Splinter Cell: ConViction

I never can take advantage of deals like that because im FAR too impatient. I want the game when i want the game.
 
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You can get release date shipping, and it'd still be around $15 dollars cheaper than getting it at a walk-in Gamestop. It usually gets there relatively early when I use that option
 
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Tron Bonne said:
You can get release date shipping, and it'd still be around $15 dollars cheaper than getting it at a walk-in Gamestop. It usually gets there relatively early when I use that option
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Hm. So i still get it the same day the game drops? I might have to try that then.
 
Yeah, and if you haven't done it yet, you can get a free month's trial of 'Amazon Prime' and get that option free, so you won't even have to pay extra for it. Just don't forgot to set the thing not to automatically renew itself since Prime is expensive
 
ProjectPat2280 said:
Like i said, i totally get where you are coming from. Im tired of playing, more or less, the same game just with a different logo. Like you, i want something different. Its one of the things i LOVED about the orig Splinter Cell games, there wasnt much out there like it. I still think that can be the case with Conviction. And im well aware that action titles aren't the only ones that sell, but ya look at the top sellers as of late, and well you kind of see that trend.

I think we agree more than we disagree. Im with you on the current state of the industry and how over saturation can ruin certain genres. I just don't see these companies caring. Take Activision for example. They will take a franchise and absolutely run it into the ground to the point of extreme over saturation, but they'll make a fortune in the process, so in their eyes, everything is ok, and unfortunately i think more companies are doing this.

But we are kinda heading off topic. IMO, i think Conviction will be a fun title. It might not bring the same fun we had with Pandora Tomorrow or Chaos Theory but i think it'll be a cool game.
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I hope its fun, and I will give it a chance for sure. I can tell it most likely won't be the fun I had with 1-3. But I'm sure it will have its moments.
 
Anyone watch the 'Stealth Trailer' over at Ubisoft?

That looked like hardcore, classic Splinter Cell goodness to me. The ability to ghost still seems present, it's just there's more action to be had.
 
I think you're misunderstanding. The guards aren't posted there until you move to that location. If you go to the window then go to the door there will be no guard at the door. In every play though I played the guard at the door never turned toward the door ensuring that the player can get an easy kill. This is of course a design choice as I was suggesting.
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I think that was the point, as a tutorial level. They're giving players a freebie to be able to toss a guy through a glass window, or toss him down a second floor window.

Splinter Cell 1-3 were amazing I played them all on my original X-Box. And I just have not been very impressed with Ubisoft as a whole the past few years.
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What'd you think about both versions of Double Agent? The Xbox and the 360?

To me to explain it is like yea change can be good as long as the core is still there. The core of Splinter Cell IS STEALTH. So if you take that away....then its not Splinter Cell. Change can be good, example in the comic book world, I was glad of some of the changes Nolan made to the Joker in terms of just superficial appearances. But in terms of the character, he was still the Joker. Now if he would have turned the Joker into a man that just loved to hug and kiss puppies....then yes I would be pissed. But having the company come out and say: "Hey the puppy kissing and loving Joker is a new change. And therefore you should love it, if not your just a grumpy pants that can't see into the "future"." Now of course your right some don't like any changes at all. And to me that is bad as the other extreme
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I'd agree with you, except...from what I've seen...they are not taking away the stealth. Only not brutally punishing you for not being a ghost. And even then, playing the demo on Realistic, it seems impossible to play the game without a stealth mentality. The punishments in the previous Splinter Cell games however, all of them, were ****ing brutal. It seems less so now.

But, I'd be the first one pissed off they'd taken away the stealth. But, from what I've seen it's still there.

I'd like to point out that Metal Gear Solid 4 did the same thing, only I'm not sure if ConViction will be as good at it. I'll decide once I play the final game. But, MGS4 can be played like a 3rd person shooter if you want to. Or you can ghost it.

Splinter Cell was a stealth game, and one of the best ever made. And now to almost gut that out is just not what they should do to the mainstay series. Now I 'm not knowledgeable enough to know if this was suppose to be kind of a "offsides" Splinter Cell game like MG Rising. If so then I would understand this more so. But even with Double Agent it just did not seem as stealth based as it use to be.
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Double Agent was just as much a stealth game as all the others. What's the difference between DA and the rest? Mostly sundrenched levels...and that was only the 360 version.
 
