All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - - - - Part 90

[Herolee10]

I still haven't forgiven you.

Yeah, when I look back at things now, I can't believe I reacted the way that I did.lol And somehow, i don't think it'll be the end of that.....there are just so many things riding on MOS right now in terms of its long term future as a solo franchise, let alone its connection with a shared universe.lol

Right now, the two characters that I fear the most when it comes to how they'll be associated with Superman are Batman and Wonder Woman, for different reasons.

 

[dark_b]

Pocahontas in Space is what Avatar was.

but thats the story.

everything with the scifi technology and avatar body was original. but i meant the look. Avatar looks original. the alien design,pandora,flying dragons and the black tiger alien. thats a 100% James Cameron design. the black alien that neytiri rides. thats all origina.

i understand that some are angry that Avatar bade over 2 billion. but the movie looked original

and i think Krypton looked original. i liked it. the colors,the design and and the geo liquid technology.

 

[Visualiza]

You are ignoring my question. Why?

And yes, there is such thing as passive aggressive trolling. You can say you are being civil, that doesn't mean you are. You don't have to necessarily be breaking the rules to do it. See Caroline Bingley for an example of this.

I'm fairly certain I answered your question in my second paragraph. Otherwise, as I said, if you'd like to continue to discuss everything else, we can do so without derailing this thread...via PM. Cheers.

 

[STARMAN]

I think there are three types of criticisms. The first type is filmmaking. We argue about editing and dialogue and plot points, etc.
The second type is tone and characterization. I think someone who has a problem with the tone and characterization in MOS then has a greater problem with the filmmaking flaws. The editing and plot holes wouldn't be as bothersome if the critic felt better about the tone and depiction of Superman.
Then I believe there is a third type of criticism. We all have our own idea of what a great Superman film should be. This is built from our love of the character as well as following this film for 3 years.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

but thats the story.

everything with the scifi technology and avatar body was original. but i meant the look. Avatar looks original. the alien design,pandora,flying dragons and the black tiger alien. thats a 100% James Cameron design. the black alien that neytiri rides. thats all origina.

i understand that some are angry that Avatar bade over 2 billion. but the movie looked original

and i think Krypton looked original. i liked it. the colors,the design and and the geo liquid technology.

I don't know about it looking all that original. Being a fan of sci-fi, comics and anime, it doesn't look all that original to my eyes.

 

[TheFlamingCoco]

I think there are three types of criticisms. The first type is filmmaking. We argue about editing and dialogue and plot points, etc.
The second type is tone and characterization. I think someone who has a problem with the tone and characterization in MOS then has a greater problem with the filmmaking flaws. The editing and plot holes wouldn't be as bothersome if the critic felt better about the tone and depiction of Superman.
Then I believe there is a third type of criticism. We all have our own idea of what a great Superman film should be. This is built from our love of the character as well as following this film for 3 years.

Nailed it. I feel like MOS is flawed in category one, questionable in category 2, and category 3 is an unfair category to have

TBH, some of the ideas/rumors thrown around by fans I liked better than in the movie, like Superman saving a dude caught in a tornado.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Nailed it. I feel like MOS is flawed in category one, questionable in category 2, and category 3 is an unfair category to have

TBH, some of the ideas/rumors thrown around by fans I liked better than in the movie, like Superman saving a dude caught in a tornado.

Welcome to Smallville.

 

[The Batman]

At the end of the day, it’s the same stuff that happened on the TDKR and IM3 boards. Some fans just can’t handle that not everybody loves “their” movie unconditionally.

People question why posters who don’t love the movie still come here….I question why, after seven years and finally getting the Superman movie they wanted, fans on here still need to bash and make lame jokes about Superman Returns. Not too long ago, a mod had to remind people in the Henry thread that it’s NOT a thread for Brandon Routh.

I’ve seen it too many times. Posters ask dissenters “Why do you come here?”… yet claim they don’t want the boards to become a lovefest.

