BvS The Death of Superman? Yay or nay? :(

[KarkClent]

I want at least one more solo Superman movie before we get the Death of Superman. I'd like to see a story featuring the classic Superman dynamic hinted at at the end of MoS where he's an established hero (and don't have half the world hating him) working at the Daily Planet with all the supporting characters there. Then they can do the Death and Return of Superman in Justice League: Parts Whatever or another solo movie.

 

[kguillou]

I would much rather prefer they save that stuff for the end of Justice League Pt. 1. Like maybe Superman makes a heroic sacrifice against Braniac or whoever and in Pt.2 he makes a triumphant return in the 3rd act. This is just too damn soon.

 

[TheFlamingCoco]

Yeah, a Justice League movie would be ideal, if they had to do it. Let the audience grow with the character first.

 

[I Am The Knight]

Superman had one line in the trailer.

And I don't think anyone here believes that he'll be permanently killed off since we know that he's due back for JL. We just don't want to see him go through the whole death and return angle at this time, especially when it looks looking iike Batman will become the godfather of the dc universe once superman is gone for awhile

Oh I missed his line. What did he say?

Well there is no doubt that Batman is the most popular hero of the two. I could see him "leading" the JL easily, especially since he can't go toe to toe with Darkseid (well, most of the time...!) so he will probably be the guy at the Watchtower calling the shots even after Superman comes back to life anyway. I wouldn't be terribly opposed to that.

 

[Fallen Angel]

The line before Perry talk's to Clark. Voice over the criminal with Batman's symbol burnt onto his body.

 

[Herolee10]

The line before Perry talk's to Clark. Voice over the criminal with Batman's symbol burnt onto his body.

Yep.

Honestly, I can't think of another reason for why Perry, Lois, Martha, and Bruce would be at the cemetery other than Clark being dead.

If anything, the pictures and the link that was provided in the last page pretty much guarantees that Superman is going to die in this film which really sucks.

I hope after the Dceu is over, we don't see batman for a long time. It really sucks that when we finally got a great superman in Henry, he ends up having to play second fiddle to Batman. This pretty much proves that superman can NEVER completely shine whenever he's in a film with Batman.

 

[Legendver2]

I'm just imagining the glorious epicness of a Snyder style slo-mo fight between Supes and Doomsday...Just thinking about it makes me shiver with excitement.

Anyway, I too agree Doomsday should be a solo film villain. But I have a feeling that the potential Superman death is a way, story-telling wise, to turn the people against him to for him, seeing his heroic sacrifice to defeat this monster. Don't know if that's the best way to do it, I'm sure there are alternate ways for that to happen without him dying temporarily, but I guess we'll never know until the film comes out.

 

[kguillou]

Ugh, this is starting to depress me. I shouldn't have started this thread. lol

 

[FeedOnATreeFrog]

Sure, if it serves the story. It all depends on how they execute it.

I don't see how Superman dying is some sort of slight against the character in favor of Batman. Maybe it's just me, but when Batman sacrifices himself in TDKRises, I thought that was letting the character 'shine'. It'd be the same with Superman. Since this movie is taking so much from TDKReturns and reinterpreting it, I imagine it could be a flip of that ending with Superman in place of Batman.

 

[Superchan]

Well I am much more interested in what's going on with Batman from what we have seen from the teaser and trailer. Superman doesn't even get any lines, does he?

With that said, I don't think they will kill him off.

I think it's because the trailer is trying to deliver the message that BvS is about how the world sees superman, hence why he was referred to in the 3rd person throughout.

 

[Herolee10]

If anything, I feel like Snyder sort of sold out on Superman in favor of Batman.

Despite all of the good things that Snyder has said about Superman in the past, you can see from the trailers, coverage, and even what little we know of the future for the character that Batman has become Snyder's biggest/favorite priority.

And if Superman bites the dust, however temporary it'll be in the long run, Batman will be left as the godfather of the DCEU with Superman just used as the heavy muscle.

What's more sad is that there doesn't seem to be many superman fans that care for the fact that Superman is going to bite the bullet at the end of this story. I've seen more people hoping for Doomsday to be in this so that he can kill off Superman or others simply not caring about it.

Frankly, this just shows that Superman should never be put in the same film with Batman.

 

[FeedOnATreeFrog]

^One can be a Superman fan and be fine with Superman dying at the end of this movie, especially if it's a heroic sacrifice that ends up painting the character in a positive light.

