The Dark Knight The Dark Knight Fan Review Thread

[CrimsonDeath]

Best director: Nolan or Del Toro?

Michael Bay.

 

[zeptron]

Sweet Zombie Jesus that was a good movie.


I mean, damn! There were so many great scenes.


The one that still stands out is the Jokers "Magic trick".

 

[Sharkboy]

Yeah. I did. And what's really sad is peoples unconditional blind love for everything Nolan. Supposedly the Joker was putting on makeup to showcase how incredibly insane he is. If that's the case, at least appeal to me enough to have him paint his whole body white, and at least have his hair green. They could have easily done that. BUt they didn't, because they wanted to make sure people understood that this was "their vision". They had to show flesh tone because they had to make sure people knew. And that is a slap in the face. There were points in the story where he looked so ridiculous it became like is he supposed to be scary or not? If batman doesn't have his ears, or his cape, but everything else about him is in tact, especially his character, guess what, he still ain't Batman. People keep saying this is the best Joker ever, and he was so perfect. No. His character was perfect, but his look was ********. Nolan decided that the Joker from the comics was ridiculous and improbable. Then he took it a step further and decided that everyone else was gonna like it as well. There had to have been a moment where someone was like, "well gee, don't you think your Joker might piss people off a little". So he decided that even if it did, he didn't care. He didn't care that he was differentiating one of the most important parts of the character. And I'll be damned, people went along with it. There's things I can move past. This **** just really pisses me off. And no one on this earth can justify why I'm wrong in this way of thinking. I appreciate what we got here in TDK. But theres **** like this and my other problem that piss me off to the point where it's hard to fully support the movie like I wanted to. And to the other guy - yes, his looks are a HUGE ****in deal! I just don't understand why they couldn't make it at least LOOK like in the ****in comic.

My other main reason, and this might just be me (strangely enough because I usually have a pretty good threshold for stuff like this.), but this movie was sooooooooooo freakin depressing when it didn't have to be. I can acknowledge that it's dope how they wrote harvey, but I came out extremely depressed after watching his portrayal in the flick because it contrasted what I expected. I expected the semi *******, extremely overzealous Dent from the comics. When reading that story (talking bout TLH) you looked forward to him becoming Two Face because you knew that once it happened the **** would hit the fan and all his troubles; personal demons would be justified through his drive for revenge afterwords. And when he got his vengeance and took control over his anger and directed it outwards, he became a true villain. One you could still cheer for, and sympathize with, but mostly because his true form was finally upon him. This harvey though, he had everything going for him. He had a public image. He had a wife. He had hero status thrown upon him by Batman himself. You came to really care about Harvey, and be really apprehensive about him becoming Two Face. And when he finally did, it became more tragic because he was never really the Two Face from the comics. He looked like Two Face, but he was still Harvey. That guy attacking Jim Gordon's family wasn't Two Face, it was Harvey. And that was just sickeningly depressing. You felt for him like no one else in the movie. That angle depressed me just about as much as Heath frightened me. Add that to the fact that he looked ABSOLUTELY OUTSTANDING as Two Face, and the ending becomes all the more frustrating. How could you do that to Harvey? So you can go against the grain and have a villain win for once in theory? You wasted a character (my third favorite bat villain) for nothing. As someone pointed out earlier, they could just as easily blamed those killings on the Joker. Batman didn't have to be the villain in the end. And the fact that he was, given what they could have done, was stupid as hell to me. This also makes it really hard on future directors. Everyone keeps saying how this movie can't be topped. Well your right. Since Two Face is dead, there is no way in hell that you can follow this story up. The third film could have been just as good, but only if Two Face was the villain. It's just the logical thing to have happen. So they killed Ra's and Two Face and expect future filmmakers to be able to top this movie while remaining in the continuity set by this franchise? Of course they won't. But back to the depression angle. It hit me after the movie that I was actually feeling bad for Loeb. LOEB, a character who, in the comics was a corrupt piece of ****. It didn't have to be that way. Others like him didn't have to be sympathetic. It was just too much for me. Call me a ***** but that's just me. It just ended up feeling too real. That's my problem I guess. It was just TOO real for me. I could barely handle it. Which too his credit, is probably what Nolan was going for.

