The Dark Knight Rises Adapting Robin

[Danny No-Shame]

I won't point out the obvious contradiction there. Oh, what the hell. If he didn't fit, he wouldn't be there. Like most things, it's purely a matter of execution.

Of course, everything that has ever been created everywhere, should be there because it is... excellent logic there, Brainiac...

Yes, it was a marketing tool. I believe it has shown that it can transcend that, when it is treated as something serious rather than something silly and childish.

Of course it can. But Robin hasn't. Ever. I doubt he ever could, because the character is ridiculous. Period.

... but someone like you wouldn't really be interested in that, so I won't bother explaining it just yet. I'm sure others will be arriving in a bit to do just that.

How the hell do you know what I would be interested in or not?

Please do forgive me for having an opinion which differs from yours. You are as entitled to it as I am to mine. Yours just happens to be wrong. Luckily Chris Nolan agrees with me on this one. I know. We had brunch.

 

[Keyser Sushi]

Of course, everything that has ever been created everywhere, should be there because it is... excellent logic there, Brainiac...

That's not what I said. I said it obviously fits because, it's there. That's like putting a shirt in a suitcase, zipping the suitcase, and then saying, "the shirt doesn't fit in the suitcase." It obviously does. That doesn't mean you wanted to pack it. Similarly, just because you hate Robin, doesn't mean he doesn't fit. It just means you don't like him. See how that works? Kthx.

Of course it can. But Robin hasn't. Ever. I doubt he ever could, because the character is ridiculous. Period.

So Batman is ridiculous too? Because, uh... Robin is just Batman Jr.

And to the remark that "Robin hasn't. Ever." been done well, I would say, read a damn comic or get off the boards, genius.

How the hell do you know what I would be interested in or not?

Because you made it crystal clear that you hate Robin. Ergo, I can deduce, using my mighty brain, that you have no interest in hearing how Robin could be done well.

Please do forgive me for having an opinion which differs from yours. You are as entitled to it as I am to mine. Yours just happens to be wrong. Luckily Chris Nolan agrees with me on this one. I know. We had brunch.

I don't care that your opinion is different from mine. I don't care that you hate Robin. But your argument is full of manufactured "facts" and half-truths. Nolan never said he hates Robin, and he never said he thinks Dick Grayson should be shot in the head. What Nolan said was that he doesn't plan to put Robin in his trilogy. He said he doesn't think he's the guy to tell that story. He also said that he thinks Robin is hard to put onscreen these days because the idea of an apprenticeship is an old-world concept that people aren't necessarily cognizant of these days. People like you.

 

[SouLeSS]

Give him the current Robin costume, or something similar to it, and I'll like it. The first gen costume though? God no.

 

[El Payaso]

If Robin was such a huge mistake, can I ask why he still exists?

**** happens. And keeps happening.

So many mistakes, all of them written out when they got the chance, so why wasn't Robin?

He was. In good Batman movies.

Because the terrible motivation behind Robin's original creation, good writers over the years have been able to turn him into something more. There are tons of good stories featuring Robin, and he's had a humongous, lasting effect on the Dark Knight's character.

One of those effects is the gay jokes. The other is Robin's elimination from movies.

That's not what I said. I said it obviously fits because, it's there. That's like putting a shirt in a suitcase, zipping the suitcase, and then saying, "the shirt doesn't fit in the suitcase." It obviously does. That doesn't mean you wanted to pack it. Similarly, just because you hate Robin, doesn't mean he doesn't fit. It just means you don't like him. See how that works? Kthx.

If the suitcase is filled with Armani suits and then I have this gaudy unpleasant red t-shirt.. it probably fits in the suitcase, but it doesn't match with the content of it. I think that is the point.

So Batman is ridiculous too? Because, uh... Robin is just Batman Jr.

But Batman does not wear flesh color tights and red and yellow clothes with elves shoes. Because that was Robin's suit for like 50 years. If they changed that in comics for the better, directors can write Robin off for the better. Or make him Nightwing at once.

