Discussion in 'X-Men: Days of Future Past' started by merbass, Jun 30, 2011.
Watch Jennifer Lawrence endure 7 hours of half-naked agony for X-Men: First Class makeup tests
I suddenly want to work in make up.
Some fun deleted scenes. Nothing that I think needed to be in the film though, which is good. Xavier vs. Frost would have been fantastic but alas... maybe next time.
Too bad the scenes with Moira were deleted. Their relationship needed the development. Also, the part where Erik and Charles ran into one another in the hallway was funny.
Vaughn should've kept the expanded scene with Banshee as well. When I was watching the movie I couldn't figure out why they'd thrown him out a window without a safety net. Turns out there were some bushes below him.
Did the scene of Erik in the airport remind anyone else of Rogue in X1 when she saw that mother cuddling her child?
So no one's able to get an early copy of XM:FC on DVD or Blu-ray? I know one of you did, but all I saw were screen grabs.
If you guys get an advance copy, please take pictures of the slipcover and back cover. And some menu screen caps would be great.
If you buy the Blu-ray from Zavvi, there's a chance of getting a framed film cell. See here.
I agree. The whole training sequence was lovely, plus it showed that Moira was helping Charles with the training, which would explain how they developed some kind of relationship.
It does, now that you mention it! The airport scene is nice, but it makes sense that it was cut. Otherwise, Charles retrieving Erik's happy memory of his mother wouldn't have the same emotional impact, and it was an important moment for their bonding.
I liked that, particularly the Banshee extended "glass" scene. It was cute to see Moira and Charles' behavior and it was playful as well.
I will say, however, that the other training scenes seemed to be just extended scenes from the training montage, and not all that necessary. And I didn't like the one where Charles got frustrated with Alex after he specifically asked Alex to use his powers. That was out-of-character, so I'm glad it was cut.
I totally agree. I see what they were going for in that scene, but it would have dulled the "Rage and Serenity" scene later in the film. Seeing that Erik couldn't even remember that memory because he's so filled with pain and anger really brought out something for that moment when he's given that memory back by Charles.
Honestly, the only scene that I really, really wished they had kept was the one with Charles visiting Moira in her room. It was so playful and fun, and the two of them had great chemistry. Loganbabe, don't tell me you didn't just love that part, too.
You didn't ask me lol, but the first Charles and Moira scene was indeed fantastic.
Haha--yes, it was. Just a fun little detail and it's nice to see Moira standing up for her job and her "professionalism"...if I were her, I wouldn't. Not with those blue eyes staring my direction.
I don't really support Moira/Charles in this movie because to me FC was too busy SCREAMING at me that there was something going on between Erik and Charles. But when I heard there were going to be scenes between M/C I was excited because I thought it would give the sudden kiss at the end some cred. I heard too that the scenes really helped develop Moira as a character, something else I wanted to see.
I was so disappointed. The first scene is fun but the atmosphere is very rushed. I do like though that Moira had the professionalism "yeah you're cute but technically I'm in charge of you so this can't happen", it gave her some personality. However the second scene feels even MORE rushed and out of left field than the kiss that was left in. :/ I didn't feel that it developed their relationship at all or her as a character. They go from drinking wine to making out in all of 20 seconds, with no lead-up or anything. These too-short scenes could have been put in or taken out and I would still consider Moira to be pretty useless and still not be convinced that she was anything more to Charles than a good lay. It's too bad, because in other versions she's useful and badass
I agree that second scene was rushed as all hell. Surely there was some sort of lead-up to that scene that was filmed and we're not not being shown.
There should have been more than one. The last time we got Moira/Charles action she was turning him down and making him envision something so strongly he left utterly convinced it would end poorly. Throwing in the second scene where Moira abandons her convictions quite readily just totally eliminates the character development that came with her claiming work came first.
Hell yeah. I'm a straight man and I'd struggle lol
Lol, wouldn't we all? t:
I agree, but I also understand why they tried it - an angrier/stressed out version of Charles.