You don't unnecessarily have to like something to respect it. I loathe Lebron James, but I can easily recognize his god given ability to play basketball. It's just the **** he does in between that makes me hate him. Such is the case with the Nolan co. with me.

There are parts of Batman Forever that I LOVE. But overall, I still hate the movie. That's how Nolan's universe appeals to me. He pissed away my three favorite Bat villains. He made Ra's white, then killed it on top of that. I hated it, but I tried to live with it. He made Joker a guy who puts on clown makeup to scare people. I tried to live with it. But then you kill Two Face? When you're supposed to have learned from past mistakes you still killed TWO FACE? That's the last straw. I was looking forward to having Batman go James Bond on us and have movie after movie after movie. But Nolan has made it very hard for other directors to follow him, by taking away crucial aspects of the Bat universe. In the end I can say this, and hopefully, after all my ranting, people will understand where I'm coming from.

This was a brilliantly acted and directed film. This was a great film in Hollywood cinema terms. But, as an adamant fan of the comics, it just didn't do what I thought it was going to to for me. In fact, it differed so much so many times that It really pissed me off. I can write a whole other review from a positive movie fan's perspective. But as a follower of the comics, I'm upset at these movies and the ones who developed them. I'm not knocking anyone who loves this movie. But don't act like everything about this thing was the definitive batman experience, because it was not.


*breathes*

I love how you have Nolan nailed down to a tee! So wheres that interview you did with him where he divulged to you all this information, Id love to read that one

See, you make some great points, but you just had to shoot yourself in the foot with alot of what you said, alot of your argument is based on unfounded claims and groundless assumptions, you THINK you know what nolan was going for, you assume that Nolan dosent care for the history of the decades worth of batman, yet you pass these assumptions along as fact, because goddammit if joker isnt permawhite then he isnt joker at all right, lol.

The thing about adaptation, in my opinion (see what i did there? its my opinion not fact, so i dont p*ss anybody off) is that you can't directly adapt film straight from the comics, not when you have source material as diverse and with as much leeway for change as Batman. This is nolan's batman-verse, just like frank miller has his own, or burton and shumacher has theirs. Paul Dini and Bruce Timm have there own, Alan Moore had his own joker, these comics are a hotbed of constant change, unlike many other comics, batman has gone through so many iterations that anyone who claims theres a RIGHT way to do things is crazy.

The most important thing about adapting a work, whether its a novel, comic or another film, is to get the spirit of the work right, to really nail what that story or work was trying to convey and replicate it. Heaths joker is perfect to me, because despite his physical difference from plenty of other iterations of the character, he not only nails what the character of joker has stood for since his conception, he adds to it, he adds another dimension to the character, not just to the film but something that will be remembered and possibly incorparated into the comics one day into the future. Ironically in the scene where he most looks physically like joker, in the conference scene, he acts very unjoker like, quite somber and serious and straight to the point. It is the interrogation scene where he looks the least like the joker, with smudged facepaint, lack of a purple suit where i thought he acted the most like the joker, when batman was plummeling him on the ground and he was laughing maniacly. It is at that moment where i completely forgot he was wearing make up and on that screen i saw the JOKER.

You must not like the Burton films either, because he made even more changes from the comics, and the joker from that film? hes not the joker, hes a purple jack nicoholson with the volume turned way way up, but to you he MUST be the joker, hes PERMAWHITE!

Your point with two face i must be inclined to agree with you somewhat, I am dissapointed slightly that the character of two face was assassinated in favour of harvey dent with a burnt face. The spirit of the two face character to me was always rooted in psychosis and duality, what nolan went for was a completely different iteration all together, making two face a tragic corrupted hero, rather than a psychopath, It will continue to cause controversy amongst fans and people will either love it or hate it, I thought the harvey dent character was superb and his two face worked extremely well for the films context and message.

