Wolverine and the X-men Episode 20 'Breakdown'

[Slim]

^ I'm hoping that as the episodes progress and more time is focused on the Phoenix we'll get to see some of that stuff in more flashbacks... probably not.

 

[QWoods]

this was the best episode yet, anyone think they could post some pics

 

[Spider-ManHero12]

Fantastic episode! Jus so gripping. Loved seeing Cyclops' past.

 

[Havok83]

What a great episode for Scott and Jean fans, at least in the beginning til Wolverine entered the picture. I loved it though and it definetly was my favorite. Didnt care for Emma stepping in but Im hopeful that they wont get paired up in this series

 

[insane polaris]

the episodes are only 20 odd minutes long, there was no room for sinisters involvment in cyclops past. theyve deliberatly showed the orphanage so that they can delve into sinister and cyclops in a future episode.

the focus of this episode was jean and cyclops, not sinsiter and cyclops.


and this epsiode should have told you that theyre not gonna explain things straight away.

we will have to wait to see sinister and cyclops... just like we had to wait to see what caused the explosion and why scott and jean were arguing.

 

[Havok83]

the episodes are only 20 odd minutes long, there was no room for sinisters involvment in cyclops past. theyve deliberatly showed the orphanage so that they can delve into sinister and cyclops in a future episode.

the focus of this episode was jean and cyclops, not sinsiter and cyclops.


and this epsiode should have told you that theyre not gonna explain things straight away.

we will have to wait to see sinister and cyclops... just like we had to wait to see what caused the explosion and why scott and jean were arguing.

IA. Why would they throw in Sinister here. Thats a whole other story which would have been out of place here especially since there was no time for it.

 

[insane polaris]

IA. Why would they throw in Sinister here. Thats a whole other story which would have been out of place here especially since there was no time for it.

just cause people were complaining that they didnt include Cyclops history with Sinister. and it got me angry bcos I agree with what you just said.

That story didnt have a place in this episode.



Anyway, on Cyclops characterisation. I believe he is just being played down as the leader type because Wolverine is supposed to be the centre role. and they need to build up to the Wolverine Movie.
Chances are once the 2nd season is on, Cyclops will have reverted back into the leader role (co leader as some have suggested) because the Wolverine Film will have already been released.


BTW, i loved this episode. and i was happy with how the characters were portrayed apart from the younger Wolverine (he seemed to much like a sweet talking playboy) i know he sleeps around alot but hes not sauve or charming (thats Gambit)

 

[Cyma]

Wow. The episode Breakdown is causing a breakdown in this forum

As for the episode, I still can’t decide what to think. Something felt missing and after a second viewing, I figured out what it was. We never actually saw what happened after Jean came along. Scott’s life then fast forwarded to Logan showing up and flirting with Jean. Nothing about what kind of a leader Scott was and whether he was in fact useless and inefficient for the role even with Jean to support him.


And that’s why I just can’t dismiss Scott as a Never Was.

I think the coddled through life is too harsh. After traumatic events, any human would need support to move on. Unfortunately for Scott, he experienced two tragic events, and while Jean and Xavier provided support after the first one, there didn’t seem to be anyone truly there for him after the second one. It’s surprising he remained sane after that.

As for the Scott fighting over Jean like an obsessive jerk…..well it was inevitable that Logan’s attempts to get close to his girlfriend would push him over the edge, wasn’t it? After it seems like he successfully provokes him, he doesn’t fight back because Jean made him promise not to(exactly how nice was she to him that they’re making promises now?). Scott gets to be the animal and Logan’s the victim. I really don’t see any honor for Logan in that.

The way I see it, this episode only said Scott had a very rough childhood, Xavier helped him physically, but Jean helped him psychologically in moving on, but then she literally went boom and he was a mess all over again. And that’s why Xavier chose Logan to lead the X-men. That’s it. Nothing about how good a leader he was.

