The Dark Knight Rises The upswinging Pendulum

[DeeBarr]

"A year ago none of these cops and lawyers would dare touch any of you..."

A year later and it's still true. The Batman has been hounded across the streets of Gotham so much that he has gone into semi retirement and is operating very much behind the scenes. The criminal element has ran amok while he recovered from being shot and now that the police are after him to boot. They have even arranged fake crimes and crime scenes to try and catch him. He is on the point where he is seriously ready to quit, not because he wants to. Because he has to.

An excellent post by Melkay made me consider this...

So, if we already know that another suit is very likely to come, we can at least speculate about how could it be, visually speaking.

The Begins Suit was designed to make him appear more bulky and more animal, in a sense, specially in the area of the neck, which was a little bent forwards to make Bale seem broodier. He was the Bat Man, and one of the main themes in the film is how he made his persona to inspire fear. Hence, a more animalistic approach was required for the suit.

In The Dark Knigth, as the title suggest it, he acted more like a Knight. He was a champion of justice who was having a crusade against crime. His dichotomy of being a hero who acts beyond the law was more played up, and his new suit reflects that. Is not as bulky, but sleeker, its made of many separated metal plates, which make him look like a knight in armor... it is a suit designed to remember us that he is considered a hero who fights for justice. A knight, albeit a dark one.


So, if the end of TDK did not fool me, I strongly believe that one of the most prominent themes in the next movie will be how Batman lives the life of an outcast. He won't be seen as someone fair or shiny by the public. If he was feared in BB and respected and "almost" idealized in TDK, in B3 he may be Hated. And, maybe he will be seen Uglier.

That's why I believe that his new suit will be more bent on describing how much of an outcast Batman has become. It will be more animalistic than the one in TDK, but with slighter alterations. Therefore, maybe the most obvious idea would be a combination of the dark/hulky suit in Begins and a sleek/armored one in TDK.

One thing is for sure... I want to see one of those iconic scenes where he has a very fierce battle and his cape is all torned and ripped... his suit broken and with holes in it... and is bleeding everywhere.

Here is my question now...

What is going to provide the turning point when he goes from bleeding villan to setting out on the road to redemption. Is it a case of endurance or will something trigger this off?

I believe it will be part both.

What will the menace that rises that forces him out and back on to the streets of Gotham City. I think that after the Dark Knight that Harvey is dead and the Joker is in Arkham Asylum. I am reading some excellent ideas for villans for the new movie on here but as of yet I have not got a sense of what the turning point will be. Obviously he is commited to his life as the Bat but I feel there is one final ingredient we are not aware of. Moreover, I thought it was a brilliant advantage for BAtman to have now that the criminal element think he is a killer too. Two police and five civillians if I remember right is a fair haul in a few days. Has Harveys death (if he is dead) been pinned on him too?

I feel we will see him at his lowest. Then the pendulum will swing up.

Why?

Food for thought I think...

Only time will tell but I would be intetrested to hear all of your ideas.

Best

Dee

 

[Bathead]

I think the theme likely will be that of redemption.
I think perhaps there wil be an incident of some sort such as that in the recent Batman cartoon, where for the longest time Batman was as much wanted by the police as his enemies. That all changed when he saved the lives of pretty much a good chunk of the GCPD from the plans of Freeze, thereby earning their respect. At this point, although they could not legally sanction his actions, the cops were definitely more likely to co-operate with him.
Now , I know some of you didn't care for that particular cartoon, understand that I'm just using it as an example of the kind of thing that could happen in the next movie. If this is to be Nolan's last Batman movie, I suspect he would want to leave it with Batman as an acknowledged hero in Gotham, as it was stated in Begins, an example of hope to the people of the city.

 

[The Jester]

I dont know if this would be effective, but would it be out of the question to actually make the third installment like the Dark Knight Returns?

This way Nolan's series could be a perfect the begining and end of batman.

 

[Doc Samson]

I dont know if this would be effective, but would it be out of the question to actually make the third installment like the Dark Knight Returns?

This way Nolan's series could be a perfect the begining and end of batman.

People hate to hear that, but personally I've been on that side of the fence for a while now. Understand though, I don't think a real "comic-accurate" Dark Knight Returns is necessary, or even possible, without Two-Face, the Joker & Superman. But the idea of an older, more grizzled Batman is what I want to see.

Bale's strongest ability is to morph his body along with his roles. I think it would put the focus squarely on Bale's acting chops, which are sorely underrated, and give him another way to portray Batman, if they advance the story 10 or 15 years into the future. Imagine Bale, a few pounds overweight wearing prosthetics with graying hair, waging war against the criminals and police. It would be a Batman we've never seen before in live action, and Bale's the perfect chameleon to do it.

 

[The Jester]

People hate to hear that, but personally I've been on that side of the fence for a while now. Understand though, I don't think a real "comic-accurate" Dark Knight Returns is necessary, or even possible, without Two-Face, the Joker & Superman. But the idea of an older, more grizzled Batman is what I want to see.

Bale's strongest ability is to morph his body along with his roles. I think it would put the focus squarely on Bale's acting chops, which are sorely underrated, and give him another way to portray Batman, if they advance the story 10 or 15 years into the future. Imagine Bale, a few pounds overweight wearing prosthetics with graying hair, waging war against the criminals and police. It would be a Batman we've never seen before in live action, and Bale's the perfect chameleon to do it.

Yeah, thats the only aspects of the story I see them borrowing; Crime getting out of hand due to the absense of batman and an older bruce wayne fixing up Gotham once and for all.

