Avengers the Initiative

[LouFerignoDemon]

If "you" felt awkward, it was forced. It kinda goes along with what I've been seeing lately in western media. I think Marvel was afraid of upsetting Muslims. Look at that cartoon backlash last year. European schools are taking the Holocaust and the Crusades out of history books. Why? So they won't upset Muslim children!

Heck....in Jersey, a school had a mock terrorist drill. School officials said they wanted it to be as "realistic" a scenario as possible. So with that in mind, did they choose Islamic extremists like the ones that took the school in Russia?? The ones that tortured and even shot little children in cold blood? Nope. Their "realistic" terrorists were Christians fundementalists. Yep....I see them doing stuff like this all the time on TV.

With that in mind I just shook my head and laughed, at page 2.

Actually, France isn't removing that from their books.

 

[blud_knight]

I'm from France, the country where families argue as a hobby, and we look down on tourists. And eat snails, which sounds pretty good right now. Especially with some butter. Mmmmm....

ah, lucky you. I wish I was some place other than the overweight, self absorbed, gun nut capital of the world. As for snails, I liked the garlic flavor, but the texture took a little getting used to. Good wine over there though
Its nice to have a different perspective on things around here too.
back to what i was wondering before country of origin side tracked me. Is Stark running the avengers too, or is he just focused on SHIELD?

 

[Anubis]

Ms. Marvel is Chairman, but Starks' still pretty much in charge.

 

[Colossal Spoons]

...who hates Maria Hill now for no reason

 

[blud_knight]

^ thanks, I had a feeling he might be. The stress of running all this might be a factor in how long this 50 state idea lasts

 

[The Question]

Dude...now you're back peddling. You thought that was out of place just like I did. Why not use Al Quaida?? They are the bad guys right? They are on the news every day. I'll tell you why... They didn't want to upset the Muslim community. But it's okay to offend the Christians??

I'm not back peddling. Just because I don't think it was well done doesn't mean I don't think they had a good reason.

11 years ago??? Have they or anybody like them been in the news repeatedly lately?? No.

Yes, actually. On September 11, 2006, a man named David McMenemy atepmted a failed suicide bombing on clinic that he (falsely) believed to be preforming abortions.

And what is our biggest threat right now on the terrorism front?? You know the answer. It sure ain't Christians terrorists. If they wanted a "realistic" scenario, why not give the one that we are facing right now??

Because to say that Muslim terrorists are the only threat we're facing right now is just untrue. They're the biggest and most public right now, but groups like God's Army are still very real and very dangerous. To have a scenario that doesn't have Muslin terrorists isn't unrealistic at all, as Christian Extremists have commited acts of murder, kidnapping, and arson here in the U.S. before and are quite likely to do so again.

 

[hippie_hunter]

I'm from France, the country where families argue as a hobby, and we look down on tourists. And eat snails, which sounds pretty good right now. Especially with some butter. Mmmmm....

You're damn right your country does.

 

[blud_knight]

You're damn right your country does.

as would you if people came to your country with a star spangled flagpole up their asses

 

[Memphis Slim]

Actually, France isn't removing that from their books.

I didn't say the French were. I said European schools. If they want to keep some spine for a change, fine. But "some" countries are gonna do it and it's insane.

 

[Memphis Slim]

Hell, in Oklahoma, we had a school system remove "To Kill a Mocking Bird" from the shelves because people were offended that it containted the n-word. Despited the fact that in the context of the story it was used by a bigot and the father was explaining to his children why it was a bad word.

That's crazy too. But at least "To Kill a Mocking Bird" is not a majaor historical event. The same thing was done hear where I live to a play called "Ragtime". People protested the N-Word. It's a "period" piece about racial issues in the early 1900's.

 

[blud_knight]

lets not leave out the "catcher in the rye" that caused quite a problem

 

[Memphis Slim]

I'm not back peddling. Just because I don't think it was well done doesn't mean I don't think they had a good reason.

It was IRAQ..... What is happening with I.E.D.s?? Who are the ones setting them for our troops??


Yes, actually. On September 11, 2006, a man named David McMenemy atepmted a failed suicide bombing on clinic that he (falsely) believed to be preforming abortions.

I saw that article. And you gotta go back to September to find that one? Turn on the CBS news right now. Pull news from last night, last week.... and there was no mention of him being in that group.

