The Avengers The Avengers: News and Speculation - Part 27A sub-se - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 51

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True and I totally understand that, it's just that some people act as if that's the way it HAS to be for this film to be huge.



Yeah but all he's saying is that Cap "eventually" became the leader in the comics and he didn't just become the leader from the get go.

Yes but he didn't just pop up as the most successful leader of the Avengers in issue 1.

I know, but I mean, three movies vs many issues of Avenger comics. If Cap is to be established as the great leader he has been in the comics, if that is gunna be portrayed in the MCU, in a three film franchise, then I think it would not be a bad idea to get that ground covered in the first film, or maybe at least later on into the film
 
Yes but he didn't just pop up as the most successful leader of the Avengers in issue 1.

When it comes down to it, Cap needs to be in charge.

This doesn't mean they can't show the progression of him becoming leader by virtue of commanding loyalty and respect from the team as the movie goes on. I would be fine with that.

In the end though, he's the leader of the Avengers. Not to mention its heart.
 
I'm not stating that it should 'Cap & The Avengers' either, but how exactly does Tony Stark 'know' any better than Steve Rogers? The man is apparently obsessed with himself and he still has skeletons in the closet. Steve, however, is the complete polar opposite. He's all heart and virtuous.

Me personally, I would prefer some prelude to the fact that Cap being the leader is his destiny. I'm not demanding for the marketing to solely be focused on Captain America though.
I meant that from Tony's perspective. HE thinks he knows best. His whole persona is based around his ego. So naturally he would think of himself as in charge, no?
 
I think the idea of Cap being the leader in this flick is flawed. The whole point is that he's not the leader. Stark knows best, why should he listen to this fogey from the 40s? Thor's a god, what could he glean from a mortal in regards to stopping his own brother? The idea of them learning to respect him and value his leadership should/will be one of the pillars of the film. Not something that's present from minute one.

Marketing it as "Captain America and his Avengers" isn't exactly a great idea

This is all correct.
 
A question to everyone:

Each of the following have a good underlying mythos and IMO could have really good movies based upon them. However they all come with risks for blockbuster success, especially being C and D list characters wrt GA knowledge. What sort of production budget would you attribute to movies based on the following characters in light of their potential for BO success?

BLACK PANTHER
IMMORTAL IRON FIST
DR. STRANGE
BLACK WIDOW
While my guess is that dr.strange would require the biggest budget based on his powers or maybe black panther with locations and scope...i guess that marvel/disney will stick right around 130-170 million for production budgets.
 
Some people have complained. I didn't point specifically at you.

RDJ is naturally thrust into the spotlight. He's the most popular character, he's the most popular actor. Marketing will reflect that.

There's a reason Darth Maul was the most prominently featured character on every piece of marketing for the Episode I rerelease.

Yep. Some people just can't let it go, even though it's obvious what's going on is targeting marketing for a specific demographic that doesn't affect the movie itself.

And I would argue the fact that Iron Man is more important to The Avengers franchise than Darth Maul is the Star Wars prequels. But you can't swing a dick without hitting some Darth Maul figures and promo crap anywhere SW stuff is sold.
 
It's not like Iron Man/Stark founded and lead the Avengers in the comics or anything.

Oh wait...
 
Yeah me too, but what I meant, is the people going to see it, who have NO interest in "becoming like us", and learning to love marvel, I mean simply the ones who found a reason to go out to a movie at midnight, regardless of the film, "this movie looks good, lets go out late, I dont really care what it consists of, but it looks good"

I mean like, the kids who have no interest in the concept, or have a desire to learn about the comics and the characters.

I was one of the, changed movie goers. I went into ironman with an open mind, loved it, read about it. Then read about hulk, then learned about Thor. And from thor it took off and I became a geek lol..

I dont mean people like that ^, I mean the people are are just gunna be there, to go out at midnight and who have no desire to learn about the characters, the people who will go for a social event. To me, I feel like those type of people (most likely high schoolers) would maybe, ruin the experience, you guys get what I mean?

I am completely fond of the idea of regular movie goers going to see, willing to learn about the characters and such, but I mean, the people who aren't even willing to do that.

Surely I must have made my point. hhaha

Invariably some bad comes with some good.
 
I've always thought Darth Maul was awesome, but I didn't know he was all that popular.
 
But in the MCU this hasn't been established yet and in this film should be.

This

When it comes down to it, Cap needs to be in charge.

This doesn't mean they can't show the progression of him becoming leader by virtue of commanding loyalty and respect from the team as the movie goes on. I would be fine with that.

In the end though, he's the leader of the Avengers. Not to mention its heart.

Exactly my point. EXACTLY, this isn't a many film franchise, like there are many avenger issues. This will most likely be three movies, and Cap neesd to be in Charge. Maybe not from the get go, but through out the movie, showing the progression. But it should be obvious by the the end of the movie that Cap is the leader.
 
It's not like Iron Man/Stark founded and lead the Avengers in the comics or anything.

Oh wait...


Shush with your common sense and comic references!