And my last bone to pick with you, dont tell anybody what the definitive batman experience is, you arent anybody to decide what is a proper batman experience. If it wasnt for you, then its your loss, and im sorry you were dissapointed with it, but It was for me, and by the sounds of it plenty of other people too, but youd probably think im just BLINDLY devoted to chris nolan, and can't think for myself, I must be a slave to the hype

 

[Ace of Knaves]

^great post i agree with everything you said about the joker there. and i feel the interrogation scene when his makeup is all smudged and ****ed up makes him look even more insane or maybe otherworldy. i also think the main focus of this joker should be found in his eyes, they are crazy!! the scene with gamble they appear to have no pupils just pure white eyes surrounded by black which makes him look ghost like.

 

[Schlosser85]

(to schlosser)

Did you even read the post?

Yes, his dad said anyone who doesn't like it is probably a "f-----", well that didn't stop me from enjoying it.

 

[flash13]

I have been waiting for this movie for three years. Batman Begins absolutely blew me away when I saw it and I have been hanging on every scrap of information about TDK from its inception to its completion. It was by far my most anticipated movie of all time. Well, I finally saw it this morning at a press screening in the UK... and my reaction surprised me completely.

I... had almost no opinion. No reaction. I don't know how I felt about this movie - I can't say that I hated or loved it. Nor can I say I didn't hate it or didn't love it. I was certainly not elated. Nor was I in any sense disappointed. It just... was.

I'm definitely going to see it again - hopefully after some time allowing it to sink in I will be able to realise how I felt about it. But right now, it's so weird - I have no idea. Anybody else feel like this, or am I just a freak?

your just a freak like me

 

[Paradyme]

I absolutely loved this movie. It was a masterpiece in my book, easily the best Batman film ever. If you still haven't seen it do yourself a favor and go. If you've seen it once treat yourself/your girlfriend/wife and go see it again. It's incredible and gets better with ever showing.

 

[Naite22]

That IMDB.com has voted this movie to be the best of all time, is completely understandable!... and I agree!

I live in Denmark, and the movie opened over here today (caught the midnight premier!). This movie is incredible! I was floared the whole way through! I dont want to write a review (there's no need) cause all that can be said about this movie has already been said a million times!... Definitely Oscar material! Best ****ing movie I have ever seen! The intensity was through the roof! Sometimes it made it hard to breath! With all I knew about this movie, I was proven that I in the end didn't knew ****!...

The theater was packed and the mood was high! When the movie ended, after Gordons beautiful -and right to the heart- end-speach, the film got a standing ovation for about a minute! Tears welded up in my eyes! Why the hell do some say that it takes too much time setting up for a third movie!?? It DOESN'T... They leave it open for a possible third, yes! But there's no cliffhanger, and the movie could easily stand as the last! Tragic, but true!

I said it all along, and have been rambling about it for the last 1½ weeks! The Dark Knight would end up between 95 to 100% on rotten, and it just hit 95%! I ****ing KNEW it!

Absolutely amazing movie!!! I never saw better!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[RakuMon]

^great post i agree with everything you said about the joker there. and i feel the interrogation scene when his makeup is all smudged and ****ed up makes him look even more insane or maybe otherworldy. i also think the main focus of this joker should be found in his eyes, they are crazy!! the scene with gamble they appear to have no pupils just pure white eyes surrounded by black which makes him look ghost like.

I thought Joker's eyes were most intense in the scene when he's dressed as a cop (sans makeup). Even though it's just a split second, Heath looks absolutely evil.

 

[J. J. Jameson]

You really can't compare the two.

Exactly. They're nearly polar opposites. Nolan loves realism and reality and grounding stuff to make it more comparable to actual life. Del Toro, on the other hand, relishes in fantasy and is best when he's working with characters and ideas that are larger than life.

EDIT: Holy crap! 95% on the Tomatometer! Insane!!

 

[Ace of Knaves]

haha yea. you can tell joker is about because that nails on the chalk board sound comes in, but you dont know when it'll happen. then all of a sudden bang!!