Look at this:
Resort Bomb Plot Suspect Pleads Innocent

Friday, April 13, 2007
By JOHN McCARTHY, Associated Press Writer

COLUMBUS, Ohio — An Ohio man pleaded not guilty Friday to federal charges that he joined al-Qaida and conspired to bomb European tourist resorts and U.S. military bases overseas.
Christopher Paul, 43, a U.S. citizen living in Columbus, did not ask to be released on bond.
Paul had learned hand-to-hand combat and how to use grenades and assault rifles at an al-Qaida camp in Afghanistan in the early 1990s, according to a federal grand jury indictment announced Thursday. He then joined the terrorist group in Pakistan and told al-Qaida members he was dedicated to committing violent jihad, prosecutors allege.
When U.S. District Judge Gregory Frost asked for his plea, Paul said "not guilty."
"And that is to all three counts, correct?" Frost said.
"Yes, sir," Paul replied.
Prosecutors and his defense attorney declined to comment after the hearing.
Paul, arrested Wednesday at his apartment, is charged with providing material support to terrorists, conspiracy to provide support to terrorists and conspiracy to use a weapon of mass destruction, which carries the most serious penalty of up to life in prison.
Court records also show links between Paul and two other Columbus men previously charged with terrorism.
One of the men, Nuradin Abdi, was accused of plotting to blow up a Columbus-area shopping mall and is awaiting trial on charges including conspiring to aid terrorists. A laser range finder and a night vision scope seized from Paul's residence are listed among items that the government intends to use as evidence in Abdi's case. Abdi also listed Paul as a reference on a government employment application, records show.
Paul was friends with the other man, Iyman Faris, who was sentenced in 2003 to 20 years in prison for a plot to topple the Brooklyn Bridge. The two attended the same mosque, Faris' attorney, David B. Smith, told The Columbus Dispatch.
The investigation into Paul spanned four years, three continents and at least eight countries, FBI agent Tim Murphy said.
The indictment says Paul traveled to Germany in 1999 to train co-conspirators to use explosives to attack European and U.S. targets and plotted to bomb government buildings in Europe and vacation spots frequented by American tourists.
A fax machine in his home contained names, phone numbers and contact information for key al-Qaida leadership and associates, according to the indictment.
Paul also sent $1,760 by wire transfer to an alleged co-conspirator in Germany, prosecutors allege.
Paul was born Paul Kenyatta Laws. He legally changed his name to Abdulmalek Kenyatta in 1989, then to Christopher Paul in 1994, according to the indictment.
His sister, Sandra Laws, said defense lawyers advised the family against talking publicly about the case. Paul's wife, daughter, father and brother also attended the arraignment.

</H1>
This kind of stuff is happening everyday. Now when so-called Christian groups step up the frequency like these nut jobs, you can can talk.

Because to say that Muslim terrorists are the only threat we're facing right now is just untrue. They're the biggest and most public right now, but groups like God's Army are still very real and very dangerous. To have a scenario that doesn't have Muslin terrorists isn't unrealistic at all, as Christian Extremists have commited acts of murder, kidnapping, and arson here in the U.S. before and are quite likely to do so again.[/quote

]


I didn't say they were the "only" threat. American citizens are threatened all the time from different sources. Al Gore says it's global warming LOL...t: But seriously,,, the most prominent and the most eminent threat ...the numero uno threat is Islamic terrorism. Period. To say differently is just being intellectually dishonest.

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

ah, lucky you. I wish I was some place other than the overweight, self absorbed, gun nut capital of the world. As for snails, I liked the garlic flavor, but the texture took a little getting used to. Good wine over there though
Its nice to have a different perspective on things around here too.
back to what i was wondering before country of origin side tracked me. Is Stark running the avengers too, or is he just focused on SHIELD?

I don't actually operate from perspective. I've said it before, I'll say it again: My perspective means nothing to anybody, and even less in the long run. As for America, I rather liked it, a lot more friendly than what most people believe outside of it. Despite the fact that my whole reason for leaving was pretty much post 9/11 when I was defending my own countries reasoning for not wanting to be involved in America's war, and had a brick thrown at me. I don't normally fight pride and bias, as it's usually without fruits of progress, and at that point, there was tons of it.

Stark is basically what Stark was to the Avengers before, just kind of it's defacto head decision making leader off the field, though with a little less authority now. (Avengers Forever rocked. "Now let me show you who really makes the calls around here.") Before, he basically ran the day to day stuff, expenses, and training stuff alongside Captain America (who basically was just field leader, and cared not for other Avengers things outside of training it seemed). And now he basically does the same thing.

...who hates Maria Hill now for no reason

He doesn't hate her. He just treats her in the way people wanted her to be treated, and now people like her because Stark treats her that way.

You're damn right your country does.

Yeah, we have little patience. We're kind of like Americans without the willingness to go up in arms right away.

I didn't say the French were. I said European schools. If they want to keep some spine for a change, fine. But "some" countries are gonna do it and it's insane.

France is like...almost the dead center of Europe, and not many nations are changing their books to my knowledge. Just like...three or something, and it's not really removing it, but removing it as a major focus, and making it more of just a mention like all other phases of history. Kind of like how the Dark Ages, or the 1900's are explained.

I think Germany is the only one who would ever flat out remove it from it's texts.

