The Avengers The Avengers: News and Speculation - Part 27A sub-se - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 50

[J.Howlett]

But Universal owns the rights to produce the TIH DVDs.

I'm sure Marvel/Disney will have to pay some type of licensing fee in order to do a box set of the films under the Marvel/Disney label.

 

[Poni_Boy]

I think it is. Especially if it has that supposed voice over at the beginning explaining the status quo of this Universe as it stands up to that point.
My first exposure to Firefly actually came from watching Serenity.
I loved that movie.
It was after that that I found out about the entire series that preceded it.
Whedon proved (to me) that he was able to make an interesting, coherent movie without me having to go thru the cinematic version of it's "back issues".
(but I wanted to, just the same)

Yep, and so many other fans of that franchise as well. That proves, like I said earlier, you can have two standalone properties in the same universe that both coincide with each other and can be enjoyed separately as well. Which is obviously what they are attempting with Avengers.

 

[J.Howlett]

I think it is. Especially if it has that supposed voice over at the beginning explaining the status quo of this Universe as it stands up to that point.

Huh. Interesting, a voice over. Has that been confirmed or pure speculation?

 

[Poni_Boy]

KF has said in multiple interviews you won't have to have seen any of the previous films to enjoy the Avengers.

You are correct. Moreso considering your profile pic.

 

[Chewy]

Huh. Interesting, a voice over. Has that been confirmed or pure speculation?

One of the visual effects artists talked about it. Said it was voiced over by a female SHIELD agent (speculated to be Cobie)

I believe he was the guy who got fired for violating his NDA

 

[J.Howlett]

You're saying that neither TIH, Thor, Cap or IM were "real stories"? Really?

Only the first Iron Man is a real story. Captain America would've been a real story had it not been for the awful prologue and epilogue. I've said my piece on those two bone headed decisions.

And make no mistake, Thor's my favorite film of the Universe, so far. It's the best but it's my favorite. But, it's not a standalone at all. Most of it is.

 

[J.Howlett]

One of the visual effects artists talked about it. Said it was voiced over by a female SHIELD agent (speculated to be Cobie)

I believe he was the guy who got fired for violating his NDA

Interesting. Hopefully with the voice over, they'll show images from the previous films in an unique way.

 

[Poni_Boy]

Only the first Iron Man is a real story. Captain America would've been a real story had it not been for the awful prologue and epilogue. I've said my piece on those two bone headed decisions.

And make no mistake, Thor's my favorite film of the Universe, so far. It's the best but it's my favorite. But, it's not a standalone at all. Most of it is.

I honestly have no idea if you're being serious or not.

If you are, then what you're saying is that because you didn't like certain aspects of those films they are not "real" stories. Correct?

 

[Drummerdude7]

Only the first Iron Man is a real story. Captain America would've been a real story had it not been for the awful prologue and epilogue. I've said my piece on those two bone headed decisions.

And make no mistake, Thor's my favorite film of the Universe, so far. It's the best but it's my favorite. But, it's not a standalone at all. Most of it is.

Thor gets better and better with every viewing. But as opposed to Iron Man, it's a lot more SHIELD heavy. Definitely more of a prologue than Iron Man was, though I'd say IM 2 was more of a prologue than Thor

 

[Drummerdude7]

I honestly have no idea if you're being serious or not.

If you are, then what you're saying is that because you didn't like certain aspects of those films they are not "real" stories. Correct?

I think he's trying to say they are far more tied to making one big universe and foreshadowing the avengers than films like Iron Man that rely more on the singular story about the character. That's how I'm interpreting it lol

 

[Chewy]

Thor gets better and better with every viewing. But as opposed to Iron Man, it's a lot more SHIELD heavy. Definitely more of a prologue than Iron Man was, though I'd say IM 2 was more of a prologue than Thor

SHIELD in Thor is very organic though. If the Avengers wasn't coming it could have been random FBI agents and it wouldn't have hurt the film at all.

The only ones that I wouldn't consider standalone are IM2 and Cap. Cap because of the bookends.

IM, TIH, and Thor work great as standalone films. CA works great as a direct prequel to Avengers.

 

[Poni_Boy]

Thor gets better and better with every viewing. But as opposed to Iron Man, it's a lot more SHIELD heavy. Definitely more of a prologue than Iron Man was, though I'd say IM 2 was more of a prologue than Thor

Iron Man 2 was supposed to be released last year as the final solo film before Avengers. Thor was supposed to come out the year Iron Man 2 did. If they had released the films in that (planned) order, I think it would have helped the franchise flow way more smoothly. Unfortunately, what we did get didn't help much.

 

[J.Howlett]

I honestly have no idea if you're being serious or not.

If you are, then what you're saying is that because you didn't like certain aspects of those films they are not "real" stories. Correct?

There are certain things that don't pay off in Iron Man 2, Thor, or Captain America within each film's narrative for them to be completely standalone. That's my opinion on it....

SHIELD had a pay off in the first Iron Man with them helping Pepper at the end. So, in theory, their place in the story works.

 

[Poni_Boy]

I think he's trying to say they are far more tied to making one big universe and foreshadowing the avengers than films like Iron Man that rely more on the singular story about the character. That's how I'm interpreting it lol

Well of course that's true, when IM came out MS didn't know if there even WAS going to be an Avengers movie. It all rested on the reception of that film so obviously it was sculpted with more finesse and distance than the rest.