And to the remark that "Robin hasn't. Ever." been done well, I would say, read a damn comic or get off the boards, genius.

I still am to read that golden comic with a Robin story that's so good it'll convince me he could work at the big screen better than a lonely Batman.

Because you made it crystal clear that you hate Robin. Ergo, I can deduce, using my mighty brain, that you have no interest in hearing how Robin could be done well.

I even found Schumacher's Robin a valuable effort. The idea convinced me more than the Bat-father concept.

Sushi, still you know this is healthy discusion but as a show of respect I wrote the irony and bad taste jokes off of this post. You know I hate you.

 

[Abe Rush]

My main beef with Robin, besides from the horrible costume is simply that I can't see a 13 or so years old fighting against grown men and actually winning... with that being said, I think I have somewhat of a "solution" to this problem, at least from my point of view. If Robin was to be introduced, I would have Bruce Wayne adopt him when he's around 12-13 years old and then struggle with him and his need for revenge for a while, before deciding he's better off doing what Batman himself did, which is to go to asia ( or a similar place ) in order to find inner peace or at least to find some answers... He could stay there for a few years and come back when he's around 17-18 years old ( trained for about 5-6 years in martial arts, etc. ) and from then on, he could be Robin, up until he's about 23, when he would become Nightwing. Before then, he would have all kind of acrobatic and technical knowledge, but he would need Batman to show him the "ways of the streets", thus Batman could reprise his role of mentor.

 

[thegameq]

Not in Nolan's reality based world. Endangering a child, etc., etc.,...
I can't see it. Sure it can be done in some way or form, but honestly no. If we're going to take Nolan's realistic take on Batman serious, then there should be no Robin.

 

[obiwangator]

I have to agree that I dont see Robin,Selina Kyle aka Catwoman and other campy villains or characters in Nolan's style. I resent over crowding TDK because that really hinders the film & quality as a whole.

 

[Crooklyn]

I have to agree that I dont see Robin,Selina Kyle aka Catwoman and other campy villains or characters in Nolan's style.

Seriously. Does anyone here even read comics anymore?

 

[Paste Pot Pete]

Seriously. Does anyone here even read comics anymore?

I think some people need to listen to Frank Miller, the author of one of the most frequently cited "realistic" comics, Year One -

"People are attempting to bring a superficial reality to superheroes which is rather stupid. They work best as the flamboyant fantasies they are. I mean, these are characters that are broad and big. I don't need to see sweat patches under Superman's arms. I want to see him fly."

 

[Crooklyn]

That's a fantastic quote. Accept comics for what they are. I have no problem grounding the material a bit for film, but c'mon, there's only so much you can do until you cross that line of bastardizing the source.

 

[Miranda Fox]

Seriously. Does anyone here even read comics anymore?

Apparently not.

Nor do they understand what a heightened reality is.

 

[Keyser Sushi]

One of those effects is the gay jokes. The other is Robin's elimination from movies.

Yes, the gay jokes are bad because they compromise the character. I get it. And Robin is not only not in the good Batman movies, but for the most part he is not in the Batman comics, either; he spends more time in his own comics.

However, I view this largely as cowardice on the part of creators.

If the suitcase is filled with Armani suits and then I have this gaudy unpleasant red t-shirt.. it probably fits in the suitcase, but it doesn't match with the content of it. I think that is the point.

Of course it's the point. But I, sir, am a wise-ass.

But Batman does not wear flesh color tights and red and yellow clothes with elves shoes. Because that was Robin's suit for like 50 years. If they changed that in comics for the better, directors can write Robin off for the better. Or make him Nightwing at once.

I think we all agree that the original Robin suit -- which is basically stylized medieval garb and looks very odd on a child. I think we all also agree that Nightwing is cooler. But Nightwing is not a sidekick, and should not be reduced to one. Also, and I say this again, but in order to be anywhere near as good as Batman, Nightwing has to start training as a child. And that brings us back to Robin.

