Would the movie have been better without Venom?

[Funkster]

No, I dont think so. Venom should have been used as the ultimate enemy for the ending of the trilogy.

What would have made Venom more of a threat is, when the symbiote was attached to Peter, it should have made him more aggressive & violent, really change his personality, rather than just change the colour of his costume, go emo & dance about like an idiot.

Then Peter could have felt really threatened when he realises what the suit/symbiote has become when it joins with Eddie Brock.

& how he defeats Venom was poor as well. I would have had Spider-Man use the sonics from the metal bars, but when Harry blows up Sandman, have him fall into the half-built skyscraper, causing it to collapse. the resultant noise affects the symbiote, driving him to flee as it cant handle it (defeating Venom for now, & leaving it open-ended to re-appear in a later sequel).

Having said that, Harry apart, even Sandman wasnt greatly handled. You never found out how his daughter was sick or if it could even be cured.

At better ending for the movie would have been that Sandman realises he has to go back to jail, but in return asks Spider-Man to help organising something to help Sandmans daughter.

I just really hate the ending. Raimi dropped the ball big time.

 

[Eddie Brock]

The symbiote was great in this movie, I don't know what you guys are smoking.

-He tried to kill someone, and then didn't feel any remorse. "Good riddance."

-He almost killed his best friend.

-He b****slapped MJ.

-He lashed out at Mr. Ditkovich and Eddie.

-He became a selfless womanizer who only cares about making MJ jealous.

If that isn't changing the character, I don't know what is.

 

[MattP]

i think Venom works fine in the movie. Its just a few corrections and he would be perfect, such as the tongue, talking in an altered voice and refering to himself as "we" that and a couple more scenes and he would be just close to perfect. I liked Topher in the role though, thought he was great and i really dug the moment the symbiote is going beserk on its own at the climax it looked way cool.

 

[Eddie Brock]

i think Venom works fine in the movie. Its just a few corrections and he would be perfect, such as the tongue, talking in an altered voice and refering to himself as "we" that and a couple more scenes and he would be just close to perfect. I liked Topher in the role though, thought he was great and i really dug the moment the symbiote is going beserk on its own at the climax it looked way cool.

I think the tongue can look stupid, so I'm glad they omitted it.

The altered voice wasn't necessary, but it would have been a cool touch, I'll admit.

And the "I" and "we" thing helps the character...it lets you know that it's Eddie ("I") who is really looking for revenge.

 

[dos_acoustic]

To make Spidey 3 a better movie, Yes
To Please Avi Arad and Sony and make more money, no

I dont know how many times i have said this before. SAM WAS FORCED TO PUT VENOM IN THE MOVIE!!! He has even talked about Arad asking him to put venom in the movie! After being forced to put Venom in the movie all of sams plans had to be altered. Giving less screen time for Sandman and GG2. Those being the only parts of the film that i find enjoyable. That first fight scene with sandman in the armored cars. It felt like spidey 2 all over again...then that feeling was crushed once the symbiote came into play

Oh well, i guess i will always have Spidey 2 to fall back on

 

[XXTBWCXX]

^^^ Everyone knows that Arad made Raimi put Venom in the movie.

It worked great with the movie though, and a climax with Spider-Man dealing with Venom made this movie more the merrier...and Spider-Man 2 wasn't as good as the first one as almost everyone believes...Spider-Man 1, to me, is the best out of the three.

And it didn't shorten time for Flint and Harry...Vulture was gonna be in the movie, possibly taking up the time that the symbiote took...because, Raimi took some scenes out anyways, like thirty minutes of it...with Flint, his family and even more Venom...so why would Venom had mess up this movie? Raimi even shorten Venom's time.

 

[Grievous]

I'm begining to wonder if this movie would have been better without Venom. The movie had too many villains and since raimi didn't like Venom, maybe he should have been the one to get cut out. How do people expect Raimi to do a good job with Venom if Raimi doesn't like him. Do you think you could do a good job with writing stories about characters you didn't like?

well the movie was about black spider-man and how the symbiote changed his life so if they do a movie with a symbiote the movie has to have Venom

 

[Venom 1988]

well the movie was about black spider-man and how the symbiote changed his life so if they do a movie with a symbiote the movie has to have Venom

It originally wasent going to have the symbiote either.

