Days of Future Past Actors from original trilogy on First Class sequel with Days of Future Past - Part 1

[spideyboy_1111]

Singer never said he was using time travel to do 'clean up'. I read the quote, and all he says is that he is not ignoring any of the existing films and has devised a way to make them all make sense and 'clean up' inconsistencies.

erm... re-read what you wrote.. "he has devised a way (using time travel/alt dimensions as the subject of his quote) to make them all "make sense and clean up inconsistencies" that's saying he's using the change to fix parts of the movies that don't match up correctly.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

The timeline, at least concerning First Class and the Trilogy is flawed. Things don't match up perfectly like one would expect, and I think the point that some of us are trying to make is that this is an opportunity to smooth those rough edges a bit. Some of the stuff in First Class seemed to go against what was previously established in the other movies like X2 where Hank McCoy is seen as a normal human and then transforms later on.

Its little inconsistencies like this that are what can be fixed.

this. he's not ERASING movies... he seems to be rounding out and altering the things that are obviously broken

 

[DigificWriter]

Nowhere in his statement does Singer indicate that he is using the time travel aspects of DoFP to do 'clean up' with regards to the inconsistencies that exist in the franchise. You people are drawing connections that aren't actually there.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

^ Many of the things that people see as inconsistencies are so minor as to be inconsequential. Regardless, though, you don't use time travel to fix inconsistencies, as it is impossible to do so and maintain the singular continuity of the franchise, which, as I've already noted several times, is what FOX has taken pains to do thus far and which they appear to be continuing to do.

minor to you, but people have been complaining about them since they occured... and THEY DO make the franchise weaker. there's very minor things that can be fixed that still make everything line up.

FOX with Miller and Singer are trying to polish off the lazy-ness of the past, and make the Marvel films the way they should be. Other than "retconning" an entire film (which is very disrespectful) tweaking a few problems is actually a PERFECT reason to use time travel. Maybe Xavier wasn't suppose to be shot in XFC in the OT timeline?, there's a billion different tweaks that can fix problems without erasing the entire film... such as bringing back the dead, or stopping an event that lead to the DOFP future

 

[SpideyVille]

erm... re-read what you wrote.. "he has devised a way (using time travel/alt dimensions as the subject of his quote) to make them all "make sense and clean up inconsistencies" that's saying he's using the change to fix parts of the movies that don't match up correctly.

Exactly, it's like all of these movies combined to make one giant puzzle, but in the process of doing so, some pieces were forced in and didn't really fit in perfectly. So this is a chance to smooth those edges out.

No one is arguing anything about continuity. They are all one continuity, and that's why those inconsistencies stand out.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Nowhere in his statement does Singer indicate that he is using the time travel aspects of DoFP to do 'clean up' with regards to the inconsistencies that exist in the franchise. You people are drawing connections that aren't actually there.

the TOPIC was "time travel/alt dimensions" than he went on to talk about how he has FOUND a way to "fix inconsistencies"

it really doesn't take a genius to understand that

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

Singer might mean cleaning up the inconsistencies from First Class... Magneto might come and help Xavier build Cerebro in this... as it was a major point in X1-2

That's not inconsistent, though. Erik can still come and help Charles build the Cerebro that we know, but this time, in the mansion.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Exactly, it's like all of these movies combined to make one giant puzzle, but in the process of doing so, some pieces were forced in and didn't really fit in perfectly. So this is a chance to smooth those edges out.

No one is arguing anything about continuity. They are all one continuity, and that's why those inconsistencies stand out.

great analogy and very well put!

 

[spideyboy_1111]

That's not inconsistent, though. Erik can still come and help Charles build the Cerebro that we know, but this time, in the mansion.

don't you think that loses the "importance" factor though? building cerebro for the first time is far more special than building it for a second... add to that Xavier really doesn't need to be crippled twice either. it's just kinda stupid (and it's stupid as all hell in the books too)

and it's not just building cerebro... its the origin of magnetos helmet too

 

[DigificWriter]

Most of the arguments I have heard are centered around this idea that Singer is going to use the time travel elements of DoFP to fix the various inconsistencies that exist even though it is impossible to do so without jettisoning or otherwise significantly altering the existing singular nature of the continuity.

Singer does briefly mention string theory, multiverses, etc., but in the context of bringing the two casts together, not in the context of doing the 'clean up' he later mentions.

