The Official Superman Thread - Part 5

[Superman Earth1]

I dunno, I'm more interested in good stories and art than cohesive continuity. The New 52 is a mess all around anyway. Morrison had a lot of great stuff going on in his Superman, it was just bogged down by mediocre art. Or, art that didn't fit his writing anyway.

A Morrison/Romita Jr Superman would be really cool actually.

Morrison's run is what held the Superman book's back IMO. He would not let anyone know what his run or story arc was about really and it really hurt the books until he left. I would say the same for Wonder Woman since the Wonder Woman in JL, and Superman/Wonder Woman is like a whole different person than from her solo titles but the writer for that books does let them know what's going on he just isn't changing what he has planed for what DC has planed.

 

[Hush]

Morrisons run was a jumbled mess and that first arc of Superman was just as rough, I still feel like we don't know what the personality of Superman is supposed to be. Unchained has that same problem, it has a much better story but it's just unclear what Supes we have in that story because the definitive take on Supes is not really nailed down yet to me for the New 52.

 

[Llama_Shepherd]

It's weird to think Morrison caused such disorganisation considering how tightly organised Batman was under him.

I hope it has nothing to do with a growing apathy.

 

[Compi716]

The current run on Action Comics by Greg Pak and Aaron Kuder has been excellent, and exactly what the Superman franchise needed post-Morrison. I highly recommend it, if you guys haven't already checked it out.

 

[Mee]

Is cohesion between the books really that important? Isn't the point of having multiple books for a character (other than milking the cash) to be able to tell different types of stories?

It's weird to think Morrison caused such disorganisation considering how tightly organised Batman was under him.

When Morrison's Batman run started, he was doing all his high concept silver age throw back stuff, while Paul Dini on Detective was doing small one shot stories every month. Morrison didn't even get to finish his run the way he wanted, or at least not in time, before DC rebooted. Characters Morrison featured as major players don't even exist anymore.

So what if Morrison's Action was different from whoever was writing Superman, that's why you have the choice.


I guess I'm in the minority here, I just don't see the overwhelming value in cohesion between the books. They should blend together to an extent sure, but different writers are going to have different approaches.

 

[Cain]

Is cohesion between the books really that important? Isn't the point of having multiple books for a character (other than milking the cash) to be able to tell different types of stories?

Yes. Which is why in the case of characters with multiple books you usually get different tones and narrative structures. Like in the case of Batman how the eponymous book was more for grandiose blockbuster type stories and Detective was more about grounded self contained mysteries.

I guess I'm in the minority here, I just don't see the overwhelming value in cohesion between the books. They should blend together to an extent sure, but different writers are going to have different approaches.

I agree.

 

[RoughNTumble]

Morrison kept the other Superman writers completely out of the loop.

editors job tbqh

 

[hippie_hunter]

editors job tbqh

I certainly agree with you there, but when you see Scott Snyder working very close with Gail Simone, Tony Daniel, Kyle Higgins, and Peter Tomasi on Batman and Geoff Johns working very closely with Peter Tomasi, Tony Bedard, and Peter Milligan, it's kind of baffling that Grant Morrison didn't do the same.

 

[7heBoss]

I think Grant Morrison is the most overrated writer ever. I don't like him. I don't like his new origin, Secret Origins and Birthright were both a million times better. I also think he ruined a lot potential opportunities with Superman's continuity so now more capable writers can't even touch on it. eg. The Death of his Parent.

I just wish that somehow all of Morrison's run could disappear and that it would be replaced with a better origin.

 

[RoughNTumble]

mayb u culd disappear

 

[Mee]

Haha


I feel like a new origin was a given, with the reboot. I'm sick of origin stories in general, the new one for Batman sucks too. Marvel is still mining Wolverine's origins...

Killing the Kents is pretty strange though. I've always liked when both of them were alive, it separated Superman from other characters, that he had parents to go home to. I always liked those down on the farm scenes.

 

[HighFivingMF]

I think Grant Morrison is the most overrated writer ever. I don't like him. I don't like his new origin, Secret Origins and Birthright were both a million times better. I also think he ruined a lot potential opportunities with Superman's continuity so now more capable writers can't even touch on it. eg. The Death of his Parent.

I just wish that somehow all of Morrison's run could disappear and that it would be replaced with a better origin.

You're terrible.

 

[7heBoss]

You're terrible.

I am not saying he isnt incapable of good writing. I thought All-Star Superman was great. I just think that people treat him like he is godly, I believe Geoff Johns to be a much better and consistently good writer. I just feel that DC trusts Morrison to these major events that are super hyped up and they just further inflate his numbers. I thought the Death of Damian Wayne was the biggest failed opportunity ever. Damian dying should have happened in Death of the Family. Joker being the greatest Batman Villain ever, Death of the Family being built up to greatness and then having the lasting repercussions of a killed character. Nope, happens in random issue of Batman Inc. literally a month later. Much better...

 

[RoughNTumble]

 

[Cain]

 

[HighFivingMF]

I thought the Death of Damian Wayne was the biggest failed opportunity ever. Damian dying should have happened in Death of the Family. Joker being the greatest Batman Villain ever, Death of the Family being built up to greatness and then having the lasting repercussions of a killed character. Nope, happens in random issue of Batman Inc. literally a month later. Much better...

 

[Llama_Shepherd]

Don't worry, it's a joke right?



Right?

 

[Hush]

This man must not have read much of Morrisons JLA run, which is why he is regarded so highly in the first place.

 

[HighFivingMF]

This man must not have read much of Morrisons JLA run, which is why he is regarded so highly in the first place.

Or his Batman run because... That's the only way that post kind of makes sense.

 

[Hush]

Or his Batman run because... That's the only way that post kind of makes sense.

Meh he could have easily just started reading at the start of New 52 and not had any idea of how Morrison had written Batman thus far and made decisions on his own way he would have liked the story to have gone because he had only read Snyders Batman.

Honestly I think Post-New 52 Morrison has not been as strong a writer, ASS was awesome and his JLA Post-Crisis was amazing along with 52 the weekly series but somewhere in the middle of his Batman run and his whole Superman run he started to go off the goofycrapo-meter and lost me.

 

[HighFivingMF]

Must have missed the story where Joker already killed a Robin too.

 

[Hush]

All he got for that one was a lousy T-shirt.

 

[7heBoss]

Must have missed the story where Joker already killed a Robin too.

Death in the Family is LEGENDARY. Are you saying that Batman Incorporated #8 is equally just as good?

I'll be honest, I am a Superman Fan so any Batman related material by Grant Morrison will be lost on me. The only Batman Run I've kept up on is Scott Snyders. Anyway, Morrison to me ruined the Superman title with his Action Comics run. I don't expect you guys to agree with me.

 

[Cain]

One thing I did love about Grant Morrison's Action Comics run is that he made the 5th dimensional imps serious threats again. That was really appreciated. Mischievous gods should behave as mischievous gods. A real love letter to the golden age and silver age Superman.

 

[7heBoss]

I think you guys don't realize that I already know about Jason Todd's Death. It doesn't mean that the Joker isn't allowed to kill off another character. The whole story of Death of the Family was driven by Joker reliving or referencing his earlier crimes. So if he managed to kill ANOTHER Robin in the process. It would have completely made sense, "Reliving a past crime". Like i said, you don't have to agree with me, but Damian dying at the end of Death of the Family would have been better than what actually happened