 

[blud_knight]

please...
terrorism is just a red harring. the biggest threat is internal corruption. This country is going to fall apart from the inside

 

[GL1]

Please tell me we are not taking the censored, biased news (TV and print) at face value... just tell me we're not doing that... And honestly, with the mistreatment that American Muslims have been recieving, if an author decides to spare them some additional bad press in a COMIC BOOK, then that's all well and good. It would be said if they were not ALLOWED to use Muslim Terrorists, though, cuz that's censorship, which is, unfortunately, on the rise.

That said, I really REALLY like this book. Does anyone have any speculation on what it is about MVP that "changes everything." Cuz lets face it, NOTHING changes EVERYTHING.

 

[blud_knight]

I don't actually operate from perspective. I've said it before, I'll say it again: My perspective means nothing to anybody, and even less in the long run. As for America, I rather liked it, a lot more friendly than what most people believe outside of it. Despite the fact that my whole reason for leaving was pretty much post 9/11 when I was defending my own countries reasoning for not wanting to be involved in America's war, and had a brick thrown at me. I don't normally fight pride and bias, as it's usually without fruits of progress, and at that point, there was tons of it.

Well. I'm sorry you had a brick thrown at you. I'm ashamed as a member of this country that someone here was so ignorant.
Thanks for the input on Stark.
On a final side note. I wanted to say that I'm sorry i was a jerk a few weeks ago, it was imature.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

That said, I really REALLY like this book. Does anyone have any speculation on what it is about MVP that "changes everything." Cuz lets face it, NOTHING changes EVERYTHING.

I'm guessing it's the cover-up that's going to change everything by making the American public lose some faith in the Initiative and the almighty SHRA once the details of MVP's death come out.

 

[BrianWilly]

I'm guessing it has something to do with the super-soldier formula. He's the grandson of the original guy who invented it, and also just spontaneously a superhuman? Not likely a coincidence.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

He wasn't supposed to be a superhuman, though. I thought he just excelled at everything so much that they assumed he must have gotten some form of the Super Soldier Formula, and they were testing him in the boot camp to see for sure. Maybe I misconstrued something, though.

 

[BrianWilly]

Hnn, I interpret "excelling at everything so much" as pretty much a superpower, since it was pretty much Captain America's superpower. People liked to make "peak human" still sound like Cap was a normal human, but in all practicality he really wasn't. I doubt they'd recruit any normal humans into the camp, even if said normal human was at Olympic-level feats. If that were the case, they'd just recruit every Olympic-athlete in the country.

Something about the autopsy revealed something about the supersolder serum. I mean, what else could they possibly find from the headless corpse of this guy?

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I didn't say they'd recruit a normal human, just that they'd recruit someone they strongly suspected of possessing superhuman powers, at least until they could test him at the Stamford facility and be sure. I thought that was what happened with MVP, but like I said, I may have read something wrong or missed something. If the autopsy said he had SSS in his blood, then that would be what I missed.

 

[BrianWilly]

I just didn't get any indication that he wasn't superhuman. And the fact of his grandfather is just too much of a flashing neon sign saying "LOOK HERE!" to ignore. Simplest answer is usually the best one, especially in a series like this which, in all honesty, looks to be pretty straightforward and, while shocking, remains fairly cliched.

 

[Dread]

"Super-soldiers" are exactly that, even if on paper it says they are "peak human". I mean, can any normal man do what Cap did?

I figure for some reason that hasn't been explained yet, MVP was a teen super-soldier. Sort of like Patriot only he didn't need MGH or a blood transfusion. His grandfather made the stuff and his body has a "secret", so I am rather sure it may be some sort of super soldier serum thingie. And if that is true, it could be something that makes the program seem wary. Why bother risking training metahumans when you can just mass produce your own? The fed has been trying to imitate and mass produce Captain America's for generations, and if Gyrich can, he will.

 

[The Question]

This kind of stuff is happening everyday. Now when so-called Christian groups step up the frequency like these nut jobs, you can can talk.

Frequency has nothing to do with it. Just because we see more news reports about Islamic terrorists doesn't mean Christian terrorists don't exist. My entire point is that there's nothing unrealistic about having a scenario involving Christian terrorists when there are Christian terrorist groups in America who have killed and kidnapped people before and are quite likely to do so again.

 

[chris moore]

Maybe the thing they found at autopsy was something to do with the nature of the energy that blew a hole in his head - like its some kinda signature theyve seen before or something. Might open up the shadowy, sinister secret thing. And might be what gets Pym to fake his death in order to snoop around undetected.

And you two (or three) with the christian/muslim/terrorists arguement thing: Other than the setting in which Gauntlet has been introduced to us in order to show us he isnt a typical cape-type and therefore very much Gyrich's kind of person to train super teens who may not have started to idolise vigilantes yet, there's nothing in this series about terrorism, or religion or any of that. Its about their training, their interractions, their first missions, and their induction into teams - so please shut the bloody hell up! The last two pages have been filled with your rantings. Go over to the community board for that kind of thing.