do, which is why their humor has a certain baseline of safe unchallenging pleasantness to it.

But beyond that, Deadpool is a fourth-wall breaking film that, ironically, really develops Wade's relationship with Vanessa, and their romance is intentionally not wholesome or meet cute. It's just not that there's nudity or sex--although the fact that it includes a scene of Reynolds getting pegged is pretty amusingly out there, especially in a superhero movie--it has a bit of an unsavory quality that is refreshing given how blandly innocuous superhero movies are. And the real climax of the film is Vanessa seeing his face, not Wade fighting Francis. Also of note is the fact that Wade is the only funny one and self-aware that he's in a movie character. Everyone else is playing it fairly straight.

I just compare that to the nonstop banter in the Marvel movies, even ones I love. I do love the first Avengers, but there are no stakes. They are fighting over a MacGuffin (the Cosmic Cube) and supposedly the world is in danger, New York will get nuked, but no one is taking it that seriously even in the third act. "We have a Hulk;" "Hang on Legolas;" "I'm bringing the party to you," "That doesn't look like a party;" "This is just like Budapest all over again," "You and I remember Budapest very differently;" "Puny God."

For the record I loved that movie, still enjoy it, and am fine with all that banter. But when every one of their movies do that during the third acts or nearly ever scene, so that audiences never get bored or find the proceedings too intense, and it is always the same kind of lighthearted inoffensive most basic comedy, it gets really tiring after awhile.

I really enjoyed Deadpool, but I saw it as a standard rom-com with edgy window dressing, and included both a "meet cute" and a wholesome relationship. The film reminded me an awful lot of the previous year's Ant-Man - Funny anti-hero with a heart of gold puts on red bondage gear in an effort to re-connect with the love of his life.

My favorite characters growing up were yuksters Spider, Avengers-era Beast and Ben Grimm, so I would be disappointed if Feige and company removed the in-fight banter in an effort to "grow up" characters created for children. Though admittedly, the gags missed the mark in the climax of both T:TDW and A:AOU. I thought CA:CW had a terrific balance and I'm hoping that tone -sitcom or not - carries through in the Infinity War film(s).

 

[MadVillainy]

Wolverine has knives in his hands. He's an inherently violent character. And the depth of the character comes from the man vs animal conflict within him. Not showing the full brutality of the character has always been a hindrance I think. How can you show that conflict without the animal side? How can you show the animal side properly with age limits? There never being any blood is contrived and it takes away from the impact of his plight.

For me it's no coincidence that the R rated Logan is being touted as one of the best comic book movies ever. It allows more freedom for the story teller. A character like Wolverine could never really be done full justice if it's gotta cater for kids. Same as your Deadpool and your Blade etc.

It's not being touted as one of the best comic book ever because of the blood or the brutality. It's because it was a good story with great acting.

 

[The Endless]

And would they be able to tell the same brutal and tragic story that has the same emotional and visceral impact with a pg13 rating? I don't think so.

Violence and gore when used right are story telling devices. Would Platoon or Saving Private Ryan be as powerful with pg13 ratings? Of course not. Never in a million years.

 

[The Endless]

I really enjoyed Deadpool, but I saw it as a standard rom-com with edgy window dressing, and included both a "meet cute" and a wholesome relationship. The film reminded me an awful lot of the previous year's Ant-Man - Funny anti-hero with a heart of gold puts on red bondage gear in an effort to re-connect with the love of his life.

My favorite characters growing up were yuksters Spider, Avengers-era Beast and Ben Grimm, so I would be disappointed if Feige and company removed the in-fight banter in an effort to "grow up" characters created for children. Though admittedly, the gags missed the mark in the climax of both T:TDW and A:AOU. I thought CA:CW had a terrific balance and I'm hoping that tone -sitcom or not - carries through in the Infinity War film(s).

Deadpool didn't have a heart of gold. He was an ass hole who treated his friends like crap, made fun of real heroes and was ultimately motivated by totally selfish reasons. And he doesn't learn anything or change his ways by the end of the movie.

Yet he was still likeable.

That's why Deadpool is unique. There is literally no other character like him.

 

[Darepool]

Well partially, yes, it's humor was not aimed at all quadrants of audiences and trying to appeal to everyone, which Marvel movies do, which is why their humor has a certain baseline of safe unchallenging pleasantness to it.