 

[Deaths Head II]

I really dislike this Cyclops. It seems like all the stereotypes most people have about the character. He's a complete *****e, a fake hero, and his mind is only revolved around Jean. They just took away all his redeeming qualities. The scene where he shoots Wolverine from behind made me hate the character really vehemently. And Cyclops is my favorite X-Man. Even if this was a reimagining, this character really doesn't have any redeeming factors. I wasn't even looking to hate the guy, but it doesn't feel like this character is meant to be liked. When he's not being shown to be a jerk, he's shown to be a loser. No one on the team even seems to like him that much apart from Emma. They don't hint at much of a relationship with any other member of the team, even Professor X. Even if I remove my Cyclops fan bias all I can see is a very petty, self-centered, jealous, and annoying *****ebag. I still like the show but I would have frankly preferred if they didn't use Cyclops in it. Even if I didn't have prior expectations its just annoying to have a character I want to punch in the face so bad.

 

[warmachine300]

If I was Cyke, I would have shot Wolverine too. He showed a lack of respect for Scotts feelings. He completely deserved it. People act crazy and irrational when it comes to love and Cyclops is no exception. Imagine suddenly loosing your girl due to unexpected changes and not knowing how and why. That's the killer along with not being able to have any closure as the friends around you apparently are acting like they don't care. If you ask me, they've done everything right with Cyclops and its completely plausible. This is a challenging transition for him so I don't blame him for acting out the way he is. Thats just life.

 

[Neptune]

I kinda agree with you. I don't hate him that much but he isn't a very likable character. I would have preferred it if he still tried to lead the X-men but failed to do a good job because of his emotions getting in the way. You know because the whole Jean and Xavier thing.
He needs more character developement than the constant "i'm so sad because i miss Jean and no one else matters" attitude.

By the way, i still think it's pretty stupid to make Wolverine the leader. Even if Cyclops wasn't capable, Storm still is. Oh wait it's not Storm's show.

 

[Da_Lycan]

As a Cyclops fan this show becomes harder to watch by the episode. Especially after episodes like this. Like someone said this does seem like X-3 animated. This show would have been so much better if Cyclops would have been killed off in the 1st episode from the blast caused by the phoenix. Atleast then we wouldn't have to deal with them dragging Cyclops through the mud. Also we would get a better answer as to why Wolverine is the leader. Because Cyclops is dead and Storm was in Africa seems alot better than well.....because Cyclops has always been a loser so he wasn't much of a leader anyway.

 

[warmachine300]

Storm wasn't recruited when Xavier made that decision. She was still in Africa so that couldn't happen. Besides it was Wolverine who brought the team back together in the first place so why shouldn't he benefit from being the leader? I dislike Wolverine as much as the next guy but I don't have a problem with him leading the team just the amount of screen time he's taken up which bothers me. Like I mentioned b4, loosing the love of your life is like loosing your left hand. You can't function properly. It takes time to heal. And Xavier knowing Cyclops was still in the recovery process opted to make Logan leader. Yes sometimes people get dragged through the mud but like I said thats just life. you can't expect Scott to be all together all the time. That just wouldn't be realistic. Especially considering the circumstances.

 

[CaptainCanada]

If I was Cyke, I would have shot Wolverine too. He showed a lack of respect for Scotts feelings. He completely deserved it.

Shooting someone in the back after they refuse to fight you and aren't actually doing anything to you is not justified at all.

 

[HotSoup]

Yes sometimes people get dragged through the mud but like I said thats just life. you can't expect Scott to be all together all the time. That just wouldn't be realistic. Especially considering the circumstances.

That's true. Scott has reason to be emo now, and I can partially understand how his anger got the best of him when he hit wolverine in the back, but at the same time, you can't have Scott be a mess all the time! The episode was supposed to show Scott when Jean was still around, when he wasn't all Mr.Emo-man like he was in episode 1. Would it have been so hard to show one scene of Scott being competent?

 

[Deaths Head II]

Storm wasn't recruited when Xavier made that decision. She was still in Africa so that couldn't happen. Besides it was Wolverine who brought the team back together in the first place so why shouldn't he benefit from being the leader? I dislike Wolverine as much as the next guy but I don't have a problem with him leading the team just the amount of screen time he's taken up which bothers me.

The thing that really strikes me odd about Storm is that they gave a reason for Scott not taking the reigns from Wolverine ever, but not for Storm. Storm barely says anything in the episodes and she only exists to throw thunderbolts. I kinda feel bad for Storm fans as Storm always seemed to be put to the side in most X-Men cartoons but at least melodramatic Storm had some speaking lines. Of course they can't have Storm struggle with Wolverine for leadership of the team though because that would mean someone threatening Wolverine's stardom and lord knows we can't have that. She just sits in the back and nods her head as Wolverine talks, just like every other character. Except for Scott, because he's a complete loser and we'll make a mockery of him to show the type of scumbag you have to be to question Wolverine.