I guess it's something that came from James himself. He says that whenever he plays a character, even a "good man" type of character, he likes to give said character an edge. Because he says it's impossible for a person to be entirely good and perfect. But when he tried doing it while playing Robbie in Atonement, Joe Wright told him "Look, he's just a good guy, so forget about it. Play him like a good guy". But even so James managed to give Robbie some kind of edge, when Robbie goes mad and barks at Briony after saving her from her faked drowing - which some people thought was out-of-character for Robbie to do, btw.
I think he tried it again with Charles, to give him this edge, but it went too far - the scene didn't look good. Like I said, I understand Charles being kind of frustrated while training Alex, and he was dealing with a new - and certainly stressful - situation in his life, but he sounded and acted too pissed off, even scary, and was certainly totally out-of-character for Charles. The idea for the scene was good, not the development.
I loved it, I laughed too much! James has a wonderful comedy timing, which is quite interesting because he almost only plays tragic characters. I guess it just comes naturally to him, because of his fun-loving personality. It's a pity that the scene was cut, because it's quite rare to see the funny side of his characters on screen.
I agree Charles could have kept the edge but I think he could have just snapped at Alex to get the fire extinguisher and left it at that. Yelling at him for not being in control of his powers when the whole point of the exercise was to learn to control his powers was.. stupid. Leave Charles' edge to the sequel, where we will hopefully get to see him walk through fire and lose his **** at some point.
The more times I've seen the first M/C scene the less I like it. I still like the bit before it where Erik and Charles are both sneaking around and Charles' gratuitous show-offy use of his powers with Abracadabra but the rest is just... so darn awkward! He seems too desperate, too fast. I've read a couple mini-articles that suggest McAvoy is playing Charles as a closeted gay guy in this scene and while I don't really agree I very much understand why they came to that conclusion. A friend of mine in university was certainly gay but so deep in denial. When he was hitting on a mutual (girl)friend, he came off very much like Charles did in this scene, rushed and awkward and trying to get right to it like she was his last attempt at a hetero lifestyle (and in the end she was, he came out a few days after she shot him down).
Again, I don't consider Charles to be gay. But this scene just feels less and less romantic to me and more desperate every time I watch it. It could be that Charles is just incredibly, indiscriminately horny here.
On a side note, I'm curious to know what Moira was thinking at him to make him retreat so hastily without any argument whatsoever. She already told him no and I think had he just read "No is NO." in her mind he would have retreated simply disappointed and possibly self-assured that she would eventually come around. But he seems more shocked/uncomfortable than anything.
Still mad she gave up her convictions for that kiss though. This scene was pretty much the only one in the movie where she had any kind of authority over someone.
Hahaha! That just made my day!
I agree with James; every person, no matter how good-hearted, still has a dark side. They still have moments when they say something they shouldn't or they snap, but in a movie like this where you only see that person for a couple hours as opposed to a regular basis (I mean, a date could last longer than 2 hours and people are on their best behavior there...well, sometimes), each scene with them has to represent something about that character. So Charles' anger doesn't fit, but it was a worthy effort.
And I liked Robbie getting pissed off at Briony; she was old enough to know better and she could have gotten herself killed. I'm not saying I agree with calling a 13-year-old a "stupid child," but I definitely understood why he said it.
It's the one deleted scene I wanted them to keep. I was at work watching it during my lunch and I kept snickering; people thought I'd gone nuts. He did great with it; I love seeing this character, who as an older man is very modest about his abilities, being playful with them and even showing off a bit. It was just fun.
That's a good reason to cut the scene, isn't it? My guess is, it looked good in the script but looked out-of-character in the movie. So they deleted it.
Jeez...they wrote up the same thing with Routh's Superman and Spock & Kirk's relationship--apparently all good-looking men are closeted homosexuals (of course, the not-so-hot ones are left for us women, but whatever).
I've known men who try to over-compensate and be players or be over-manly in order to hide the fact that they're actually gay; I didn't get that vibe here at all. Just like some people with low-self esteems over-compensate by coming off as arrogant...but there are people who are simply arrogant. No need to over-analzye it.
I got the impression that Charles is having fun like a typical, twenty-something guy. He's playful, he's a little arrogant and he wants to get laid. But, even above all that, Moira is the first woman he's actually shown his abilities to. So he's probably even more interested in her for that alone; he's able to be himself around her and she's obviously fascinated by what he can do. So, being rejected by her might sting a little more than normal and the fact that his typical, charming one-liners didn't work either was probably a slap in the face as well.
