Justice League The Darkseid story to go with for the first JL movie! And why Darkseid?

[smallville fan]

Film 1: Starro
Film 2: Tower of Babel
Film 3: Darkseid invasion

then the later films could explore the different universes, a concept that could first be explored in a Flash movie, and then we could have some Forever Evil and Crisis type of event films.

This is good but I have an issue with the "Tower of Babel" story line as it's supposed to show Batman is prepared for everything including the worst to come ie a rogue JL and yet he's not prepared for something as simple as a home invasion? Someone would've quite easily went into Bruce Wayne's facebook and fraped his account or other stuff.

I also agree with some of the ideas here that we should have Darkseid later.

Here's my villain list:

1. Starro/Brainiac
2. Darkseid
3. Crisis on Infinite Worlds/Forever Evil/JLA Earth 2
4. A Legion of Doom story borrowing heavily from Kingdom Come

 

[Venom'sDad]

Another thread (http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=463777) indicates that almost everyone wants Darkseid as the villain for the first JL movie.

So I have two questions:

1. Why Darkseid?
2. Which Story? (Existing or made up)

Seriously surprised that so many voted for him as the villain for the FIRST movie

I want something similar to this!

I wanted Bale as well, so.....

 

[Mightyally]

First of all, I often try to imagine the perfect DCU but as soon as I try adding lord DS to the mix it all gets messed up. If they go with DS for the first movie, and I hope not, I´d appreciate if they expanded his role over MoS and potentially Wonder Woman´s movies. He could travel to Krypton for either the Anti-Life equation or just to explore Krypton because he wants to know how Superman could be strong enough to repel his invasion. Here he could encounter Doomsday in the phantomzone or release Brainiac somehow, which should turn up in a solo MoS movie. If they go with Doomy, it could be that DS sent him to Earth for vengence on Superman, who defeated him earlier. This gives us continuation of DS + his ambitions and makes sure the movie is about more than just a ragemonster. + It would be nice if MMH is the one who saves Supes from Doomy in the end and that´s how he gets pulled in to the League.

You know the new gods old gods thing? Would be nice to see Orion and Highfather and the Olympians. Wonder Woman´s later movies/movie could therefore continue DS involvement a little bit, I´d include DS here because the guy has a lot of baggage. If they go with Brainiac, which would be cool and make sense since Clark has the codex in his blood, it better be later on because I don´t want yet another alien invasion.

My plan for the DCU with DS int he mix would be:

MoS: Zod
MoS2: Lex and Batman
JL1: DS/invasion
MoS:3 Doomsday
JL2: CSA with Lex in the mix, much like Forever Evil.
Wonder Woman 2: New Gods-Olympians with a lot connection to Darkseid.
JL3: Brainiac and Darkseid where the League travels to Apokolips because he needs their help against Brainy.
He might lure Supes there because he has Kara or something. I´m thinking something like Batman/Superman: Apokolips, if you´ve seen it.

What do you think?

 

[Batmannerism]

Keep it simple, a live action version of JLA: war (or JL origins if you prefer).
It's a Darkseid story, and maybe not the most complex one, but one that
does the job, and is perfect for the big screen.

Lots of reasons why:

- simple story, ( Avengers was great fun, simple story, but great fun, and JL has the
potential to be as good, if not better. I suppose it's one weakness is that it will be compared to Avengers, as an alien invasion story).

- does the job of introducing the characters to each other.

- great banter between Batman and Green Lantern

- shows Wonder Woman at her most bad-ass.

- Superman's good in it, but doesn't dominate the story, neither does Batman.

- Even Aquaman looks tough in JL origins.

And then there's Darkseid, shows up with a posse of parademon homeboys,
to conquer Earth, beats up the JL, and only just gets defeated.
Darkseid doesn't say much in that story, but kicks a lot of ass. For a film, I suppose
they'd need to give him a few more lines, and get some exceptionally scary-voiced
actor for the voice, but that's not hard.

So in summary, keep it simple and I can't think of a story that blends a bit of character development (particularly GL) with a ton of action, and most importantly
focuses on the heroes, who are the reason we're all going to the film in the first place.

- most importantly, the story focuses on the JL as both individuals, and their
first, somewhat successful attempt to work together. There's plenty of focus on the
characters in the story, in fact it's such a standard "superheroes meet for first time
and fight each other" it's a cliché......except that it's a cliché that actually works.
Sure, it's not a cerebral Alan Moore psychoanalysis, with sexual or homoerotic undertones, or a Grant Morrison brain teaser (although he does simple stories well too), it's a Geoff Johns reinvigoration of the original JL paradigm, it ain't rocket science but sure it's fun, and that's what needed here. IMO.

BTW - if anyone ever decides to make an animated Legion film, the Great Darkness saga was my all-time fave classic Legion story.

 

[Llama_Shepherd]

JL: Origins/War wouldn't work as an origin on film. Not without being heavily rewritten.