And I do have a problem with Wolverine leading the team. This isn't the Wolverine I grew fond of. It's a weird amalgram of Wolverine and Cyclops. His attitude changes from his solo missions to the team missions, and he is a complete hypocrite when ragging on Scott for doing things like going out on his own. Wolverine just wasn't meant to be this type of character. I don't know why they keep trying to make him like this.

Like I mentioned b4, loosing the love of your life is like loosing your left hand. You can't function properly. It takes time to heal. And Xavier knowing Cyclops was still in the recovery process opted to make Logan leader. Yes sometimes people get dragged through the mud but like I said thats just life. you can't expect Scott to be all together all the time. That just wouldn't be realistic. Especially considering the circumstances.

Scott has never broken apart before because of losing Jean though. Thats just something the movies established so they could easily get rid of Scott in X3. When Jean died in the comics Scott appreciated how she helped him in his life and left the X-Men in order to become his own person like Jean helped him do. Thats how he respected her memory and what she gave to him while she was alive. But doing that for this Cyclops would make him too deep a character and lord knows we can't have that.

 

[insane polaris]

im hoping for an episode where the x-men have to split up into 3 teams. and each one is lead by Wolverine, Cyclops and Storm.

or even if Wolverine asks Storm or Cyclops about advice on tactics, suggesting they are his second in commands.

 

[Dread]

This episode has probably sparked the most talk-back of any episode in a few weeks, at least. I can't reply to every opinion and post stated, but I will try with some of them.

You say it doesn't benefit the audience yet the audience loves the show and the show is a huge success worldwide and a second season is being produced.

You are correct that the "silent majority" of viewers likely don't care about some of these concerns. X-MEN 3 after all did better at the box office than the other films. I am more than aware that in the eyes of many casual viewers, Wolverine IS the X-Men and so movies and shows that cater to him and that ideal of him as the be-all will do well.

That said, McDonalds will make more money and serve more customers than a high class steak joint, but one place makes beef better than the other. SMALLVILLE is an atrociously terrible show but has just been renewed for a NINTH season. Most of the masses aren't as concerning or critical as many of us.

I just think it doesn't have to be this way; that it is possible to do a show that has Wolverine as a flawed leader without having to go so out of their way to have him be clearly superior in every practical way to the other characters, or at least all of the X-Men besides Nightcrawler. Note that everyone loves how Kurt has been done in this show, myself included, and he was the one X-Man absent to be PWNED by ninja in "Code of Conduct" and his worst tendencies aren't magnified as being him by definition. The show's writers haven't gone out of their way to claim that Wolverine is a better man than Kurt now, and was even in the past; on the contrary, Kurt is the one X-Man who is allowed to occasionally upstage the almighty Wolverine. Course, the fact that he was cool in X-MEN 2 helps, but is also shows that even to a mainstream audience, the X-Men can be about more than Wolverine. The franchise in the comics has evolved from being Logan's supporting character cast as it was in the late 80's into the dawn of the 21st century; the movie franchise, however, hasn't, and won't, ever. Where the newest TV franchise ends up remains to be seen, as we have another season to either learn from these kinds of mistakes, or repeat them.

Just because it's valid dosent mean it's right....they are literally taking the worst aspects of cyclops' character, the ones that make him seem pathetic, and fail to show us his good attributes. I agree with pretty much everything dread has said. The episode made cyke pathetically dependant on jean grey, made him look like a jerk against wolverine, and pretty much confirmed to me that this cartoon is basically "X3" animated....

As critical as I am about this show, and while I agree with the rest of your post, I do disagree with the bold section. Despite the flaws, WOLVERINE AND THE X-MEN is better than X-MEN 3. If a friend of mine was considering buying a DVD of X3 or W&TXM and they were of equal price, I would recommend the latter without hesitation. It is a better product all around. The show's strengths, beyond having more than 2-3 hours airtime, is trying valiantly to incorporate 50 years of stories into a season, especially the last decade of stories, and having a strong serial pace (even if not as strong or serial as SPECTACULAR SPIDER-MAN). Season 2 could stand to improve on character development, though.

