Comics Amazing Spider-Man #561

[Blader5489]

This issue was awesome because not only did it prove that MJ isn't Jackpot, but it explained why Jackpot uses some of MJ's catchphrases.

I've been saying MJ isn't Jackpot since the beginning...finally, validation. t:

MJ dating someone else. My wallet thanks me further for not wasting its contents!

I doubt it, you waste your money on so much crap already.

 

[Styleshift]

This issue was awesome because not only did it prove that MJ isn't Jackpot, but it explained why Jackpot uses some of MJ's catchphrases.

I've been saying MJ isn't Jackpot since the beginning...finally, validation. t:



I doubt it, you waste your money on so much crap already.

Not quite just yet...Jackpot was born AFTER omd. and we havent seen her anywhere else besides spidey. (i think?)
I still sense a connection here.
remember how she originally said she didnt know Mj?

besides she'd end up being another venom if she wasnt someone we've seen before...

another thing is i remember a interview with slott or wacker and they mention the mystery behind jackpot deepens....(in short we didnt get a reveal here.)

 

[Spider-Gnome]

Sara Ehret seems like a waste of a character to me now. Am I thrilled that MJ isn't some type of super hero now? Yes I am. But come on now, she's a huge fan of MJ which is why she copies all the lines and so on. If they're looking for some female partner for Spider-man, just use Black Cat.

Like I mentioned before...MJ dating someone else...It's hard to read. She obviously knows that her and Spider-man were together in "another" life. So why the hell is she with some other guy? Ah well...I'm going to have to accept this cause unfortunately this is the angle that Marvel is going to run with for a while. If I want my 616 Spider-man fix, I have no choice but to try and deal with this.

Also...Peter has been acting like a d**k throughout this storyline. Very out of character the way he was being so petty with this paparazzi shots.

Let me say, I am one of those that is 110% against OMD. I gave BND a chance, thinking they will eventually retcon it (hopefully).

While initially interesting, I always felt like an empty pit in my stomach while reading it. Lately, I feel the series has not been good. None of the new villains are really interesting (Menace isn't even a good Hobgoblin, and I hate Freak), and regressing Pete is awful. He didn't even act like that in the 70's!

But, now, I agree that it looks like MJ remembers "everything." So seeing her climb into bed with that guy just made my heart sink. It is just uncomfortable reading this stuff.

I really can't agree that they are writing Spidey well again. You want to see Spider-Man handled properly? Watch The Spectacular Spider-Man on Saturday mornings. Thank goodness for that show! Please retcon this stuff and sweep this Brand New Day under the carpet.

Sorry, if this was a rant. I know we are suppose to stick to stuff in this issue. This is basically a response to MJ in this issue being in this relationship while seeming to remember "everything."

 

[Blader5489]

Not quite...Jackpot was born AFTER omd. and we havent seen her anywhere else besides spidey. (i think?)
I still sense a connection here.
remember how she originally said she didnt know Mj?

besides she'd end up being another venom if she wasnt someone we've seen before...

another thing is i remember a interview with slott or wacker and they mention the mystery behind jackpot deepens....(in short we didnt get a reveal here.)

Did you even read the issue? Four months ago, Jackpot says her name is Sara Ehret. Yesterday, we see MJ and Sara talking to each other--two separate, completely different people.

MJ. Is. Not. Jackpot.

 

[Styleshift]

To be honest I read the issue again...and I'm really trying to be optimistic because it is dan slott after all but...there taking the character even FURTHER from what he is.

and regressing Pete is awful. He didn't even act like that in the 70's!

hell he didn't even act that way when he was 16.
I can understand it being alot of money and all...but him continuing paparazzi was putting people in danger. and if I recall the same females whose picture he took remain dead at the hands of Paper doll.


[/quote]
But, now, I agree that it looks like MJ remembers "everything." So seeing her climb into bed with that guy just made my heart sink. It is just uncomfortable reading this stuff.
[/quote]

yup thats slap number 2 after calling him tiger.

[/quote]
I really can't agree that they are writing Spidey well again. You want to see Spider-Man handled properly? Watch The Spectacular Spider-Man on Saturday mornings. Thank goodness for that show! Please retcon this stuff and sweep this Brand New Day under the carpet.[/quote]

There actually dropping in sales month after month. we'll see either way it's sink or swim time.

 

[Styleshift]

Did you even read the issue? Four months ago, Jackpot says her name is Sara Ehret. Yesterday, we see MJ and Sara talking to each other--two separate, completely different people.

