The Avengers The Avengers: News and Speculation - Part 27A sub-se - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 28

[bubbadoom]

Star Wars was conceived as a trilogy.

You don't really believe that do you?

Vader clearly was not the focus of the movie in the original film, he was not Luke's dad at that time, and was killed in the original cut of the film.

It was only after the success of the first film that Lucas announced that SW was to be a "trilogy or trilogies" - which he has since apparently given up on.

 

[Scarecrow_King]

You don't really believe that do you?

Vader clearly was not the focus of the movie in the original film, he was not Luke's dad at that time, and was killed in the original cut of the film.

It was only after the success of the first film that Lucas announced that SW was to be a "trilogy or trilogies" - which he has since apparently given up on.

How exactly has he given up on that? There have been 2 trilogies. Seems like the opposite of "giving up" on that.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

so george decided to name the film "episode 4" and just leave it at that? haha.. George is a bit of an idiot at times, but... to think he'd simply do that makes me wonder what people are smoking!

 

[Alexei Belyakov]

Well then you're gonna get disappointed time and time again.

True, but I've also been satisfied by many CBMs: Batman (1989), Batman Returns (1992), X-Men (2000), Spider-Man (2002), X2 (2003), Spider Man 2 (2004), Sin City (2005), Batman Begins (2005), 300 (2007), Iron Man (2008), The Incredible Hulk (2008), TDK (2008), Watchmen (2009), X-Men First Class (2011). Hopefully, studios will continue to make truly great CBMs & not make the sole purpose of adapting these stories a "demand for popcorn". I'm expecting TDKR & MOS to go on the list above, as well as Mangold's Wolverine film & Slade's Daredevil reboot. Marvel Studios I'm no longer sure about. I want The Avengers to be incredible, but based on this years MCU films I'm not exactly feeling confident. Cap had a glorious first trailer & virtually perfect casting, so I've been fooled before. While I have faith in Whedon, he's not in charge. At the end of the day, its Feige's show.

 

[Scarecrow_King]

so george decided to name the film "episode 4" and just leave it at that? haha.. George is a bit of an idiot at times, but... to think he'd simply do that makes me wonder what people are smoking!

actually, it was only released under the title Star Wars. when it became clear that they were making more, it was renamed as Episode IV: A New Hope.

 

[Xeno]

As fun as Golden Age superhero-dom can be, let's face it: Cap's introduction to the general public did not really begin until 1964, with Avengers #4. Nobody (still alive) became a fanboi of Captain America in 1941; and the kids who *did* pick up the comic during the war years understood it for what it was --- flag-waving propaganda. Golden Age Cap wasn't even part of the Marvel mythos --- hell, he wasn't even Marvel, but part of Timely Comics.

The Golden Age adventures of Cap that anybody can even recount are strictly retroactive stories from the Invaders comic of the 70s. Cap's story really begins in 1964 in the ice; everything before that (including the godawful non-canonical failed revivals in the postwar 40s and 50s) is just prologue and backstory.

So no, I don't believe Marvel Studios needs to focus a trilogy on a propaganda-rag-for-kiddies Golden Age character who had little connection or continuity with his Silver Age revival...the Cap we all know and love.



Tell them that Marvel hasn't answered that question in 70+ years; why the hell would they start now? In all seriousness, I'm starting to latch on to this Internet blogosphere "arc reactor/cosmic cube parallel" theory that, if it exists in the script anywhere beyond the overly speculative minds of bored fanboys, could wind up uniting the four major Avengers. Recent info about Banner's story in the Avengers --- the Banner-Black Widow scene where she tells him that the Tesseract emits gamma radiation, the same kind that gave rise to the Hulk --- seems to back that up. So now, if you postulate that the Super Serum was somehow derived from that same cosmic energy, and that gave Steve the superhuman ability to survive in a block of ice for 70 years....

....Just sayin'.

The theory that gamma radiation has something to do with the effects pf the Super Soldier serum on Steve Rogers isn't so far-fetched when one considers the evidence in the movies. Banner's attempt to recreate the serum, under military guidance, focused on gamma radiation in some way. Perhaps Dr, Erskine's "Vita-Rays" were gamma radiation by another name. When Banner came up with the serum he needed to use the radiation to activate its effects, as Erskine did with Steve. Only, like the flawed serum Erskine used on Johann Schmidt, Banner got the formula wrong and instead ended up transforming into a monstrous version of his own id. Whereas in Steve's case the formula and radiation brought forth his inner goodness and morality in perfected human form.

It is intriguing that Joe Johnston and Kevin Feige said that Captain America's strength will possibly increase after his unthawing. Johnston made it sound as if the producers and writers have conceived of Cap evolving beyond the limits he had in the comics. I don't know if that idea is being pursued still or if it relates to the gamma radiation angle, though.

 

[Xeno]

How exactly has he given up on that? There have been 2 trilogies. Seems like the opposite of "giving up" on that.

Lucas's original plans called for a third trilogy that would be set after the events of ROTJ. Unless there has been some news about the projected trilogy that I missed, it does appear that he has abandoned those plans.

