The Official Boxing Thread!!! - Part 2

[Docker2.0]

You named one decent fight in Paq vs Bradley. Name another. GBP gave us Mayweather vs Canelo, Broner vs Maidana and a couple of more, just to sleepy to list them all. Not saying you are wrong because you are right in ways because Al Haymon is bad for boxing..........but so is Bob Arum. It's like a Marvel vs DC thing or Bloods or Crip thing. This should not be happening in boxing. People are complaining about Mayweather vs Paq but what about the other fights that could be made that are not? I'd love to see a Matthysee vs Provodnikov or Danny Garcia vs Juan Manual Marquez or Broner vs Crawford. All these fights are being denied to us because of some gang crap.

 

[Iron_Stark]

Yeah, but that was in 2013. In 2013, Showtime kicked the absolute crap out of HBO as far as fights went. As soon as Sheafer left, we got the Pros vs Joes type fights.

Arum sucks and is a con man, won't argue with you on that but atleast is willing to put his guys with other promotes fighters, like the potential Cotto/Canelo fight.

Haymon won't put his guy to fight each other, much less vs other promoters fighters. Look at Adonis Stevenson, Haymon wouldn't put him with Kovelov or Hopkins. Which is why Hopkins stayed loyal to Oscar and didn't jump ship to Haymon since Oscar got him the Kovalev fight.

You're right, this shouldn't be happening in boxing, the best should be fighting the best. No more pros vs joes type cards. And the guys that are with Showtime aren't going to be getting a fair shake since that scumbag Espinoza got butt hurt that Canelo went to HBO, he'll now probably black list Oscar and GBP and keep ok'ing more Salka type opponents for Garcia, Broner etc.

 

[Docker2.0]

Yeah but I honestly believe that Haymon is doing this to get back at De La Hoya. We will see though once Shaeffer gets back involved with boxing again.

 

[Iron_Stark]

How is it getting back at De la Hoya??? It hurt the Mayweather brand more than GBP. This was billed as "Mayweather Promotions first big PPV event", and it ended up being advertised horribly, the event was terrible and the whole card sucked. Which cost Leonard Ellerbie's job.

If Haymon was trying to sabotage GBP, then he failed, he hurt MP more than GBP.

Two last things though, now I know I'm obviously not there and don't know what goes on behind closed doors, but from everything I've seen and read, Ellerbie was with Mayweather from the very beginning, he was the one guy that genuinely cared for Mayweather and wasn't there to leech off of Mayweather's money, and this is how Mayweather treats him? Giving him the boot just like that? Goes to show the character of Mayweather.

And Sheaffer isn't coming back anytime soon, atleast not to promote Mayweather's last couple of fights, he's still in contract with GBP until 2018 and Oscar is planning on keeping it that way.

 

[Docker2.0]

I wasn't just talking about the Mayweather card but the last couple of Showtime cards. At least I'm hoping that's Haymon's end game. If it isn't, then he seriously needs to question his matchmaking abilities. The last couple of Showtime cards have sucked. From the Garcai match, to Lamont Peterson, to Broner and to the Mayweather fight.

 

[Iron_Stark]

Well they need to step it up if they plan on doing good. GBPs is probably blacklisted from Showtime now and Haymon is blacklisted from HBO, and isn't going to be doing business with Top Rank, Kathy Duva and who knows who else.

Lets see how deep his pockets are to buy out Sheaffers 50 million dollar contract from GBP and bring him into the fold. Because right now Mayweather Promotions doesn't have anyone to run it and will fail hard if they keep doing what they're doing.

 

[Fallen Angel]

I see Tavoris Cloud is back in action tonight. Hasn't been in action since Hopkins and Stevenson beat him back to back.

 

[Docker2.0]

Is it on tv?

 

[Iron_Stark]

Holy crap Cloud got obliterated by that Beterbiev guy. He only had 5 pro fights. He's got scary power and beat a who's who in the amateurs, including Kovokev twice.

That guy is going to be a force in the division.

 

[Fallen Angel]

He made him his biatch. There's some scary mofo's in the 175lb division.

 

[Fallen Angel]

Chad Dawson is finished at the top lost a 10 round S/D to some second rate fighter last night.

 

[Docker2.0]

Good to see K9 winning a title. He has to be one of the most underrated fighters of today.

Anyone getting sick of Mayweather and Pacquio's game about fighting each other? If Mayweather has no plans of fighting Pacquio, then stop talking about it. If Pacquio gets past Algeri, he and Arum needs to talk about fighting Mayweather then. It amazes me how Arum and Pacquio talk about fighting Mayweather only when he has an opponent scheduled but once he's free, he uses the "ask my promotor" excuse. They are both looking more and more like idiots each day but the blame goes to Arum more than anyone else IMHO. I will say though the more I think about this upcoming fight, the more I think Pacquio is going to lose because I can see Arum screwing him because Algeri is more marketable, especially with Pacquio playing in the PBA. Still have no interest in seeing the fight though.

 

[Doc Samson]

I've been on record numerous times saying how overrated I think that potential fight would be. I've never saw any reason for people to think Manny could beat Floyd, or even make it interesting. Didn't matter if it happened 5 years ago or 5 months from now, I've never seen any logical reason for this much hype for this match in particular, and whatever interest I did have has waned with each passing year...

But I'm with you on the talking part, if there's really no intention, just shut up about it from both camps. All it does is get fans worked up for nothing.

 

[Fallen Angel]

The hype now is non existent. Had this been 4 years ago it would've been our next and latest Super fight. Sure I'd watch if they fought now but it wodn't be as a wesome it could and should have been. Pacman of 4 years ago was a best I'd have given him more of a chace back then, now barely none.

