First Avenger The "OFFICIAL" CA:TFA Negative Reaction Thread

[Wolvieboy17]

I disagree. Our real-life soldiers were painting snarling teeth and angry eyes on the noses of their aircraft in WWII. They painted pictures of women on the sides of their planes, too. Those were cartoony and symbolic. They weren't necessary for the plane to function properly but they were inspirational and cool.

That's how I think of Cap's 3D wings...inspirational and cool.

Well you basically just described what they've actually done in the movie, painted on wings that could still be considered symbolic. They painted teeth and women on planes, they didn't give them dentures and strap a mannequin to them.

 

[WildcatNC]

Well you basically just described what they've actually done in the movie, painted on wings that could still be considered symbolic. They painted teeth and women on planes, they didn't give them dentures and strap a mannequin to them.

Beat me to it. t:

 

[Webhead38]

This is straight from the horse's mouth (Joe Johnston):

“Scripts had been developed that took place half in World War Two, half in the modern day and none of those scripts were particularly successful because the costume ended up overshadowing the man,” says Marvel chief Kevin Feige. “So we finally said, ‘If we could make a Captain America movie any way we wanted to make it, how would we make it?’ Well, we’d set the entire movie in the past, in that period, with all of the Marvel trimmings. And so we made the fun, kick-ass Captain America movie we wanted to.”

“I’ve always loved Raiders and the tone that it had,” says director Joe Johnston. “It was period but didn’t feel like it was made in the period. It felt like a modern-day film about the period, which is what we’re doing on Captain America. It will not feel like a war movie. It’s funny where it needs to be and emotional where it needs to be and serious and full of action.”

And he's not just an American hero, argues Evans. “I think he’s the ideal human,” says Evans. “Not just American. It’s what being a good person is. Steve’s managed to overcome all the shortcomings he’s had in life and he does what’s good and what he believes is right.”

I just knew this thing read like a train wreck. They can't even honor his origin without going all 'PC' on it. Lame...

 

[Chewy]

How are they going 'PC' on it? By saying he's a good person?

 

[Webhead38]

Well being a "good person" is pretty generic isn't it? I mean is he going to become Superman? Captain America stood for the American dream. What we fought for. What many of our troops died for. He stood for the principles of this country back then. Hence the name. Is he going to die now to get a cat out of a tree? It just sounds like they diluted the concept. He was someone who wanted to serve this country. But because of his disability he could not. He was suppose to represent the fighting spirit of our military for that period. When he was frozen and was revived in modern times, he still had those old values. THAT is the rub on the character. He is now in modern times with old fashion values. If he's a just a "good person", where is the distinction?

 

[Wolvieboy17]

Wow. You should never be in creative control of anything. Ever.

 

[Iceman]

I don't see much wrong with that quote from JJ/Evans.

 

[Suzanne78]

Well being a "good person" is pretty generic isn't it? I mean is he going to become Superman? Captain America stood for the American dream. What we fought for. What many of our troops died for. He stood for the principles of this country back then. Hence the name. Is he going to die now to get a cat out of a tree? It just sounds like they diluted the concept. He was someone who wanted to serve this country. But because of his disability he could not. He was suppose to represent the fighting spirit of our military for that period. When he was frozen and was revived in modern times, he still had those old values. THAT is the rub on the character. He is now in modern times with old fashion values. If he's a just a "good person", where is the distinction?

Well, Chris has been focusing his answers on Steve's personality, describing him as a noble, good, honorable, just person. He drew inspiration from a friend of his who's an Eagle Scout. Everything that CE's been saying about who Steve Rogers is in this movie goes right to the symbolism of Cap, and everything you stated here in this paragraph.

I don't really think there's any dilution of Cap's symbolism going on, IMO. Nor do I see them going "PC". But we'll have a better idea when the teaser and trailer are released.

 

[wobbly]

Well being a "good person" is pretty generic isn't it? I mean is he going to become Superman? Captain America stood for the American dream. What we fought for. What many of our troops died for. He stood for the principles of this country back then. Hence the name. Is he going to die now to get a cat out of a tree? It just sounds like they diluted the concept. He was someone who wanted to serve this country. But because of his disability he could not. He was suppose to represent the fighting spirit of our military for that period. When he was frozen and was revived in modern times, he still had those old values. THAT is the rub on the character. He is now in modern times with old fashion values. If he's a just a "good person", where is the distinction?

Where do they say he doesn't represent those things? Jumping the gun there.

He said "not just an American hero", ie: he is an American hero but goes beyond that as well.
That's an accurate description of Cap unless the idea of a 'good person' and being the 'ideal human' is exclusive to being American.

 

[Wolvieboy17]

Ah man, thats a huge shame. I love Cap and everything he stands for but since I'm Australian I guess i'm not allowed to.

 

[Webhead38]

Wow. You should never be in creative control of anything. Ever.

Sorry if my expectations go beyond the thrills of a one dimensional comic book that should have been made for television.

 

[Wolvieboy17]

Because a superhero who would only represent a narrow minded nationalist way of thinking is three dimensional.

 

[afan]

And he's not just an American hero, argues Evans. “I think he’s the ideal human,”

Well being a "good person" is pretty generic isn't it?

"Good person" is generic, but ideal human is not. Did you miss that?

 

[The Infernal]

Well you basically just described what they've actually done in the movie, painted on wings that could still be considered symbolic. They painted teeth and women on planes, they didn't give them dentures and strap a mannequin to them.