Ah...if we didn't hear it, my guess is that she probably said more than, "no means no." I think she totally blasted his butt for being unprofessional, assuming she'd just climb into bed with him, and there was probably some other choice phrases that a PG-13 movie doesn't allow...and THAT made him uncomfortable. Not knowing what she said, but seeing his reaction was priceless.
Are you talking about the deleted scene with the wine? Yeah, I agree there. I'm glad that scene was cut. It felt rushed and the dialogue was, um...a bit much. The mutation angle was cute with him hitting on women in the bars, but it was overkill in that later scene (of course, that scene was cut, but meh). And the scene itself lasted ten seconds and they didn't discuss anything of value. It felt very forced, unfortunately.
I didn't think of that at all, how she's the first woman he's probably shown his powers to (and been attracted to). Hence the showing off. What a cheeseball "Look what I can do SLEEP WITH ME".
Haha that would have been awesome. Again Moira standing her ground which would have made her a likeable character. I don't have anything against Moira but I don't have anything... for her? We don't learn anything about her the entire movie, her character is defined by factoids we glean from others (like the fact that she's perhaps the only female agent which is pretty awesome).
YES. Ughhh. Some scenes I think could have been left in without any damage done... in particular I like both of the Banshee ones, though the timing is better in the theatrical version of him first trying to fly. I also love Dragneto because it shows Charles using his powers for ridiculousness and to me anyway shows a level of fun-friendship-comfort level, a little bit of ridiculous silliness allowed in their relationship. It shows Charles is extra unafraid of Erik and even likes him enough to mess with him. But again the timing of the scene works better without it. Most of the deleted scenes I do consider "canon" because they do still work within the confines of the movie and the characters. The first M/C scene can still work as well but it jumbles things up a bit with him rushing out to stop Erik (how long does it take to walk out?). The second one does not work at all and ughhh the dialogue and the awkward kiss and yikes. Even the way he slams the wine in the icebucket is awkward. The Argentinian airport scene doesn't work either because it completely diminishes the satellite scene. Alex and Charles' little argument is too cruel on Charles' part, and I'm not sure the Hank/Raven bit in the laboratory works either. Not sure if I'm missing any. ^_^ But those are my 2 cents. The scene that I wish wish wish they had put in there but obviously didn't was the extended version of Charles and Erik's final chess match. We know from trailers that there was more to it.
Yes, but such a cute cheeseball. t: I don't like men who feel it necessary to show off all the time, but playful flirtation is just fun. And men and women do it all the time to get noticed by the opposite sex.
Sadly, I think Moira was under-used in the later half of this movie. She had her moments, but she's just "there" most of the time. I liked what I saw of her, especially because she's a female CIA agent in the 60's and (at least at first) you get to see her discovering mutants from a human point-of-view. Gives her something extra.
Dragneto was a bit too silly for me, but I understand why you liked it. By itself, it's fun but I'm glad it was cut. Besides the Moira/Charles scene (the first one, not the second), I don't think any other deleted scene would have added anything to the movie. I enjoyed Banshee's scenes as well, especially when he made Moira/Charles sick (that was cute), but I can see where the training montage could have ended up too long if they had kept all that.
Personally, for deleted scenes, I pick out what I consider "canon" and forget about the rest. Some deleted scenes contradict the movie. For example, Charles yelling at Alex; in the movie, that part of the scene is replaced with Charles assurring Alex he'd teach him to control his powers, which was obviously added in post-production. Also, Erik recalling the memory of his mother in the beginning of the movie and then, during the training scene, he tells Charles he didn't even realize he still had that memory. Doesn't quite fit.
But each to their own. I thought most of the scenes were fun, if nothing more.
Yeah, I do the same. For me Dragneto and the Banshee scenes are canon. The rest I can do without. Still bummed they cut the chess scene though and the oft-mentioned psychic battle(though I'm not sure they ever even shot it. Hopefully we'll get to see a badass battle of Frost vs Xavier in a sequel, we've seen a nice range of Erik's powers now I'd like to see Charles pull out some extra badass moves).
