This show was just not well thought out

[Panthro]

Hey Clare. Long time no see.

 

[PsyJ]

I love TAS Jubilee! I never got why so many hated her. I also definitely prefer X-Men TAS and Wolverine over X-Men Evolution. X-Men Evolution just bored and annoyed me.

 

[EvilClareToo]

Hey Clare. Long time no see.

Hi Panthro! Yeah, I know-I tend to hang out on the comics forum since there is no more WATXM to discuss!!!!I can only take so many "Cyclops was robbed on WATXM" discussions before we started repeating ourselves. At least now we can pick on Jubilee....

We need that X Men anime soon so we have something new to discuss-hopefully it won't be a rehash of the Cyclops discussion (Ellis, you listening??????)

 

[Panthro]

Hi Panthro! Yeah, I know-I tend to hang out on the comics forum since there is no more WATXM to discuss!!!!I can only take so many "Cyclops was robbed on WATXM" discussions before we started repeating ourselves. At least now we can pick on Jubilee....

We need that X Men anime soon so we have something new to discuss-hopefully it won't be a rehash of the Cyclops discussion (Ellis, you listening??????)

I know, I've tried so hard to break the habit, it's like Rehab level. Of course, Cyclops wasn't the only one who got screwed over - Storm was screwed over with virtually no characterization (in contrast to Cycke's terrible one) while Colossus was reduced to a cameo. You could even say Jean Grey got screwed over with being a barely there MacGuffin (they probably should have just had her dead & buried from the get go, would have made Cycke getting together with Emma so much easier).

Hopefully the next series will be better.

 

[EvilClareToo]

I know, I've tried so hard to break the habit, it's like Rehab level. Of course, Cyclops wasn't the only one who got screwed over - Storm was screwed over with virtually no characterization (in contrast to Cycke's terrible one) while Colossus was reduced to a cameo. You could even say Jean Grey got screwed over with being a barely there MacGuffin (they probably should have just had her dead & buried from the get go, would have made Cycke getting together with Emma so much easier).

Hopefully the next series will be better.

Yes, but look on the bright side. They presented us with the best Emma and Bishop we've seen so far (comic book appearances included!), Domino, Nightcrawler and Scarlett Witch were ace, we saw Gambit kick major butt in Genosha in true anime style as well as see his full charm offensive in action, the Hellfire Club popped up, Angel was great (I really fell for him in this series-Guardian Angel was probably the best episode), and we got to see camoes of AoA Blink, Dust and Firestar. FIRESTAR!!!!!!

 

[Zant]

You forgot A great Magneto,Quicksilver and Sentinals which were not jokes like the 90s ones.Also an ambitious season long arc which most superhero shows are afraid of.If the next x men show is half as ambitious as this show then I'll be happy.Can't wait for x men anime

 

[Squidboy]

I really did like the evolution of the Sentinels throughout the season. Even though we knew what they'd end up being like, it was still cool to watch them come to fruition in the last few episodes.

 

[Panthro]

Yes, but look on the bright side. They presented us with the best Emma and Bishop we've seen so far (comic book appearances included!), Domino, Nightcrawler and Scarlett Witch were ace, we saw Gambit kick major butt in Genosha in true anime style as well as see his full charm offensive in action, the Hellfire Club popped up, Angel was great (I really fell for him in this series-Guardian Angel was probably the best episode), and we got to see camoes of AoA Blink, Dust and Firestar. FIRESTAR!!!!!!

I certain can't argue with that, I'm just saying Cyclops would have been better off if he'd been placed on a bus for California & not seen again. You could have stuck a giant carrot in his place and the story's overall result would have been pretty much the same.

Magneto & Mr. Sinister got handled pretty well, and getting Clancy Brown to voice Sinister was a stroke of genius, so I have to give them credit for that as well.

 

[Squidboy]

I think the Cyclops episode with Sinister was one of the strongest ones of the season, so if we had to accept him being wallpaper, just to build up to an awesome episode like that, then it was definitely worth the wait.

 

[Jordacar]

I still have trouble deciding which X-Men toon I prefer. All 3 of them have great stuff going on. I might say WatXM, but that show was like one season extracted from a really good longer series, and not the first season of that show.

Every TV show worth its salt goes through growing pains. XTAS and XM:E certainly did. I think WatXM was much better when it started than the previous two shows were when they started. In a weird way, it's almost like they bypassed some (not all) of those growing pains by essentially skipping to the 2nd or 3rd season.