MJ. Is. Not. Jackpot.

I read the issue. but trust me when I say I'm good at reading into deeper meanings and not just looking at the pretty pictures sparky.

There's more going on than whats on the surface and that is VERY clear.
Look at the issue with Spidey and Jackpot. Have you at least wondered why she would tell him exactly who she was and NOT recognize Spidey when he showed up at her house?
Besides I never claimed whether she is or isn't Jackpot. I just said things aren't what they seem right now. So when your trying to correct someone about reading....how about you read what they said first before doing so?

 

[Blader5489]

I just said things aren't what they seem right now. So when your trying to correct someone about reading....how about you read what they said first before doing so?

Maybe you should take your own advice. You never said things aren't what they seem, you said "I sense a connection there."

You can back-peddle all you want, but the fact is, MJ isn't Jackpot.

 

[Styleshift]

Maybe you should take your own advice. You never said things aren't what they seem, you said "I sense a connection there."

You can back-peddle all you want, but the fact is, MJ isn't Jackpot.

Listen pal, when exactly did I say "holy crap MJ IS JACKPOT!"?
I simply said I still sense a connection between the two, that there is a bigger picture. I didn't boldly state a reason. I didn't even state exactly what I think because its still too early to call.

You really upset me with your freakin posts. you always do this crap. I was discussing with you that there are plenty of things to suggest that there is still something else going on. this issue doesn't prove anything solid.
I didn't start mocking you saying "DID YOU READ THE ISSUE?" when you said Mj wasn't Jackpot because marvel hasn't OFFICIALLY released her identity yet DUH! They would have hyped the issue if they did that. or maybe you forgot about sins past and all the other big reveals of the past 12 years. (in fact the mystery only deepens because she looks EXACTLY like Mj with short hair! maybe your not into art but pay attention to how the panel is drawn.)


if thats your choice than who am I to mock you for it? Heck you could of said Bennett was Jackpot and I would have been cool with it.
It's your choice. In my choice *unlike yours* the jury is still out. but there is definitely something more between the two.

 

[kguillou]

Well, there is DEFINITELY more than meets the eye with the whole Sara/Mj/Jackpot thing. Why would Jackpot outright tell Spiderman her identity back in #550? There's no way she would have. Sara can't be Jackpot BUT there is a connection between the two, definitely. I just dont know how MJ figures into all this. Trust me guys, this is exactly what Slott wants us to be thinking right now.

 

[ragingdemon155]

Well, there is DEFINITELY more than meets the eye with the whole Sara/Mj/Jackpot thing. Why would Jackpot outright tell Spiderman her identity back in #550? There's no way she would have. Sara can't be Jackpot BUT there is a connection between the two, definitely. I just dont know how MJ figures into all this. Trust me guys, this is exactly what Slott wants us to be thinking right now.

I think your giving Marvel a bit too much credit with thinking things in advance. At times, it seems as if there just coming up with this on the fly.

 

[ragingdemon155]

Let me say, I am one of those that is 110% against OMD. I gave BND a chance, thinking they will eventually retcon it (hopefully).

While initially interesting, I always felt like an empty pit in my stomach while reading it. Lately, I feel the series has not been good. None of the new villains are really interesting (Menace isn't even a good Hobgoblin, and I hate Freak), and regressing Pete is awful. He didn't even act like that in the 70's!

But, now, I agree that it looks like MJ remembers "everything." So seeing her climb into bed with that guy just made my heart sink. It is just uncomfortable reading this stuff.

I really can't agree that they are writing Spidey well again. You want to see Spider-Man handled properly? Watch The Spectacular Spider-Man on Saturday mornings. Thank goodness for that show! Please retcon this stuff and sweep this Brand New Day under the carpet.

Sorry, if this was a rant. I know we are suppose to stick to stuff in this issue. This is basically a response to MJ in this issue being in this relationship while seeming to remember "everything."

I agree %100.

Like I mentioned, seeing MJ in bed with this guy is disturbing to me. It doesn't make any sense. It goes against her character. If MJ does remember everything which is what it seems like, she wouldn't just lay down and give up on the relationship. MJ is too strong for that. She would find a way to make it all right or at least try.

Whatever....like I mentioned, MJ being misrepresented isn't my main problem. It's Spidey being a d**k. He was very unlikable at times during this storyline. I get that some people are going head over heals for this, but how can anyone support how the character is being written. Dan Slott is a hell of a writer and the concept behind the villain was also pretty cool in my eyes....but, Spider-man/Peter Parker really needs some work.