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I don't understand. Why did you quote me if you are just restating what I said?
 
I don't understand. Why did you quote me if you are just restating what I said?
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To let you know you've got someone on your side. I hear you, man.

I think after that, though...the demo stops holding the players hand. Getting past the guards in the main room, and up that pipe...and then the guards in the lower level, are a nicer challenge.

I do hear that level is vastly different in the final version. I think one trailer shows an interrogation option in the level too.

Yea i just saw that and you are right. That's classic Splinter Cell. I kind of figured people would jump to conclusions based on a 5 minute demo, they always do.
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Yeah, they even had to fastfoward sections to not show the patient aspects of going stealth. But, that trailer was posted right after the demo was released...I think, to calm down some of the Splinter Cell faithful.

The demo showcased the new stuff, mostly, which is more than understandable I think. They want to bring the new people into the fold, because they know they can probably count (as every franchise does) on the base to support them. But, things like the the Mark and Execute, and the new way to interrogate enemies were the showcase pieces of the demo I thought.
 
Yeah, I totally understand what they're trying to do. Doesn't mean I have to go along for the ride though. I hope no one thinks I'm just hating to be hating, because I was super excited for this game after it was officially unveiled at E3 pretty much up until I played the demo. But just because the game is more actiony doesn't mean it's better. The path is more linear, you have less options in how to approach any situation, the AI is straight up stupid, it seems more scripted and limiting in some sections, etc...

Yes I'm judging the game based on a five-minute demo, but that's all I have to judge it on. I'm sure this game is going to find it's target audience, but it's clear I'm not part of it anymore. I'll just have to get my stealth fix elsewhere.
 
ChrisBaleBatman said:
To let you know you've got someone on your side. I hear you, man.

I think after that, though...the demo stops holding the players hand. Getting past the guards in the main room, and up that pipe...and then the guards in the lower level, are a nicer challenge.

I do hear that level is vastly different in the final version. I think one trailer shows an interrogation option in the level too.
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Ah, I see. I agree that the lower level seems to "baby" the player less the top level as well but not by much.

I have heard the same things regarding the changes in the demo and have seen the video with the interrogation scene that the demo omits. Hopefully the final version is also more challenging though, at least on the realistic setting because IMO the demo was not very challening on the realistic setting.

I kinda don't get what the stealth video is supposed to prove though. Sneaking though that level didn't show any incentives to playing stealthily or discouragements for engaging enemies. I could get though the demo without engaging anyone (except those you are forced to) but that doesn't mean that the game mechanics or level design doesn't encourage the opposite. Which I believe is the argument of "hardcore" fans if I'm not mistaken. I havent followed the debate much.
 
ChrisBaleBatman said:
I think that was the point, as a tutorial level. They're giving players a freebie to be able to toss a guy through a glass window, or toss him down a second floor window.



What'd you think about both versions of Double Agent? The Xbox and the 360?



I'd agree with you, except...from what I've seen...they are not taking away the stealth. Only not brutally punishing you for not being a ghost. And even then, playing the demo on Realistic, it seems impossible to play the game without a stealth mentality. The punishments in the previous Splinter Cell games however, all of them, were ****ing brutal. It seems less so now.

But, I'd be the first one pissed off they'd taken away the stealth. But, from what I've seen it's still there.

I'd like to point out that Metal Gear Solid 4 did the same thing, only I'm not sure if ConViction will be as good at it. I'll decide once I play the final game. But, MGS4 can be played like a 3rd person shooter if you want to. Or you can ghost it.



Double Agent was just as much a stealth game as all the others. What's the difference between DA and the rest? Mostly sundrenched levels...and that was only the 360 version.
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First I can't fully judge a game off a demo. I said that a a few times. But, I said it gives me worries. Just as much as some are praising it off of a five minute demo I will question it with it as well.

Double Agent wasn't horrible I just did not care for it as much, it seemed easier then the others. It's been a while since I played it but I remember I did not care for it as much. What was wrong with the challenge in SC 1-?. You claim the punishments were brutal....they were not that bad, but it made it challenging and not just something to get through in a few tries. The point of games and for me to spend 60 bucks is to have challenge and not beat a game so quickly. It does seem to be plaguing many games.

