The Official Superman Thread

[Frankenmation]

But come to think of it, I don't really know of any British writers who did a truly impressive job with him besides Morrison anyway.

Alan Moore?

 

[Sawyer]

That's a bingo.

Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow is my all time favorite Supes story.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Alan Moore?

Oh, right, I forgot about him. "For the Man who Has Everything" is a great story, as is "Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow?"

 

[Anubis]

Is Kelly a Brit?

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Nope.

 

[Kurosawa]

Kelly and Rucka are good enough i suppose, but The British writers do write Superman better, IMO. They give him the imagination and grandeur that a character like him deserves. Mark Waid is probably the only american writer who can match that.

Morrison and Waid are the only guys since 86 that have really gotten it completely right, Kelly had his moments as did Jurgens and Stern but even counting all of them, 5-6 competent writers in 25 years is terrible for any character.

 

[Mystirious]

Joe Kelly's "What's So Funny About Truth, Justice, and the American Way?" is the best Superman story I've ever read, personally.

One of the best comics I have ever read

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Morrison and Waid are the only guys since 86 that have really gotten it completely right, Kelly had his moments as did Jurgens and Stern but even counting all of them, 5-6 competent writers in 25 years is terrible for any character.

True. That's why I haven't read much Superman for the last few years. I also missed a lot of Kelly's run, unfortunately, since I didn't know how great he was at the time. I've only picked up a few scattered issues long after his run was over.

Rucka's run was good to me because it wasn't necessarily about Superman's "Superman-ness," for lack of a better term. It wasn't so self-referential about how great Superman is or what he represents, the way a lot of Morrison and Kelly's work tended to be. He approached Superman as a character first and foremost and did a lot of good stuff with him in that context.

 

[Mystirious]

True. That's why I haven't read much Superman for the last few years. I also missed a lot of Kelly's run, unfortunately, since I didn't know how great he was at the time. I've only picked up a few scattered issues long after his run was over.

Looking forward to seeing how Cornell writes Superman when the Luthor arc is done

 

[The Batman]

what about Rob Liefeld? j/k

I don't know if it has anything to do with race... can't make this a race issue, just boil it down to individual writers.

I think it's sad that someone is boiling down all of the influences and basis for what makes a good superman story on race. There are so many more influences and thought processes beyond that of race and as rightly pointed by others above, there have been some damn good American writers who have done great Superman stories.

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?id=27462&page=article

Another fan asked [Grant Morrison] how hard it is for him to write the quintessential American characters like Superman or Captain America seeing as he's not American. "In some cases I've noticed is that a lot of the British writers have almost more respect for these characters," the writer responded. "They're more interested in Superman as the best of America. That's what we saw in 'All-Star.' We really saw something beautiful in this country whose heroes up to that point were cowboys and gangsters that Siegel and Shuster created this man who would not kill and could solve all the problems and save us. To me, they created something that America really has to live up to.

"From outside, we kind of see Superman as the very best of what you guys can do, so I think the outsider's perspective helps in a lot of ways. I've thought a lot of American writers are kind of embarrassed by him, and it's an embarrassment or being ashamed of your greatest myth....we find that quite weird as an outsider."

Have there been good american superman writers? of Course. But they often dont have the same sense of respect or imagination for the character that british writers do. They just dont. And no one's making this a race isssue, so i dont know where thats coming from. This has more to do with culture and how it affects the writing.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Ironically, though, most of Captain America's best writers have been American, and at his best, he embodies basically the same things Superman does. The ideals the US was built on, as opposed to the grim realities it's fallen prey to over the centuries.

 

[Mystirious]

Ironically, though, most of Captain America's best writers have been American, and at his best, he embodies basically the same things Superman does. The ideals the US was built on, as opposed to the grim realities it's fallen prey to over the centuries.

Is Ed Brubaker American

His Captain America run has been

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Yeah, he's American. He hasn't really focused on Cap's symbolism so much, though. He tends to come at it from a more character-centric angle, working on Steve dealing with Bucky's return and then Bucky's redemption.

 

[Mystirious]

Yeah, he's American. He hasn't really focused on Cap's symbolism so much, though. He tends to come at it from a more character-centric angle, working on Steve dealing with Bucky's return and then Bucky's redemption.

 

[Anubis]

How can it be a race issue? It's a nationality issue if it even is an issue. They're all a buncha white guys.

 

[The BatDude]

Joe Kelly's "What's So Funny About Truth, Justice, and the American Way?" is the best Superman story I've ever read, personally.

One of the best comics I have ever read

Check out Kelly's Action Comics #792. It's a great Superman story, a bit more tone down in action but the story itself is a sad heart-warming story of how much Supes never gives up about caring for the people he protects.

 

[Mystirious]

How can it be a race issue? It's a nationality issue if it even is an issue. They're all a buncha white guys.

Do not think it is a race or nationality issue

Check out Kelly's Action Comics #792. It's a great Superman story, a bit more tone down in action but the story itself is a sad heart-warming story of how much Supes never gives up about caring for the people he protects.

 

[The Batman]

Ironically, though, most of Captain America's best writers have been American, and at his best, he embodies basically the same things Superman does. The ideals the US was built on, as opposed to the grim realities it's fallen prey to over the centuries.

Honestly, i think it has to do with power levels. People probably see Cap as easier to write since hes somewhat "street" level...

 

[Kurosawa]

Honestly, i think it has to do with power levels. People probably see Cap as easier to write since hes somewhat "street" level...

That's a huge part of it. Even a great writer like Denny O'Neil couldn't handle Superman for long because of the power level. It takes more work and imagination to challenge him and that's why he's regarded as such a hard character to write. I think the upside to writing a great Superman story-especially in this day and age-is much higher than writing a great Batman story, or anything else in mainstream superhero comics to be honest.

 

[Tron Bonne]

That's a pretty good theory actually. The comics medium has shifted a lot to that kind of area in the last couple of years, and street level characters are more standard and what people seem to be interested in. It's a shame

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I would agree except that I've read a whole slew of utterly fantastic Thor comics, and Thor's at least as powerful as Superman. Hell, one of the best mega-arcs in Thor's history, the King Thor Saga, featured Dan Jurgens cranking Thor's power level up even higher as a central plot point. Power levels are just an excuse for lazy or unimaginative storytellers.

 

[Comics N' Toons]

Power levels are just an excuse for lazy or unimaginative storytellers.

That is a very untrue statement.

Changing power levels on characters such as Thor or Superman or even Sentry might just be a great way to write a better story.

In Superman, we can look at Byrne's revamp or Denny O'neil's SANDMAN SAGA.

It doesn't mean the writers are "lazy or unimaginative storytellers," but maybe it better serves the story they want to tell.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

If the story you want to tell involves fundamentally shifting a character's power level on some kind of permanent basis, it's probably not appropriate for that character. There are very few exceptions to that rule that I can think of. Byrne's Superman revamp proved to be a terrible idea because the changes didn't stick. Superman was back to being pretty powerful before too long because that's part of what Superman is--he's the big gun, the guy who could tear the world in half but never would. That's part of what makes Superman Superman, so I'd be very, very wary of placing the character in the hands of a writer who didn't get that.

 

[WompuM]

Question:

Does anyone know where I can get my very own robot Zoey Dechanel-Lois Lane robot?

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Yes. But it involves Lex Luthor, a high-speed camera, and a whole lot of K-Y jelly.