But beyond that, Deadpool is a fourth-wall breaking film that, ironically, really develops Wade's relationship with Vanessa, and their romance is intentionally not wholesome or meet cute. It's just not that there's nudity or sex--although the fact that it includes a scene of Reynolds getting pegged is pretty amusingly out there, especially in a superhero movie--it has a bit of an unsavory quality that is refreshing given how blandly innocuous superhero movies are. And the real climax of the film is Vanessa seeing his face, not Wade fighting Francis. Also of note is the fact that Wade is the only funny one and self-aware that he's in a movie character. Everyone else is playing it fairly straight.

I just compare that to the nonstop banter in the Marvel movies, even ones I love. I do love the first Avengers, but there are no stakes. They are fighting over a MacGuffin (the Cosmic Cube) and supposedly the world is in danger, New York will get nuked, but no one is taking it that seriously even in the third act. "We have a Hulk;" "Hang on Legolas;" "I'm bringing the party to you," "That doesn't look like a party;" "This is just like Budapest all over again," "You and I remember Budapest very differently;" "Puny God."

For the record I loved that movie, still enjoy it, and am fine with all that banter. But when every one of their movies do that during the third acts or nearly ever scene, so that audiences never get bored or find the proceedings too intense, and it is always the same kind of lighthearted inoffensive most basic comedy, it gets really tiring after awhile.

Damn, it must suck for you that these films are generally loved by the public. Even after enjoying the great western film Logan and being in the afterglow of it's 'genre transcendence' you come in here and unprovoked take cheap shots at the MCU with it's 'sitcom' tone. Keep it up, it's clearly having an impact.

"We have a Hulk;" "Hang on Legolas;" "I'm bringing the party to you," "That doesn't look like a party;" ....That is so offensive to my integrity as a film viewer and to what the genre could be.

 

[The Endless]

I'm a fan of the MCU. But tbf... he's not wrong.

Marvel will never make films like Deadpool or Logan. They can't. But that isn't necessarily a bad thing. They're aiming for that Star Wars/Back to the Future/Indiana Jones style and tone. And for the most part they are nailing it. Those types of movies are difficult to get right. And they are just as credible as more artsy fare. The imagination, craft and passion is still there. The MCU films aren't just shallow half arsed cash grabs.

I remember watching Avengers opening weekend. It was an extraordinary experience. The film might not have stakes or drama, but the audience was fully engrossed and having the time of their lives. The only other cinema experience I've had that was similar was Deadpool, funnily enough.

These films connect with people the same as some harrowing drama, just in a different way. That is what art is. So anyone who looks down on these types of films regardless of how well they are executed needs to reach far down and pull their heads out of their arses. End of story. Simple as that.

 

[Darepool]

I'm a fan of the MCU. But tbf... he's not wrong.

Marvel will never make films like Deadpool or Logan. They can't. But that isn't necessarily a bad thing. They're aiming for that Star Wars/Back to the Future/Indiana Jones style and tone. And for the most part they are nailing it. Those types of movies are difficult to get right. And they are just as credible as more artsy fare. The imagination, craft and passion is still there. The MCU films aren't just shallow half arsed cash grabs.

No, absolutely. And most comic characters don't require to be made like Wolvie or Pool, ie hard R.

 

[Flint Marko]

I'm a fan of the MCU. But tbf... he's not wrong.

Marvel will never make films like Deadpool or Logan. They can't. But that isn't necessarily a bad thing. They're aiming for that Star Wars/Back to the Future/Indiana Jones style and tone. And for the most part they are nailing it. Those types of movies are difficult to get right. And they are just as credible as more artsy fare. The imagination, craft and passion is still there. The MCU films aren't just shallow half arsed cash grabs.

I remember watching Avengers opening weekend. It was an extraordinary experience. The film might not have stakes or drama, but the audience was fully engrossed and having the time of their lives. The only other cinema experience I've had that was similar was Deadpool, funnily enough.

These films connect with people the same as some harrowing drama, just in a different way. That is what art is. So anyone who looks down on these types of films regardless of how well they are executed needs to reach far down and pull their heads out of their arses. End of story. Simple as that.

This guy gets it.

 

[Darepool]

Yes he does, the last bit was edited in as I made my post

 

[Zarex]

Deadpool didn't have a heart of gold. He was an ass hole who treated his friends like crap, made fun of real heroes and was ultimately motivated by totally selfish reasons. And he doesn't learn anything or change his ways by the end of the movie.

Yet he was still likeable.

That's why Deadpool is unique. There is literally no other character like him.