 

[Herolee10]

^One can be a Superman fan and be fine with (or even look forward to the idea) of Superman dying at the end of this movie, especially if it's a heroic sacrifice that paints the character in a positive light.

It's a cheap tactic in my honest opinion and does more harm for him than good in the long run.

And you do realize that by ending this film with Superman dead that they'll have to waste precious time in Justice League: Part 1 to deal with this return, which also means that he won't be able to interact with everyone as much.

And it also means that he won't really be a "founding member" of the group if they're all together when he returns.

Plus, in a film where Superman is taking on Batman, it's kind of a slap in a face to superman fans to have him die at the end while Batman walks away just fine....leaving more attention on him.

Not to mention that it's too freaking soon to do a story like this when it hasn't been earned yet imho as well.

Superman's screwed, period, if he dies at the end of this film that's only using him as a plot to further Batman's arc.

Heck, I'm only following this film because I want to see on what will perhaps be Henry's final outing as Superman when portrayed as a important figure in the DCEU and not second fiddle to Batman before the latter takes over after his temporal death.

 

[Smallville13]

Yep.

Honestly, I can't think of another reason for why Perry, Lois, Martha, and Bruce would be at the cemetery other than Clark being dead.

If anything, the pictures and the link that was provided in the last page pretty much guarantees that Superman is going to die in this film which really sucks.

I hope after the Dceu is over, we don't see batman for a long time. It really sucks that when we finally got a great superman in Henry, he ends up having to play second fiddle to Batman. This pretty much proves that superman can NEVER completely shine whenever he's in a film with Batman.

Whoa. That's new. Were people pointing this out back when those set pics were landing?

That's pretty bold if true. I can see it though. That sounds like something Snyder would go for to reverse the negative backslash (both in the DCEU and amongst messageboards) of the depiction of Supes in MoS... Have him make the ultimate selfless sacrifice...

Hmm...

Also if this is the case, nice that they're just acknowledging that Perry and possibly other DP staff are just in on the secret identity.

Edit: With Geoff Johns' confirmed involvement in writing for the DCEU, specifically Batman, I can see this scene incoming:

 

[FeedOnATreeFrog]

And you do realize that by ending this film with Superman dead that they'll have to waste precious time in Justice League: Part 1 to deal with this return, which also means that he won't be able to interact with everyone as much.

And it also means that he won't really be a "founding member" of the group if they're all together when he returns.

Even if he is the seventh one to arrive (which we don't know), does that make him not one of the seven founding members? And what if the JL is his idea to begin with, with each recruit knowing that this is what Superman wanted. Plus, we have no idea when he would return or how much screen time it would take. It could be in the last scene of BvS (just like TDKReturns/Rises, which I am a fan of).

Plus, in a film where Superman is taking on Batman, it's kind of a slap in a face to superman fans to have him die at the end while Batman walks away just fine....leaving more attention on him.

Was it a slap in the face to Batman fans when he died in TDKReturns, a Batman story where he took on Superman? Did that just leave the attention on Superman? In BvS, maybe Batman walking away without a mark to show for it just shines a light on how Batman wasn't even able to attempt going up against Doomsday. Only Superman was.

Not to mention that it's too freaking soon to do a story like this when it hasn't been earned yet imho as well.

Whereas I think it's totally fine when characters 'die' in their first movie, let alone their second (Captain America in The First Avenger, Groot in Guardians, Gandalf in Fellowship of the Ring, Neo in the Matrix, etc )

Superman's screwed, period, if he dies at the end of this film that's only using him as a plot to further Batman's arc.

Like Captain America, isn't a big part of Superman about inspiring other characters? Superman helping to further Batman's arc would be highlighting Superman's character as well.

Heck, I'm only following this film because I want to see on what will perhaps be Henry's final outing as Superman when portrayed as a important figure in the DCEU and not second fiddle to Batman before the latter takes over after his temporal death.

Or maybe Superman sacrificing himself makes him more of an important figure in the world.

 

[Herolee10]

Even if he is the seventh one to arrive (which we don't know), does that make him not one of the seven founding members? And what if the JL is his idea to begin with, with each recruit knowing that this is what Superman wanted. Plus, we have no idea when he would return or how much screen time it would take. It could be in the last scene of BvS (just like TDKReturns/Rises, which I am a fan of).