 

[Squidboy]

I think writing for the comics gave Kyle and Yost a better grasp of pacing the show, so the show benefited greatly from that, but there were some fumbles along the way. The Hulk episode really didn't add anything to the series, other than plug the Hulk Vs. movie. There were some episodes that were just great - X-Calibre was probably the best episode of the series, if not of any X-Men shows. I might be biased as a Nightcrawler fan, but I thought that episode really brought the series to a good place, after stumbling around for a few episodes in what seemed like one-shot stories that didn't really add up much, other than to introduce new characters, or to showcase how awesome Logan is.

 

[EvilClareToo]

I think writing for the comics gave Kyle and Yost a better grasp of pacing the show, so the show benefited greatly from that, but there were some fumbles along the way. The Hulk episode really didn't add anything to the series, other than plug the Hulk Vs. movie. There were some episodes that were just great - X-Calibre was probably the best episode of the series, if not of any X-Men shows. I might be biased as a Nightcrawler fan, but I thought that episode really brought the series to a good place, after stumbling around for a few episodes in what seemed like one-shot stories that didn't really add up much, other than to introduce new characters, or to showcase how awesome Logan is.

Totally agree! Nightcrawler rocked in this series, and X Calibre brought out all the best in him: the spirital, caring side and the swashbuckling sweet charmer. One of my favorite episodes, and it made sooo angry at Gambit that he tried to take him out in Aces and Eights!! Long live the fuzzy elf (at least on tv!)

 

[Squidboy]

The Gambit episodes weren't bad (especially when he's playing Lorna), but for me, the quintessential Gambit episode is "Cajun Spice" from X-Men Evolution, where he kidnaps Rogue to help him deal with the Guild feuds in New Orleans. It just hit all the right notes so well and irritated me to no end that Gambit fell into the background after that episode.

 

[Panthro]

I still have trouble deciding which X-Men toon I prefer. All 3 of them have great stuff going on. I might say WatXM, but that show was like one season extracted from a really good longer series, and not the first season of that show.

Every TV show worth its salt goes through growing pains. XTAS and XM:E certainly did. I think WatXM was much better when it started than the previous two shows were when they started. In a weird way, it's almost like they bypassed some (not all) of those growing pains by essentially skipping to the 2nd or 3rd season.

Thing is by skipping to a 2nd or 3rd season, we don't have a lot of pre-established investment in these particular incarnations of the characters. Some characters were able to get by just fine without it, others clearly suffered without it. I mean how much can we really care about say Forge when we don't even get to know him that well?

 

[Squidboy]

Forge was only really there for some comedic effect and to show that the X-Men have lots of friends that could be brought in and out of the show with little investment needed to introduce them. I'm sure these types of characters (Colossus, Forge, Juggernaut) would have been expanded upon in the second season (in fact, I know that Piotr was supposed to have his own episode planned), but that obviously didn't happen. The problem with the show being based around Wolverine is that all the other characters were second to him, which meant that we might have gotten a hand-full of Wolverine solo episodes that could've very well gone to other characters who hadn't had their moment to branch out yet. Problem was, nobody would really tune in for Forge and the X-Men, so that was the price to pay for having Logan as the lead.

 

[EvilClareToo]

The Gambit episodes weren't bad (especially when he's playing Lorna), but for me, the quintessential Gambit episode is "Cajun Spice" from X-Men Evolution, where he kidnaps Rogue to help him deal with the Guild feuds in New Orleans. It just hit all the right notes so well and irritated me to no end that Gambit fell into the background after that episode.

I really liked Cajun Spice, but fans of comic book Gambit would probably prefer XMen TAS Gambit best (he was awesome in the 1st and 2nd seasons, before he was regulated to occasional guest star star status in later seasons). I was also surprised that he just dropped off the face of the planet after Cajun Spice. I at least expected him to show up for the final Apocalypse slap down at the end of Season 4. I mean, they were desperate to find mutants to fight him-I don't see how they manage to overlook Gambit. That was a bit of a slap in the face for fans. At least they showed him at part of the X Men team in the last shot.

Now we will never know if they had planned some sort of redemption of the character in Season Two WATXM, or better yet, an appearance of AoA Gambit! Damn you, Marvel/Disney!!!!

 

[Squidboy]

I think Gambit has gotten a decent shake of things in all of the cartoons thus far, so I'm hoping that he'll be featured in the new show as well, because Gambit+Anime=awesome possibilities. Though I would like to see some of the more underused characters (Colossus, Iceman, Havok, Psylocke) get a shot at the spotlight, considering they received little screentime in the past three shows.