That said, it is a shame that W&TXM has been held back by the mandate or choice that Wolverine must always be a better X-Man than everyone else, and it hurts Logan himself by making him less interesting and more of a straight man.

I didn't get the impression from anything Dread said that he thinks Cyclops is his pet character. All I got was someone saying they don't like this representation of the character.

What I said earlier some where in here was I'd prefer they keep Cyclops in the background rather that represent him like this. Imagine if they took all the worst aspects of every other character on the X-Men and started using entire episodes to spotlight them. It wouldn't be the X-men anymore just a cartoon with the name. Hopefully the give Cyclops something redeemable.

Thanks for getting my arguments. Now, I am no fool. I do anticipate some sort of story where Cyclops manages to do something, anything heroic, and it to be a "now he gets it" kind of episode, even for a short time (as if Cyclops were actually competent, there would be no need for Logan to be leader, and I would bet that this mandate will stay in future seasons, especially after so much commercial success with it), and all that. My question, though, is that after depicting Cyclops as such a dishonorable, obsessive, petty, and perennially incompetent fop, will we or anyone else genuinely care about any possible redemption?

SPECTACULAR SPIDER-MAN has given a lot of focus to the character of Flash Thompson, who is on the surface a shallow, unintelligent bully with inflated ego problems. Yet HE is far more redeemable and rootable than Cyclops is right now. That is a problem for me. That all comes down to writing.

Some shows and stories can work with a character who is deliberately written as unrootable and unlikable. I am just unsure if this show is one of them.

But I've decided that I'm not going to worry about the characters in this show, and just go along for the ride. It has some great storylines up in the air, it's incorporating things from the comics that have never been in a cartoon, and a lot is true to the comics. I would love to feel for the characters, but I really only care about Angel and Nightcrawler. I like characters over plot, which is why I'm probably going to like Evo more than this, but its still a fun show to watch.

EVOLUTION was better at character interaction and development. What some viewers and even TV people fail to understand is that "character development" is more than just giving a character 1-2 focus episode every season or so. It means having the characters interact amongst each other on a regular, consistent basis and managing to narrow down where they all come from, who they all are, strengths as well as flaws, and how these many clash with their enemies or friends and what happens after that. It is in this area that Evolution excelled, perhaps because the Kid's WB network got in the way of the rest for a while.

W&TXM has sacrificed a lot of that for a more straight-forward comic book serial styled spectacle. And it is quite an incredible spectacle. And that isn't to say the characterization is zero; that is untrue and unfair. But it is at a level beneath Evolution for the majority of non-Wolverine characters as of 22 episodes in, and I believe it has been sacrificed for the spectacle and for the busy plot lines. Many episodes are packed to the gills at 20-22 minutes. EVOLUTION in contrast had a more meandering general story line; episodes took more time to get where they were going, and there were few inter-episode subplots beyond who was dating who, and they weren't as packed together.

Still, you could tell a simple bank robbery story and it could be fascinating if your cast of characters are all well defined and rounded. A much grander tale of the end of the world is flashy but not as deep if you don't get the feature characters right and give the audience a reason why they should care to see them succeed or fail. In some ways I see this show as being so obsessed with making sure things happen that they think they can "make up" the sacrificed characterization with an odd focus episode or two, but that isn't the best way to do it, or the most effective. Yes, the original 90's X-MEN series did do that sometimes. But it isn't 1992 anymore. This show has over a decade of hindsight to work with.

Cyclops is my favorite X-men character and like others, I really wanted to like this episode about him, but in the end I just couldn't. As I was watching it I couldn't help but wonder if the writers had a specific mandate not to show Cyclops as being halfway competent ever. He was terrible in the danger room and need Jean to hold his hand against Magneto. What happened to the fearless leader of the X-men?

And the sad part is that I know that the writers know that Cyclops is capable of some serious badassery, as shown in episode 12 where he delivered a serious beatdown to Sinister's mooks. Those were among the best actions scenes in the series so far, and it's almost as if the writers were afraid that if they showed Cyclops as being awesome in this episode he'd start to eclipse Wolvie, and so decide to screw him over.