I still am to read that golden comic with a Robin story that's so good it'll convince me he could work at the big screen better than a lonely Batman.

Hold on there, big fella. I never said it would work better than a lonely Batman. In fact I've always said I prefer Batman to work alone. But I think there comes a point when Robin is an acceptable addition, and is a good strong character in his own right. The problem is that he takes some of the focus off of Batman. Which means that Batman deserves a good solo run before Robin is ever introduced. Which, I have said many times as well.

I even found Schumacher's Robin a valuable effort. The idea convinced me more than the Bat-father concept.

And I had the opposite reaction to Schumacher's Robin... I found him unconvincing and wussy.

Sushi, still you know this is healthy discusion but as a show of respect I wrote the irony and bad taste jokes off of this post. You know I hate you.

LOL. And you know as well as I do that if we didn't have each other to disagree with, we'd both have a little less fun in this place.

 

[Keyser Sushi]

Apparently not.

Nor do they understand what a heightened reality is.

Sort of makes you want to drive around the world smacking Hypers with a half-frozen mahi-mahi, doesn't it?

Or is that just me?

 

[Miranda Fox]

Sort of makes you want to drive around the world smacking Hypers with a half-frozen mahi-mahi, doesn't it?

Or is that just me?

I'd settle for a Clue Bat. Or possibly a Clue-By-Four.

 

[Paste Pot Pete]

I still blame Batman & Robin for this persisting mentality.

Many fans apparently have yet been unable to release themselves from its icy grasp of suck; they were left so shellshocked that they now utterly refuse to accept anything less than the exact polar opposite of what they witnessed in B&R.

The slightest hint of color or fantasy sends them spiraling into Vietnam-like flashbacks.

The thing is, there's not too much reason to be afraid. Yes, there have been times where "camp" has dominated thanks to too many sidekicks and wacky villains and scenarios, but for the better part of the 70+ years Batman has been around, it hasn't dampered him too much. The essentially universally beloved Batman: The Animated Series contained all of these elements, but no one ever complains about them. As a matter of fact, the Clayface episodes (a villain many say should never ever ever under any circumstances ever be in a film) are some of the best cinematic and dramatic parts of TAS. That's because it was handled with respect and class, which is what it boils down to.

 

[Keyser Sushi]

I'd settle for a Clue Bat. Or possibly a Clue-By-Four.

LOL. Well, mahi-mahi is also called Blue Dolphin.

Clue Dolphin?

 

[Green_Lantern43]

Okay, I am not for Robin in the new movies, but if it were me I would bring him in as an older guy, prolly have it be Dick Grayson...and for the casting choice of him I think that Jason Behr would be perfect...

But yeah thats who I would cast, but once again im not so big into Robin in the movies or what not, but it was a good read to see who people picked and such..

 

[Keyser Sushi]

^Too old.

Much.

 

[Nepenthes]

Too old even for my older version of Robin. Maybe a good Nightwing, except he doesn't really have the spunky look that ladies ladies love, and I think that'd be important for a movie.

 

[Nepenthes]

Just some Robin pictures I like.....

See he looks older there ^ and it doesn't seem too wrong

 

[Amazing Afroman]

_______________________________________________

First, this topic is NOT about whether Robin should be introduced. We've gone over that many times and I've made a new thread to keep that stuff out of here. To do otherwise is to demonstrate that you are either a jerk, a simpleton, or a pissflap.


So let's just say that a Robin character WILL be introduced at the end of movie 3 or at the beginning of a new trilogy (continuing the more serious approach of Nolans films). There would be many things to consider when adding him in, things you might initially take for granted. These are not often discussed.


For instance

- Dick Grayson might not even be the best option, especially when you can combine elements from several Robins into one. Would you have the acrobat, the hoodlum or the detective? Which bits would you take from the various personalities and origin stories?


- Robins costume works quite well in the comics but of course it'd be much harder to adapt for film than Batmans. Personally I'd adopt a recognisable look from outside the 'spandex' genre, eg. ninja, urban commando or 'modern medieval' Robin Hood. What changes and inspirations would you use?