 

[Lord]

You can take simply inspiration from there, The Avengers had plenty of The Ultimates but wasn't an adaptation (though The Ultimates was better in my opinion)

 

[Llama_Shepherd]

That isn't what was said though, it was said to adapt the story. Which wouldn't work. Pretty much nothing happens in it, even less than in Avengers.

It would have to be reworked quite heavily to the point where large swathes would need to be altered so the structure is radically different.

 

[Mightyally]

I also see tons of problems with having that story but on the other hand, I´m not really worried they´ll do an DS invasion.

If all goes well they´ll bring in Amazo and Savage for a first movie and keep it about the heroes, their weaknesses, the earth´s reaction, teamwork etc and not squeeze in DS, that guy should be saved.

The only thing that really matters is how they decide to introduce new charachters and if we´ll see them in movies before etc. Until we know more about it it´s hard to decide which villains/scenarios would be most awesome to use.

 

[Lord]

It's Zack Snyder, i doubt he won't go with Darkseid or some other big destruction type of villain

 

[Mightyally]

^ Having a hard time tryin to counter that. But seriously, Savage and Amazo can do some pretty bad-ass damage. How do you suggest MoS BvS will do in that department?

 

[Lord]

If it was done by somebody who cares more about characters like Whedon, then i could see Amazo, but with Snyder and Goyer i really doubt it, they're the kind of people that don't contend with smaller characters. I believe there will be a lot of action in BvS, Goyer will probably try to make it more contained like The Dark Knight, but with so many heroes already, and how many fisical threats can be tied to Lex Luthor, i'm fairly sure that it will be very big.

The promise of Superman vs Batman is already big enough in fact.

I just hope they don't butcher Darkseid, from the new 52 origin storyline the thing they should take from is not have the league explicitly beat Darkseid, just stop his forces for now, leaving it open for his return in a 3rd film.

About Brainiac, i would prefer him for a Superman solo film, but i could see them putting him in a JL one

 

[Llama_Shepherd]

Snyder does care about the characters, he really does. But there are times when it's not like he's trying to put film before the source material (like Nolan) or make the source material almost more important than the film (like Whedon). He does this weird mish-mash of both that seemed perfect before Man of Steel, but now seems like he's trying to appeal to his own sensibilities of making everything the hugest thing ever.

I could definitely see him going with Darkseid to achieve those ends.

 

[Batmannerism]

JL: Origins/War wouldn't work as an origin on film. Not without being heavily rewritten.

Well it's true that every story, comic or novel gets rewritten for the screen (Lord of the Rings).

However, I disagree with you that heavy rewrites are necessary, as I don't see the need for much reworking of a simple story that does what a first JL film needs to do i.e introducing the characters to the audience, and to each other.

If you watch the Fast and Furious films, which are fun, but not really great works of cinematic art, you don't need a film for each character before they can become part of the team. A JL film could work in a similar way.

Really, do we need that much re-writing to make an enjoyable, watchable film ? I mean, this is a superhero team movie, and as such, it isn't going to be Shakespeare or the Godfather/Citizen Kane of superhero films.

If the characters are well done and likeable enough for us to care about them and the action is well-paced and exciting, then what else do you need ? It's the interaction between the characters, particularly Green Lantern and Batman that makes JL Origins so much fun. If they pull that off well on-screen, then the movie will succeed - a detailed complex story just isn't necessary.

MOS doesn't really have a particularly complex plot, but it's awesome, and even The Dark Knight when you think about it isn't unfathomably complex, its the characters that make it such a great watch.

Avengers was pretty damn successful, and it's plot was essentially.
"Loki stirs up ****, Heroes meet up and argue, aliens invade, heroes team up to defeat them."

JL Origins/War is pretty much " Heroes meet up while investigating, argue/fight, Darkseid shows up, heroes team up to defeat him."

As long as the characters are well done, what else do you need ?
IMO very little.

So I respect your opinion but have to agree to disagree on that one.

 

[Mightyally]

I´m seriously gonna guess it´s Amazo-Savage. It´s the only villains I could see for a JL1. DS is gonna come later!

 

[Lord]

I agree with taking elements from Origins/ War, but a live-action film would need to be more complex and have more elements that don't make it seem like yet another alien invasion film or an Avengers rip-off.

Superman and Wonder Woman would have to be changed too, in the original story they were kind of boring and even out-of character (Superman was bland, but WW got the worst treatment, being portrayed as yet another naive carefree warrior). Not to mention Batman, who's basically portrayed as the only sane and kind member, when that should go to the likes of Superman.

 

[Llama_Shepherd]

MOS doesn't really have a particularly complex plot, but it's awesome, and even The Dark Knight when you think about it isn't unfathomably complex, its the characters that make it such a great watch.

Avengers was pretty damn successful, and it's plot was essentially.
"Loki stirs up ****, Heroes meet up and argue, aliens invade, heroes team up to defeat them."

