Was anyone else moved by Magneto's love/respect for Xavier?

[LostSon88]

Something bothers me about that scene though. He talks about how Xavier had to die so that "our dream may live". Whose dream is he talking about? Because he certainly isn't talking about Xavier's dream. Is he saddened that Xavier had to die as a casualty for his dream? This kind of brings up a good question. If it came down to it and his dream surviving, would he be willing to let Xavier die or even kill him? Was he always willing to accept Xavier as a casualty of his war on humanity?

Perhaps in Magneto's eyes, both Charles and himself were after the same thing: MUTANT PROSPERITY

So in a sense you could say that they had the same dream, they just went about it in very different ways.

 

[xmenfan84]

Perhaps in Magneto's eyes, both Charles and himself were after the same thing: Mutant Prosperity...

So in a sense you could say that they had the same dream, they just went about it in very different ways.

I agree...Charles was much more of an idealist while Magneto was more realistic, even cynical at times.

 

[skruloos]

Perhaps in Magneto's eyes, both Charles and himself were after the same thing: MUTANT PROSPERITY

So in a sense you could say that they had the same dream, they just went about it in very different ways.

I don't think that's the case at all. It's quite obvious from their conversation in the opening of X1 that they feel quite differently about humanity's relationship with mutantkind. It is expounded further at the end of X1.

 

[LostSon88]

Well from what I get from the X1 conversation, they DO want the same goals...the only difference is that Mags is impatient to see how it turns out and wants to "make a move".

Unlike Charles, he wants to take action NOW to ensure Mutant-kind survives...I mean although Charles takes a much more passive approach towards his goals, he TOO wants to ensure that Mutant-kind survives.

Mags wants to ensure it through violence and threats.
Xavier wants to ensure it through compromise and understanding.

BUT THEY BOTH WANT THE SAME THING.

Hence, they both have the same objective, just differing opinions about how to go about it.

Hence, Mags comments in X3 about Charles dying before seeing his dream realized makes sense.

 

[AVP82]

Perhaps in Magneto's eyes, both Charles and himself were after the same thing: MUTANT PROSPERITY

So in a sense you could say that they had the same dream, they just went about it in very different ways.

I like that. Both Xavier and Magneto wanted mutants to prosper in the world. However, Magneto believes that mutants are superior to humans, and Xavier believes mutation is the next stage in evolution, and wanted mutants to coexist with humans.

 

[skruloos]

Well from what I get from the X1 conversation, they DO want the same goals...the only difference is that Mags is impatient to see how it turns out and wants to "make a move".

Unlike Charles, he wants to take action NOW to ensure Mutant-kind survives...I mean although Charles takes a much more passive approach towards his goals, he TOO wants to ensure that Mutant-kind survives.

Mags wants to ensure it through violence and threats.
Xavier wants to ensure it through compromise and understanding.

BUT THEY BOTH WANT THE SAME THING.

Hence, they both have the same objective, just differing opinions about how to go about it.

Hence, Mags comments in X3 about Charles dying before seeing his dream realized makes sense.

I don't know about that. It seems to be pretty clear in X1 when Magneto asks Xavier why he's so intent on protecting the humans. I don't think he's fighting for equal rights for mutantkind but rather mutant superiority. This becomes even more clear in X3 when he talks about mutants being the cure for homosapiens.

Xavier wants humans and mutants to live together in peace. I've always gotten the impression that that was never good enough for Magneto.

 

[skruloos]

I like that. Both Xavier and Magneto wanted mutants to prosper in the world. However, Magneto believes that mutants are superior to humans, and Xavier believes mutation is the next stage in evolution, and wanted mutants to coexist with humans.

And that is quite a fundamental difference. I don't think they want the same thing at all, or else Magneto is wrong about what Xavier wants.

 

[AVP82]

And that is quite a fundamental difference. I don't think they want the same thing at all, or else Magneto is wrong about what Xavier wants.

Both Xavier and Magneto want mutants to prosper and live in the world without harm or prejudice being inflicted upon them.

They just have have different views of the mutants' place in society.

 

[LostSon88]

I don't know about that. It seems to be pretty clear in X1 when Magneto asks Xavier why he's so intent on protecting the humans. I don't think he's fighting for equal rights for mutantkind but rather mutant superiority. This becomes even more clear in X3 when he talks about mutants being the cure for homosapiens.

Xavier wants humans and mutants to live together in peace. I've always gotten the impression that that was never good enough for Magneto.

What i'm trying to say is that in Erik's mind, he and Xavier want the exact same thing, the difference is that IN ERIK'S MIND, Xavier is not willing to cross the line/get his hands dirty, etc. to achieve it...Magneto is.

Xavier ALSO believes that he and Erik want the same thing, hence the dialogue in X2:

Xavier: "Erik is capable of doing something like this...but it would only hurt his goals of mutant prosperity." (paraphrased)

Cyclops: "you mean superiority."

Xavier: "you're right...if ERIK had his way."

So you see, Mags & Xavier BOTH believe that they are after the same dream...they just don't agree with how to achieve it.

Mags believes by extermination, Xavier believes through understanding.