- Would Robin even need a cape? Sure it's part of his classic costume (until recently ) but in BB the only reason Batman has a cape is to glide around. If Robin copies this trick it will make Batman less distinctive - while Robin could rely on a more unique mode of transport (freerunning!)
Same goes for the bandit mask, it wouldn't work, but is there any alternative?


- How important is age? Does Robin really need to be a child to serve his function? To me it was never about Batman taking care of an orphan... the kid doesn't need a guardian he needs a mentor. I'd put him at 18-20, which is still quite young to be partnering with a 30+ Batman. Older Robin also makes sense from a marketing and tonal perspective.


- This being Robins introduction the villain is very important. They should be part of the theme, like both villains in BB reflected separate themes. ????


-Who would you cast? Obviously it's a while off so just pretend that a contemporary actor will be the same age then as he is now. I guess we're talking about types and examples.


Again, if you really are against including Robin then please use this thread to explain how you'd make the best of the decision rather than just opposing it

 

[WeaponXProject]

If Robin is in the future movies, which means Bale won't be in them with him cause he hates Robin, I believe they should take a darker route than before. Reinvent him and shallow out his suckups to Bruce and Batman. I don't f-ing know surprise me! But stick with the sad family deaths stuff and make him a loner with no where to go. Maybe they'll have Batman fight and Robin's the new guy in town fighting crime. But only a specific group of criminals who killed his family for revenge. But we all know neither Nolan nor Bale will be a part of a film with this sidekick.

 

[WeaponXProject]

Also I had to add that if Robin was introduced down the line that I can invision Jake Gyllenhaal playing him but there are some issues considering he is rumored to take over the Spiderman role for Spidey 4. Truthfully, I'd rather him be Spidey than Robin.

 

[GL1]

18 year old Robin = Nightwing.

If you take away the kid element, you lose not only any reason for him being in the films, but you also make it unbelievable... there's no way in heck that an 18 year old can just suit up and do everything Batman took 10 years to learn. It's IMPOSSIBLE. Adult Robin is a BAD idea.

Much Better would be to have Bruce get Grayson at around 12 and have Grayson TRAINING in the BACKGROUND as a SUPPORTING CHARACTER and then, 2-3 movies later, he'll be 16, 17 or 18 and he can suit up.

For Robin to work he HAS to be introduced as a kid and he HAS to be introduced as a non-combatant at first, otherwise you have a Robin that competes with Batman (for screen time especially) isntead of a Grayson character that compliments or assists Batman. To say nothing of why would Batman recruit a grown man into his cause and reveal all his secrets to someone old enough to have ulterior motives.

Adult Robin is a bad idea, much better to have a kid Grayson never become Robin than to have an Adult Robin defying logic by his very presence. Kid Grayson can at least have some interesting varied on-screen moments from a character with an interesting perspective and an interesting take on Bruce's tragedy and how it got him where he is.

And for all this "Nolan and Bale wouldn't do it." They're either dumb or lying. Nolan says Robin's in a crib somewhere, but we all know that's silly taking into account the other ages involved in the story. Bale and Nolan seem to claim that Robin is undoable, but they insist on putting a little kid in a bright red shirt not only in the movie, but as a notable part of the climactic scenes with Rachel and Scarecrow.

This little boy in a bright red shirt even has a Batman gadget now, thanks to Bruce. But Nolan and co are 100% anti-Robin? Not even. Perhaps misinformed, perhaps scared of WB forcing them to target teens, but they've already got people running errands for Bruce, driving his Batmobile... as soon as he sends Alfred, Gordon or Fox on a stakeout, I think some of you will figure out that Batman has three sidekicks in Batman Begins anyway. Why not add the REAL one?

 

[Katsuro]

If Robin is in the future movies, which means Bale won't be in them with him cause he hates Robin,

That's right, Bale wont play Batman in a movie with Robin, but he had no problem auditioning for the role of Robin himself about 10 years ago.