The McCain Thread

[Superman4ever]

GAAAAASSSSSPPPP!

McCain's "crosses in the dirt" is NOT his story!

"Cross in the Dirt" story stolen from Solzhenitsyn (updated X3)
by rickrocket
Sun Aug 17, 2008 at 09:32:42 AM PDT

I was watching the forum last night and decided that since I hadn't eaten yet, I would try to listen to John McCain speak. I was doing OK with the "my friends" and the evil chuckle when I heard him talk about his POW story of the cross in the dirt. That was when I couldn't take it anymore.

It just sounded so fake and so contrived, so I did a little research about it. Someone on here said it sounded like a scene from Ben-Hur, so I did a google search about Ben-Hur and cross in the sand and such. No dice. But I searched around a little bit more and here is what I found. A story about Alexander Solzhenitsyn from his times in the Soviet Gulags.

Along with other prisoners, he worked in the fields day after day, in rain and sun, during summer and winter. His life appeared to be nothing more than backbreaking labor and slow starvation. The intense suffering reduced him to a state of despair.

On one particular day, the hopelessness of his situation became too much for him. He saw no reason to continue his struggle, no reason to keep on living. His life made no difference in the world. So he gave up.

Leaving his shovel on the ground, he slowly walked to a crude bench and sat down. He knew that at any moment a guard would order him to stand up, and when he failed to respond, the guard would beat him to death, probably with his own shovel. He had seen it happen to other prisoners.

As he waited, head down, he felt a presence. Slowly he looked up and saw a skinny old prisoner squat down beside him. The man said nothing. Instead, he used a stick to trace in the dirt the sign of the Cross. The man then got back up and returned to his work.

As Solzhenitsyn stared at the Cross drawn in the dirt his entire perspective changed. He knew he was only one man against the all-powerful Soviet empire. Yet he knew there was something greater than the evil he saw in the prison camp, something greater than the Soviet Union. He knew that hope for all people was represented by that simple Cross. Through the power of the Cross, anything was possible.

Solzhenitsyn slowly rose to his feet, picked up his shovel, and went back to work. Outwardly, nothing had changed. Inside, he had received hope.

[From Luke Veronis, "The Sign of the Cross"; Communion, issue 8, Pascha 1997.]

So, it is very interesting that Mr. Solzhenitsyn and Mr. McCain had the same Christian guard/prisoner experience. Or maybe it is all just a made up story. Somehow I doubt that Alexander Solzhenitsyn heard John McCain's story and copied it.

UPDATE: This story was actually excerpted from "The Gulag Archipelago" by Alexander Solzhenitsyn, which was released in the US in 1973.

UPDATE X2: It seems that McCain is a bit of a Solzhenitsyn fan, as evidenced in his article in the NY Sun here. Thanks to Turing for the link.

UPDATE X3: May other great Kossacks have expanded on my diary. Check out their great diaries.

TomP: Cross in the Dirt, a recap of what we know
Calouste: No "cross in the sand" for McCain in 1973
Throwing Stones: McCain lies, contradicts himself on Cross story

Thanks to everyone. This is my first time on the rec list. What a way to start!

Classic!

 

[kainedamo]

So, we're supposed to take McCain's word that he didn't hear any of the questions, though he had plenty of opportunity. That isn't fair at all.

And from that clip, its pretty obvious he knew the questions ahead of time. I remember when I watched the forum discussion, that one stood out to me, I thought it was strange that he answered so quick.

He answered questions before they were asked he couldn't have known would be asked unless he knew ahead of time.

 

[jaguarr]

Looks like McCain knew the questions beforehand at the Faithforum last night:




http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/8/17/02247/6361
http://thepoliticalcarnival.blogspot.com/2008/08/video-pastor-rick-confirms-mccain-not.html

This guy can't even CHEAT well enough to get away with it.

jag

 

[DorkyFresh]

[YT]ek3jAkx9m10[/YT]

 

[souvlaki]

Oops...

 

[jaguarr]

souvlaki, do you read the forums at all before you post?

jag

 

[souvlaki]

souvlaki, do you read the forums at all before you post?

jag

Obviously not. I am in a hurry and on my way to work, so I just wanted to post it before I left. It wasn't there when I checked the board a couple hours ago. My mistake.

 

[jaguarr]

jag

 

[Kelly]

Got a chance to read the blog and listen to Warren.....


I'm not going to say he did or did not hear the questions in advance, but neither of those things really prove anything.

As far as the housing foreclosures...........................*shakes head* in my opinion, if you are not having problems financially........*sighs* shut the hell up and do your job to help those that are working as hard as they can, yet just not making it.

I'm not going to fault Cindy McCain on the money she has, but McCain really needs to not talk so much, and get the job done.

 

[Superman4ever]

[YT]ek3jAkx9m10[/YT]

Man, that's a great vid. Sent to ALL my friends!

 

[The Senator]

Politico: McCain to Announce VP on August 29

Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) plans to celebrate his 72nd birthday on Aug. 29 by naming his running mate at a huge rally in the battleground state of Ohio, Republican sources said.