Just like Wolverine calling himself a monster being a purely informed weakness, Cyclops' former supposed leadership seems to be an informed ability. We know that somewhere between being a total woobie in this episode and being a total badass in episode 12 he must have had some serious training and moments of awesome, but we never get to see them! Would it have so hard the show a few quick scenes (stillframes, even!) right after the part where Emma says that Jean took Scott's pain away of him leading the team with half the deadly efficiency and effectiveness that he does in the comics, maybe putting the beatdown on a few supervillains? Would that have been so hard? And it would have made his fall into emo-ness much more emotionally powerful.

On the downside, or upside, the end scene of episode 12 where Wolverine is a complete aggressive hypocrite to Cyclops and Scott just backs down to him like a wuss now makes more sense. He was NEVER assertive. He ALWAYS buckled like a belt in every situation. So, saying, "I'll stay," with an unspoken "sir" at the end from "Excessive Force" doesn't seem as out of character to this show's Scott. At least I understand it now. It just isn't very sympathetic. And that is my problem. If this episode sought to make one sympathetic for Scott, for me it failed, and I see I am not alone.

And welcome to SuperHeroHype, HotSoup.

Wow. The episode Breakdown is causing a breakdown in this forum

As for the episode, I still can’t decide what to think. Something felt missing and after a second viewing, I figured out what it was. We never actually saw what happened after Jean came along. Scott’s life then fast forwarded to Logan showing up and flirting with Jean. Nothing about what kind of a leader Scott was and whether he was in fact useless and inefficient for the role even with Jean to support him.

And that’s why I just can’t dismiss Scott as a Never Was.

I think the coddled through life is too harsh. After traumatic events, any human would need support to move on. Unfortunately for Scott, he experienced two tragic events, and while Jean and Xavier provided support after the first one, there didn’t seem to be anyone truly there for him after the second one. It’s surprising he remained sane after that.

As for the Scott fighting over Jean like an obsessive jerk…..well it was inevitable that Logan’s attempts to get close to his girlfriend would push him over the edge, wasn’t it? After it seems like he successfully provokes him, he doesn’t fight back because Jean made him promise not to(exactly how nice was she to him that they’re making promises now?). Scott gets to be the animal and Logan’s the victim. I really don’t see any honor for Logan in that.

The way I see it, this episode only said Scott had a very rough childhood, Xavier helped him physically, but Jean helped him psychologically in moving on, but then she literally went boom and he was a mess all over again. And that’s why Xavier chose Logan to lead the X-men. That’s it. Nothing about how good a leader he was.

I do appreciate you disagreeing with several of my points and opinions about this episode and the show in general without resorting to ad hominem attacks against me ("you're just biased for Scott so everything you say is melodramatically twisted") or changing the rules of the debate midway ("you can't use examples from prior comics or cartoons, except when I use them, then it is okay"). Apologizes to VileOne for paraphrasing.

You have a good point that we didn't see a large chunk of time in this episode, or in general. In some ways that has been a boon and bane in this series. I can imagine the producers and writers not wanting to "bore" the audience with exposition they are already assumed to be aware of from the comics, three films, and prior cartoons. The downside of that is that without said "boring exposition" to set things up, we have little idea how some of these characters are coming from except from what we are given, usually in small amounts. And while this gets us into the "action" of the show quickly, without this build-up, the audience, at least if they're analytical, can't make assumptions not backed up by what is shown.

You're absolutely correct that a lot of time was skipped over. But my point is that this episode, taken in with what has already been revealed and shown with Cyclops, well...doesn't strongly imply that he was ever actually competent before now, and doesn't support assuming it was simply because we never saw a lot. In "OVERFLOW", Kitty Pryde criticizes Cyclops' state, not because he is inefficient, but because he is unmotivated; "He would have been the first one in the Blackbird" before. But, with all due respect, there is a difference between being unmotivated and being inefficient or incompetent. Someone who is very motivated but fails at everything they try and always needs to be led by the hand by a mentor or a girlfriend at every inconvenience is no more useful than a guy who sulks in his room growing emo beard stubble half the time. Now, Forge is usually incompetent in a fight, but he's supposed to be comic relief (and a tech-support cliche), so it works for him. In the real world, effort alone isn't enough; one has to get results on investments. And that was what this episode seemed to imply for me, that Cyclops never lived up to expectations, long before Jean blew up. Just now it is worse.