 

[Bond]

Haha, I thought it'd stop at 94%. This is awesome.

 

[NoBozos]

actually, my dad didn't use the "F" word. he used the "P" word!

I didn't mean to offend anyone when I posted that.

back to the Joker. To me, someone that paints their face is crazier than someone who turned white from being dropped in chemicals.

and I agree about the smeared makeup look in the jailhouse. I thought he looked real nasty. He just looked real sleezy throughout the whole film. He reminded me of Dustin Hoffman in "Midnight Cowboy" in that he looked like you would get fleas (or worse) if you rubbed up against him.

 

[Superman-Prime]

okay, I think that there is some thing wrong with me. I fell asleep during the first one and was hoping that this new would be way better, so i see this movie and well I fell asleep again. I couldn't watch this movie all the way through. I got really bored. .5/10

Ok... so you said 5 out of 10 and you voted a "1"?

 

[Conebone69]

Haha, I thought it'd stop at 94%. This is awesome.

Yeah, I love that this movie is doing well and all but honestly a 95% on RT?! Thats a bit much

 

[The Bruce]

I live in Denmark

Me too t: I had my mom with me. She was blown away. She doesn't give a crap about comic book movies, but Heath took her breath away. His "Magic trick" Got a roar from my theather, people were freaked out and laughing their asses off - actually the Joker made you feel like that. Freaked out and amused at the same time.

Blu-ray is a must!

 

[Blader5489]

Ibn's post made my head implode.

Good God...

 

[Cain]

hes not the joker, hes a purple jack nicoholson with the volume turned way way up

I was with you up until this point. I think you may need to familiarize yourself more with the character outside of modern comics. Please let me know what wasn't in tune with The Joker from the 40's to early 80's in that performance cause I'm curious.

 

[NoBozos]

I agree that they shouldn't kill off the bad guys at the end of every film. They should always be locked up or escape so they can fight another day.

"That's how it always ends with The Joker and me. Unresolved"

 

[Octoberist]

Yeah, I love that this movie is doing well and all but honestly a 95% on RT?! Thats a bit much

how is it too much, Conebone? Do...you want a knuckle sandwich? HMMMM JK

 

[DSET]

Michael Bay.

bay is gggg- ay

 

[believe_batman]

Thought I'd share my review, from a different perspective. I've always been a Batman fan, and I think the Dark Knight satisfies criteria for both form and content, providing a movie that not only is excellent in acting, effects, make-up, props, etc. but explores themes that challenge humanity to stand-up for its better side.

The first theme that stood out to me is, as G.K. Chesterton once said, "Not facts first: Truth first." In the decision to allow Batman to take the blame for Harvey Dent's death and the murders he committed beforehand, Gordon and Batman choose to support the capital-T TRUTH that their city's only hope lies in a strong, consistently established, justly maintained legal system over the small-t truth that Harvey Dent had lost his mind and done things that were completely against everything he truly believed.

The second theme that stood out to me is the idea that everyone has an internal knowledge of good and evil and an urge to choose the good. The Joker - in an incredible performance by Heath Ledger and a part written in a true reflection of a deep understanding of the character in the comics - is portrayed as a terrorist. Just as radical extremists demand that all people submit to their creed or be destroyed, the Joker demands that the world submit to his belief that everyone has a price, no one has values they won't abandon when the chips are down, and that someone like Batman - who gives his all to uphold order - ultimately only contributes to the chaos. Yet, the first person to truly do something the Joker doesn't expect is the criminal who tosses the detonator out the window - proving that more than the forces of chaos are at work within humans.

The last theme I saw was that self-sacrifice is the only proper response to the destructive power of selfishness. The Joker's selfish desire that everyone agree with him and experience life as he does is the perfect complement to Bruce Wayne's sacrifice of everything he holds dear to protect the freedom of others. Both characters are utterly sold out to their beliefs, and the movie presents the contrast between the two in an incredibly profound way, demonstrating that no matter what the Joker does, Batman will not sell out his beliefs and his one rule. I hope people truly take to heart the message of the power of self-sacrifice in service of your ideals and others... what a difference it could make on our streets and in our wars (where, I believe, we already demonstrate this principle in our aiding of countries that clearly don't deserve our help).