That’s a week from this Friday, and the day after Sen. Barack Obama (D-Ill.) accepts the Democratic nomination at a 70,000-person spectacular in a Denver stadium.

The campaign has begun building a crowd of 10,000 for Dayton, Ohio, according to an organizer. McCain is scheduled to appear with his running mate at a large-scale event in Pennsylvania shortly thereafter.

Senior Republicans are in the dark about who he’ll name, although they say former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney and Minnesota Gov. Tim Pawlenty are prime contenders after a trial balloon by McCain gave him very negative feedback about the idea of picking a pro-choice running mate like former Pennsylvania Gov. Tom Ridge.

Sources close to McCain say he has wrestled with the choice, torn between a high-stakes, high-reward pick like Ridge or Connecticut Sen. Joseph Lieberman or a safer and more conventional selection such as Romney or Pawlenty.

But McCain friends emphasized that he talks about the decision with almost no one, and could even change the announcement plans and go sooner.

“McCain views this as the one decision that he has total, utter, non-negotiable control over,” one campaign official said.


The announcement strategy – provided McCain doesn’t change it – calls for naming the pick early Friday morning to try to suppress Obama’s bounce coming out of his convention.

“You’re going to own the weekend,” a McCain official said.

The Republican convention begins the following Monday in St. Paul, Minn.

McCain advisers say they don’t think it would make sense to name the pick earlier because the impact would get diluted by Obama’s selection. And since the GOP convention is second, they have the advantage of knowing the opposition ticket before showing their own cards.

“You can fire the bullet once,” said one key Republican. “You want the most meaningful target.”

Alex M. Triantafilou, chairman of the Hamilton County (Ohio) Republican Party, said in an exuberant post on his blog this weekend: “Sen. McCain is expected to host a rally on August 29 in Dayton and is looking for a BIG venue and for a BIG crowd. He'll get it. This is not yet public. I guess I just made it so.”

The post has been removed without explanation.

PolitickerOH.com reported Monday morning that the event will be at the 10,000 seat Ervin J. Nutter Center, a sports and entertainment complex at Wright State University

 

[Matt]

Hmm...Who would have the most effect in Ohio? Pawlenty? No Ohians would know who the hell he is. Ridge? Would make more sense to announce him in PA, also a battle ground state, so I'll say he's out. Lieberman has enough name recognition that you can announce him where ever you'd like. Romney is the same (Though I'd say Michigan makes more sense)...but Romney's economic expertise makes him a good choice for an Ohio announcement as arguably no state has taken a harder hit economically than Ohio in the past two decades. I'd say its either Lieberman or Romney.

 

[The Senator]

Hmm...Who would have the most effect in Ohio? Pawlenty? No Ohians would know who the hell he is. Ridge? Would make more sense to announce him in PA, also a battle ground state, so I'll say he's out. Lieberman has enough name recognition that you can announce him where ever you'd like. Romney is the same (Though I'd say Michigan makes more sense)...but Romney's economic expertise makes him a good choice for an Ohio announcement as arguably no state has taken a harder hit economically than Ohio in the past two decades. I'd say its either Lieberman or Romney.

It could be Rob Portman.

 

[Überlibran]

Heh. Remember when the Rick Warren asked John McCain at the faith-based forum " Who are the three wisest people that you know that you would rely on heavily in an administration?" and McCain answered that Congressional Rep. John Lewis was one of them (okay, well just pretend you remember). Somebody should've mentioned that to John Lewis:

"I cannot stop one human being, even a presidential candidate, from admiring the courage and sacrifice of peaceful protesters on the Edmund Pettus Bridge or making comments about it." But, he added, "Sen. McCain and I are colleagues in the US Congress, not confidantes. He does not consult me. And I do not consult him."

So yeah, sounds like they don't even talk. I knew his answer was B.S. To paraphrase John, THAT'S not integrity we can believe in!

 

[Kelly]

Maybe he plans to consult him once he becomes President.....maybe he has a list in his mind of the people that he would bring into discussion when circumstances require them.....they may not be his best friends, but they may be people that he believes would be of help....

Not saying that is how McCain is thinking, but its a possibility...

 

[hippie_hunter]

Hmm...Who would have the most effect in Ohio? Pawlenty? No Ohians would know who the hell he is. Ridge? Would make more sense to announce him in PA, also a battle ground state, so I'll say he's out. Lieberman has enough name recognition that you can announce him where ever you'd like. Romney is the same (Though I'd say Michigan makes more sense)...but Romney's economic expertise makes him a good choice for an Ohio announcement as arguably no state has taken a harder hit economically than Ohio in the past two decades. I'd say its either Lieberman or Romney.

Lieberman and Romney would be good choices IMO.

Since Lieberman was formerly a Democrat, he can really fit into the moderate angle McCain wants and help get the independent vote. It can also help him with New Hampshire, the Jewish vote in Florida, and maybe even Connecticut since Lieberman is very popular in that state.

