The Amazing Spider-Man 2 Based on ASM2's box office and quality, was rebooting a mistake?

[Human Torch]

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Thank You.t:

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

I've decided that, in my ideal world, SM4 would have happened (the version Raimi wanted to make) and the Raimi series would have ended better. From there, I would have liked loose sequels with a new cast.

That being said, I don't think rebooting was their mistake. I think the movies themselves could have been better, and that is the mistake that was made. Sony has made questionnable decisions with the property, and TASM2 in particular. If these movies were better, I think they'd be more accepted by both the GA and the Raimi fans.

That is just me, though.

Completely agree with this, if the re-booted series had been better, there wouldnt be an issue, but I still think a Spiderman 4 would have been a better idea.

I think that another issue with the Raimi films is that they wrote themselves into a corner. They killed off a lot of of the villains and I don't think it could have lasted more than 1 or 2 films. Otherwise it's just one film popping up in each movie, Spider-Man defeating him, and moving on. But Spider-Man 4 should have been made. They could have shown Dylan Baker's Lizard (even though that wasn't the plan), have Peter and MJ get married, and finally have Peter tell Aunt May that he is Spider-Man.

Killing off villains isnt a problem with a character like Spiderman in my eyes. Doc Ock and Sandman could have come back, and then you have villains Raimi didnt use like Scorpion, The Lizard, Rhino, Morbius, Kraven, Shocker, Mysterio, Vulture, Hydro-man, Hobgoblin and Carnage, and thats just off the top of my head and not including people like Black Cat who neither good nor bad.

Raimi had plenty of options left.

 

[spiderman2]

It would have been interesting to see what rami could have done with morbis has there where rumors at one point about him being in spider man 4 and with rami doing scary movies would be interesting to see what he would have done.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

It would have been interesting to see what rami could have done with morbis has there where rumors at one point about him being in spider man 4 and with rami doing scary movies would be interesting to see what he would have done.

Agreed, and I actually feel the same about The Lizard, think Raimi would have done amazing things with him.

 

[spiderman2]

I belive there where rumors at one point to that spider man 3 was going to be split into spider man 3 and 4 because they had enough story to make it into 2 but that they couldn't figure out a way to end spider man 3. If they had decide to do that back when they where working on spider man 3 the movie may have been better and then we would have had at least spider man 4. It would be interesting to no what rami was thiking about doing for spider man 4 in treams or villains and storey and what the studio wanted.

 

[spiderman2]

I think there was also talk about a spider man 4 and 5 being filmed at the same time and that toby was going to get 40 million so like 20 million eatch. I believe there where like 4 or 5 different villains that came up in romors before the reboot was annorced.

 

[Lord]

100% agree. If this film had the same buzz as something like Captain America 2 did, then Spidey fans would have been satisfied and we'd be singing Sony's praises right now. Fans and doubters alike. But, that didn't happen because of issues with the film itself and trying to do too much and losing focus of the big picture on this particular film (not the franchise).

It's still a hard sell, even Batman needed The Dark Knight to exceed all expectation 2 times, even with such a large hype, in order for people to forget the old films, and unlike that franchise, the pre-reboot Spider-Man film was still a big deal when it came out and most people liked it.

I enjoyed both TASM and TASM2.

I think TASM nailed the casting and all the personal interactions between the main cast are great. Spider-Man has never been so awesome in costume on-screen. His wisecracks, his look and movements; all amazing. The villains and poor plotting are the real issues. Basically, they need better writers.

I don't think the reboot was a mistake. Webb and co. nailed the main aspects of Spider-Man in a way we haven't seen before. The problem is that the same attention isn't given to the villains. Just hire GOOD writers and I think a great movie could be churned out. No more popcorn movie writers.

I disagree, i do see many friends who care nothing about the comics but grew up with the original films complaining that the last suit looked more realistic, while this one looks made of plastic.

As for the movements, i think the previous films worked better because they also did some practical effects and didn't so over the top, the train sequence, even the clock tower fight, Spidey saving Gwen Stacy from that moving crane, etc. looked really good, had they kept the spectacle gettin bigger but not make it too over the top, this franchise would probably be closer to Transformers's place when it comes to the box office.

 

[Red Mask]

It's a franchise. You use it or lose it.

 

[Lord]

I think there was also talk about a spider man 4 and 5 being filmed at the same time and that toby was going to get 40 million so like 20 million eatch. I believe there where like 4 or 5 different villains that came up in romors before the reboot was annorced.

Yeah, there were plenty of rumors, i remember them mentioning the possibility of doing the Lizard, Raimi mentioned liking Morbius, and so on. Talking with various kids and collegues at the time who didn't know much of the comics, we actually thought Carnage was going to most likelly be the villain. But it seems like the idea Raimi was really set into going with was the Vulture, who the studio didn't think was good enough.