Can't wait to see the behind-the-scenes though. I've been saving them for when I buy the bluray. Gifs I've seen floating around have been pretty hilarious and fun and from what I've heard it's confirmed in the extras that Charles and Erik indeed have a "tragic romance" going on. As someone who hates non-canon pairings/slash I was beginning to worry something was wrong with me when I noticed something going on between these two in the film. Feeling pretty vindicated now.
I would have loved a psychic battle in this movie, but I think having one in the sequel when Charles can't walk will have a deeper impact. Like saying, "Yeah, I'm still one powerful badass; don't under-estimate me because I'm in a wheelchair." I like that idea and hope that's one reason they didn't put it in this movie.
As for the "romance," I, personally, don't believe that every strong relationship has to be a sexual one. We just seem so eager to sexualize everything. I think people can deeply love and respect each other without wanting to screw one another in the process--those emotions don't have to go hand-in-hand.
That being said, I think it's one of the best bromances I've seen, and I think that bromance is the reason this movie works at all--the main plot with Shaw wanting to just blow up everything feels cartoonish to me. These two actors (and characters) are what made this movie great. They have fantastic chemistry, and one thing I really hope to see in a sequel is their relationship as Erik turns more dark and Charles has to deal with his disability (they better do that right! SCI is a devastating condition and it would be an insult to the character not to explore that). But anyway....
EXACTLY. I've read that Matthew Vaughn may be ableist (IIRC he said something like "Magneto needs a new nemesis cuz Charles is in a wheelchair"<----WTF!!!!) but I hope that was just a misguided quote. Erik needs a new nemesis anyway because he and Charles are in the grey area between allies and enemies and I can't seem either of them up for fighting in the sequel. Maybe if they made 3 movies, at the end of the third one.
Having Charles be at a physical disadvantage may also mean he has a lot more time to consider the mental advantages he never realized he had. Using them against Frost and winning against her would be awesome. He can't just be a poor helpless character "because he's in a wheelchair". He needs to find ways to rise above his disadvantages and become stronger for them.
I think we've both said it before but he needs to walk through fire in the next movie and come out with power that he couldn't have fathomed. I'm trying to remember in the older movies too if we ever got a sense of his power beyond telepathic messages and using cerebro. I don't think we did. I'd like to see him use a bit of rage to get stronger and dial it back a bit when he realizes that's not the way he wants to end up.
Oh definitely. And I think there are tons of famous examples out there. Kirk and Spock, Sherlock and Watson, excellent friendships with excellent bromance. But Erik and Charles have something more going on. I was actually having a really good discussion with a friend of mine about this. She pointed out that if the E/C relationship is sexual, it'd be sexual on a small scale and even then you'd have to define what "sexual" means to them. I agree with this. I don't think Charles and Erik spend the movie ravishing each other with their eyes. I think they're in love with each other, with sex being a rather belated element to it, if it even occurs to them at all. But still, they're much more than friends. Does that make sense? It's like having a crush on someone when you're younger, or being in an asexual relationship. They are like that, but so much more.
Absolutely again. Whether you see the romance or not is irrelevant, as long as you can at least see the Bromance, which is indeed why the movie works. The most scathing of reviews still give the chemistry high marks. It's exactly the reason I want a sequel, to see these two brilliant actors sort out their demons individually and together and have this brittle relationship of friends and foes and tension that you really don't see anywhere else in the movies these days. To move onto X4, which would undoubtedly be a blow'emup movie that would ignore the nice character nuances put forward with FC would be an insult to the franchise. Finish the FC trilogy, finish the second Wolverine movie if you reeeeally have to, and then you can reboot the movies or hand the rights back to Marvel as you like. But these storylines deserve more in the meantime!
So very, very true. And I don't mind a new "nemesis" but I think to just discard Charles because he's in a wheelchair is stupid and a total waste. The whole reason FC worked at all was this tragic relationship. To brush it aside would ruin any sequels.
Now, personally, I would love them to bring in a nemesis that both Charles and Erik see as a threat...but the way Charles tries to defeat this enemy and the way Erik tries to defeat them are totally different. And, in the end, Charles stops Erik from doing something horrible and maybe even breaks up his new "brotherhood of mutants" in the process, further straining any friendship they still have. But that's just me.
