The Flash The Flash season 2 episode 3 - "Family of Rogues"

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The writers are probably doing it because the fans last year threw such a massive tantrum over Iris resenting Barry and Joe for lying to her. They're gun-shy with Iris and her emotions at this point.

There should be an episode down the line that explains that Iris is bottling her emotions more than she used to since Eddie died.

And Barry should be there for her. Because they're best friends. And she should be there for him when something inevitably eats at him later this season.

This is what would sell their relationship. Whenever either of them really have a problem they always end up going back to each other. Build the romantic relationship off of that.
 
Is no one gonna mention that Cold got past the laser grid by... freezing the lasers?! Did I miss something? Those were just lasers, right? And he froze them and they turned solid... WHAT?!?!

I figured he just froze the air around the lasers in the process of freezing the interior security system since he mentioned how long it would take to thaw, and the security alarm was still activated by the ice forming (just delayed due to being frozen).

Still kinda silly, but no more than some of the things he's done with his cold gun in the comics. He freezes air in the comics frequently.
 
I wouldn't classify their relationship as being rock solid, since he's lied to her twice now about some pretty important things. Iris really ought to be developing some major trust issues right about now.

That's not even getting into the fact that Joe tried to bribe Francine to leave so he wouldn't have to tell Iris the truth. I have no idea why the writers are hellbent on making Joe so unlikable.

I think keeping Barry's secret was the standard superhero trope, and it wasn't just Joe's choice. In the case of her mother she was a drug addict that ran away and slipped off the grid, when Joe couldn't find her he made a call, a poor one to keep going all this time I admit, but I think Iris knows it came from the right place. As far as the bribe goes, the woman has been gone for 20 years and was obviously nothing but trouble, Joe wanting to keep her away was an understandable reaction IMO.

One thing I did find funny was Joe saying she was able to disappear because she was a cop's wife, that was pretty silly, for starters she was a junkie and secondly I don't think being married to a cop turns you into Jane Bourne.
 
This episode was a solid 7 to me. Nothing really jumped out at me, but I enjoyed it.
 
I think keeping Barry's secret was the standard superhero trope, and it wasn't just Joe's choice. In the case of her mother she was a drug addict that ran away and slipped off the grid, when Joe couldn't find her he made a call, a poor one to keep going all this time I admit, but I think Iris knows it came from the right place. As far as the bribe goes, the woman has been gone for 20 years and was obviously nothing but trouble, Joe wanting to keep her away was an understandable reaction IMO.

One thing I did find funny was Joe saying she was able to disappear because she was a cop's wife, that was pretty silly, for starters she was a junkie and secondly I don't think being married to a cop turns you into Jane Bourne.
Also, I think it helps that after she disappeared, Joe probably thought it was likely that she was dead or would soon be dead given her history.
 
I think keeping Barry's secret was the standard superhero trope, and it wasn't just Joe's choice.

It's a dumb trope, one the writers didn't have to indulge in. Ultimately, Joe made the call so I have to blame him. From what I recall, Barry was planning on telling Iris but Joe talked him out of it, so I see it as Joe's idea.

In the case of her mother she was a drug addict that ran away and slipped off the grid, when Joe couldn't find her he made a call, a poor one to keep going all this time I admit, but I think Iris knows it came from the right place. As far as the bribe goes, the woman has been gone for 20 years and was obviously nothing but trouble, Joe wanting to keep her away was an understandable reaction IMO.

I understand the initial decision to lie, but once Francine came back Joe should've seen that as a sign he ought to come clean with Iris. She wasn't a little girl anymore and could handle the truth about her mother. Francine seemed sober in the bar so I don't see how she could be written off as nothing but trouble.
 
So... Cold as always brings the heat on this show (dodges rotten tomatoes and trash). So Ironside plays a dude that explodes heads? I see what you did there show. Kudos.

Lots of good stuff, and I can see people are all over it. I agree with most sentiments BUT... Yeah, this show is always two steps forward and one back for me and I was hoping by season two that would not be the case. To wit:

1. Yes, great opening. Over the top but still cool, and it shows that Iris still matters A LOT to Barry. However, THIS is exactly the stuff they should have been doing with Iris from the start to make her compelling and interesting and seem like someone that Barry would be interested in BEYOND young forbidden almost siblings puppy love. She should have ALWAYS been a woman interested in journalism as a way to help the wider world. Imagine starting her out that way instead of working her into that role. However... We still have the issue of the actress. Nothing can be better to illustrate this than the scene she shares with Jessie in regards to her mother. Jessie BRINGS it big time. He leaves it all on the field, no holding back. Cut to Patton and... She's just NOT in his league, which of course not, she doesn't have the experience of a Martin, but there's no indication it's there either. The saving grace is the writing of Iris in that moment. They made her shocked, sad, but reasonable. Her reaction was the mature reaction of someone that's been through what we have seen and given the track record of the handling of this character, that's a bit of a miracle... Still though, that's just as it's written. As it was acted...Meh. She's got no spark. Sorry, she's minor league and should at best be on some cable teen soap.