I don't think that character could hold his oun as the only villain, but it was still an interesting idea, it's actually a shame that they didn't go with him teaming up with Sandman in Spider-Man 3, him being the brain and Flint the Muscle, while both still beign 3 Dimensional. However, with Harry in that, maybe there should have only been a single villain besides the Goblin.

Going with Vulture and Black Cat could have actually been an interesting take, they would probably have MJ and Peter already together by that point, but them trying to have things work again while Black Cat is in the mix messing around with Spider-Man would be a better idea in my opinion.

Either way, there were plenty of ways to move on, the character could finally get married, even the comics of the time were trying to be closer to the movies and almost felt like part of the same universe some of the times, making it even easier to adapt.

Killing off villains isnt a problem with a character like Spiderman in my eyes. Doc Ock and Sandman could have come back, and then you have villains Raimi didnt use like Scorpion, The Lizard, Rhino, Morbius, Kraven, Shocker, Mysterio, Vulture, Hydro-man, Hobgoblin and Carnage, and thats just off the top of my head and not including people like Black Cat who neither good nor bad.

Raimi had plenty of options left.

You forgot Electro, that guy could easily hold a film of his oun like the Green Goblin and Dock Ock did. But on the whole i agree, they even had the road to a Sinister Six confrontation more easily set, having Sandman around and the potencial to do it in Spider-Man "6".

And Venom would probably be easier to bring back than Dock Ock, we saw him get destryed, but before the reboot, SONY was already working on a spin-off, so they probably had some idea of how to ressurrect him .

Not sure if it was on purpose, but there seemed to be a Silver Goblin Mask that could have eventually be used by Hobgoblin, he could easily be the main baddie of the second trilogy the same way Green Goblin's shadow was in the entire first Trilogy.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

I belive there where rumors at one point to that spider man 3 was going to be split into spider man 3 and 4 because they had enough story to make it into 2 but that they couldn't figure out a way to end spider man 3. If they had decide to do that back when they where working on spider man 3 the movie may have been better and then we would have had at least spider man 4. It would be interesting to no what rami was thiking about doing for spider man 4 in treams or villains and storey and what the studio wanted.

I think in the end splitting Spidey 3 into 2 movies would have been the best thing, but at the time trilogies were big thing. I still think they should have let Raimi do Spiderman 4 though.

You forgot Electro, that guy could easily hold a film of his oun like the Green Goblin and Dock Ock did. But on the whole i agree, they even had the road to a Sinister Six confrontation more easily set, having Sandman around and the potencial to do it in Spider-Man "6".

And Venom would probably be easier to bring back than Dock Ock, we saw him get destryed, but before the reboot, SONY was already working on a spin-off, so they probably had some idea of how to ressurrect him .

Not sure if it was on purpose, but there seemed to be a Silver Goblin Mask that could have eventually be used by Hobgoblin, he could easily be the main baddie of the second trilogy the same way Green Goblin's shadow was in the entire first Trilogy.

Forgetting Electro further re-enforces my point, Spidey has so many good villains killing some off isnt a problem, there were others I forgot like Smythe and Tombstone as well. I think Venom, Sandman and Doc Ock all could have come back, then there was a plethora of villains Raimi could have used for something new. They simply didnt need to re-boot. X-Men has carried on and recovered from its franchise low and I think Spiderman could have as well.

 

[DACrowe]

I knew that the reboot series had the potential to flame out, but on the second film before the spin-off (disaster) concepts? Wow.

There will be an Amazing Spider-Man 3. After that, it might be negotiable. Either way, I think it is safe to say that while Garfield is fantastic (arguably better than Maguire, definitely so while in costume) and Stone is the best love interest in any superhero movie made in the last 10 years...it just is not enough.

Whether fans think so or not, the general audience has spoken, and they voted against a reboot. WB and their Ben Affleck Batman should be watching this. Very carefully.

 

[OcStat]

Haha, come on, WB has to be watching every Marvel Movie very closely.

I wanted Raimi to make Spider-Man 4, and eagerly followed all the news on this site when it was a work in progress. But if you've read the apparent leaked plot, that movie would not have have been trashed worse than 3 was, and it would have been 2 films in a row.

The reboot issn't just bad timing, too soon, a cash in, whatever negative or positive thing you want to say. It's inevitable, that's all. And some people have embraced the new take, others haven't. But this won't be the last time a character is rebooted or recast. And it definitely won't stop them from continuing the franchise. At the least, Amazing 3. The other two spin-offs have a lot of development time behind them, and still won't be out before the next Amazing entry. They have plenty of time to adapt their projects.