I do think that the joker could be recasted if the story took place later in the future. Of course we don't know for sure, but it didn't seem that the joker was really a threat until batman came into the picture. At the end of The Dark Knight, possibly Joker could go into a more stable, saner state without batman. After years and years, and finally with the dark knight's return, Joker goes back into madness, and we can have that carnical showdown.

 

[MaceB]

I dont know if this would be effective, but would it be out of the question to actually make the third installment like the Dark Knight Returns?

This way Nolan's series could be a perfect the begining and end of batman.

I've been thinking about that for a while myself and - like Doc - I'm pretty torn about it. There are so many great things that could come from presenting an older, more worn Batman. It's part of the comics, after all, and it's a fresh way to present a character who's been on screen for the last twenty years. It's a logical step, and it could bring a solid conclusion to Nolan's series. It's ultimately the Batman I most want to see.

On the other hand, part of me says that it's best to be patient with these sorts of things. I'd like to think that after Nolan's trilogy (god willing), WB will start a new saga that leaves off (in an ambiguous way) where the previous one began. In other words, I hope this is the start of a much larger chain of Batman films. If Nolan skips ahead and goes straight to the old Batman, that fu#*s up my dreams a little bit. There's no rush to get there in my opinion, as long as I know that we are going to get there at some point.

 

[Ronny Shade]

I wouldn't mind a story that is thematically similar to DKR. In fact, that's what I've been suggesting. I've been using Noman's land as the example, but the themes are similar. They're both about the total destruction of order in Gotham City and Batman being the only one there to save it and bring it back. Does this make him a dictator? Almost. He's always going to be fighting the temptation to make the rules instead of trying to enforce them. I don't want a falsely aged Bale and a DKR direct translation.

 

[Rasputin911]

they should finish a trilogy about the "young" Batman's story arc (he is still new at being Batman at the end of TDK), and then bring Nolan/Goyer/Bale back in a few years for a DKR-esque film. It wouldn't be an adaptation, but it would provide the themes/inspiration (like Long Halloween and TKJ did for The Dark Knight)

 

[protoctista]

they should finish a trilogy about the "young" Batman's story arc

I like this idea, though not the way in which you ellaborated on it.

Batman Begins was what the title denotes - It tells the story from the first relevant indicators of Batman's emergence, to his first major incident as a crime fighter.

The Dark Knight shows Batman stuggling with his new founded position as a crime fighter, taking him from a somewhat naive outlook - believing that it is a battle that can be fought and won to allow him to return to a normal life, to a hardened understanding of the nature of his role - not as a crime fighter or a hero, but as a silent protector - a watchful guardian.

These are both early progressions. These are the sorts of developments and lessons that a young solider will undergo during training and his first months of active combat - acquiring his methods and philosophy/understanding.

The Dark Knight's sequel should conclude a trilogy that chronicles batman's path to maturity - enstating him in the position of power that is his most constant throughout the mythos. At the end of the third film, we should have seen Bruce Wayne become batman, understand what it is to be batman, and then take control of his methods so that he can continue his task in a recurring manner. This, in short, is the path to maturity. Nolan's trilogy.




Where will that leave the franchise?

I think what Nolan will have established is batman's recurring status within the mythos. Batman will no longer be the young man searching for his place within the world - he will have that place. The story would switch focus to the nature of his career.

The question that filmakers will be answering is, what does he do with his career?

Well in my opinion, what will be established is a central mythos upon which new directors can explore different areas of the psychology, philosophy, and relationships of batman. Whole swathes of new material can be drawn into the story - the wider, mainstream audience will now understand who and why batman is, as well as what gotham is and how it operates. The wider audience will have Nolan's central mythos upon which to develop.

New material like 'difficult' villains, superman/batman cross-overs, robin, the wider DC universe, an extended will-they-wont-they relationship with catwoman,... the possibilities are endless.

 

[CJ]

I like this idea, though not the way in which you ellaborated on it.

Batman Begins was what the title denotes - It tells the story from the first relevant indicators of Batman's emergence, to his first major incident as a crime fighter.

The Dark Knight shows Batman stuggling with his new founded position as a crime fighter, taking him from a somewhat naive outlook - believing that it is a battle that can be fought and won to allow him to return to a normal life, to a hardened understanding of the nature of his role - not as a crime fighter or a hero, but as a silent protector - a watchful guardian.

These are both early progressions. These are the sorts of developments and lessons that a young solider will undergo during training and his first months of active combat - acquiring his methods and philosophy/understanding.

The Dark Knight's sequel should conclude a trilogy that chronicles batman's path to maturity - enstating him in the position of power that is his most constant throughout the mythos. At the end of the third film, we should have seen Bruce Wayne become batman, understand what it is to be batman, and then take control of his methods so that he can continue his task in a recurring manner. This, in short, is the path to maturity. Nolan's trilogy.




Where will that leave the franchise?

I think what Nolan will have established is batman's recurring status within the mythos. Batman will no longer be the young man searching for his place within the world - he will have that place. The story would switch focus to the nature of his career.

The question that filmakers will be answering is, what does he do with his career?

Well in my opinion, what will be established is a central mythos upon which new directors can explore different areas of the psychology, philosophy, and relationships of batman. Whole swathes of new material can be drawn into the story - the wider, mainstream audience will now understand who and why batman is, as well as what gotham is and how it operates. The wider audience will have Nolan's central mythos upon which to develop.

New material like 'difficult' villains, superman/batman cross-overs, robin, the wider DC universe, an extended will-they-wont-they relationship with catwoman,... the possibilities are endless.

Couldn't have said it better myself. This has always been the way I percieved the Nolan series and how I expect it to end.