2. Call me too much of a purist but this show has a great lead in Gustin and we should be getting amazing Flash feats, both mental and physical... But they can't decide if THAT'S the Flash they want to give us or not. The inconsistency is killing me each week. Barry has amazing powers... Some of the time it seems. He can outrun or catch bullets but Cold standing 4 feet in front of him catches him flat footed. Again... In the same episode he catches a bullet seemingly on a whim, he get's frozen in place by Snart? He's supposed to be this brilliant CSI, a job that depends on smarts, outside the box thinking and thoroughness in thinking... But Barry's plan is, "hey... I think I'll infiltrate the gang... Eh it's something I thought up getting donuts." No "plan" really, just figured he'd wing it. Next... Barry should be able to get himself out of jams like getting frozen on the spot. There's no need to justify the STAR Labs pit crew's existence, which may be the problem in a nut shell. All these cast members, well we GOT to use them, seems to be the mantra. But that's just it. Using them as science explainers or have THEM get Barry out of jams so consistently weakens Barry's character, especially since the show keeps stating how smart Barry is supposed to be. He should have figured his own way out of being frozen, not even need a suit. Sure, let Stein handle the big calculations and "wormhole" theorizing, let Cisco built the gear for specific things, but c'mon, LET BARRY BE SMART AND US HIS POWER IN SMART WAYS. It's kind of a trademark of the Flash.

3. Do super heroes in modern media ALWAYS have to have personal reasons to do what they do? Is that the only motivator? Do we really need Jay to have to look at Caitlyn and decide to stay and stop Zoom for some ill defined emotional reason? Shouldn't he just be (he is the vet hero here)"I will stay because you need me to help you take on Zoom"? There's no need for some BS romantic subplot here at all.

Again, I liked the episode overall (that laser grid thing was all sorts of DUMB though) but as always they seem to not able to make me give this unconditional love. I can't give it a pass on these elements that undermine my weekly viewing. Again... Like, hell, love the show more or less, but they always have these LARGE imperfections I can't let go because they do distract from the overall quality.

You're just gonna have to turn your brain off, man. This is never - never - going to be a truly great series, so it's better to just enjoy it for what it is.
 
Honestly, I think the bad science in this episode crossed the line twice. It was so absurd, that it was almost artistic in how comic book bad science it was. I mean, freezing the beams of laser light? That's so unbelievable that it had to have been deliberate.
 
Aren't the laser beams actually xenon gas or something like that? Not sure it would necessarily make sense, but it would make more sense than freezing light.
 
You're just gonna have to turn your brain off, man. This is never - never - going to be a truly great series, so it's better to just enjoy it for what it is.

It's really sad after how much promise I thought the show had in the beginning, but I think you're probably right. Still, for what it is, it's still pretty good fun.
 
Aren't the laser beams actually xenon gas or something like that? Not sure it would necessarily make sense, but it would make more sense than freezing light.

The laser beams or what makes them work are the free electrons in the gas that is used as a medium, you can slow them down by cooling said medium down and even make them stop to work/move by reaching low enough temperatures (0K), so you could theoretically use something like Captain Cold's Cold gun (which is a device that would never work in reality, anyway) to stop an 'ordinary' laser grid that way. But the writers work with comic science and I wouldn't try to think too hard about it.
 
In other words, if we accept Captain Cold's gun, this is something possible to accept to?
 
I enjoyed this episode and I like how they're dealing with Iris' Mom. Looking forward to seeing Wally introduced
 
This episode was very fun. It gave us a lot more development for the Snart family. Any episode with Captain Cold is always great, and I loved the material they gave Lisa here too. Peyton List has always been a lot of fun on the show, but she really got some great emotional material in this episode. I also really liked Michael Ironside's performance, and it was neat to see Barry using his super speed to crack that keypad.

The episode was nicely tense and suspenseful when they were working to remove the bomb from Lisa's head. Lisa and Cisco once again had some great scenes together.
 
Another thing I liked about this episode was how much it underlined the fact that Leonard has certain ethics despite his villainy. He can be ruthless when he wants to be, as we've seen in the past, but he obviously has a lot of respect for his adversaries, and there are some things he just won't do because they go against his personal morality.

For example, Leonard was obviously appalled when his father Lewis shot Barry point-blank and left him for dead, right after Barry had helped them break into the vault. Even though Leonard has tried to kill Barry in the past, this was NOT the appropriate moment for that, as far as Leonard was concerned. Clearly, Leonard thought that it was dirty, disloyal, and cowardly of his father to shoot Barry after Barry had just helped them. If we know one thing about Leonard, it's that he values loyalty from teammates, and if they are loyal and do their job, he appreciates it. Therefore, Leonard must have been furious at his father for double-crossing a teammate like that. And of course, Leonard obviously felt some level of gratitude towards Barry because Barry was trying to save his sister from that bomb.

When Lewis shot Barry, the look of pain and regret and sympathy on Leonard's face definitely seemed genuine. And the way he softly whispered, "Sorry, Barry" really sounded like he felt terrible about what his father had just done to Barry. Wentworth Miller really gave a nice performance as usual.
 
I understand the initial decision to lie, but once Francine came back Joe should've seen that as a sign he ought to come clean with Iris. She wasn't a little girl anymore and could handle the truth about her mother. Francine seemed sober in the bar so I don't see how she could be written off as nothing but trouble.

Addicts are often great liars, masters at it in fact, and after 20 years away I think Joe was panicking about the havoc she could create in their lives and reacted instinctively.
 
Say, was I the only one wondering how Iris's mom knew the love of her life died, and that she wasn't coping with it? How closely is she watching her, to know that she hasn't dealt with Eddie's death?
 
Say, was I the only one wondering how Iris's mom knew the love of her life died, and that she wasn't coping with it? How closely is she watching her, to know that she hasn't dealt with Eddie's death?

Good question. How much is public knowledge about what went on the day of the singularity? Though I suppose that Eddie was missing for a while before that, so it was public knowledge that a CCPD detective had been kidnapped. One wonders just how much Joe has to lie and bend the truth sometimes in his reports.
 

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