If you’re frustrated about the complaints for this movie…blame Goyer and Snyder for making a film that can be interpreted as flawed. And for myself and others, this is a flawed movie, almost distractingly so. You can spin that any way you want (“Oh, you just don’t like change!” “Oh, you just hate Snyder!”), but that’s just the way it is. People act like just because they love it, it automatically deserves a Dark Knight/Spider-Man 2/Avengers type of response.

 

[TheFlamingCoco]

I even like the anticlimactic robot fight, complete with Zod building his suit from the empty shells.

But then we wouldn't have gotten the Smallville fight, which I think is the best superhero fight scene yet.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

I even like the anticlimactic robot fight, complete with Zod building his suit from the empty shells.

But then we wouldn't have gotten the Smallville fight, which I think is the best superhero fight scene yet.

Robot guards were indeed an awesome idea. Not so sure about the Zod suit, but I loved the robot guards. Mainly because it would have given Superman something to completely tear apart with complete abandon.

 

[TheFlamingCoco]

At the end of the day, it’s the same stuff that happened on the TDKR and IM3 boards. Some fans just can’t handle that not everybody loves “their” movie unconditionally.

People question why posters who don’t love the movie still come here….I question why, after seven years and finally getting the Superman movie they wanted, fans on here still need to bash and make lame jokes about Superman Returns. Not too long ago, a mod had to remind people in the Henry thread that it’s NOT a thread for Brandon Routh.

I’ve seen it too many times. Posters ask dissenters “Why do you come here?”… yet claim they don’t want the boards to become a lovefest.

If you’re frustrated about the complaints for this movie…blame Goyer and Snyder for making a film that can be interpreted as flawed. And for myself and others, this is a flawed movie, almost distractingly so. You can spin that any way you want (“Oh, you just don’t like change!” “Oh, you just hate Snyder!”), but that’s just the way it is. People act like just because they love it, it automatically deserves a Dark Knight/Spider-Man 2/Avengers type of response.

Good post, though I think it deserves a higher critical response than Spider-Man 3

 

[DarthSkywalker]

At the end of the day, it’s the same stuff that happened on the TDKR and IM3 boards. Some fans just can’t handle that not everybody loves “their” movie unconditionally.

People question why posters who don’t love the movie still come here….I question why, after seven years and finally getting the Superman movie they wanted, fans on here still need to bash and make lame jokes about Superman Returns. Not too long ago, a mod had to remind people in the Henry thread that it’s NOT a thread for Brandon Routh.

I’ve seen it too many times. Posters ask dissenters “Why do you come here?”… yet claim they don’t want the boards to become a lovefest.

If you’re frustrated about the complaints for this movie…blame Goyer and Snyder for making a film that can be interpreted as flawed. And for myself and others, this is a flawed movie, almost distractingly so. You can spin that any way you want (“Oh, you just don’t like change!” “Oh, you just hate Snyder!&#8221, but that’s just the way it is. People act like just because they love it, it automatically deserves a Dark Knight/Spider-Man 2/Avengers type of response.

That works both ways. Others can't handle that people love the film. Hence the comments about how some can't understand why people who love the film can't see the flaws.

Agree on the Superman Returns stuff. Got old years ago.

The question still stands. Why keep coming back? I am not saying there is anything wrong, but I am asking why do it. Validation? Attempts to prove your point right?

 

[Smallville13]

I think a point to make is those of us that take issue with the film isn't because of Zod or Jonathan Kent's death. These were very well executed scenes, and were intentional.

People argue over Batman killing Harvey Dent, and letting Ra's Al Ghul die, but that did not take away from the awesomeness of those films. Had MOS had been as great as those films it would be the same.

But the film falls on a technical level, as in the very structure of it. Everything happens to service the plot or allude to a theme. But the plot follows a very straight predictable line, and the film doesn't really have anything to say regarding it's themes.

 

[BlueLantern]

I think a point to make is those of us that take issue with the film isn't because of Zod or Jonathan Kent's death. These were very well executed scenes, and were intentional.

People argue over Batman killing Harvey Dent, and letting Ra's Al Ghul die, but that did not take away from the awesomeness of those films. Had MOS had been as great as those films it would be the same.

But the film falls on a technical level, as in the very structure of it. Everything happens to service the plot or allude to a theme. But the plot follows a very straight predictable line, and the film doesn't really have anything to say regarding it's themes.