 

[Doc Samson]

And that's probably the main reason I don't want the fight to happen, because everyone who loves Manny is going to use that as an excuse, as if Floyd hasn't aged with him.

I personally don't feel like it would make any difference, Floyd is just a better boxer who happens to utilize Manny's Achilles heel to perfection. And contrary to popular belief, Floyd's been hit plenty and as far as I can see, he can take a better punch, so I never thought it would be all that competitive. But that's just me, if it happens, I guess we'll see...

 

[Warhammer]

Come on, now. We all know that if they announced it, we'd still be excited to watch it. Even if it is simply out of curiosity instead of genuine anticipation for a super fight. The storylines are perfect. Mayweather's last fight before he retires. Pacquaio's redemption. Both fanbases will watch because after a million years, we will finally know who would win (followed by the inevitable excuses to be made when one loses). The money alone, even after all this time, will be crazy.

I mean, Mayweather would run a defensive clinic on Pacquaio's ass but I'd still line up to watch it.

 

[Fallen Angel]

You guys both make great points.

Doc what I meant is there was that short period of time where Pacman was a BEAST and I legit thought if they fought back then he would KO Floyd in the latter rounds. If they fight now I expect Floyd to run away with a comfortable-ish UD but not before a few hiccups.

Pacman's descent from his peak has been quicker than Floyd who still at the top of his but on the downward curve.

 

[Doc Samson]

You guys both make great points.

Doc what I meant is there was that short period of time where Pacman was a BEAST and I legit thought if they fought back then he would KO Floyd in the latter rounds. If they fight now I expect Floyd to run away with a comfortable-ish UD but not before a few hiccups.

Pacman's descent from his peak has been quicker than Floyd who still at the top of his but on the downward curve.

Oh I wasn't disrespecting your opinion in any way, I was just saying that for years now, even back when they were considered still "in prime" I felt like Floyd would have an easy time with Manny if he chose to, and I NEVER thought it would live up to the hype because of it.

Some may consider it "running" but I call it boxing. Actually, I don't even think he would use movement that much, that's something else he doesn't get enough credit for, he stands pretty flat flooted, he's only really utilized a lot of movement in a handful of fights. But because he doesn't take loads of damage, and he's cocky, he has a stigma to him that says he runs and doesn't (or can't) take punishment.

I've seen him hit cleanly by quite a few fighters, and he took it. When I've seen Manny hit, he's been in trouble. Outside of De La Hoya, parts of Hatton & Maidana II, I don't see all this movement. He stands in the pocket, counters, and moves defensively, not run around the ring, and those principals are exactly what wild fighters like Manny can't deal with. He couldn't deal with it from Marquez, he surely can't from Floyd. But I've beaten that dead horse, I'm simply agreeing with Docker, if they aren't gonna fight, just stop talking about it...

 

[Fallen Angel]

Nah it's all cool man I agree if you aint fightin' shut the frick up. I personally don't think they will the boat has long gone. oh and what about those Anti doping tests that Pacman don't agree to that Floyd insists on? That's another hurdle to clear.

 

[Docker2.0]

Come on, now. We all know that if they announced it, we'd still be excited to watch it. Even if it is simply out of curiosity instead of genuine anticipation for a super fight. The storylines are perfect. Mayweather's last fight before he retires. Pacquaio's redemption. Both fanbases will watch because after a million years, we will finally know who would win (followed by the inevitable excuses to be made when one loses). The money alone, even after all this time, will be crazy.

I mean, Mayweather would run a defensive clinic on Pacquaio's ass but I'd still line up to watch it.

Screw you man for reading my mind!! As much as I think this fight is past due, if they fought tomorrow I'd buy it. Thing is, I know Floyd would absolutely dominate Manny but it's just to shut some idiots up about it. But Doc Samson is right. If they fought, first thing people would say is Floyd waited until he got older, never mind the fact that Floyd is older, so he's in a lose-lose situation.

 

[Warhammer]

Oh yeah, I agree. Floyd's reputation takes a hit no matter what. However, he still gets the W in the books. It will probably be the last real stain on his legacy from here on out if he retired tomorrow so why not knock it out and not be called a coward. Also, many can b**** and moan while he cries in a tub of all the money he'd make on this fight. Hell, Floyd wouldn't even have to promote a damn thing. The announcement itself will be more than enough.

 

[Iron_Stark]

Meh who cares about that fight anymore, especially when Canelo/Cotto is on the horizon.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Canelo and Cotto isn't a good fight imo. I like both guys, and in Cotto's case I love him. But Canelo is gonna bury Cotto rather easily. Cotto doesn't have the legs to stay away. He'll get beat up by a bigger, stronger, faster, younger fighter.

 

[Iron_Stark]

That's what they were saying about Martinez doing to Cotto and look what happened there.

It's a lot closer fight than most think. And more intriguing, it's the second most wanted fight behind Mayweather/Pac.

Mayweather has two options, make the fight the public demands or concede the Mexican dates.

I don't see May/Pac happening, Canelo is taking back the Mexican holidays. And rightfully so.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Martinez was always dependent on if he came back healthy. Considering Martinez was having knee trouble in his last two fights, then wrecked his knee again, it was always a question of health. Do you expect Canelo to walk into the fight with Cotto unable to stand? Because that is why Cotto beat Sergio. He was literally battling with himself to stand.

Styles make fights, and Cotto doesn't have the ability to stand up to Canelo's barrage. Canelo is the exact kind of fighter to put it on Cotto. He has the chin, size and heart to stand up to Cotto's shots, while having the skill, power and athleticim to hunt Cotto down. He will need to either hurt or finish Canelo early. If he doesn't, he will be beaten up down the stretch and most likely stopped.