Was it a slap in the face to Batman fans when he died in TDKReturns, a Batman story where he took on Superman? Did that just leave the attention on Superman? In BvS, maybe Batman walking away without a mark to show for it just shines a light on how Batman wasn't even able to attempt going up against Doomsday. Only Superman was.



Whereas I think it's totally fine when characters 'die' in their first movie, let alone their second (Captain America in The First Avenger, Groot in Guardians, Gandalf in Fellowship of the Ring, Neo in the Matrix, etc )



Like Captain America, isn't a big part of Superman about inspiring other characters? Superman helping to further Batman's arc would be highlighting Superman's character as well.



Or maybe Superman sacrificing himself makes him more of an important figure in the world.

With all due respect of course, since I don't want to give you the impression that I'm trying to insult you or anything, but why does Superman need to "die" in order to inspire people?

Why can't he be allowed to inspire people when he's alive?

It's no secret that MOS left people divided on the character and I don't think having him killed off in a film starring him going up against everyone's favorite Batman is going to help make things better.

Plus, Batman kicked Superman's ass in TDKR and wasn't really dead at the end.

Here, it looks like it could be the case where Superman really does bite the bucket.

And let me ask you this. If Batman died at the end of TDK, do you think that it would have been received well?

Honestly, I'm starting to agree with Snyder's critics when they said that he was a bad choice for Superman.

Man, the more that I think about it, the more it makes my blood boil as a fan of the character. To see the character having to go through a mixed (and heated) reaction from MOS to potentially getting his ass kicked and out-shined by Batman in the followup, where he dies at the end.

Also, unlike TDKR, Batman was clearly the main protagonist of that story. BvS, both characters are supposedly the protagonists.

It really sucks to be a Superman fan right now. I just want the DCEU to get it over with so that they can reboot the damn thing later on and hopefully they'll get Superman right from the start to finish.

They're already screwed up Superman by killing him off in this film.

 

[FeedOnATreeFrog]

With all due respect of course, since I don't want to give you the impression that I'm trying to insult you or anything, but why does Superman need to "die" in order to inspire people?

Why can't he be allowed to inspire people when he's alive?

He doesn't have to die to inspire people, but it doesn't mean it can't happen.

In the Bible, Jesus didn't have to die to inspire people, but he did die, and it did inspire people.

It's no secret that MOS left people divided on the character and I don't think having him killed off in a film starring him going up against everyone's favorite Batman is going to help make things better.

Whereas I think it will.

Plus, Batman kicked Superman's ass in TDKR and wasn't really dead at the end.

Here, it looks like it could be the case where Superman really does bite the bucket.

I don't see that as a problem though.

And let me ask you this. If Batman died at the end of TDK, do you think that it would have been received well?

If it was written well and made sense with the whole story they were telling, sure.

 

[Herolee10]

He doesn't have to die to inspire people, but it doesn't mean it can't happen.

In the Bible, Jesus didn't have to die to inspire people, but he did die, and it did inspire people.



Whereas I think it will.



Yes, Batman fakes his death, and Superman doesn't. I don't see that as a problem though. I just think it makes Superman seem more heroic. He didn't think he was coming back.

And maybe that's what earns Batman's trust. Whereas he was previously trying to destroy Superman, maybe by the end, Batman's the one who's trying to bring Superman back to life.



If it was written well and made sense with the whole story they were telling, sure.

Well I guess we agree to disagree then.

Honestly, I have no problem with a "Death and Return" story line being adapted BUT NOT at this stage in the game.

I will ALWAYS hold the view that it's too early to do this type of arc for the character.

And no matter "how well" it's done, it still doesn't change the fact that Snyder ****ed up Superman from this film to JL (at the very least).

I can see why a lot of people weren't too happy at the idea of Snyder coming back for Superman in the sequel.

Jeez, I just really hate the idea and really regret it now that Snyder was even brought on to do this, let alone to be the unofficial godfather of the DCEU.

He had so much potential after MOS, but he went down back to Singer's level imho.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

Well I guess we agree to disagree then.

Honestly, I have no problem with a "Death and Return" story line being adapted BUT NOT at this stage in the game.

I will ALWAYS hold the view that it's too early to do this type of arc for the character.

And no matter "how well" it's done, it still doesn't change the fact that Snyder ****ed up Superman from this film to JL (at the very least).

I can see why a lot of people weren't too happy at the idea of Snyder coming back for Superman in the sequel.