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

don't you think that loses the "importance" factor though? building cerebro for the first time is far more special than building it for a second... add to that Xavier really doesn't need to be crippled twice either. it's just kinda stupid (and it's stupid as all hell in the books too)

Yeah, it does lose a bit of the importance factor, but it isn't inconsistent. Since the first Cerebro was destroyed in FC, they're going to have to build a new one sooner or later and this is the best chance they have.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Most of the arguments I have heard are centered around this idea that Singer is going to use the time travel elements of DoFP to fix the various inconsistencies that exist even though it is impossible to do so without jettisoning or otherwise significantly altering the existing singular nature of the continuity.

no it's not... you're stuck on a one track mind butterfly effect where something small makes DRASTIC changes later...

there's an infinite number of universes out there.. some with drastic change.. some with minuscule.

and example being... Xavier getting Crippled in XFC changes the continuity of XO and X3, where.. if for instance Singer stops Xavier from getting shot in FC.. that now suddenly fits in continuity.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Yeah, it does lose a bit of the importance factor, but it isn't inconsistent. Since the first Cerebro was destroyed in FC, they're going to have to build a new one sooner or later and this is the best chance they have.

it's still inconsistent if it's not "proven" consistent yet.... we know cerebro is rebuilt and put into the mansion.. but X1 also put emphasis on the idea that Xavier and Mag INVENTED it.. just not "rebuilt it"

 

[DigificWriter]

I'm done with this argument; if you change events from any of the films, you remove that film from the existing singular continuity of the franchise, and I do not believe that there is any evidence whatsoever of FOX intending or wanting to go in that direction.

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

it's still inconsistent if it's not "proven" consistent yet.... we know cerebro is rebuilt and put into the mansion.. but X1 also put emphasis on the idea that Xavier and Mag INVENTED it.. just not "rebuilt it"

In X1 Charles merely says that Erik helped him build Cerebro. Nothing about that hints at them inventing it together.

I still don't think it's inconsistent, because there still isn't a Cerebro in the Mansion. I'd understand if Charles made Cerebro in the mansion in FC, but he didn't. Give it time.

 

[SpideyVille]

great analogy and very well put!

Thanks, and I think some of the confusion is that there are two different arguments that are being mixed into one.

The first is as I stated, there is one continuity, but it's not perfect. So by using Time Travel, they have an opportunity to fix it up so that it makes more sense and ends any confusion that has occurred since each of the films were released.

The second argument, which is mostly based on speculation, is that whenever you use Time Travel, which in this case I don't believe is being used a lazy device to erase anything, there is always some kind of ripple effect. And as I've mentioned, it all depends on what time period they go back to or forward to. The fact that Patrick Stewart is returning suggests that it will include scenes from before the end of X3. And the speculation is that by using Time Travel, and having people from the future go to the past, they will change things that could lead to other changes, such as Xavier never dieing, that way they can bring him back for a sequel if they ever choose that. It wouldn't be retconning because it would work in the realm of Time Travel. It's not like in SM3 where they suddenly said "what you think happened didn't really happen the way we said. Here's the real story." That was a retcon. This is more like "What happened still happened, but someone went back to a time before it happened, and prevented it from happening."

Man, this is why they always say don't talk about time travel because you're just going to confuse everybody.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

I'm done with this argument; if you change events from any of the films, you remove that film from the existing singular continuity of the franchise, and I do not believe that there is any evidence whatsoever of FOX intending or wanting to go in that direction.

Fine be done. But you're over analysing time travel. There's really no set logic it just depends on which the story decides to go with. Fixing something small doesn't mean the future won't happen the same way

 

[Whiskey Tango]

There is only one inconsistency that I would consider to be major: Xavier walking in 1979 and the mid-80s (when he and Erik visited the Grey home).

Xavier and Magneto going their separate ways at the end of First Class, yet apparenly pals again when they visit Jean in X3.

Xavier says he and Erik met when they were teens in X-men, but in FC they're both grown men when they meet.

Xavier and Mystique apparently forgetting they were best buds in college.

Moira not aging.

Storm's cameo in FC when she shouldn't have even been born.

Storm, Cyclops and Xavier not remembering Wolverine when they meet him again in X-Men. You could maybe make the case that Scott and Ororo just forgot because they were young but Xavier met him *twice* and even spoke with him both times.

Emma Frost apparently de-aging from adult in FC to a teenager in X3.

Somebody already mentioned the weirdness with Beast.

Whatever else I'm forgetting.

I wouldn't call any of those 'minor'. And I still like the movies but it's silly the way people try to brush them off as meaningless rather than admitting Fox couldn't decide on a reboot or prequel and ended up half-assing it.

Even so, you don't use time travel to fix that type of issue, as I already noted.

So you keep saying. It's the easy way to do so if that's your intent, however.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Thanks, and I think some of the confusion is that there are two different arguments that are being mixed into one.

The first is as I stated, there is one continuity, but it's not perfect. So by using Time Travel, they have an opportunity to fix it up so that it makes more sense and ends any confusion that has occurred since each of the films were released.

