The Amazing Spider-Man 2 The Amazing Spider-Man 2 General Discussion - - - - - - Part 40

[Spideyfan117]

Didn't the storage locker have a "happy birthday" caption on it or something?

Yeah, because it was tweeted on Dane Dehaan's birthday.

 

[Vid Electricz]

it's just the aspects he mentions in his post

it's in no way a stretch that "Peter the scientist" is also "Peter the nerd", those elements obviously go hand in hand. also, he likes to photograph things, which also is no stretch when he is what I mentioned before. Loner, yes, that also goes hand in hand with all of the above. "Peter the guy who dented the goal post" what? that is not an aspect of the character, that was a little gag in the middle of the movie. "Peter the *****e" Peter did not help the store clerk because he was in an angry state and the clerk ticked him of even more. In what other way is Peter a *****e?

Obviously, I was pointing more towards the overarching idea of Peter being portrayed as a Mary Sue, rather than overly specific details like denting a goal post.

 

[TeeKay]

Peter doing multiple things instead of being a simplified stereotype, how absurd

and you just said Peter the scientist and Peter the nerd separately, like those elements are so wildly different that they couldn't go hand in hand. your post kinda lost credibility right there

There's no problem giving Peter those personalities, the problem was that those personalities never had time to play out and he seemed to be chaning from a brooding teenager, to a scientist, to a skateboarder. It was just all over the place imo.

I do, I'm not so sure about you though.

Are you trying to saying I was bashing TASM? All the criticisms I brought up weren't bashing, they were genuine problems I had and even though I'm in the minority, there's also some people who share the same concerns I have with the film.

 

[TheWallCrawler]

Obviously, I was pointing more towards the overarching idea of Peter being portrayed as a Mary Sue, rather than overly specific details like denting a goal post.

Well it was TeeKay that said those overly specific details and not me. I was saying that those points in his post that are supposed to prove "how many aspects they are trying to cram on Peter's character" are completely absurd in the way how most of them easily fit on one character

 

[Whiskey Tango]

Are you trying to saying I was bashing TASM?

I'm saying I wasn't bashing Raimi like you were inferring, and I've said it several times now, but it doesn't seem to be soaking in.

 

[TheWallCrawler]

There's no problem giving Peter those personalities, the problem was that those personalities never had time to play out and he seemed to be chaning from a brooding teenager, to a scientist, to a skateboarder. It was just all over the place imo.

I never noticed that character was radically "changing". I was just seeing a guy showing different sides of himself and how that person reacts to different situations. I don't think he suddenly changed to a *****e because he reacted in a ***** like way to something. btw what part did you mean when you said *****e?

 

[TeeKay]

Well it was TeeKay that said those overly specific details and not me. I was saying that those points in his post that are supposed to prove "how many aspects they are trying to cram on Peter's character" are completely absurd in the way how most of them easily fit on one character

Yeah putting those aspects within the character is all well and good but they never have time to play out. That was my disdain towards it, not the personalities themselves but the fact that we never spend time to get to know these personalities within the character. Thing is, you already know Peter because you read the comics, I'm looking at this as somebody who has no idea about the character at all.

 

[TeeKay]

I never noticed that character was radically "changing". I was just seeing a guy showing different sides of himself and how that person reacts to different situations. I don't think he suddenly changed to a *****e because he reacted in a ***** like way to something. btw what part did you mean when you said *****e?

I wanted to say dick. That's more appropriate. He missed Cpt Stacy's funeral. I know he was there but Gwen didn't see him. Not only that, he didn't even give Gwen a shoulder to cry on and support after her dad died. Then he breaks up with her the same day her father's funeral was. Then he totally broke Cpt Stacy's promise at the end of the film with his final words to Gwen. Are you kidding me? Who’s bright idea was it to add that? I don’t care if it’s too foreshadowing Gwen’s death; focus on your first film. This scene just destroyed any and all character development it had going for Peter Parker. You break the promise of a dead guy? His last wishes? Really? Really?That was ********

 

[JOE]

He wanted to distance himself as much as possible from her because he feels responsible for her father's death, not to mention his dying wish to "leave Gwen out of it". I'd hardly call him a "dick".