Being a part of this whole paparazzi deal? Yea....that's really Peter....

 

[The Infernal]

I just read the issue and I still see that Jackpot's identity is unconfirmed. Hinted at, but not confirmed. Though there were potentially two different people hinted at. Not together, but separately.

First was MJ's being vague on why she was really there. Second was Sara at the end, which I won't go on about as it's said already. Could be either way to me. That or the identity isn't decided yet and the writers are gauging peoples reaction to the character.

Then there is the possibility that they both are. Maybe the initiative double up some people, especially if someone's secret identity is a celebrity.

I dunno though. Guess I'll just wait and see.

I did like MJ's boyfriend in this one though. It showed a more well rounded character.

 

[carnageehw]

Screw the piss out of this issue. Seriously. I hope in my short time here I"ve given off the impression of being fairly rational. But this issue pissed me off to no end.

Now, the story of Paper Doll, the Bugle stuff etc are all decent. Whatever. I've seen better, and I've seen worse stories. Can't complain.

But this Mary jane shiite has GOT to stop. If you want to retcon the marriage and make Pete not married DO IT. Don't give us this stupid BS teasing that OMD will be all set back to how it was. When you move forward, you MOVE FORWARD. All this is doing is serving to keep the readers mindfull of the past life of Pete, which is completley contradictory to everything this whole BND stuff is supposed to accomplish.

Second it makes Peter look stupid, and pisses off the reader. Do you know what I really, REALLY hate. Movies or shows where the veiwers KNOW the main character is innocent, and the entire movie is about proving to "cops" or something, that the main guy is innocent...something the veiwer already knows. It is tedious and annoying.
And that is what BND now it. The READERS know that MJ and Pete are always meant to be together. We know this because Meph even said so. We won't forget this. To top it off, now MJ knows everything that happened before. TOO MANY PEOPLE KNOW THAT THE WAY THE COMICS WERE BEFORE BND IS THE WAY IT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE.

So while I can see the argument that the individual stories are good, the entire message of the comics shows a complete lack of direction vision, and shows a great deal of contempt for the reader. It's pissing me off.

PLEASE MARVEL: MAKE UP YOUR MINDS. Make it a Brandy New Day if that's what you want. Don't go ass backwards and insult my intelligence.

 

[Styleshift]

I think your giving Marvel a bit too much credit with thinking things in advance. At times, it seems as if there just coming up with this on the fly.

we're not giving Marvel too much credit. we're giing slott the credit.
C'mon buddy you don't think we'd ever do that these days in a Spidey book? they've yet to redeem themselves in 12 years! haha.

as for my earlier statement...Let me further clarify...it was late and I really didn't feel like writing all of my points because it was long. (also why i got upset easy.)

anways, sure it still could go either way at this point. but here's the thing. I loved that era of Spider-man. Slott was a continuity freak. thus he should know that Mj was written into an airhead on that show. and when she asked for her character to have more personality...a deranged fan tried to kill her and she quit in fear of her life.
thats point number 1.

now
If you've ever read the killing joke. (yes I know who wrote it.)
Or any of Grant morrison's runs. you'll learn to look out for how the Panels are drawn. every good writer directs the artist in how to draw the panel.
look at how mj and sara are drawn directly accross each other. he was directed to give them the same facial designs for a reason.
I mean they look EXACTLY like each other.
thats point 2.

Than you have the weird fact that jackpot didn't set off Spidey's Spider sense when she told him her name and she didn't reacted to Spidey as some weirdo until he told her that jackpot said her name was Sara she shut the door on him and told him to stay out of it...

thats point 3

Jackpot appeared AFTER BND. which means she was created during the time continuity was screwed up.

thats point 4

They didn't have a big corny spoiler on this book. THE IDENTITY OF JACKPOT REVEALED. nope just amazing similarities. now maybe some people can accept slott being simple. but i don' believe for one second he's going to have Jackpot be revealed as a fan of Mj that decided to fight crime.
point number 5

plus
Mj mentioned that shes BEEN coming to the city off and on without talking to her friends. who knows why? its not just because of Carr.

and that was point 6.

Now I'm still holding out my opinion for more info. (I don't want to look stupid)
but if you ask me really think it has something to do with Mephisto. I do know one thing. the mystery has deepened. this issue only convoluted more stuff! you there are EVEN more ways to argue which character is Jack pot.

 

[Styleshift]

Screw the piss out of this issue. Seriously. I hope in my short time here I"ve given off the impression of being fairly rational. But this issue pissed me off to no end.