 

[WildcatNC]

The theory that gamma radiation has something to do with the effects pf the Super Soldier serum on Steve Rogers isn't so far-fetched when one considers the evidence in the movies. Banner's attempt to recreate the serum, under military guidance, focused on gamma radiation in some way. Perhaps Dr, Erskine's "Vita-Rays" were gamma radiation by another name. When Banner came up with the serum he needed to use the radiation to activate its effects, as Erskine did with Steve. Only, like the flawed serum Erskine used on Johann Schmidt, Banner got the formula wrong and instead ended up transforming into a monstrous version of his own id. Whereas in Steve's case the formula and radiation brought forth his inner goodness and morality in perfected human form.

It is intriguing that Joe Johnston and Kevin Feige said that Captain America's strength will possibly increase after his unthawing. Johnston made it sound as if the producers and writers have conceived of Cap evolving beyond the limits he had in the comics. I don't know if that idea is being pursued still or if it relates to the gamma radiation angle, though.

Where was this said??


That does sound interesting, makes you wonder.

 

[Xeno]

Where was this said??


That does sound interesting, makes you wonder.

There was an article in the LA Times/Hero Complex with Johnston and the scriptwriters (and possibly Feige) where they were discussing Cap's powers and the path they wanted to take for sequels. I'll try to find it. The entire article was interesting because they talked at length about their ideas about Steve Rogers' adjustment to the modern world and the structure of future stories. That was also the interview in which Johnston said that Peggy is still alive when Steve is unfrozen and he would like to see them have that dance, I believe.

 

[Herolee10]

There was an article in the LA Times/Hero Complex with Johnston and the scriptwriters (and possibly Feige) where they were discussing Cap's powers and the path they wanted to take for sequels. I'll try to find it. The entire article was interesting because they talked at length about their ideas about Steve Rogers' adjustment to the modern world and the structure of future stories. That was also the interview in which Johnston said that Peggy is still alive when Steve is unfrozen and he would like to see them have that dance, I believe.

Where's Jack Sparrow with the Fountain of Youth when you need him huh folks?

 

[Xeno]

Where's Jack Sparrow with the Fountain of Youth when you need him huh folks?

Or Nick Fury's Infinity Formula.

 

[Herolee10]

Speaking of Carter, wasn't there a rumor awhile back that Sharon Carter may appear in the film? Whatever happened to that?lol

I wonder if Natasha and Cobie are in fact the only two female characters in this film.

 

[TheVileOne]

The rumor was that Amanda Righetti was cast in the movie, and she had a short scene at the end of Cap as a SHIELD agent. So we suspected perhaps if she was coming back maybe she was Sharon Carter. Though I don't know if it was ever confirmed if she's actually in the movie and if she's just playing a random SHIELD agent or perhaps Carter.

The movie looks so jam-packed, it is hard to see if they'd even be able to work in Sharon Carter.

 

[cherokeesam]

The theory that gamma radiation has something to do with the effects pf the Super Soldier serum on Steve Rogers isn't so far-fetched when one considers the evidence in the movies. Banner's attempt to recreate the serum, under military guidance, focused on gamma radiation in some way. Perhaps Dr, Erskine's "Vita-Rays" were gamma radiation by another name. When Banner came up with the serum he needed to use the radiation to activate its effects, as Erskine did with Steve. Only, like the flawed serum Erskine used on Johann Schmidt, Banner got the formula wrong and instead ended up transforming into a monstrous version of his own id. Whereas in Steve's case the formula and radiation brought forth his inner goodness and morality in perfected human form.

It is intriguing that Joe Johnston and Kevin Feige said that Captain America's strength will possibly increase after his unthawing. Johnston made it sound as if the producers and writers have conceived of Cap evolving beyond the limits he had in the comics. I don't know if that idea is being pursued still or if it relates to the gamma radiation angle, though.

I like your thinkin', xeno. Sounds perfectly plausible that Vita-Rays might actually be gamma rays, and there we have another piece of the puzzle fitting into place. Hell, I think this "Arc Reactor/Cosmic Cube Energy" theory is awesome....I wish Stan the Man had thought it up a long time ago. t:

actually, it was only released under the title Star Wars. when it became clear that they were making more, it was renamed as Episode IV: A New Hope.

We've gotten wayyyy off Avengers, but just a quick correction: yes, Star Wars was always just Star Wars until the second trilogy emerged, and fans started necessarily calling it A New Hope; but the "Episode IV: A New Hope" was *always* there since 1977, on the opening crawl. It confused a hell of a lot of us, and people (myself included) back then were wondering what happened to the other three episodes.

 

[Thebumwhowalks]

We've gotten wayyyy off Avengers, but just a quick correction: yes, Star Wars was always just Star Wars until the second trilogy emerged, and fans started necessarily calling it A New Hope; but the "Episode IV: A New Hope" was *always* there since 1977, on the opening crawl. It confused a hell of a lot of us, and people (myself included) back then were wondering what happened to the other three episodes.