My only criticism is the way the movie treated the character of Rachel Dawes - her desertion of Bruce Wayne to sleep with Harvey Dent, and then two-faced waffling with him ruined her character, but not the movie. From laughing at the random mannerisms of the Joker and feeling disturbed at laughing at a mass-murdering terrorist, to clapping at the incredible feats of the Batman and his technology, to feeling deep empathy for the aloneness of Bruce Wayne, Alfred and Commissioner Gordon... each holding to secrets for the good of the world... I'd like to thank Chris Nolan for making this movie.

 

[CuppaJoe07]

you thought he looked almost normal in the interrogations scenes? i thought he looked more otherworldly with his make-up ****ed up, he looked sorta like a demon or like his face is rotting away.

Well, honestly, what do people expect? Of course his make up had to be messed up.

He just got through that huge confrontation, truck rolls over, gets captured by the police, gets his ass beaten by Batman...and his make up is supposed to stay perfectly in tact after all that?

Not to mention sweat would do that to you.

 

[Thot]

I have been waiting for this movie for three years. Batman Begins absolutely blew me away when I saw it and I have been hanging on every scrap of information about TDK from its inception to its completion. It was by far my most anticipated movie of all time. Well, I finally saw it this morning at a press screening in the UK... and my reaction surprised me completely.

I... had almost no opinion. No reaction. I don't know how I felt about this movie - I can't say that I hated or loved it. Nor can I say I didn't hate it or didn't love it. I was certainly not elated. Nor was I in any sense disappointed. It just... was.

I'm definitely going to see it again - hopefully after some time allowing it to sink in I will be able to realise how I felt about it. But right now, it's so weird - I have no idea. Anybody else feel like this, or am I just a freak?

I can fully relate to what you are saying. I too loved Begins and greatly anticipated TDK. When the credits rolled after the film, I just sat there, not sure how I felt. I wasn't so much disappointed as I was indifferent. Upon further reflection I concluded that the movie just flat out depressed and exhausted me. "Why so serious?" has taken on new meaning for me. It was a good movie as far as movies go; exciting, intriguing and generally entertaining, but not what I was looking for as the sequel to Begins, (which I believe to be better film). So, all in all, TDK is fine film-making to be sure, but for me not the best Batman film, nor the best superhero film ever. I will be watching it again soon so I can evaluate and analyze it more completely. I WANT to like it more than I do right now and maybe after a second viewing, I will. For now, I can say that I loved Batman Begins but merely liked TDK.

 

[Godman]

I can fully relate to what you are saying. I too loved Begins and greatly anticipated TDK. When the credits rolled after the film, I just sat there, not sure how I felt. I wasn't so much disappointed as I was indifferent. Upon further reflection I concluded that the movie just flat out depressed and exhausted me. "Why so serious?" has taken on new meaning for me. It was a good movie as far as movies go; exciting, intriguing and generally entertaining, but not what I was looking for as the sequel to Begins, (which I believe to be better film). So, all in all, TDK is fine film-making to be sure, but for me not the best Batman film, nor the best superhero film ever. I will be watching it again soon so I can evaluate and analyze it more completely. I WANT to like it more than I do right now and maybe after a second viewing, I will. For now, I can say that I loved Batman Begins but merely liked TDK.

They are both on equal grounds after three screenings for me...The Hype is still up to it, but I watched begins last night again to reevaluate and it seems that many just seem to have forgotten how damn good that movie was too. Dark Knight had elements I LOVED and so did Begins. Batman Begins has a better Batman himself since he is less on the dialog and more on the ninjitsu where as The Dark Knight he has more to do and more of a menace that forces people to acknowledge his existence but in the end. The movies are both equal. It is a Fine Saga, and I honestly think the best is yet to come in which we haven't seen yet. Most Likely the riddler and Two Face.


Guy pierce would be a good riddler or Depp, but Depp may be too big of an name.