But for both of these men, the ultimate goal is ALL about Mutant Prosperity.

 

[obeastdyke]

I liked the Xavier/Magneto interaction. But why was Magneto just sitting there. There is no way Dark Phoenix could hold his powers back maybe Wolverine/Cyclops but not Magneto.

 

[LostSon88]

Her telekenesis was probably what kept him in his place...

 

[AVP82]

I'm thinking Magneto's helmet is useless by that point too.

 

[skruloos]

Both Xavier and Magneto want mutants to prosper and live in the world without harm or prejudice being inflicted upon them.

They just have have different views of the mutants' place in society.

And again, that's a pretty fundamental difference. One sees humans as equals and the other sees humans as inferior.

 

[AVP82]

And again, that's a pretty fundamental difference. One sees humans as equals and the other sees humans as inferior.

But still same goal for mutants = mutant prosperity

 

[skruloos]

What i'm trying to say is that in Erik's mind, he and Xavier want the exact same thing, the difference is that IN ERIK'S MIND, Xavier is not willing to cross the line/get his hands dirty, etc. to achieve it...Magneto is.

Xavier ALSO believes that he and Erik want the same thing, hence the dialogue in X2:

Xavier: "Erik is capable of doing something like this...but it would only hurt his goals of mutant prosperity." (paraphrased)

Cyclops: "you mean superiority."

Xavier: "you're right...if ERIK had his way."

So you see, Mags & Xavier BOTH believe that they are after the same dream...they just don't agree with how to achieve it.

Mags believes by extermination, Xavier believes through understanding.

But for both of these men, the ultimate goal is ALL about Mutant Prosperity.

It seems to be pretty clear that Xavier was mistaken there. If Erik had his way, meaning his dream had been fulfilled, then Mutants would achieve full superiority over humans. And Xavier doesn't seem to share that dream at all.

And even then, Xavier states that it is Magneto's dream to have Mutant Prosperity before he is corrected by Scott. He doesn't say it is "our" dream. And Storm pretty much states what Xavier's dream is in her eulogy in X3. He wants to build peaceful bridges between humans and mutants. Magneto's dream is clearly not that at all.

 

[skruloos]

But still same goal for mutants = mutant prosperity

But you are completely ignoring one major factor in this: both their dreams include mutant relations with humans. One dream is to achieve peace between the two, the other is for mutants to lord over humans. It's not as simply as mutant prosperity.

 

[AVP82]

But you are completely ignoring one major factor in this: both their dreams include mutant relations with humans. One dream is to achieve peace between the two, the other is for mutants to lord over humans. It's not as simply as mutant prosperity.

I agree, but their common dream is that they want mutants safe without feeling tormented or prejudiced, and also not to be afraid of their powers. That's why they worked together in the first place. However their methods and approaches differ. I see the differences between the two, but you have to admit that there is a common bond or dream that they still share in the beginning of making mutants live and prosper in this society.

 

[Iceman]

I'm glad that there was some reference made to Magneto's respect for Xavier. There should have been more evidence of this.

 

[PoSeiDon]

The one thing that i loved about x-men in the movie verse was the well played friendship between xavier and eric! they came off very naturally i guess since being friends in real life! it was never over the top!

 

[SsM]

I think there were a few scenes which I really thougt... almost saved x3 for me.... and the scene where lensherr is telling john about how great a man xavier was had to be one of them.

 

[skruloos]

I agree, but their common dream is that they want mutants safe without feeling tormented or prejudiced, and also not to be afraid of their powers. That's why they worked together in the first place. However their methods and approaches differ. I see the differences between the two, but you have to admit that there is a common bond or dream that they still share in the beginning of making mutants live and prosper in this society.

I'll concede that they shared a similar dream in the beginning. However, the Magneto we meet in X1 and who continues to grow in bitterness towards humanity did not share the same dream as Xavier. Their differences had already come about and their dreams had manifested differently.

 

[shadowy_blue]

I felt sorry for the de-powered Magneto.

He's been a mutant his whole life, and that life has pretty much been taken away from him.

He's now just a lonely old man sitting in the park, playing chess by himself.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who was deeply moved by X3's ending. You're correct on all points, and one other interesting thing about it is that it ties up well to X1's opening scene.

X1's opening: Magneto as a kid using his powers for the very first time(?)/discovered he was a mutant.

X3's ending: Magneto as a withered old man devoid of his powers. Now a regular human(?)

Kinda neat.

 

[invincible mann]

moved by magnetos respect for charles ? no
pleased? YES!

 

[ShadowBoxing]

There dreams are fundamentally different. This is apparent to anyone who read the comic. Xavier wants a peaceful coexistence between mutants and humans. Magneto believed their evolution makes them superior to normal humans, that mutants are above. One of the reasons for Toad in the original brotherhood of evil mutants was to show that in fact Magneto was a hypocrite and did not believe mutants were inherently superior. Thats in fact he viewed certain mutants as above others and the others he treated like dirt.

 

[LEX]

Magneto calling out for Jean to stop what she's doing.

Jean killing Xavier.

Magneto watching them in horror.

"CHARLES!"


Yep, I was moved, alright.