No, it wasn't. They only added the episode IV: ANH title to the opening crawl when they re-released the film in cinemas a couple of years later, in 79 or something.
He did plan on sequels, and had storyline ideas for events that took place before epIV though, but these all went through re-writes and such, he didn't exactly know what he was going to do next, although some ideas survived.

 

[cherokeesam]

No, it wasn't. They only added the episode IV: ANH title to the opening crawl when they re-released the film in cinemas a couple of years later, in 79 or something.
He did plan on sequels, and had storyline ideas for events that took place before epIV though, but these all went through re-writes and such, he didn't exactly know what he was going to do next, although some ideas survived.

Bull ******' crap.
I was there in 1977, opening week. As an 11-year old kid. First thing me and my buddies and cousins saw was "Episode IV: A New Hope," and we were already wondering "WTF." It became a hot topic of conversation in the newspapers in the following weeks.

 

[Neo_3]

I wasn't there, but I read right now that it was added to the 1981 version. The first time on video (minus BETA) had the A New Hope.

 

[Shadowlord X]

The storyline for the Star Wars movies has changed drastically multiple times over the years. The last I read about it's origins (which was years ago in Starlog magazine, way before the 2nd trilogy of movies) was that it was originally titled:

Star Wars: the story of Mace Windu

Then the title character was changed to ______ Starkiller, then Luke Skywalker.

Also Episodes I - III were originally very different:
Episode I told the origin of the Jedi
Episode II told the origin of Obi-Wan Kenobi
Episode III told the rise and fall of Luke's father who had recieved the _______ Starkiller name by this point.

That whole series has changed so much so many times I doubt GL even remembers all the details.

 

[Rock Sexton]

The theory that gamma radiation has something to do with the effects pf the Super Soldier serum on Steve Rogers isn't so far-fetched when one considers the evidence in the movies. Banner's attempt to recreate the serum, under military guidance, focused on gamma radiation in some way. Perhaps Dr, Erskine's "Vita-Rays" were gamma radiation by another name. When Banner came up with the serum he needed to use the radiation to activate its effects, as Erskine did with Steve. Only, like the flawed serum Erskine used on Johann Schmidt, Banner got the formula wrong and instead ended up transforming into a monstrous version of his own id. Whereas in Steve's case the formula and radiation brought forth his inner goodness and morality in perfected human form.

It is intriguing that Joe Johnston and Kevin Feige said that Captain America's strength will possibly increase after his unthawing. Johnston made it sound as if the producers and writers have conceived of Cap evolving beyond the limits he had in the comics. I don't know if that idea is being pursued still or if it relates to the gamma radiation angle, though.

Gamma Rays and Vita Rays are two separate things. I don't know how anyone can argue against that.

 

[scifiwolf]

I'm loving the idea of Steve's power expanding, driving home the SUPER in the SUPERhero. Not enough of that in TFA. I loved the displays of superhuman strength (the punching bag at the end was my fav) and would like to see more of that.

 

[Xeno]

Gamma Rays and Vita Rays are two separate things. I don't know how anyone can argue against that.

Have Vita Rays ever been defined in the MCU or the comics? The concept seems undefined enough to be flexible in the MCU. The Movieverse changes a lot of things from the comics, anyway. For instance, the Hulk's origin has changed drastically, from Banner's transformation being caused by a gamma bomb to a flawed Super Soldier serum knockoff. It wouldn't be too much of a stretch to have gamma rays and Vita Rays turn out to be the same thing, either because of a mistake by Erskine and Stark or because it was a code name chosen to prevent the Nazis from discovering the exact nature of the process.

 

[Rock Sexton]

I'm loving the idea of Steve's power expanding, driving home the SUPER in the SUPERhero. Not enough of that in TFA. I loved the displays of superhuman strength (the punching bag at the end was my fav) and would like to see more of that.

I'm dying to see the parkour and gymnast style moves ..... not just him leaping on, over, or off things.

 

[Iceman]

Also Episodes I - III were originally very different:
Episode I told the origin of the Jedi
Episode II told the origin of Obi-Wan Kenobi
Episode III told the rise and fall of Luke's father who had recieved the _______ Starkiller name by this point.

Damn, that sounds so much better.

 

[Xeno]

I'm loving the idea of Steve's power expanding, driving home the SUPER in the SUPERhero. Not enough of that in TFA. I loved the displays of superhuman strength (the punching bag at the end was my fav) and would like to see more of that.

I love that idea, too. I've wanted Cap to be stronger since I was a little kid. Having him grow more powerful in the movies makes sense since the Hulk and the Abomination both used variations of the Super Soldier serum and are exponentially more powerful than Cap.

It is always said that Steve Rogers is merely at the peak of human potential, but not superhuman. The scene with the punching bag argues otherwise. I don't think it would be possible for even the strongest normal man to do that sort of damage. He would have to have at least limited super strength to do that, wouldn't you think?

 

[bubbadoom]

actually, it was only released under the title star wars. When it became clear that they were making more, it was renamed as episode iv: A new hope.

thank you