Heart of silver then? Bronze maybe? Wade rescued the girl from her stalker without compensation and kept himself from Vanessa after he lost his looks. Both were selfless acts.

 

[The Endless]

Heart of silver then? Bronze maybe? Wade rescued the girl from her stalker without compensation and kept himself from Vanessa after he lost his looks. Both were selfless acts.

Bronze sounds about right haha.

And yea fair points. But then that guy was just some geeky text pest... who got the **** kicked out of him and seemingly tortured. Bit of an over reaction.

He kept himself from Vanessa because he was ashamed of himself. It's vanity. He wants Francis to give him his looks back, when he finds out he can't, he blows his brains out.

The only selfless thing he does is actually leaving Vanessa when he finds out he has cancer so she can't watch him die slowly and horrifically. Which is a believable human reaction.

 

[metaphysician]

Bronze sounds about right haha.

And yea fair points. But then that guy was just some geeky text pest... who got the **** kicked out of him and seemingly tortured. Bit of an over reaction.

He kept himself from Vanessa because he was ashamed of himself. It's vanity. He wants Francis to give him his looks back, when he finds out he can't, he blows his brains out.

The only selfless thing he does is actually leaving Vanessa when he finds out he has cancer so she can't watch him die slowly and horrifically. Which is a believable human reaction.

Actually, I think that last thing *was* an act of selfishness, and the movie pretty much agreed. He left her because *he* couldn't stand to see her pain; it was about avoiding an awkward and painful situation for himself more than anything else. However, it was a very understandable and human moment of weakness.

That said, "heart of bronze" seems about right. Wade is an *******, but he's not 100% dick. He's not going to selflessly dedicate his life to saving the world, but he also tends to try and do right by those around him. He's just really bad it at, because he may not be 100% dick, but he's still an *******.

 

[The Endless]

Yea I see what you're saying lol.

Deadpool is more complex a character than people give him credit for. I guess the Bugs Bunny like irreverence and fourth wall breaking overshadows the more human side of the character.

 

[psylockolussus]

Just no.

I don't need the X-Men to be swearing all the time and chopping the head of their opponents.

 

[First Avenger]

I'm a fan of the MCU. But tbf... he's not wrong.

Marvel will never make films like Deadpool or Logan. They can't. But that isn't necessarily a bad thing. They're aiming for that Star Wars/Back to the Future/Indiana Jones style and tone. And for the most part they are nailing it. Those types of movies are difficult to get right. And they are just as credible as more artsy fare. The imagination, craft and passion is still there. The MCU films aren't just shallow half arsed cash grabs.

I remember watching Avengers opening weekend. It was an extraordinary experience. The film might not have stakes or drama, but the audience was fully engrossed and having the time of their lives. The only other cinema experience I've had that was similar was Deadpool, funnily enough.

These films connect with people the same as some harrowing drama, just in a different way. That is what art is. So anyone who looks down on these types of films regardless of how well they are executed needs to reach far down and pull their heads out of their arses. End of story. Simple as that.

All of this.

 

[GREEN =w= DAY]

Nah

Even though Deadpool and Logan are both excellent films, others such as X-2, Days of Future Past, and First Class are just as good and didn't need to be R rated

 

[Boom]

I think if there's anything for Fox to learn from Deadpool and Logan, it's to trust the source material and the filmmakers who are passionate about these characters. And don't be afraid to take risks. Deadpool almost didn't happen. The test footage leaks, and here we are now. They were hesitant to make an R-rated Wolverine film, and it's one of the finest superhero films ever made.

Now if only they'd carry this mindset over to the Fantastic Four, if they somehow inexplicably try to make another one.

 

[wnjcwjkk]

Nah, but I would like to see them reboot the X Films. I feel like they have ranged from Aight to Good, but have never really reached the potential I feel like they should, because they did the first trilogy before they really found the formula or knew that the films would be better received when they are closer to the source material, the audience is willing to invest and bring in outside knowledge, etc.


I feel like they kinda realized that and took a better approach with First Class and DOFP, but the films have been really shackled and held back by the first several films, going so far as to change things with time travel, but they can't change everything.

Haven't seen Logan yet, but the reviews make me wish these guys had been in charge since the first Wolverine, a period piece war movie, a Samurai film, and Logan, the nWo Western, chase movie. Logan I think goes to show how much more potential the source material has, and I think they need to restart once Jackman is gone, because I know that was 80% of the reason First Class wasn't a full reboot.