Either way, most likely they will switch some of the creative team around, I wouldn't mind some new writers myself. Some people will like it, some people won't.

I just think if Sam really had it in him to finish that 4th movie and reset the bar like he intended, he would have. A new team deserved a chance, I think it was worth it. It's a bummer it hasn't been as successful at the box office, but thier is a lot of other comic book movies vying for the same peoples attention.

 

[MessiahDecoy123]

Agreed, and I actually feel the same about The Lizard, think Raimi would have done amazing things with him.

Or Lizard could've ended up like Venom.

 

[Spiderine]

Agreed, and I actually feel the same about The Lizard, think Raimi would have done amazing things with him.

I was really interested in seeing a movie with Lizard and Kraven. Lizard going on a rampage while Kraven hunts him down to kill the creature. Spidey caught in the middle having to stop Lizard from hurting people and stopping Kraven from killing him. Would have been better use of both characters in one film.

 

[OcStat]

Well if Raimi did the Lizard, I think he would have made something great. I don't think he wouldv'e passed up Connors family, and the audience already would have been connected to Connors himself thanks to 2 & 3.

Unfortunately that wasn't even where he was going with 4.

 

[Spiderine]

Well if Raimi did the Lizard, I think he would have made something great. I don't think he wouldv'e passed up Connors family, and the audience already would have been connected to Connors himself thanks to 2 & 3.

Unfortunately that wasn't even where he was going with 4.

Your right. Raimi wanted Vulture for SM4. He actually wanted Vulture for SM3. If Raimi got his way with SM3 maybe we would have gotten Lizard and Kraven along with Black Cat in 4.

 

[MessiahDecoy123]

I was really interested in seeing a movie with Lizard and Kraven. Lizard going on a rampage while Kraven hunts him down to kill the creature. Spidey caught in the middle having to stop Lizard from hurting people and stopping Kraven from killing him. Would have been better use of both characters in one film.

In my perfect world this would've been ASM1.

With Alfonso Cauron directing.

and Joseph Gordon Levitt as Peter Parker.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Or Lizard could've ended up like Venom.

Lets face it, this wouldnt have happened. Raimi was never a fan of Venom, and he was shoehorned into the movie very late on. Raimi loved The Lizard and would have taken the proper time to develop him.

IMO as well, Goblin is TASM2 was worse than SM3 Venom.

I was really interested in seeing a movie with Lizard and Kraven. Lizard going on a rampage while Kraven hunts him down to kill the creature. Spidey caught in the middle having to stop Lizard from hurting people and stopping Kraven from killing him. Would have been better use of both characters in one film.

That would have been amazing.

Your right. Raimi wanted Vulture for SM4. He actually wanted Vulture for SM3. If Raimi got his way with SM3 maybe we would have gotten Lizard and Kraven along with Black Cat in 4.

I think in SM5 we would have gotten The Lizard though, and possibly Kraven as someone else mentioned, SM4 was definitely Vulture and Black Cat though. I am not a fan of Vulture personally, but I was still interested in what Raimi would have done with him.

 

[spiderman2]

yeah vulter I don't like I don't think he is enough for a movie with out onther villain and I don't know if just black cat with him would be enough.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

yeah vulter I don't like I don't think he is enough for a movie with out onther villain and I don't know if just black cat with him would be enough.

I think the reason Raimi was going to include BC was because he knew The Vulture alone wouldnt be enough.

 

[Spiderine]

Before they shoved Venom in SM3, that film was going to be Sandman and Vulture with Harry still redeeming himself at the end. That would have probably worked better than Sandy and Venom. If Ben Kingsley were playing him, he would have certainly been more respectable.

 

[MessiahDecoy123]

Lets face it, this wouldnt have happened. Raimi was never a fan of Venom, and he was shoehorned into the movie very late on. Raimi loved The Lizard and would have taken the proper time to develop him.

IMO as well, Goblin is TASM2 was worse than SM3 Venom.

Venom/Eddie Brock were complete non-characters in SM3. A falling piano would've more interesting.

Green Goblin/Harry from ASM2 were actually attached to the story and characters. As Harry becomes more selfish he slowly becomes the goblin psychologically.

It's full character arc that feels natural and earned unlike most of Raimi's villains.

 

[InJustice]

I was really interested in seeing a movie with Lizard and Kraven. Lizard going on a rampage while Kraven hunts him down to kill the creature. Spidey caught in the middle having to stop Lizard from hurting people and stopping Kraven from killing him. Would have been better use of both characters in one film.

Now that's a fantastic way to utilize two villains.

 

[spiderman2]

I agree hopefully we see something like that in a spider man movie at some point.

 

[spiderman2]

venom was better then asm2 goblin no way. Gobin was way better has he had a good motivation and didn't get killed off and will be back.