Xavier not even trying to support Cyclops through his crisis considering he is willing to sooth Logan's own emotional pain whenever he has a bad dream or feels guilty over ninja attacks doesn't make him out to be less than cold, either. No character but Emma seems to give a damn about him beyond showing up for missions, not even the founders like Iceman or Beast. That could be due to a lack of consistent character interaction, though. Granted, Iceman and Beast may be aware that Scott could never cut it without coddling, just never say anything.

Finally, while Logan was being a jerk to Scott from his first meeting, Scott took it to a level that was far out of line, and there is little way to excuse it. He blasted Wolverine IN THE BACK after Logan expressed no desire to fight him, and was looking to leave. Furthermore, Jean showed up and revealed the promise she made Logan make to her about not hurting or fighting Cyclops. First, it implies that Jean saw Scott as someone needing protection from the all powerful flirty biker. Secondly, Logan WAS honoring her promise. Even when it resulted in him being blasted into trees or across the backyard. Logan was willing to honor his word to Jean even when it was inconvenient to him, much as he did with Mariko in "CODE OF CONDUCT". Cyclops, on the other hand, not only came off as a petty bully for continuing a fight Logan never started and had no interest in engaging, but take some other episodes in context, and it seems the two are still intertwined by that promise. In "Hindsight Part 2" and in "Greetings from Genosha", Scott looks for any excuse to blast Logan, who never retaliates. It seems clear that Logan is still honoring the promise to Jean, even if she is MIA. Cyclops, though, is aware of it and is exploiting it to land a cheap shot. The fact that Scott thought Logan was attacking "Angel" in episode 10 doesn't wash because he snarls, "Go on, give me a reason!" to Logan, EAGER for a fight and seeing this as a mere excuse. Logan usually tears into Cyclops for being irresponsible, unstable, and incompetent; so Scott seems to prove it every time? That's not the best way to make him sympathetic to me.

You're correct that the episode doesn't outright say that Scott was a "Never Was". On the other hand, it does little for me or others to assume he was once competent and is only now a Has Been, either. More circumstantial evidence leads to the Never Was category. And there is no way to make picking a fight with someone who promised never to fight you and then hitting them in the back sympathetic. At this point Cyclops is only a nose-hair from being a villain, and he may as well join Emma Frost at the Hellfire Club; he might be happy and appreciated there.

I really dislike this Cyclops. It seems like all the stereotypes most people have about the character. He's a complete *****e, a fake hero, and his mind is only revolved around Jean. They just took away all his redeeming qualities. The scene where he shoots Wolverine from behind made me hate the character really vehemently. And Cyclops is my favorite X-Man. Even if this was a reimagining, this character really doesn't have any redeeming factors. I wasn't even looking to hate the guy, but it doesn't feel like this character is meant to be liked. When he's not being shown to be a jerk, he's shown to be a loser. No one on the team even seems to like him that much apart from Emma. They don't hint at much of a relationship with any other member of the team, even Professor X. Even if I remove my Cyclops fan bias all I can see is a very petty, self-centered, jealous, and annoying *****ebag. I still like the show but I would have frankly preferred if they didn't use Cyclops in it. Even if I didn't have prior expectations its just annoying to have a character I want to punch in the face so bad.

Summed some of my feelings up well in fewer words.

Shooting someone in the back after they refuse to fight you and aren't actually doing anything to you is not justified at all.

Precisely! That is something a villain does, or at least someone who can't be cheered on. Unless you are a pro-wrestling fan, I guess...

or even if Wolverine asks Storm or Cyclops about advice on tactics, suggesting they are his second in commands.

To be fair, W&TXM did do that, sort of, at least twice. In "HUNTING GROUNDS" where Logan is kidnapped by Mojo and forced to fight for him against Nightcrawler and Scarlet Witch, Storm leads Rogue and Iceman in a rescue mission without him. It was effective to aid in the rescue, or at least the pick-up, after Mojo was defeated. Cyclops did that to a lessor degree in "BACKLASH" when Wolverine was inside the base with Forge and Cyke started trying to drill off battle tactics alongside his assembled X-Men against the Sentinels; the only problem is that this scene was completely pointless, because Wolverine had already saved the day and everyone present by stabbing Master Mold's main computer. And then people wonder how some of us think things are leaned against Scott almost deliberately.