 

[AIRWOLF]

Well I think the movie would have been better with elimination of either of the two characters, meaning Sandman or Venom. I felt that neither of the two villains got fully developed in the final edit of the movie, removing one of those villains could have allowed for more smoother flow of the movie. But personally I feel the whole revisiting Uncle Ben murder thing should have been left alone, that way all those questions about why that info about Flint was kept from Parkers, could have been avoided. Harry should have been the main focus of the film, about his thirst for revenge. And since the theme was that of revenge, Venom would have been more preferable final villain than Sandman if the choice came down to either of the two.

 

[Eddie Brock]

When you think about it, Venom was the ONLY villain in the trilogy that Spider-Man fought using his brain.

FIGHTING STRATEGIES
GG - Kick the crap out of him
Doc Ock - Kick the crap out of him
NG - Kick the crap out of him
Sandman - ATTEMPT to kick the crap out of him
Venom - Use sonics to weaken the symbiote, destroy it with a pumpkin bomb

It's pretty messed up actually, since Spider-Man always talks about how he has to use his brain in the comics.

 

[The Joker]

When you think about it, Venom was the ONLY villain in the trilogy that Spider-Man fought using his brain.

FIGHTING STRATEGIES
GG - Kick the crap out of him
Doc Ock - Kick the crap out of him
NG - Kick the crap out of him
Sandman - ATTEMPT to kick the crap out of him
Venom - Use sonics to weaken the symbiote, destroy it with a pumpkin bomb

It's pretty messed up actually, since Spider-Man always talks about how he has to use his brain in the comics.

Well, since Venom is supposed to be invincible [], using those strategies was the only way to go. After all, did Spidey ever beat Venom in hand to hand combat in the comics??

As for Ock, Spidey did not use physical violence to defeat him. He appealed to Ock's moral side to do the right thing. He never actually physically beat Ock in SM-2.

Norman and Harry were the only two he beat down into submission. Sandman was washed away by water in one battle.

 

[Eddie Brock]

Well, since Venom is supposed to be invincible [], using those strategies was the only way to go. After all, did Spidey ever beat Venom in hand to hand combat in the comics??

As for Ock, Spidey did not use physical violence to defeat him. He appealed to Ock's moral side to do the right thing. He never actually physically beat Ock in SM-2.

Norman and Harry were the only two he beat down into submission. Sandman was washed away by water in one battle.

Yes, he appealed to Ock's moral side..after he kicked the crap out of him.

Spider-Man defeated Doc Ock...Otto was lying in the water, defeated....then Spidey realized that he couldn't stop the machine alone and THEN he went back to Otto.

 

[The Joker]

Yes, he appealed to Ock's moral side..after he kicked the crap out of him.

Spider-Man defeated Doc Ock...Otto was lying in the water, defeated....then Spidey realized that he couldn't stop the machine alone and THEN he went back to Otto.

He has Peter by throat. This is a physically defeated Doc Ock??

He didn't kick the crap out of him. He electrocuted him by tricking him into stabbing the electric cable with the tentacle blade. That's not kicking the crap out of him.

And he was not beaten. Just stunned.

 

[Eddie Brock]

He has Peter by throat. This is a physically defeated Doc Ock??

He didn't kick the crap out of him. He electrocuted him by tricking him into stabbing the electric cable with the tentacle blade. That's not kicking the crap out of him.

And he was not beaten. Just stunned.

He was clearly beaten. His tentacles were motionless in the water. Spidey could have left him there and it would have been the end of it...but he knew that no one knew the machine like Ock, and so he went back for help...

Just because your favorite villain got defeated like everyone else doesn't mean that you have to be in denial about it.

 

[The Joker]

He was clearly beaten.

Yeah, that pic sure proves that, doesn't it.

His tentacles were motionless in the water.

For about 15 seconds.

Spidey could have left him there and it would have been the end of it

Really?? So, Ock would have recovered like he did, and just sat there would he??

but he knew that no one knew the machine like Ock, and so he went back for help

Exactly.

He didn't try to physically combat Ock again. He ripped off his mask and appealed to Otto.

Just because your favorite villain got defeated like everyone else doesn't mean that you have to be in denial about it.

Grow up, dude.

 

[Eddie Brock]

Yeah, that pic sure proves that, doesn't it.

That picture proves nothing...if the machine wasn't there, Spider-Man could have left Otto there and that picture would have never happened.

For about 15 seconds.

Yes...the 15 seconds we saw....there's no way to say that he wouldn't have stayed down if left there.

Really?? So, Ock would have recovered like he did, and just sat there would he??

