The McCain Thread

[Bathead]

No, it was McCain bringing up his name something like
20+ times during the debate. If he hadn't done that, I guarantee we wouldn't still be hearing his name.

 

[CaptainClown]

No, it was McCain bringing up his name something like
20+ times during the debate. If he hadn't done that, I guarantee we wouldn't still be hearing his name.

should have stuck with Joe six pack

 

[Superman]

JOHN MCCAIN HAS NEW STRATEGY IN VA


That's right, John McCain has decided to focus on "real Virginia." And how will he do this? Why, by creating a third Virginia state:

Hey!!!!! The town I'm in is in the "Real Virginia".

They better bring that new northern state line south a bit, I'm not moving again.

 

[Bunker]

....that's....wow.

Rallies like these aren't even hard to find. It's not like it's 7 videos showing the same McCain rally. It's at the point where even hardcore McCain supporters have trouble spinning it, or pull the, "Bah it's the same at both rallies" line...

That really speaks a lot to the kind of crowds McCain and Palin pull anymore, I know not all of their supporters are like this, but they sure have one hardcore racial, hateful, bigoted following.

I mean some of the things they said..."The only difference inbetween Osama and Obama is the BS", "Go back to Kenya"....WTF?

It's the only way they're going to win, by pandering to backwards, racist white people.

 

[CaptainClown]

It's the only way they're going to win, by pandering to backwards, racist white people.

but....we can't let the minorities take our land....

 

[jaguarr]

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcon...onal/stories/101908dnpolcampaign.3ddd1ea.html

Analysts say McCain's 'socialism' claims may be a stretch

12:25 AM CDT on Sunday, October 19, 2008

By DAVE MICHAELS and TODD J. GILLMAN / The Dallas Morning News
[email protected]
[email protected]

CONCORD, N.C. – As John McCain trails Barack Obama in swing states he needs to win to claim the presidency, his campaign has promoted the idea that his opponent's tax and health-care policies evoke socialism.

The claim was made after Mr. Obama remarked in Ohio last week that he wanted to "spread the wealth around."

But such comparisons to socialism gloss over important facts, analysts say.

Both Mr. McCain and his running mate, Sarah Palin, have criticized Mr. Obama's proposal to raise taxes on high earners and require that businesses provide health insurance. Ms. Palin referred to the plan as "a little bit like socialism."

And in a radio address Saturday, Mr. McCain said: "At least in Europe, the socialist leaders who so admire my opponent are upfront about their objectives."

Mr. Obama hit back Saturday, saying that Mr. McCain is "out of touch with the struggles" of many Americans.

William Wallace, a former vice president and chief operating officer of the Federal Reserve Bank of Dallas, said the country's progressive tax code, which Mr. McCain does not propose abolishing, is "socialist in nature."

"It's a term that gets people's attention, and therefore I understand why a political candidate might want to use it," said Dr. Wallace, a professor at the University of North Texas. "But to say we are headed toward socialism is a vast overstatement in my book."

Congress' decision this month to allow the federal government to invest directly in failing banks was the most significant government intervention in financial markets in decades – and Mr. McCain voted for it along with Mr. Obama.

Responding to Dr. Wallace's comments, Tucker Bounds, a McCain campaign spokesman, said Mr. Obama's economic plan is "simply not sensible."

"Barack Obama wants to increase taxes on small business, the one current bright spot in the economy," he said, "only to issue handouts to Americans who don't pay income taxes in the first place."

To be sure, there are big differences between the candidates' tax and health-care proposals. Most important, Mr. Obama would raise tax rates on households earning more than $250,000, from 33 percent and 35 percent, to 36 percent and 39.6 percent. Mr. McCain would maintain the current rates for the top two tax brackets, which were set during President Bush's first term.

Both candidates have proposed a mix of tax credits and exemptions that would reduce overall tax bills for many households. According to the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center, Mr. Obama's plan would reduce taxes for 80 percent of households, while raising them for 10 percent. Mr. McCain's plan would lower taxes for 60 percent of households, and raise them for 1 percent.

Mr. Obama fired back at Mr. McCain at a rally in St. Louis on Saturday, which attracted 100,000 people, a record for the Obama campaign, according to aides.

"John McCain is so out of touch with the struggles you are facing that he must be the first politician in history to call a tax cut for working people 'welfare,' " Mr. Obama said.

Mr. McCain also has argued that small businesses would be hurt by Mr. Obama's tax hike on the top earners. At Wednesday's debate, Mr. McCain invoked an Ohio man, whom he called "Joe the Plumber," as one potential small business owner who would be penalized by the increase.

Mr. Obama probably stoked the accusations of socialism when he told the man, Joe Wurzelbacher, that tax hikes on higher earners were important to "spread the wealth around." Mr. Wurzelbacher confronted Mr. Obama over his tax policy when the Democrat showed up in his neighborhood looking for votes last weekend.

Independent analysts have concluded that Mr. Wurzelbacher would likely see a tax cut under Mr. Obama's plan.