Now, the story of Paper Doll, the Bugle stuff etc are all decent. Whatever. I've seen better, and I've seen worse stories. Can't complain.

But this Mary jane shiite has GOT to stop. If you want to retcon the marriage and make Pete not married DO IT. Don't give us this stupid BS teasing that OMD will be all set back to how it was. When you move forward, you MOVE FORWARD. All this is doing is serving to keep the readers mindfull of the past life of Pete, which is completley contradictory to everything this whole BND stuff is supposed to accomplish.

Second it makes Peter look stupid, and pisses off the reader. Do you know what I really, REALLY hate. Movies or shows where the veiwers KNOW the main character is innocent, and the entire movie is about proving to "cops" or something, that the main guy is innocent...something the veiwer already knows. It is tedious and annoying.
And that is what BND now it. The READERS know that MJ and Pete are always meant to be together. We know this because Meph even said so. We won't forget this. To top it off, now MJ knows everything that happened before. TOO MANY PEOPLE KNOW THAT THE WAY THE COMICS WERE BEFORE BND IS THE WAY IT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE.

So while I can see the argument that the individual stories are good, the entire message of the comics shows a complete lack of direction vision, and shows a great deal of contempt for the reader. It's pissing me off.

PLEASE MARVEL: MAKE UP YOUR MINDS. Make it a Brandy New Day if that's what you want. Don't go ass backwards and insult my intelligence.

Well said. the stories are better told than they have been in years. (thats not saying much considering arcs like the other or the howard mackie run.)

but its like they are TRYING to lose fans these days. I can accept change in comics. but the thing is they had a whole bunch of things to upset fans in the book that DID like the marriage. they know there are fans of it. which is why this is there 4th attempt to get rid of it in the books. and even though they finally did it. it still was a loss for them over all.
but i mean look at all these things that i found in the books...
1. the faust book Mj was holding in her first BND appearance.
2. The Jackpot Mystery.
3. Mj remembering (this hints they will return to what they were)
4. the box that says Mj's stuff when peter moved into his new apartment.
5. Mj in bed with carr.
6. first page of BND had peter making out with a new girl. (for no real reason and yes i know what happened. don't correct me. please. )

Dan slott is an awwwsoooome writer. t: I tried to keep optimistic about this story but i like to read my comics more than once to feel the deeper meanings...and
now I feel he's dropped the ball with the paparazzi arc. i know we all make mistakes but that cost people lives and peter CONTINUED to do it. If peter was so concerned about the money he would take his time and INVENT something to get rich over. since it was pretty easy for him to make a new camera sensor or invent webbing among other great things. plus we had another great responsibility message....yea peter learned that when he was 16. this issue while well written was more of a teaser than anything...in the end things really didn't move along save for peter moving in to his apartment and Bennett becoming an enemy of Peter. which i must admit its kinda funny because didnt this all happen to robbie and peter before when norman owned the paper? niiiiiice

 

[carnageehw]

3. Mj remembering (this hints they will return to what they were)

This is my biggest peeve. I mean, there is no logical reason why they are doing this.

The whole point of BND is to get Pete to not be married to Mj.
Two things are happening. Either MJ remembers everything, or MJ remembers a little. If MJ remembers Everything it makes no sense. She KNOWS her and Peter and meant to be together, yet she does nothing to rectify this. Worse yet, she ignores what she knows and sleeps with other dudes. What is the point in having her remember if she is going t o do nothing and sleep with other dudes? The only point there can be is that she has a plan to get them back together. Except that too is pointless because we know the whole point of BND is to keep them apart.

It's circular writing.

What if she remembers a little bit? Well, that's only slightly better, because she's not as stupid for ignoring her feelings and sleeping with other dudes, but we're still at the whole "What's the point of her bringing up that she remembers that past a lot?" Why do this? Good storytelling would indicate that you do this becasue you are foreshadowing a plan, or thatsomething will happen. Except we know this can't be the case. It is now a case of horrible writing because it ONLY serves to remind us of a storly line that is almost universally hated! (OMD).

Seriously. Screw them.

 

[Styleshift]

This is my biggest peeve. I mean, there is no logical reason why they are doing this.

The whole point of BND is to get Pete to not be married to Mj.
Two things are happening. Either MJ remembers everything, or MJ remembers a little. If MJ remembers Everything it makes no sense. She KNOWS her and Peter and meant to be together, yet she does nothing to rectify this. Worse yet, she ignores what she knows and sleeps with other dudes. What is the point in having her remember if she is going t o do nothing and sleep with other dudes? The only point there can be is that she has a plan to get them back together. Except that too is pointless because we know the whole point of BND is to keep them apart.