Just out of curiosity, did you WATCH the scene? Look at Otto...he's sitting there in the water, not moving, not doing anything...Spider-Man coming back was his motivation to even try and get up...if Spider-Man had left him, Otto would stay down...wallowing in his failure.

Exactly.

He didn't try to physically combat Ock again. He ripped off his mask and appealed to Otto.

He didn't try to attack Otto because that isn't what he needed...he needed answers about the machine, and he's not the Punisher, he doesn't interrogate people...IF Ock had gotten up and attacked, Spider-Man wouldn't have taken his mask off, he would have fought back.

Grow up, dude.

Well, since Venom is supposed to be invincible [],

You first.

 

[The Joker]

That picture proves nothing...if the machine wasn't there, Spider-Man could have left Otto there and that picture would have never happened.

Ock would have recovered like he did, attacked Spidey again, like he did in that pic. Spidey was a threat to Ock's goal.

Yes...the 15 seconds we saw....there's no way to say that he wouldn't have stayed down if left there.

Why the hell would he stay there?? Decides he likes sitting in water??

Just out of curiosity, did you WATCH the scene? Look at Otto...he's sitting there in the water, not moving, not doing anything...Spider-Man coming back was his motivation to even try and get up...if Spider-Man had left him, Otto would stay down...wallowing in his failure.

You clearly did not watch this scene. Otto recovers, Spidey comes over to him and unmasks, and tells Otto they have to shut the reactor down. Ock's tentacles rise from the water, and grab Peter by throat, with Ock exclaiming that he won't shut it down

How exactly is he wallowing in failure when he refuses to shut the friggin' thing down??

He didn't try to attack Otto because that isn't what he needed...he needed answers about the machine, and he's not the Punisher, he doesn't interrogate people...IF Ock had gotten up and attacked, Spider-Man wouldn't have taken his mask off, he would have fought back.

But, Ock DID attack him. Again, you are missing the obvious. Peter knew there was no point in fighting back. Why do you think he didn't try to wrench free from the tentacle's grip?? He cannot defeat Ock that way. He had to appeal to his moral side to win him over.

Spidey beat Ock, alright. But, not in a physical way. It was mental triumph. He showed Otto the error of his ways.

You first.

Don't know why you quoted that. It's the truth. Spidey never did beat Brock in hand to hand combat. He is invincible in that way.

 

[ProfeZZor X]

The story concept for Venom wasn't bad... Only the timing and his appearance.

 

[The Batman]

In a perfect world, It shouldve been just Venom and New Goblin. The villains from the first two films were two of spidey's most iconic villains...and having venom as the main villain wouldve completed the trifecta of having the top three villains in the original trilogy. Not only that, but having the symbiote wouldve added to the story and fued between harry and peter

However...Raimi dosent like Venom. So, realisitically, Venom shouldnt have been in the movie, and Sandman's role shouldve been beefed up, and he shouldve been more of a menace as well.

So, for a top notch spiderman 3, venom should stay...but if raimi had it his way and we were removing a villain, venom wouldve went

 

[The Joker]

Yeah the movie would have been better without Venom. He was crap. Especially when he spoke.

 

[Eddie Brock]

Whatever, Doc Ock...I've come to a realization that all your posts regarding Spider-Man villains follow the same format:

-Decide if villain in question is Doc Ock
-If not, insult villain in question
-Then proceed to talk about how Doc Ock is better by comparison

 

[The Joker]

Whatever, Doc Ock...I've come to a realization that all your posts regarding Spider-Man villains follow the same format:

-Decide if villain in question is Doc Ock
-If not, insult villain in question
-Then proceed to talk about how Doc Ock is better by comparison

LOL! I'd love to see some of these posts. Because I have nothing but praise for Harry and Norman as villains in these movies.

Not the first time I've seen you cry wolf like this in a debate. Your recent clash with Chibikyriama was an eye opener. He even had to threaten to call the moderators to pull you into line, didn't he??

Yeah, we're done here.

 

[Bana]

Venom pretty much made the movie for me so no

 

[XXTBWCXX]

I love seeing people arguing eachother THROUGH the internet...always nice.

 

[Eddie Brock]

LOL! I'd love to see some of these posts. Because I have nothing but praise for Harry and Norman as villains in these movies.

Not the first time I've seen you cry wolf like this in a debate. Your recent clash with Chibikyriama was an eye opener. He even had to threaten to call the moderators to pull you into line, didn't he??

Yeah, we're done here.

Chibikyriama was nowhere near an interesting debater....he threatened to call the mods from the get-go....there's no fun in that.