The second argument, which is mostly based on speculation, is that whenever you use Time Travel, which in this case I don't believe is being used a lazy device to erase anything, there is always some kind of ripple effect. And as I've mentioned, it all depends on what time period they go back to or forward to. The fact that Patrick Stewart is returning suggests that it will include scenes from before the end of X3. And the speculation is that by using Time Travel, and having people from the future go to the past, they will change things that could lead to other changes, such as Xavier never dieing, that way they can bring him back for a sequel if they ever choose that. It wouldn't be retconning because it would work in the realm of Time Travel. It's not like in SM3 where they suddenly said "what you think happened didn't really happen the way we said. Here's the real story." That was a retcon. This is more like "What happened still happened, but someone went back to a time before it happened, and prevented it from happening."

Man, this is why they always say don't talk about time travel because you're just going to confuse everybody.

I actually believe 1 of 2 theories will happen... in XMDOFP I don't think we will get a direct translation of the book... but we may get any one of these...

1) The FC crew (which there seems to be far less of) is visted by someone from the future needing help, and they jump forward into it. (either purposely or by accident), i do think there's a chance that the time traveler might not even have meant to go as far back as they did). They essentially get trapped in the future but are finally able to go home at the end learning how to stop the events they witnessed

2) a couple characters (2-3) from the OT struggle to change the events of there future by correcting different event's of the past... essentially revisiting scenes from previous X-films trying to stop the future from happening.

I really don't think they're going to let an opportunity like DOFP to not be highly showcased.. so i really don't think the film will focus on the 60s era or the cast considering only a small handful so far have been brought back.. That theory may change though if we do start getting more FC casting announcements.

im also aware this deviates from the original story... but id be shocked if they did anything more than adapt/borrow from it.

 

[GuestStar2004]

Storm, Cyclops and Xavier not remembering Wolverine when they meet him again in X-Men. You could maybe make the case that Scott and Ororo just forgot because they were young but Xavier met him *twice* and even spoke with him both times.

in first class when Xavier spoke to wolverine it was only 1 word and he didn't really get a look at his face proper in person nor did wolverine say anything apart from 3 words and didn't even look round at them till they had gone

even if Xavier got a look at logans face through Cerebro once i doubt he would remember, nor would he have a reason to remember over 20 years later

and as for cyclops in origins.. he didn't see logans face either

Moira not aging.

she probably the original moira's daughter or something

 

[Whiskey Tango]

in first class when Xavier spoke to wolverine it was only 1 word and he didn't really get a look at his face proper in person nor did wolverine say anything apart from 3 words and didn't even look round at them till they had gone

even if Xavier got a look at logans face through Cerebro once i doubt he would remember, nor would he have a reason to remember over 20 years later

and as for cyclops in origins.. he didn't see logans face either

Xavier and Erik both knew Logan was a mutant or they wouldn't have been there to recruit him in the first place. It wasn't like he was just some random duder they bumped into in a bar. I don't buy that he'd be that easily forgotten by two highly intelligent men who had learned enough about him to attempt recruiting him for their super-powered team of mutants. No way.

Also Xavier met Logan *again* after the events of the Wolverine movie.

she probably the original moira's daughter or something

Or we can drop the fanwanky attempts at explaining it and just admit it's an error. The world won't implode just because people accept that Fox didn't start thinking about consistency until it was too late.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

the xavier not knowing wolverine thing is sorta meh.. Xavier is full of secrets, and does have a history like magneto...as playing people like pawns on a chess board.

and yeah.. cyclops never actually got a look at or met wolvie. though... i do find it a bit odd an event like that wouldn't stick into Cyclop's mind where even a small glimpse, or other kids description of "a man with claws" freeing them.. you'd think something about wolvie when he met him would remind him of that event...

well.. unless Xavier altered his mind too... i mean, what if some bad event happened to a "second team" (like in the books) and Xavier erased scott's memory because of it?

 

[Angamb]

Charles and Eric really didnt see Logans face

so where is the problem here?

 

[DigificWriter]

Xavier and Magneto going their separate ways at the end of First Class, yet apparenly pals again when they visit Jean in X3.

Xavier says he and Erik met when they were teens in X-men, but in FC they're both grown men when they meet.

Xavier and Mystique apparently forgetting they were best buds in college.

Moira not aging.

Storm's cameo in FC when she shouldn't have even been born.

Storm, Cyclops and Xavier not remembering Wolverine when they meet him again in X-Men. You could maybe make the case that Scott and Ororo just forgot because they were young but Xavier met him *twice* and even spoke with him both times.

Emma Frost apparently de-aging from adult in FC to a teenager in X3.

Somebody already mentioned the weirdness with Beast.

Whatever else I'm forgetting.

I wouldn't call any of those 'minor'. And I still like the movies but it's silly the way people try to brush them off as meaningless rather than admitting Fox couldn't decide on a reboot or prequel and ended up half-assing it.



So you keep saying. It's the easy way to do so if that's your intent, however.

The majority of those things are only 'inconsistencies' in your mind. Just because you think something is inconsistent does not mean that it actually is.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Charles and Eric really didnt see Logans face

so where is the problem here?

they would have seen him in cerebro though