I never said the plot had to be complex. It just needs to have some, any, substance. Let's just take the structure of Justice League: Origins-

6 issues, assuming it's a 130 minute film, that would equal 1 issue to every 22 minutes, roughly. Darkseid shows up at the end of issue 4 for the final battle. That would mean there is 45 minutes of fighting Darkseid/ rescuing Superman for the climax of the film, and then about 5 minutes for the ending. Also, the first around 80 minutes would be heavily focused on Batman and Green Lantern versus Parademon, Batman versus Superman, Batman, Green Lantern and Flash versus Superman, then the interim minutes introducing Aquaman, Wonder Woman and the invasion of Apokolips.

All that actually happens in that story is a whole lot of fighting, there's very little actual character work, when I say literally nothing happens, it's because besides throwing punches, the only thing that happens on a character level is Victor Stone gets mad at his dad.

JL Origins/War is pretty much " Heroes meet up while investigating, argue/fight, Darkseid shows up, heroes team up to defeat him."

But that's literally all that happens. It's like the ending to a film.

As long as the characters are well done, what else do you need ?
IMO very little.

Avengers had several scenes that had the characters actually develop (not massively) in a neutral environment. They actually had to converse, something sorely lacking in Justice League: Origins.

So I respect your opinion but have to agree to disagree on that one.

Justice League origins didn't even have enough story to fill a 75 minute animated feature. Why do you think it would fare better with double the runtime?

 

[Lord]

I´m seriously gonna guess it´s Amazo-Savage. It´s the only villains I could see for a JL1. DS is gonna come later!

Guess whatever you want, but i fear that you will end up being disapointed.

 

[Mightyally]

We shall see, but one thing...wouldn´t it be a little weird to have an animated movie, a current comic book vol and a real movie based on the same plot?

 

[Lord]

Who said they would adapt that comic book? The Ultimates was adapted into 2 animated films and used as inspiration for The Avengers, yet that film wasn't an adaptation. The Origin storyline was very weak, so i dfinitelly wouldn't want that to be the entire film.

 

[Hyde]

My bets are on Lexenberg being the villain. It's been said that Batman/Superman will end on a cliffhanger which leads into Justice League, and my idea for it is that Lex has Superman held prisoner in some top-secret facility, ready with the resources he needs to conquer the planet. Batman, hidden away in the Batcave, looks up at the Batcomputer - on each monitor there is a different hero, all under surveillance from Bruce Wayne.

Alfred: Please tell me you're not doing what I think you're doing.
Bruce: Clark's imprisoned and the world stands on the brink of siege. The world needs heroes.
Alfred: If this situation is as depressing as you make it out to be, then you better get started.

Something like that.

 

[Mightyally]

Cool man! Way to go if you really wanna portray Lex as the genius he is ^
He´s approximately a level eight genius after all.

Who said they would adapt that comic book? The Ultimates was adapted into 2 animated films and used as inspiration for The Avengers, yet that film wasn't an adaptation. The Origin storyline was very weak, so i dfinitelly wouldn't want that to be the entire film.

1. I did but I meant adapting as in "based on" The main idea I had was about the general idea with Lord DS invading. I mean sure, the animated movies had some other stuff like going aboard that ship and included Billy (which deserves more comic book time in the new 52) and the new 52 JL vol 1 could never be used and be re-done as a movie with less consitency than JL war but you´d still think to yourself, ohh it´s this story when you watch the real JL movie.

2. Please tell me more about the Ultimates, what should I search to read up on that?

3. Agreed.

 

[Lord]

About the Ultimates you don't need to read anything before, Just try The Ultimates vol.1 and vol.2. If you liked that, then read The Ulltimates 2 vol.1 and vol.2.

The Ultimates 3 was written by Jeph Loeb and was only 5 issues long, it was terrible.

 

[Mightyally]

^ Okay. I´ll do it!!!

 

[Lord]

Let me know your reaction It's one of the few works by Millar i really like, but i warn you that some characters are vastly different, expect Captain America to be more realistic when it comes to his personality (and not in a kind way) and Forget whatever you know about likeable Hulk. Otherwise, Tony Stark is very close to the movies, in fact, he probably served as inspiration due to being constantly drunk and Thor is an hippie, some fans trying to b**** about the Ultimate universe bring that fact, but i greatly enjoy and think that take on the character makes sence.

 

[Mightyally]

Yeah, I´ll recommend Superman: Birthright. When you read it you´ll be like, ohh this is Man of steel. So it´s actually very interesting in that apect. It gives you a lot to go on if you wanna figure out what Batman vs Superman will be like with Lex and all. Lemme tell you, they´ve taken A LOT from that story, came as a total wtf when I read this a couple months back.

Anyhow, It´s a good piece even if it´s not as captivating as All-star Superman or Red son (which both are the best solo Superman I´ve ever read), but it´s definitely as thought through as them and on par with them in most other aspects. READ

I´m a bit of a grammar nazi you know. One that does a trillion mistakes himself, which doesn´t make any sense, but it makes far more sense than sence!