 

[TeeKay]

So the best way was to skip the funeral of his girlfriend's dad whom he feels responsible for his death? Then he shouldn't have broken a dead man's last wish even I would never go as far as do something like that. The whole 'hes just a teenager argument' is just a poor excuse people use to defend Peter's decision in that scene. He should be able to distinguish between right and wrong.

I'm saying I wasn't bashing Raimi like you were inferring, and I've said it several times now, but it doesn't seem to be soaking in.

I never said you were either.

 

[Spideyfan117]

He wanted to distance himself as much as possible from her because he feels responsible for her father's death, not to mention his dying wish to "leave Gwen out of it". I'd hardly call him a "dick".

Yup, and he feels bad when Gwen is further saddened by him trying to keep Captain Stacy's wish. Peter has selfishly put people he loves in danger in the comics (and in previous film and animation series) before. Those moments usually have serious consequences. Nothing really new here.

 

[Vid Electricz]

Big difference is that in the comics, Captain Stacy's dying wish is to "take care of Gwen", not "leave her out of it."

 

[TeeKay]

It's getting hilarious at how Whiskey is dancing around some of your points whilst flat out ignoring others. lol.

"Wow! That really makes for some great, interesting, dynamic relationship drama!-" said every CW teen drama ever.


His point---------------->

your head.

I would go as far and say the Gwen and peter relationship was some CW teen drama but it lingers towards that according to the explanation Whiskey gave for them falling for each other.

Big difference is that in the comics, Captain Stacy's dying wish is to "take care of Gwen", not "leave her out of it."

I didn't have a problem with Cpt Stacy telling Peter to stay away from Gwen, my problem was Peter breaking that promise because it negates everything he had learnt in the film.

 

[HanShotFirst]

This forum's ignore function is kinda useless cause you can see blocked posts when someone else quotes them. What the hell Hype? It's like walkin on mine field I have to be extra careful :P

 

[Spideyfan117]

Big difference is that in the comics, Captain Stacy's dying wish is to "take care of Gwen", not "leave her out of it."

Good thing I didn't say "Peter selfishly broke Captain Stacy's promise in the comics," then. I was referring to the more general struggle Peter has with doing what he wants with his personal life and as Spider-man. It doesn't always work out favorably for him when he decides he's going to stay in a relationship with someone when he knows full well the risk that goes along with it.

Bottom line is this, Peter was obviously an emotional mess at the end of TASM. He was sad that Captain Stacy died. He wanted to honor his wishes. But he also loves Gwen and wants to make her happy, especially after losing her father. This is a moral dilemma made worse because of the multiple emotions accompanying it. It makes me question what I would do in a similar situation. He was faced with a choice and he chose what other incarnations of the character often choose: to be Spider-man and keep the girl.

 

[IronSpider6]

http://thedailybugle.tumblr.com/ new daily bugle post

 

[Picard Sisko]

I hope so! Peter Parker, whilst an everyman in some ways, is an effective character, because we can relate to him as a person/his struggles, etc... Not because he's a Mary Sue type who's cool, and good looking and super smart, and athletic and well dressed, etc... that we're meant to project ourselves on to.

Garfield is a great Peter Parker, he just needs a great script!

I can agree with this!

 

[Vid Electricz]

Good thing I didn't say "Peter selfishly broke Captain Stacy's promise in the comics," then. I was referring to the more general struggle Peter has with doing what he wants with his personal life and as Spider-man. It doesn't always work out favorably for him when he decides he's going to stay in a relationship with someone when he knows full well the risk that goes along with it.

You said:

Peter has selfishly put people he loves in danger in the comics (and in previous film and animation series) before. Those moments usually have serious consequences. Nothing really new here.

The difference is that in the comics, Peter was naive enough and without the guidance to steer him away from these poor decisions. In the comics, Peter is confident enough to believe he can protect Gwen (with Capt Stacy's approval). In the comics, he is told by a wise "father figure" to leave her out of it completely, thereby sparring her life with certainty. The approach in the comics and the result of the unfavourable outcome for Peter is completely different than in TASM.