With time running short to halt his opponent's momentum, Mr. McCain seemed eager to step up his attacks.

Some prominent Republicans have gone further. Ohio Sen. George Voinovich told a southeast Ohio newspaper outright that Mr. Obama "is left of Teddy Kennedy. With all due respect, the man is a socialist."

Missouri Sen. Claire McCaskill, an Obama supporter, agreed that Mr. Obama's "spread the wealth" comment "wasn't the best way of putting it."

"But what he was talking about was instead of doing the tax cuts for the thinnest sliver at the top, which is the only things the Republicans ever want to do, he wants the tax cuts to go to the majority of Americans," said Ms. McCaskill, a Democrat.

On Saturday, Mr. McCain kept up the accusation that Mr. Obama's tax plan would hurt small-business owners.

McCain aides dressed up Saturday's rally in Cabarrus County, N.C., near Charlotte, with hand-drawn, made-for-TV signs such as "Don't spread the wealth: Let Joe Keep his dough" and "Don't take Joe the Plumber's $$$$."

"The small businesses Senator Obama would tax provide 16 million jobs in America," Mr. McCain said Saturday in North Carolina. "And a sudden tax hike will kill some of those jobs at a time when we need to be creating more jobs."

But less than 2 percent of all small businesses in the country earn enough to qualify for the top tax brackets, according to the Tax Policy Center. The majority pay either 15 percent or 25 percent, according to the center.

Mr. McCain also has criticized Mr. Obama's health-care plan. Mr. Obama would require that businesses either provide health care or contribute to a public system that would cover the uninsured. Mr. Obama has said small businesses would be exempt from the requirement but hasn't defined "small business" for the purpose of his policy.

Mr. McCain's idea is to offer tax credits that could be used to purchase private health-care policies. He would tax workers on the value of their health-care benefits.

Mr. Obama’s plan would “greatly increase” health insurance coverage, reducing the number of uninsured Americans by about 18 million in 2009, according to the Tax Policy Center.

Mr. McCain’s plan would reduce the uninsured by “just over” 1 million in 2009 and by almost 5 million by 2013, the center says.

"In a very technical sense, it is a step toward" socialism, Dr. Wallace said. Yet the government has created many programs that are socialistic in a similar respect, including the Social Security system, Dr. Wallace said.

jag

 

[ShadowBoxing]

It's the only way they're going to win, by pandering to backwards, racist white people.

Contrary to popular belief, there aren't enough of them.

 

[jaguarr]

I'll post this in McCain's thread, since he's the one who brought Joe The Plumber up over and over again:

http://www.freep.com/article/20081019/COL01/810190417/?imw=Y

Average Joe can't fix America's pipes

BY MITCH ALBOM • FREE PRESS COLUMNIST • October 19, 2008

Until last week, the most common axiom about plumbers was that when they bent over to fix a pipe, you could see the crack of their butts.
Advertisement

Not anymore.

Thanks to Joe Wurzelbacher, we can now go to plumbers for our political future.

Wurzelbacher was mentioned about two dozen times in the debate between Sens. Barack Obama and John McCain this past week. They called him Joe the Plumber, an average Ohio guy who had told Obama during a campaign swing that he was planning on buying a business that makes $250,000 to $280,000 a year. He then asked the candidate, "Your new tax plan is going to tax me more, isn't it?"

The exchange was caught on tape (what isn't these days?). And from there, the pipe hit the fan. McCain held up Joe as an average American businessman who would suffer from Obama's plan to spread the wealth around.

McCain said that with Obama in charge, guys like Joe would "not be able to realize the American dream of owning their own business."

Jackpot! Joe the Plumber, to Republicans, was instantly a working-class hero, a good, honest family man who just wanted to start a company and was gonna get socked by Obama's socialist ideas.

By Thursday, the media were on his lawn. Katie Couric called him. You already could imagine the movie: "Mr. Wurzelbacher Goes to Washington."

And then Joe opened his mouth.
Nothing is as it seems to be

It turns out Joe has no plumber's license.

Joe isn't in the plumbers union.

Joe never did a plumbers apprenticeship.

Joe's business likely would not be taxed under Obama's proposal.

Joe might even get a tax cut under Obama's proposal.

Joe doesn't believe in Social Security.

Joe's first name isn't Joe, it's Samuel.

And Samuel hasn't paid his taxes.

And that's just as we go to press. By the time you read this, Joe may be a member of the Weathermen. None of this surprises me. It is what you get in a country that seems to think everything is a form of "American Idol."

Look. There is a reason we call "the average guy" average. Because he's in the middle. Average. When you aim for the White House, to lead the free world, to hold the fate of the Earth in your hands, you shouldn't aspire to average. And this election shouldn't be about average.

Don't get me wrong. Plumbers, when you need them, are more desirable than presidents. I, personally, would be underwater in my home if not for my plumber.

But in politics, we overdo the small picture because we get bored with the big picture. Our eyes glaze over when candidates talk policy. The devil is in the details, but we're not interested in the devil. We'd rather watch, be entertained, be told a story.