Romney can help McCain out with the economic angle of the election since the economy is the forefront of the election, and even though most Americans agree with what McCain says, they trust Obama more for some reason with the economy and see it as McCain's weak point. He can also help taking Michigan since that is a close race there.

 

[rdh007]

Lieberman and Romney would be good choices IMO.

Since Lieberman was formerly a Democrat, he can really fit into the moderate angle McCain wants and help get the independent vote. It can also help him with New Hampshire, the Jewish vote in Florida, and maybe even Connecticut since Lieberman is very popular in that state.

Romney can help McCain out with the economic angle of the election since the economy is the forefront of the election, and even though most Americans agree with what McCain says, they trust Obama more for some reason with the economy and see it as McCain's weak point. He can also help taking Michigan since that is a close race there.

Didn't Lieberman decline already? Though that doesn't mean he can't change his mind.

 

[The Senator]

Lieberman and Romney would be good choices IMO.

Since Lieberman was formerly a Democrat, he can really fit into the moderate angle McCain wants and help get the independent vote. It can also help him with New Hampshire, the Jewish vote in Florida, and maybe even Connecticut since Lieberman is very popular in that state.

Romney can help McCain out with the economic angle of the election since the economy is the forefront of the election, and even though most Americans agree with what McCain says, they trust Obama more for some reason with the economy and see it as McCain's weak point. He can also help taking Michigan since that is a close race there.

Lieberman is not going to help McCain win Connecticut.

CT Democrats are not going to jump ship for McCain; in fact, many of them feel Lieberman is a traitor and wouldn't dare vote for him. The most McCain can hope for are the independents and moderate Democrats, but when you consider Obama has a double-digit lead in the state right now and the bulk of the voters are decided, I'm not sure Lieberman will have enough impact to affect the current mood in that state.

 

[The Senator]

Didn't Lieberman decline already? Though that doesn't mean he can't change his mind.

Considering Lieberman said he wouldn't run for the Senate if he lost his primary, then rescinded on that statement, I don't really hold him as the purveyor of honesty.

 

[Spider-Bite]

They might be more in agreement with McCain on offshore drilling, but on the economy, I doubt they are more in allignment with McCain. the economy is at the forefront as you said. The country does not believe that Bush has done a good job managing the economy, and McCain supports an extension of the Bush economic policies. The country does not agree with huge tax cuts for the rich.

Apparently McCain doesn't even agree with himself on pork barrel spending, considering he voted to give 3 million dollars last year to study the dna of bears, and then went on to talk about how stupid the government was for wasting 3 million dollars on studying the dna of bears.

 

[rdh007]

even though most Americans agree with what McCain says, they trust Obama more for some reason with the economy and see it as McCain's weak point.

Why would they see it that way? Because of the things he's already said?


“I didn’t pay nearly the attention to those issues in the past.” [Jan. 2000]

“I’m going to be honest: I know a lot less about economics than I do about military and foreign policy issues. I still need to be educated.” [Nov. 2005]

“The issue of economics is not something I’ve understood as well as I should,” but “I’ve got Greenspan’s book.” [Dec. 2007]

 

[Überlibran]

Maybe he plans to consult him once he becomes President.....maybe he has a list in his mind of the people that he would bring into discussion when circumstances require them.....they may not be his best friends, but they may be people that he believes would be of help....

Not saying that is how McCain is thinking, but its a possibility...

Do you really believe that Kel? Seriously?

 

[Marx]

It could be Rob Portman.

Gag me.

 

[Matt]

They might be more in agreement with McCain on offshore drilling, but on the economy, I doubt they are more in allignment with McCain. the economy is at the forefront as you said. The country does not believe that Bush has done a good job managing the economy, and McCain supports an extension of the Bush economic policies. The country does not agree with huge tax cuts for the rich.

But at the end of the day...this election will be decided by one thing:

Oil.

People ***** about the war, but its not effecting them directly enough to take notice, for the most part...so the majority won't vote on it, regardless of how much they *****.

Same with economy. Most are still employed and living comfortably on credit. The recession hasn't hit anyone hard enough yet.

The one thing that will decide this election is when folks are driving to the polling place, look up and see gas between $4.50 and $5.00 a gallon. And that will be McCain's biggest advantage. No matter how little results his plan will yield, it creates the illusion of relief. And it is the reason he is even still in this election.

 

[hippie_hunter]

Lieberman is not going to help McCain win Connecticut.

CT Democrats are not going to jump ship for McCain; in fact, many of them feel Lieberman is a traitor and wouldn't dare vote for him. The most McCain can hope for are the independents and moderate Democrats, but when you consider Obama has a double-digit lead in the state right now and the bulk of the voters are decided, I'm not sure Lieberman will have enough impact to affect the current mood in that state.

Considering that Lieberman won re-election with 50% of the vote even after losing the primary shows that Lieberman has a lot of pull there. He's very popular among independents, moderate Democrats, and Republicans in the state who might jump ship. Probably not, but I can see it as a possibility.

The people who will never vote McCain are the people who voted for Lamont and hate Lieberman in the state anyways. But they got their asses embarrassingly kicked in 2006.