Just saying that making Peter redact his promise to Stacy makes him come off as selfish and inconsiderate, as though he's learned almost nothing throughout the course of the film.

Bottom line is this, Peter was obviously an emotional mess at the end of TASM. He was sad that Captain Stacy died. He wanted to honor his wishes. But he also loves Gwen and wants to make her happy, especially after losing her father. This is a moral dilemma made worse because of the multiple emotions accompanying it. It makes me question what I would do in a similar situation. He was faced with a choice and he chose what other incarnations of the character often choose: to be Spider-man and keep the girl.

Yes, but in a completely different context that puts him in a poor light. They tried to emulate the "moral dilemma" from SM1, but it was half-hearted and redacted almost immediately (those are the best kind ). If he really cared for Gwen, he would let her go. He has the loss of two father figures to inform this decision.

 

[TeeKay]

Based on trailers though, it looks like Peter is turning more into classic Peter Parker… anyone agree? That whole scene with him making up excuses for Aunt May for example...

That whole chimney scene with Aunt May had me rolling.

 

[Smoke87]

The heart breaking part is we know where peter's is going to get him in the end. He doesn't.

From my view, it wasn't fair to ask peter to stay away from gwen (though cpt Stacy was justified). Agreeing to the promise at the time is also understandable, and he even tried keeping it, but his feelings for gwen are too strong. These are 2 people in love and if I was in peters place I'd have done the same. It's easy to make bad choices especially when you are young and in love. So yes peter has made a choice against Stacy's wishes that will lead to gwens death, but that is in the character of peter parker and it will make the death that much more tragic in the end.

 

[Vid Electricz]

I didn't have a problem with Cpt Stacy telling Peter to stay away from Gwen, my problem was Peter breaking that promise because it negates everything he had learnt in the film.

If Stacy had said "Take care of Gwen" or "Protect Gwen", then it would be a moot point, but Peter is flat out ignoring wise advice from a quasi father figure trying to protect his daughter's life. Peter decides that his wants and desires are ultimately more important than those of the dying man he made the promise to, or the woman he loves life.

 

[Spideyfan93]

The composition of this is AWWWWKWARD.

 

[TeeKay]

Yes, but in a completely different context that puts him in a poor light. They tried to emulate the "moral dilemma" from SM1, but it was half-hearted and redacted almost immediately (those are the best kind ). If he really cared for Gwen, he would let her go. He has the loss of two father figures to inform this decision.

No but they have to kill off Gwen in order for him to finally learn responsibility. Peter's last line to Gwen "yeah but those are the best kind" was ********. It's bad writing, plain and simple, especially when Peter was supposed to have accomplished his much needed self-realization in which he embraced the responsibilities that came along with his powers, he ends up back to square one.

If he'll learn about responsibilities when Gwen dies, what did Uncle Ben die for then? That was whole point of his death, and the lesson Peter should have drawn from it. Uncle Ben's death doesn't even set him on the path to responsibility (he even failed to acknowledge he might have been a tad bit responsible, and thus prefers to go on a vengeful crusade) and top of that he fails to catch the killer.

Then Captain Stacy dies too. Peter saw the man who was so hell-bent on arresting him draw his last breath after a moving speech in which he finally believed in Spidey's good will and legitimacy,asks him to stay away from his beloved daughter so she would be safe ( See the similarities from Raimi's SM1 when Norman's last words were, "Peter don't tell Harry") and Peter's says leaves Gwen to grieve on her own, he's somewhat responsible for Cpt Stacy's death and then he breaks up with her.

Then out of nowhere he breaks his promise?WOW.JUST.WOW...Two successful deaths in the course of one film and he still has to learn with ANOTHER death?? What kind of character development is that? That was poor writing imo.

 

[Marvel Spider]

The composition of this is AWWWWKWARD.

That's fan art, right? Where'd you find it?

 

[Spidey_62]

The composition of this is AWWWWKWARD.

QUALITY right there.