Yeah, they stopped doing that back in the pirate days when there was the problem of the long voyage and loosing a lonely deck hand trying to cop a feel.

Well being a "good person" is pretty generic isn't it?

Stopped reading there.

Wow. You should never be in creative control of anything. Ever.

Worth repeating.

 

[Webhead38]

Because a superhero who would only represent a narrow minded nationalist way of thinking is three dimensional.

Oh my. Now I'm a nationalist for asking the film makers to stay true to his origins? Jeez. And your calling me sensitive? Hang it up pal. It's not worth getting your drawers in a wad over. No one said you couldn't like this film. If you can't have a basic discussion about character development without making personal attacks stay out of this. Just agree to disagree. Waving the flag is something every person on ANY country can relate to. It's not about saying someone is BETTER. It's about having pride in your own heritage. That's all.

 

[captainrogers]

Well being a "good person" is pretty generic isn't it? I mean is he going to become Superman? Captain America stood for the American dream. What we fought for. What many of our troops died for. He stood for the principles of this country back then. Hence the name. Is he going to die now to get a cat out of a tree? It just sounds like they diluted the concept. He was someone who wanted to serve this country. But because of his disability he could not. He was suppose to represent the fighting spirit of our military for that period. When he was frozen and was revived in modern times, he still had those old values. THAT is the rub on the character. He is now in modern times with old fashion values. If he's a just a "good person", where is the distinction?

Life, Liberty, and the Puruit of Happiness? That ALL Men (Not JUST American) were created equal? Freedom?
Being in the military, these are the reasons I'm in for.
I don't see anything diluted or un-American, with Joe's comments. Steve doesn't stand for the Flag. He stands for the ideals said Flag represents.
I serve my country. I serve my country because I( naively or not ) still believe in the Dream. And I believe THATs why Rogers joined. And I absolutely think they "got it".
Apologies for my rant.

 

[Webhead38]

Like I said above. You can wave your own flag without putting it in someone's face. It's about having pride in your own heritage and values of your own country. Is that such a bad thing? The American flag in this film doesn't have to stand for anything more than a metaphor for pride in all countries.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Webhead, NOTHING in that statement says they're diluting him being American. They just said he's a good person and stands for things that are not just American, but are human. Guess what, HE'S RIGHT!!! Cap has stood against America MANY times in the comics when he felt America wasn't doing the right thing. He is not a blind patriot. He has his own sense of honor and DOES symbolize what a human can be. He's not just the perfect man physically, he is also that personally, and that DOES go beyond him being American.

Your complaint is unjustified.

 

[wobbly]

Oh my. Now I'm a nationalist for asking the film makers to stay true to his origins?

No, but it's presumptuous at best to read Evans words and somehow conclude they have not.

Like I said, being a 'good person' and the 'ideal human' is not exclusive to his being an American. That is what Evans actually did say there after all, not what you chose to read into it.

Wouldn't you agree?

 

[The Infernal]

Life, Liberty, and the Puruit of Happiness? That ALL Men (Not JUST American) were created equal? Freedom?
Being in the military, these are the reasons I'm in for.
I don't see anything diluted or un-American, with Joe's comments. Steve doesn't stand for the Flag. He stands for the ideals said Flag represents.
I serve my country. I serve my country because I( naively or not ) still believe in the Dream. And I believe THATs why Rogers joined. And I absolutely think they "got it".
Apologies for my rant.

Trust me. That's not a rant by internet standards.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Life, Liberty, and the Puruit of Happiness? That ALL Men (Not JUST American) were created equal? Freedom?
Being in the military, these are the reasons I'm in for.
I don't see anything diluted or un-American, with Joe's comments. Steve doesn't stand for the Flag. He stands for the ideals said Flag represents.
I serve my country. I serve my country because I( naively or not ) still believe in the Dream. And I believe THATs why Rogers joined. And I absolutely think they "got it".
Apologies for my rant.

America also didn't invent these values. We found them in many prior sources, and used them when founding this country. That doesn't give the US exclusive right to Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness. Enlightenment thinkers applied these to ALL men.

You and I totally agree.

 

[Webhead38]

No, but it's presumptuous at best to read Evans words and somehow conclude they have not.

Like I said, being a 'good person' and the 'ideal human' is not exclusive to his being an American. That is what Evans actually did say there after all, not what you chose to read into it.

Wouldn't you agree?

Of course I would agree! And I never said anything about Captain Amercia needing to represent America like we are 'superior'. That is so completely opposite to my thinking, I don't even know where to begin. All I said was waving the flag (LIKE A METAPHOR) is what he should do. By doing this, it allows people from ALL countries to wave their own flag. It's about pride in your country. THAT is the point. Not saying one is better than the other.

 

[블라스]

Wow. You should never be in creative control of anything. Ever.

 

[captainrogers]

Of course I would agree! And I never said anything about Captain Amercia needing to represent America like we are 'superior'. That is so completely opposite to my thinking, I don't even know where to begin. All I said was waving the flag (LIKE A METAPHOR) is what he should do. By doing this, it allows people from ALL countries to wave their own flag. It's about pride in your country. THAT is the point. Not saying one is better than the other.

Well, he's basically wearing it. I think he's got that covered via his name as well.

 

[The Infernal]

See? It was worth repeating.