The fans obviously only what AMMEEERRRICCAAA FUUUUUU YEEAAHHHH
 
You said "I understand why Disney/Marvel is marketing the film around RDJ" followed by "but at this point, it wouldn't hurt the film's revenue stream if the marketing slowly changed the guard" which obviously means you don't understand Disney/MS' marketing strategy, regardless if you claim that you do.

Once again, how so?

To reiterate my point, I'm quite aware of why Disney/Marvel are marketing the film around RDJ/Iron Man but with May just around the corner, how exactly is this an awful idea? At best, all that's left is 10-12 tv spots and a few other minor marketing details. So please, enlighten me as to why it would be awful and damaging idea in showcasing Cap alittle more.

You're complaining about a Japanese promo poster. A poster, that was released in Japan only. For newspaper advertisements.

Please re-read my previous statements.
 
When it comes down to it, Cap needs to be in charge.

This doesn't mean they can't show the progression of him becoming leader by virtue of commanding loyalty and respect from the team as the movie goes on. I would be fine with that.

In the end though, he's the leader of the Avengers. Not to mention its heart.
Well Hawkeye and Black Widow are ultimately soldiers. They may be snarky about it but they'll fall in line if they're told someone's the leader.

Banner's that weird guy in the corner. He has no desire to lead, he can barely be talked into participating.

The power struggle between the big three is what makes them the big three. From their perspectives none of them should be falling in line. They would each individually make the "best" leader.

The bromantic triangle they should form ultimately makes that a moot point. Thor and Stark will allow Cap to assume his rightful place as leader not because they're told to, but because he's their friend, and they know he deserves to
 
Well, the Cap has military training that could come well in handy and could put him in a very strong leading position when it comes to fight a war as a group.

If this is, as Whedon says, indeed a war film, the only true soldier of the bunch, already a leader in WWII, would be a prime candidate for a leader, at least in those capacities.
 
I've always thought Darth Maul was awesome, but I didn't know he was all that popular.

His popularity is completely understandable given what else TPM had to offer, i.e., jar-jar, 'roger-roger' robots, and pod racing with the muppets.
 
I think the idea of Cap being the leader in this flick is flawed. The whole point is that he's not the leader. Stark knows best, why should he listen to this fogey from the 40s? Thor's a god, what could he glean from a mortal in regards to stopping his own brother? The idea of them learning to respect him and value his leadership should/will be one of the pillars of the film. Not something that's present from minute one.

Marketing it as "Captain America and his Avengers" isn't exactly a great idea

Thumbs up to this.
 
Well Hawkeye and Black Widow are ultimately soldiers. They may be snarky about it but they'll fall in line if they're told someone's the leader.

Banner's that weird guy in the corner. He has no desire to lead, he can barely be talked into participating.

The power struggle between the big three is what makes them the big three. From their perspectives none of them should be falling in line. They would each individually make the "best" leader.

The bromantic triangle they should form ultimately makes that a moot point. Thor and Stark will allow Cap to assume his rightful place as leader not because they're told to, but because he's their friend, and they know he deserves to

Bingo :up:
 
Also I believe the audio/video being out of sync is a longtime problem on Youtubes end. You might try uploading the video again.

Dude, if you knew what I had to go through to get it uploaded to YT and rendered from Sony Vegas then you wouldn't want me to upload it again, lol. It took me like a week because Sony Vegas didn't want to ****ing work, and when it did YT didn't want to work either. This is the first time I've got it to work :P

It might've been intentional, as it was my first time I'm still learning so maybe it was my fault.
 
Once again, how so?

To reiterate my point, I'm quite aware of why Disney/Marvel are marketing the film around RDJ/Iron Man but with May just around the corner, how exactly is this an awful idea? At best, all that's left is 10-12 tv spots and a few other minor marketing details. So please, enlighten me as to why it would be awful and damaging idea in showcasing Cap alittle more.

Please re-read my previous statements.

Here, you can re-red mine which it looks like you skipped over them. I'll highlight the important parts.

You're complaining about a Japanese promo poster. A poster, that was released in Japan only. For newspaper advertisements.

Do you know how Robert Downey Jr tracks in Japan compared to Chris Evans? Do you know how Iron Man tracks compared to Captain America? How about Hulk? Thor? Which Marvel Studios films have flopped and which have soared in and only in Japan?

Do you know the answers to those questions? Because I'm pretty sure the Disney/MS marketing teams does. Yet you think you know better than they do how this film should be promoted in a country that you don't even live in.

Bottom line, Japan is the only country we have evidence of that RDJ is getting the spotlight from the marketing department. If you aren't aware of what is marketable in Japan then your opinion is irrelevant; especially when you dismiss Disney/MS' marketing team like you know better than them.
 
I think the idea of Cap being the leader in this flick is flawed. The whole point is that he's not the leader. Stark knows best, why should he listen to this fogey from the 40s? Thor's a god, what could he glean from a mortal in regards to stopping his own brother? The idea of them learning to respect him and value his leadership should/will be one of the pillars of the film. Not something that's present from minute one.

Marketing it as "Captain America and his Avengers" isn't exactly a great idea

I agree with this SO much.
I'm hoping The Team, along with the casual viewer, gets educated and sees why Cap is the respected leader he is in the comics.
 
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