But saying that none of the MS films are "real stories" is laughable.

 

[Chewy]

Iron Man 2 was supposed to be released last year as the final solo film before Avengers. Thor was supposed to come out the year Iron Man 2 did. If they had released the films in that (planned) order, I think it would have helped the franchise flow way more smoothly. Unfortunately, what we did get didn't help much.

Yeah Thor and Ant-Man were originally supposed to be 2009 films. Before the writers strike delayed everything

I believe CA and IM2 would have been 2010, Avengers 2011

 

[J.Howlett]

Iron Man 2 was supposed to be released last year as the final solo film before Avengers. Thor was supposed to come out the year Iron Man 2 did. If they had released the films in that (planned) order, I think it would have helped the franchise flow way more smoothly. Unfortunately, what we did get didn't help much.

Huh, I didn't know that. Makes sense in hindsight.

 

[Drummerdude7]

Iron Man 2 was supposed to be released last year as the final solo film before Avengers. Thor was supposed to come out the year Iron Man 2 did. If they had released the films in that (planned) order, I think it would have helped the franchise flow way more smoothly. Unfortunately, what we did get didn't help much.

I agree, woulda helped considering it was super SHIELD heavy...wasn't as organic as the agents in Thor. But I'm still happy with the way things are.

 

[J.Howlett]

Thor gets better and better with every viewing. But as opposed to Iron Man, it's a lot more SHIELD heavy. Definitely more of a prologue than Iron Man was, though I'd say IM 2 was more of a prologue than Thor

Yeah, of the five films, Thor's the most fun to watch for some reason. There are things about it that don't work but man, that cast elevates the hell out of that film.

 

[Poni_Boy]

Yeah Thor and Ant-Man were originally supposed to be 2009 films. Before the writers strike delayed everything

I believe CA and IM2 would have been 2010, Avengers 2011

Yep. Thor had two straight years of production delays. So much so that the SEGA tie-in game was done a year before the movie began filming; which made them have to go back and change lots of visuals in the game.

 

[Poni_Boy]

Huh, I didn't know that. Makes sense in hindsight.

Yep. Marvel Studios doesn't have bottomless pockets that would help them avoid major production issues such as writers strikes, raises for certain actors and the very best CG effects. They are still a fledgling production house with only a small budget to work off of. A lot of the problems with the previous four films are because the financial resources weren't available. If Avengers pays off, though, that will change.

 

[Drummerdude7]

Yeah, of the five films, Thor's the most fun to watch for some reason. There are things about it that don't work but man, that cast elevates the hell out of that film.

Absolutely. My girlfriend knew who Thor was but didnt know the details, an she loved Iron Man, and now she loves Thor more than IM1. She killed herself laughing when Thor is at breakfast. The cast is great and the film did a phenomenal job blending reality with fantasy.

 

[wobbly]

Totally disagree with dismissing the Marvel films so far as just being 'warm ups' to Avengers and not being 'real stories'.

IM1 was a self contained story with no obvious connection to a grander scheme until the post credits Fury scene (which a lot of the audience would have missed first time round!)

TIH had the Super Soldier connection, but that was handled as a fundamental part of its self contained story (knowledge of Cap, Shield, or the Avengers was not required at all to get the idea). There was the last bit with Ross & Stark, but that was originally meant to be post credits as well (Marvel got skittish before release and thought promoting Stark as appearing would help get more bums on seats).

IM2 had the most obvious connections to Avengers within its story, but it was still a self contained story (Tbh I personally think the complaints about the Shield/Avengers references in IM2 are overblown).

Thor had Coulson and Shield, but then the story could have used any government security agency in the role they served. Hawkeye's brief cameo was the most obvious link to Avengers, and again the story was entirely self contained. No need to see the other films at all to enjoy it.

Lastly Captain America, again a self contained story. The only direct links to Avengers coming with the opening discovery scene, Howard Stark's character, and the ending scene with Fury (another one bumped up from post credits from what I have read).

Bottom line is all the Marvel films have been self contained 'real' stories which can be enjoyed independent of each other. IM2 was the only when where knowledge of Fury was presumed within the story (assumption being that anyone who watched IM1 would have gotten round to knowing about that one's post credits scene).

 

[Spideyfan93]

I remember when Thor and Cap got delayed back in the day and it depressed the hell out of me for a couple weeks but the wait was worth it in my opinion. Even though those 2 films weren't brought to fully realized potential, they are fun stand alone movies.

 

[J.Howlett]

Yep. Marvel Studios doesn't have bottomless pockets that would help them avoid major production issues such as writers strikes, raises for certain actors and the very best CG effects. They are still a fledgling production house with only a small budget to work off of. A lot of the problems with the previous four films are because the financial resources weren't available. If Avengers pays off, though, that will change.

Thor shows that. It's the cheapest looking of the five. Again, favorite of the five, but cheapest looking of the five.

 

[Chewy]

Yep. Marvel Studios doesn't have bottomless pockets that would help them avoid major production issues such as writers strikes, raises for certain actors and the very best CG effects. They are still a fledgling production house with only a small budget to work off of. A lot of the problems with the previous four films are because the financial resources weren't available. If Avengers pays off, though, that will change.

The writer's strike probably cost us an Edgar Wright Ant-Man movie