 

[Panthro]

Forge was only really there for some comedic effect and to show that the X-Men have lots of friends that could be brought in and out of the show with little investment needed to introduce them. I'm sure these types of characters (Colossus, Forge, Juggernaut) would have been expanded upon in the second season (in fact, I know that Piotr was supposed to have his own episode planned), but that obviously didn't happen. The problem with the show being based around Wolverine is that all the other characters were second to him, which meant that we might have gotten a hand-full of Wolverine solo episodes that could've very well gone to other characters who hadn't had their moment to branch out yet. Problem was, nobody would really tune in for Forge and the X-Men, so that was the price to pay for having Logan as the lead.

Well Forge was a random example. Let me try a different one: how can we be expected to feel any genuine interest in watching an amnesiac Jean Grey be threatened by Ark-Angel or the MRD when we don't know her that well? Or share Storm's heartache over Angel turning into Ark-Angel when we don't know her that well and only seen her and Angel interact for like two minutes?

Yes, the showing being based around Wolverine hurt the other characters by pushing them to the sides. We can only speculate as to how season 2 may have rectified this, though I fear certain characters were beyond rectifying.

 

[Squidboy]

I think this show was heavily relying on people who knew the characters and the stories enough to get by. That's why they start the show with the team being blown to hell. Are we supposed to care? Sure, but they didn't give us any reason yet.

And I don't completely remember Angel's transformation (I haven't watched the show since last summer), but from what I remember, the scene in the hospital with him and his broken wings was probably supposed to be something for the viewers to feel some sympathy about, especially when it jumped from that to him working with Sinister. I think the show did its job in showcasing some of the characters and to give us reason to care about them, but that's just from a comicbook fan's POV. I can't very well speak for an 11 year old who tunes in to see a blue demon fighting off metal interdimensional pirates from attacking an orange goldfish boy, a winged pixie, and a bunch of other rejects on a boat.

 

[Panthro]

I think this show was heavily relying on people who knew the characters and the stories enough to get by. That's why they start the show with the team being blown to hell. Are we supposed to care? Sure, but they didn't give us any reason yet.

And is that really the best way to approach a series, even one for characters as well known as the X-Men?

 

[Squidboy]

Nope, and that's exactly what I was saying is wrong with the show. Focused too much on Wolverine, instead of making the other characters and stories seem important. I mean, Mystique was only introduced as a past partner with Logan? She's Raven Friggin' Darkholme, she doesn't need to be linked with Wolverine to be relevant, but that's the direction the show took. And yeah, the characters have been given a complex history over the years, but characters like Nightcrawler, Rogue, and Sabretooth could've benefited from an episode paired with her more than Logan. Alas, that's not the direction the show took.

 

[EvilClareToo]

I think this show was heavily relying on people who knew the characters and the stories enough to get by. That's why they start the show with the team being blown to hell. Are we supposed to care? Sure, but they didn't give us any reason yet.

And I don't completely remember Angel's transformation (I haven't watched the show since last summer), but from what I remember, the scene in the hospital with him and his broken wings was probably supposed to be something for the viewers to feel some sympathy about, especially when it jumped from that to him working with Sinister. I think the show did its job in showcasing some of the characters and to give us reason to care about them, but that's just from a comicbook fan's POV. I can't very well speak for an 11 year old who tunes in to see a blue demon fighting off metal interdimensional pirates from attacking an orange goldfish boy, a winged pixie, and a bunch of other rejects on a boat.

Well, I can speak for my then seven year old daughter, and she became a big Nightcrawler fan after that episode (she could care less about Wolverine after seeing the series) and she was also quite upset at Angel's transformation to Archangel and especially by his father's treatment of his status as a mutant and cutting off his wings. I think she's seen those episodes like 5 times!

 

[Squidboy]

My three year old niece really liked the Nightcrawler episode, so I'm trying to really push her into liking the character. It worked with Power Rangers and Spider-Man, so I might as well try to re-watch the episodes he was in with her.

 

[EvilClareToo]

You're a good uncle, Squidboy!

 

[katie_girl09]

The Gambit episodes weren't bad (especially when he's playing Lorna), but for me, the quintessential Gambit episode is "Cajun Spice" from X-Men Evolution, where he kidnaps Rogue to help him deal with the Guild feuds in New Orleans. It just hit all the right notes so well and irritated me to no end that Gambit fell into the background after that episode.

Cajun Spice was okay. I just hated the fact that he had to be with Rogue (barf). As much as I love TAS Gambit, I have to say that right now WATXM Gambit is taking a slight lead. I absolutely love the character when he's a self-interested and crooked swindler.