Oh, yes, yes, yes. I totally agree. And the angry angle would be a nice touch; it would bring something out in this character that hasn't been seen. He has a right to be angry--God, I would be.
That's a good point. I don't believe these two want to jump into bed together, but there's definitely affection there. There's intimacy that you don't usually see in same-sex relationships. A lot has to do with Charles' telepathy and sharing Erik's memories, and also the fact that they're both mutants. They understand each other. Despite they're different upbringings, they're both smart, charming men. And they respect each other completely. Could it have turned sexual if a few more buttons got pushed? Ah, yeah...I'll admit that. But I think that's a boundary they never consider or fantasize about crossing into. But it's more than just a simple friendship. I also believe they love each other--no objection there.
Absolutely. Right now, I'm NOT interested in an X4 and (frankly) I'm not all that keen on a new Wolverine movie, either. You have a great start to a new trilogy set up with great characters...why stop it and move onto X4? Wolverine--okay, fine. But not X4.
Not just you. I really like this idea. I always had it in my mind that Erik would come up against some guy/gal who went up against his ideals AND Charles' ideals on some level and Erik would have to bite the bullet (awful pun not intended) and go to Charles and be like "look I can't take this guy alone". And then they'd team up and it'd be just like Old Times ! but then they'd beat the baddie and maybe even have an awful heartbreaking moment where they're both like "Wow we're such a good team! Charles will obviously join me! Erik will surely come back home!" and... nope. </3
Yup. He got to be all noble on the beach but now that he's had some time to stew over how he was betrayed and also realize what it means to be paralyzed from the waist-down.... I can see it building and building. I would actually be furious myself if they gloss over this and just let him be the calm, solemn Charles at the end of the movie. If Erik comes back and he's all "Oh Erik GREAT TO SEE YOU I'VE MISSED YOU OH MY LEGS NO BIGGIE BRO!" and forgives him.. grr. I need to see that even Charles isn't capable of immediately forgiving anyone. I know we're pretending that the deleted scene with Alex isn't canon because Charles is such a dick in it but pretending that it is... can you imagine the anger he'd unleash on Erik?? On Raven??? Let's see some of that! Maybe he gets so angry his hair falls out... haha. ;P
I don't think they were thinking about sex necessarily but I do think they were thinking about other things that would still have been taboo in the 60s or perhaps still trying to work out their feelings. I think Charles figures out pretty early on what Erik means to him in the more-than-friends zone, but I think Erik doesn't really get it until perhaps even as late as the beach. Him asking him to be by his side isn't about being on the anti-human side. It's him telling Charles he wants to be with him, the two of them, together. I don't think he's considered the sexual logistics, I think that in that moment all he wants is to be with Charles and they'll figure it out as they go. Up until the beach his mind was too full of Shaw to worry about other stuff I think.
And Wolverine 2 keeps getting pushed back and the writers and directors keep changing faster than a pair of socks. I read that Black Swan's director was initially helming it, which would have been really interesting, but now that's changed and now the screenwriter has switched to the guy who penned the 4th Die Hard. They were supposed to be filming by now but production was pushed back because of the earthquake (which has got to be a dog-ate-my-homework excuse, I live here and as lovely as they used to be the affected parts of Japan would not be the parts they would film in anyway). And now pushed back again because HJ has another committment or something... I think they should just fast-track a FC sequel. But the big problem seems to be that FOX is money-hungry. They think X4 will do well because X3 did. They're forgetting that X3 came off the heels of the widely-loved X2. People flocked to it under the impression that it couldn't be that bad, despite the negative reviews. Then they were betrayed twice and XMFC did badly at the box office. While I think they've definitely restored faith in the franchise, I thing this faith belongs to the First Class timeline. They're giving their audience too much credit if they think 1) they will remember/care about a movie that will be nearly 10 years old by the time they come out with X4 and 2) they will remember X3 with fondness and find loose ends that deserve being tied up in X4. Hint: THERE AREN'T ANY.
I love Patrick Stewart and Ian McKellan but it's time to let the older X-Men universe die and stick with this fresh one. X4 and leading into X5? No thanks.
Sorry for my rambling btw, I write a little too stream-of-consciousness sometimes.