 

[bryanss3]

jeez what a post!!

 

[Dread]

jeez what a post!!

Sorry. I was too motivated today.

 

[bryanss3]

don't apologize I enjoy reading

 

[warmachine300]

Logan behaved like a jerk to Scott so of course he deserved to be shot in the back. He completely undermined his relationship with Jean. And its not that Logan is happy to lead the team remember this is Xaviers idea. Maybe Xavier should have shown Scott a bit more compassion but I he was looking at the bigger picture. Theres far more at stake than Scotts crushed pride. And its not like Logan is incapable of leading a team. He just doesn't want to. I think this show is turning out to be remarkable, the last 8 episodes have been great. My problem is with the character developement. Like I mentioned in the 'Backlash' post characters like Storm, Beast and Iceman are being left behind. Storm especially has been severely short changed. And for someone like Storm who is a massive iconic figure. Its just not acceptable. I still don't know fully who she is. Its like the writers has taken her and a few others for granted assuming because they are now quite notoriously known we should know who they are. Well maybe so. But to me WAX she doesn't have a voice and her contribution is minimal. In X-Men Evolution Storm's roles was not as prominent as say Jeans or Rogues but every time she came on you had a definite sense of who she was. As with all the evolution characters. As much as I like the storylines in WAX they need to make sure other characters are not being left in the dirt. Okay so Wolverine, is leading the team. Thats fine. But others characters need a lifeline too. They should go back to their brilliant work on Evolution and really study what made it soo great and then I think this show will be a bit better. But its already improving anyway.

 

[bryanss3]

Xavier should have shown Scott a bit more compassion but I he was looking at the bigger picture. Theres far more at stake than Scotts crushed pride.

I'm gonna use this to segway into something I've been thinking about this shows plot. The entire plot for this show is kind of absur. Charles Xavier is a responsible person and should know that if you don't like the future(which he is in) altering the past even if it is possible to do is one of the most irresponsible ways to make a change its unpredictable and as we all know will result in something much worse. I don't know why they chose this for a plot. They've done a lot of good stuff with it, but it is a very strange plot to really drive a show on.

 

[Deaths Head II]

Logan behaved like a jerk to Scott so of course he deserved to be shot in the back. He completely undermined his relationship with Jean.

I really don't see how flirting with Jean makes Logan worthy of getting shot in the back. Especially since he turned his back because he wasn't willing to fight Scott. That was just a cheap shot, plain and simple.

Logan didn't even try try as hard to get with Jean, nor does he care about her as much as he does in the comics. Here it felt more like he was just checking the goods instead of developing a strong attraction. But this Cyclops explodes at Logan more then any other version of Cyclops has ever done. Wolverine was always the one who wanted to fight with Cyclops and trying to egg him on. Cyclops always kept his cool and was the bigger man. There was a reason why Wolverine was made short in the comics. A guy with his attitude at a large height just comes off as a bully. Now that Scott has that aspect of Logan, he comes off as exactly that. But I doubt even the early comics Wolverine would do anything as dishonorable as hitting an opponent while his back is turned.

 

[bryanss3]

I really don't see how flirting with Jean makes Logan worthy of getting shot in the back. Especially since he turned his back because he wasn't willing to fight Scott. That was just a cheap shot, plain and simple.

Logan didn't even try try as hard to get with Jean, nor does he care about her as much as he does in the comics. Here it felt more like he was just checking the goods instead of developing a strong attraction. But this Cyclops explodes at Logan more then any other version of Cyclops has ever done. Wolverine was always the one who wanted to fight with Cyclops and trying to egg him on. Cyclops always kept his cool and was the bigger man. There was a reason why Wolverine was made short in the comics. A guy with his attitude at a large height just comes off as a bully. Now that Scott has that aspect of Logan, he comes off as exactly that. But I doubt even the early comics Wolverine would do anything as dishonorable as hitting an opponent while his back is turned.

I don't get why anyone would justify that in real life if guy flirts with you're girlfriend then when he turns his back you attack you'll usually be looking at a minimum of a year in jail. even if he does have a healing factor.