Very good points.

The question still stands. Why keep coming back? I am not saying there is anything wrong, but I am asking why do it. Validation? Attempts to prove your point right?

It's not validation as much as a desire to find like minded people. There's also an element of am I the only crazy one who didn't like it?

 

[DarthSkywalker]

I think a point to make is those of us that take issue with the film isn't because of Zod or Jonathan Kent's death. These were very well executed scenes, and were intentional.

People argue over Batman killing Harvey Dent, and letting Ra's Al Ghul die, but that did not take away from the awesomeness of those films. Had MOS had been as great as those films it would be the same.

But the film falls on a technical level, as in the very structure of it. Everything happens to service the plot or allude to a theme. But the plot follows a very straight predictable line, and the film doesn't really have anything to say regarding it's themes.

It has plenty to say on its themes imo. Choice being the big word, and it touching on everything from adoption, the environment, the concepts of heroism and sacrifice.

It's not validation as much as a desire to find like minded people. There's also an element of am I the only crazy one who didn't like it?

But that is validation. And honestly, the second bit is only possibly if you are willing to listen to other points of view.

 

[BlueLantern]

But that is validation. And honestly, the second bit is only possibly if you are willing to listen to other points of view.

If looking for like minded folk is validation as opposed to searching for a social discourse, fine. I'm up for listening to views as long as they're well thought out.

 

[STARMAN]

I think if MOS was fun than half of these flaws go ignored. Once it took itself seriously then the flaws are taken seriously too.

 

[The Batman]

Good post, though I think it deserves a higher critical response than Spider-Man 3

I don't think its RT rating should be more than about a 70. At the very least, I don't think its RT rating should be higher than Superman Returns.

The question still stands. Why keep coming back? I am not saying there is anything wrong, but I am asking why do it. Validation? Attempts to prove your point right?

I don't need validation, and I don;'t need to prove to anyone that I'm right. This film's RT rating speaks for itself, and so does the fact that we're even having a conversation about the polarizing view of the movie.

At the end of the day, I am a Superman fan. That's why I'm here. And just as people have the right to bash SR and nitpick Donner's films to death, I have the right to express my view on a movie I'm not in love with.

 

[TheFlamingCoco]

Well, Superman Returns got a 75 percent fresh at Rottentomatoes, so I would be happy to see a similar reception for this film.

BUT, I also feel like some of the boldness made it more polarizing. I can see the sequel being more minimalistic and getting better ratings.

 

[STARMAN]

If they would have played it safe it would be higher on RT. Would it be a better film? I don't know.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

I don't think its RT rating should be more than about a 70. At the very least, I don't think its RT rating should be higher than Superman Returns.



I don't need validation, and I don;'t need to prove to anyone that I'm right. This film's RT rating speaks for itself, and so does the fact that we're even having a conversation about the polarizing view of the movie.

At the end of the day, I am a Superman fan. That's why I'm here. And just as people have the right to bash SR and nitpick Donner's films to death, I have the right to express my view on a movie I'm not in love with.

You just brought up Rotten Tomato. Really? That has about as much to do with the quality of a film as CinemaScope or any random review here or the classic IMDB rating.

This post speaks of bitterness. You are annoyed with how others feel about Donner's film and SR. This isn't about Man of Steel. You just made that perfectly clear.

You literally just brought up what percentage a film should have on Rotten Tomato.

 

[Herolee10]

Ultimately, playing it safe didn't work out for SR, and I'd also argue that it was mainly due to nostalgia that the film did so well in the critics reviews' portion.

And yeah, I have no problem with the idea that not everyone is going to love this film since every films has its fans and detractors. My only problem is when those said detractors keep coming here just to post on how bad they feel the film is and how we shouldn't like the film for it.

 

[TheFlamingCoco]

^ It's "Batman's" opinion. No need to get personal :/

 

[DarthSkywalker]

^ It's "Batman's" opinion. No need to get personal :/

Opinion is opinion. But read the post. Why even bring up SR and STM? It is clear.

 

[TheFlamingCoco]

Because it's the All Things Superman forum?