As for MGS4 yea they gave the option to do both, yet it actually became really hard if you did. Some parts would not allow for all action anyways. But the stealth was still there in full. To me if Conviction allows this through out most of the game then I will be happy. But really taking away these things you called "punishment" I called challenge. And it makes me wonder why so many games don't like challenge anymore. I'm not saying NES style challenge where it got out of hand, but SC were never frustrating hard most of the time, but very challenging. As I said before too many games are getting to easy and letting people off the hook. Just like PoP 08....you hardly could die. I just tire of that with Ubisoft especially.

To reiterate myself again, I am not condemning this game, I don't until I've played it. I may wait a while till I do play this, and hear what you guys have to say. I don't fully judge until I've played it. And I think as you said you will have to wait and see now as well. So I will wait for my select reviewers I trust to tell me how the game is.

And again I respect you and Pat and I'm not saying this game will suck or anything like that. I just expressed concerns. But to me as a whole in almost every genre games are getting too easy IMO. But after seeing that video Pat posted I am more hopeful now.

ProjectPat2280 said:
Yea i just saw that and you are right. That's classic Splinter Cell. I kind of figured people would jump to conclusions based on a 5 minute demo, they always do.

http://splintercell.us.ubi.com/conviction/#/home/7132/
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And as some jump to conclusions that it will be a good game off of a demo? The door swings both ways.

But again Pat, I have my mind open for this game. And I will wait for reviews.

But I did enjoy our previous conversation, because to me I did go onto something much bigger than just SC this just sparked it. I just am worried for the gaming industry as of late and its games. But I hope the best for this one. As I do any game.
 
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Flash Facts said:
I kinda don't get what the stealth video is supposed to prove though. Sneaking though that level didn't show any incentives to playing stealthily or discouragements for engaging enemies. I could get though the demo without engaging anyone (except those you are forced to) but that doesn't mean that the game mechanics or level design doesn't encourage the opposite. Which I believe is the argument of "hardcore" fans if I'm not mistaken. I havent followed the debate much.
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The video was to show that the game isn't forcing you to shoot your way through each level. At the start of the level you heard the classic Splinter Cell instructions 'If you are spotted, its game over'. I think some people were upset that it appeared as tho the title no longer allowed players to be patient and wait for the right opportunity to sneak past enemies undetected the way the previous games did. I think the argument with the hardcore SC guys is that they dont want SC to turn into Gears of War. They dont want to have to shoot their way out of every scenario. They dont want it turning into a straight up action title.
 
For those thinking the demo was too easy, even on realistic settings or the enemey AI seemed poor, there was a reason for that:

We designed the demo with one main objective in mind: make it exciting and fun to play for as much people as possible; even for gamers who had never played Splinter Cell before but were into action games. With that in mind, we adapted the level design (less enemies, more projected texts, tutorials) as well as the AI for this demo to meet this objective. We also ran a lot of playtests and worked in conjunction with Microsoft’s people who have been really resourceful on this matter, and we feel that we found the right balance for a lot of gamer to have fun with this demo and still find it challenging.
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Here's a Q&A talking about other aspects of the demo and the final build:

http://www.msxbox-world.com/xbox360...nviction-Interview-with-Ubisoft-Montreal.html
 
That was one of the best launch trailers I've ever seen. Absolutely fantastic.
 
When he looked up into the broken mirror and you hear "I will stop at nothing to learn the truth." in the background, it gave me chills. Very nice Ubisoft.
 
I absolutely love the "I have a message for anyone who stands in my way....pray" ah man Fisher is a bad ass. I'm pumped for this game.
 
With Johnny Cash playing in the background...****ing awesome trailer.

And Solidus, I hear what your saying. I really respect your opinion and understand where your coming from. I think the temptation franchises have to copy from other recently successful ones is something that bothers me as a gamer. I'm actually worried about the stealth genre...because I've noticed that it's not even a genre anymore. Games like Splinter Cell Conviction, hell even Double Agent, and Metal Gear Solid 4 get listed under Action/Adventure now. The stealth field is probably as thin now as it's been in a long time since it's creation.

That stealth trailer has me feeling hopeful. And really, the challenge of being stealthy in a level has always been a self imposed one for me. I ghost Splinter Cell 1 as best I can, even though there's no incentive whatsoever for it.
 
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