It's circular writing.

What if she remembers a little bit? Well, that's only slightly better, because she's not as stupid for ignoring her feelings and sleeping with other dudes, but we're still at the whole "What's the point of her bringing up that she remembers that past a lot?" Why do this? Good storytelling would indicate that you do this becasue you are foreshadowing a plan, or thatsomething will happen. Except we know this can't be the case. It is now a case of horrible writing because it ONLY serves to remind us of a storly line that is almost universally hated! (OMD).

Seriously. Screw them.

I'm not knocking people that like the new direction...I respect there view.
but BND is simply bad story telling.
It's repetitive and lacking...It's really hard to care for the characters in these books...there personalities was off...

I know Mj was a party girl. not the type to settle down...but she never came off as one to sleep around. further more I wish they would stop giving readers hope that they'll soon end up married again...its not right. if mj and peter were married and they truly couldnt find any way to make the wife of spider-man useable in a story. they could have given her powers. im sure that would have met better reaction than omd.

I can't spend any more money on this...they took 20 years and said ok it didnt happen this way...but its ok for them to retcon the powers and harry's death and say "it still happened"

I like logic in my stories. its why i never complain about the hulk or xmen. or spidey's earliest in carnation. when gwen died there was fan out rage but it was well written and you felt SAD for spidey. post omd you wonder if the writers and creative staff have lost there minds.

 

[carnageehw]

I'm not knocking people that like the new direction...I respect there view.
but BND is simply bad story telling.

This is my view too. I'm a Spidey marriage fan, but hell, I'm sure I could slowly get used to the new direction....if they would only stop reminding me about the old one!

 

[Styleshift]

Yeah...I felt if I could stay on the book during the other, the magic totem spider origin, the clone saga, sins past, nearly all of howard mackie's run, Mj's exploding plane death by her unrevealed stalker, the confusing reveal of the stalker. (it felt like the story was changed at the last moment.)
I could stay on after the ending of the marriage. like many others i saw it coming.
than mephisto came about and that was the icing on the cake. I gave up and than came back on thinking it was over....wel at least I thought it was over.
they seemed to return to normal story telling....but i mean Spidey these days is more of a n event than an on going story. anything that changes gets changed back because it was a stupid change in the first place. and theres no longer a sense of progression.

look at how far the x-men have come, or johnny storm from the fantastic four? these characters while retaining there core are still older they've all changed to some degree and thats why we care about them. but peter is acting even younger and more immature than when he WAS a teen.

 

[Dark Spidey]

Okay... i'm gonna make a prediction...

Sara Ehret suffers from multiple personality disorder.

That's why when Spidey went to see her at her house, she didn't know him. Now of course, she might have just been trying to throw him off the scent. But she also tells him to leave "us" alone. Leading me to believe that when she becomes Jackpot she takes on a whole new phycological identity too.

Which is why the carefree Jackpot identity (clearly modeled on MJ -whose similar facial features might actually be the route of Sara's identity crisis in the first place) freely told Spidey her name was Sara Ehret.

 

[spidey 802]

whoa! whoa! whoa! whoa!....MJ is dating some one else in ASM 561???i think i got to take a look at that....

 

[kguillou]

Why is it that despite the fact that marvel has put all this effort into making this new direction for Spidey, that they keep reminding us of the old one?? BND, very blatantly is still revolving around the effects of OMD, an event which Marvel is trying to make us forget yet at the same time is still pouring down our throats! This whole MJ storyline is obviously going to be a big part of this "new" direction, and its obvious that eventually MJ is going to tell Peter that they were once an item until Mephisto came and took their wedding rings away. If this is supposed to be a "brand new" direction then make it a new, fresh direction, and stop reminding us all of OMD!! We're all trying to forget, in fact i almost did until i saw the Mj scene where she says "in another lifetime...". That really broke my heart. Marvel make up your mind!

....Besides that i loved the issue though, go Slott!

 

[Doc Destruction]

whoa! whoa! whoa! whoa!....MJ is dating some one else in ASM 561???i think i got to take a look at that....

I'd rather cheese grate my nuts, personally.

 

[Venom 1988]

I'd rather cheese grate my nuts, personally.

Go on then do it....

 

[USMC]

Did u wanna watch or something, Venom? Sicko.