So we attach to how McCain looks puffed up when he walks. We attach to a volatile quote from Obama's former preacher. I actually heard a radio host claim that a photo of Sarah Palin buying diapers for her baby could have a noticeable effect on the election.

Diapers?
The president isn't all-powerful

In that kind of world, is it any wonder Joe the Plumber became a sensation? But when you dig in, you see his circumstance might be the exact opposite of that for which he's being touted.

Now, personally, I am no fan of Obama's tax plan -- not because of him, but because I have never seen higher taxes result in more efficient government. But I also know that whatever Obama or McCain are touting now is unlikely to pass as is. Remember Bill Clinton's health care plan? He ran on that, and after eight years, it still hadn't happened.

By the time the House and the Senate get done with tax proposals, they rarely look like the originals, so who knows who will pay what next year?

What we do know is grabbing the "regular" guy and holding him up is an old political trick that rarely works. And sometimes it backfires on both sides.

After all, McCain is now getting criticized. And how many people will want to hire an unlicensed plumber who owes money on his taxes?

And we haven't even mentioned a butt crack.

I appreciate this guy's perspective. This constant focus on insignificant crap in this election has been ridiculous and could have some undesirable side-effects not just for the candidates, but for the people who's names the choose to invoke as well.

jag

 

[Marx]

JOHN MCCAIN HAS NEW STRATEGY IN VA


That's right, John McCain has decided to focus on "real Virginia." And how will he do this? Why, by creating a third Virginia state:

 

[Marx]

MCCAIN DEFENDS ROBOCALLS
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/19/two-gop-senators-denounce_n_135919.html





(As I said earlier, I guess he feels differently being the one committing them, instead of being on the receiving end. What a hypocrit! )

 

[sasquatchs]

"Cold, political calculation". Seems like a dumb moment to bring out the straight-talk

[YT]d_MRanG6kqU[/YT]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_MRanG6kqU

 

[ShadowBoxing]

Yeah, what a poor choice of words

 

[Fading]

MCCAIN DEFENDS ROBOCALLS
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/19/two-gop-senators-denounce_n_135919.html





(As I said earlier, I guess he feels differently being the one committing them, instead of being on the receiving end. What a hypocrit! )

Gotta love that, (paraphrasing) "Well yeah I hate robocalls, what Bush said about me was evil. However I support and like robocalls because now the're about Obama. These dirty tactics were unjust and lies because they were about me, but however since I'm the one using them now they're the truth and justified."

The hypocrisy, and dirty tactics of the McCain campaign is staggering. Suddenly, the Swiftboat ads and smear campaign against Kerry don't seem quite so bad in comparison.

 

[Matt]

So, I finally got a chance to watch part of the Letterman appearance McCain did. Damn...Letterman kind of beat the crap out of him. He was asking questions the MSM ought to be:



jag

Man, Letterman was really going for the jugular there. When we look back at what caused people elections it'll go something like this:

Michael Dukakis - Willy Horton

John Kerry - Swift vet ads

John McCain - David Letterman

Never again will a candidate cross David Letterman.

 

[ShadowBoxing]

You don't f*** with the Letterman, bit*hes

 

[Cosmic]

"Cold, political calculation". Seems like a dumb moment to bring out the straight-talk

[YT]d_MRanG6kqU[/YT]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_MRanG6kqU

Nice. I suppose everyone is going to have their gaffe moments from time to time, but at this point, I don't know what to say. It's like he's become a complete parody of himself.

 

[Goddessreicho]

HA HA! Anyone watch The Family Guy tonight? Oh that Seth, he had to just pictorially poo all over McCain/Palin, and boy did he.

 

[Marx]

JOE' THE PLUMBER' MISSES MCCAIN'S OHIO RALLIES
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/10/19/joe-the-plumber-misses-mccains-ohio-rallies/

 

[Mikelus]

Man, Letterman was really going for the jugular there. When we look back at what caused people elections it'll go something like this:

Michael Dukakis - Willy Horton

John Kerry - Swift vet ads

John McCain - The economy, Palin & David Letterman

Never again will a candidate cross David Letterman.

Fixed!

 

[ShadowBoxing]

JOE' THE PLUMBER' MISSES MCCAIN'S OHIO RALLIES
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/10/19/joe-the-plumber-misses-mccains-ohio-rallies/

He had to pump some iron, give him a break

 

[Marx]

He had to pump some iron, give him a break

 

[The Senator]

Actually, Joe the Plumber had to go unclog Cheney's arteries. How dare you mock a true American hero!

 

[Marx]

Actually, Joe the Plumber had to go unclog Cheney's arteries. How dare you mock a true American hero!

I thought he was going try to and buy a company that isn't for sale? Or catch up on back taxes? Or maybe even get a plumber's license?

 

[Superman]

[YT]9LbLxja4UHY[/YT]

Ouch.

I loved what he said about what Rep. Bachmann said. He's right it is nonsense and all of it has to stop.

 

[Superman4ever]

Nice!