Jeez, I just really hate the idea and really regret it now that Snyder was even brought on to do this, let alone to be the unofficial godfather of the DCEU.

He had so much potential after MOS, but he went down back to Singer's level imho.

Eat a SNICKERS lee.

 

[Herolee10]

Eat a SNICKERS lee.

lol; my snickers ran out, which is why I'm ranting now Krypton.haha

It doesn't feel good dude, it really doesn't.

Especially with the stuff that Fallen Angel posted in the previous page, which made it worse because now I see that there was no real proof that Henry was even spotted at the funeral scene.

So unless Snyder is pulling a "Rises/Return" homage where superman is revealed to be alive and well and is only pretending to be dead for whatever reason, I think it's safe to say that not only has Snyder ****ed up doing Superman but it seems very apparent to me now that the character will just never get back to the top.

The character had a lukewarm/forgettable comeback in 2006 with "Returns". He had one hell of a split reception for "Man of Steel". And now, he's about to be neutered by Batman before being temporarily killed so that the Justice League can form without him.

Honestly, there's more potential facts that what I just wrote can happen as opposed to the opposite happening.

I'm also starting to think that when Waller was talking about Superman in the Suicide Squad trailer that she was talking about him in past tense, as though he was already dead in that time period.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

lol; my snickers ran out, which is why I'm ranting now Krypton.haha

It doesn't feel good dude, it really doesn't.

Especially with the stuff that Fallen Angel posted in the previous page, which made it worse because now I see that there was no real proof that Henry was even spotted at the funeral scene.

So unless Snyder is pulling a "Rises/Return" homage where superman is revealed to be alive and well and is only pretending to be dead for whatever reason, I think it's safe to say that not only has Snyder ****ed up doing Superman but it seems very apparent to me now that the character will just never get back to the top.

The character had a lukewarm/forgettable comeback in 2006 with "Returns". He had one hell of a split reception for "Man of Steel". And now, he's about to be neutered by Batman before being temporarily killed so that the Justice League can form without him.

Honestly, there's more potential facts that what I just wrote can happen as opposed to the opposite happening.

I'm also starting to think that when Waller was talking about Superman in the Suicide Squad trailer that she was talking about him in past tense, as though he was already dead in that time period.

You are backing AWAY from the light lee. t:

 

[FeedOnATreeFrog]

Well I guess we agree to disagree then

Also, I just noticed what's written under your username, haha. It all makes sense now.

 

[Gu3ree]

If they do this, but I hope they don't, their plan is to end the film with Superman's death, and then he gets resurrected in Justice League.

If it's called Dawn of Justice...hopefully that doesn't mean killing Superman off if they mean to start up the Justice League with the trinity in Batman v Superman.

Unless they want to go the original way, where the Justice League's original members were, Flash, Lantern, Green Arrow, Martian Manhunter, Wonder Woman and Aquaman.

Batman and Superman didn't become members of the League until later.

It wouldn't sell without Batman and Superman though.

I'll say once again, the ending/cliffhanger to Pirates: Dead Man's Chest didn't work. Captain Jack Sparrow getting eaten by a giant Octopus and presumed to be dead.

They'd be ruining Justice League's potential. I mean people want to see all the seven members together on screen. It's a big event.

It's like in Smallville, the worst episode of the entire series and greatest letdown of them all..."Bloomsday/Failsday" Don't you dare call that episode a finale or "Doomsday". it didn't deserve that....

So you read in spoilers, and saw in the trailer, Clark is going to fight Doomsday...and the Justice League returns! with the Flash. And when they were all brought together, it was like...meh. What could have been exciting became a huge letdown.

I'm worried Batman v Superman could end up like this.

 

[Herolee10]

You are backing AWAY from the light lee. t:

lol; but honestly Krypton. I mean, is there really anything out there to prove me wrong? I mean if there was any shred of proof that Superman isn't going to die or that he's not going to be neutered by Batman's presence in this film, then I'd shut up for good.

But there isn't.

Also, I just noticed what's written under your username, haha. It all makes sense now.

lol; I just placed that there to be tonight tbh.haha

Honestly, I really didn't hate the character before, but considering on how much I feel Batman's presence in this universe will hurt Superman in the long run, I am not a fan.

 

[BH/HHH]

I would rather they don't touch the Death of Superman story arc and do it in the future when they are looking to reboot as a LOTR/Hobbit style trilogy where they release the next one every Christmas.