Best Punisher movie so far?

[BigSams50]

^ Also gotta love the chandelier scene.

 

[Kable24]

Unfortunately I find the chandelier scene to be very UnPunisher like. The best scene is the shotgun to Pittsy's head.

 

[DACMAN]

The Punisher has set up various long plots to get to people in previous comics.

Right. "To get to people". To kill them. To punish them. Not get them to kill eachother and all that. It was completely out of character. He does recon. But to figure out the best way to get in there and kill everyone, or get close to kill someone like you said.

 

[DACMAN]

Those 2 were my favorite moments in the whole movie. The pencil thing was bad ass

I loved those scenes too. But how can they beat out the getting stabbed by your own bone scene? I can't see how anyone could ever top that in the bad ass department.

 

[DACMAN]

Show me where I said "he didn't wince". I said " He sat there, etc, etc, etc". The woman started sewing into his skin, when she wasn't supposed to, and he sat there and continued the scene. Almost anyone you meet, let alone any actor, will tell you that's badass.

Right. Well first I was talking more so about the character. He didn't just "sit there". He was showing he was in obvious pain. We've seen the Punisher sown up dozens of times and he never acted the way Jane did. Is it cool Jane finished the scene even though she went through the prosthetic a bit? Sure. But it wasn't as bad as you make it sound. There was a prosthetic in place she went through a bit. It's cool he finished the scene, but he was showing obvious signs of pain. Which is fine for an actor, but not for the Punisher.

You ever read Marvel Knights Punisher issue I wanna say 17 or 18 by Ennis? The issue he runs into Joan the mouse now living in the middle of no-where after Frank gave her all that money? He stitches himself up without batting an eye.

 

[DACMAN]

Unfortunately I find the chandelier scene to be very UnPunisher like. The best scene is the shotgun to Pittsy's head.

I liked Punisher WZ. Thought they did the character perfect. But I have to agree. Something about that seemed un-Punisher like to me too.

 

[DACMAN]

That's just ridiculous. Having a high tolerance for pain doesn't mean you don't ever show you're in pain or make noise when you're injured. Pretty sure that The Punisher has before, and will again. "He wouldn't scream" is just silly in context, and Garth Ennis's Punisher is not the be-all end-all of the character.

He has stitched himself up in the comics before without making a sound. I just gave an issue.

And yes. Ennis's Punisher is what the Punisher is now. He made the Punisher what he is even more so than Miller on Batman, or David on the HULK. The fact you don't know that makes me wonder how much about the Punisher you actually know.

 

[The Guard]

Right. Well first I was talking more so about the character.

Then make a different point, and do so clearly, don't tell me I'm wrong about him sitting there and doing what I said he did just because you come up with a different idea about what "sitting there" means.

I said "Thomas Jane". I referenced something outside the character, about the actor and the shooting of the scene itself, and pretty clearly made it about the actor. That should have clued you into the fact that I was talking about the actor, not the character.

While I understand the point you made, for you to then come back and say "No he didn't" makes you look like you simply don't understand what I said, or what was going on in the first place.

He didn't just "sit there". He was showing he was in obvious pain. We've seen the Punisher sown up dozens of times and he never acted the way Jane did.

That's partially because the people conceiving the character clearly have no idea how people react, and simply think it's a badass Clint Eastwood thing to do, and because The Punisher in those instances tends to be a drawing, not a flesh and blood actor who probably wants the character to seem...you know...human and real.

Is it cool Jane finished the scene even though she went through the prosthetic a bit? Sure. But it wasn't as bad as you make it sound. There was a prosthetic in place she went through a bit. It's cool he finished the scene, but he was showing obvious signs of pain. Which is fine for an actor, but not for the Punisher.

I don't recall saying it was badass because he showed no signs of pain. I recall saying it was badass that he did it.

And I didn't put a value judgement on how bad it was, so I'm iffy on your "it wasn't as bad as you make it sound" statement. I didn't make it sound good OR bad. I said "He sat there while someone sewed into his skin."

You ever read Marvel Knights Punisher issue I wanna say 17 or 18 by Ennis? The issue he runs into Joan the mouse now living in the middle of no-where after Frank gave her all that money? He stitches himself up without batting an eye.

he has stitched himself up in the comics before without making a sound. I just gave an issue

He's also worn white boots, and been an actual angel of death, and done god knows what else over the years.

What's your point?

Had I said "No, you're wrong, he never got sewed up without making expressions of pain in the comics", there might be a point to your telling me which issues it happened in. As I did not, I'm unsure why you bothered with that.

Now you seem to think you can prove something by showing one example, despite the other examples out there in the mythology, or that you need to point out an element I never debated to begin with.

That said, when it comes to a movie and an actor's performance, I could really care less what you found in one issue, or even in several issues, or a dozen, or what have you. Because what I care about, in the context of a movie, is what is realistic and compelling. The Punisher is a human, and humans show pain, especially when their skin and muscle is torn. It's a natural reaction.

Ennis, whose Punisher, by the way, has been The Punisher for decades (this is fairly relevant), and is therefore more used to things like getting sewn up, stabbed, shot, etc, also shows this more experienced, veteran Punisher in a lot of pain when he has bullets dug out of him and such. So yeah...Garth shows The Punisher in pain sometimes as well. His Punisher doesn't exactly have no emotions or sensitivity to pain.

And yes. Ennis's Punisher is what the Punisher is now. He made the Punisher what he is even more so than Miller on Batman, or David on the HULK . The fact you don't know that makes me wonder how much about the Punisher you actually know.

At least in terms of Miller on Batman...untrue. Frank Miller did a ton to help redefine Batman and his world for an entire generation of fans and creators, and his work has had far more impact on the character than Ennis's work on Punisher has had on The Punisher as a character. Miller basically created a number of major elements of the mythos that have since become part of Batman lore, and expanded on other existing elements and enriched them. Ennis basically just went back to what writers have always done with The Punisher, and he made it work yet again, by using what had always worked best. He also took a few elements of the mythos in a new direction. But no, Ennis's impact on The Punisher is nowhere near what Miller's was on Batman. Had The Punisher been some sort of wisecracking happy go lucky superhero, maybe. But he never was. Ennis just make an already dark character's world slightly weirder, and was allowed, via the MAX line, to make it more intense.

As for your "makes me wonder how much Punisher you know" nonsense?

Good lord, you're the one who is so far, limiting what makes The Punisher work to Ennis and his work apparently.

 

[DACMAN]

Vol 4 issue 19 Marvel Knights Punisher "Of Mice and Men". I looked through my collection and found it. So...booyah.

And as far as reading all that,...seriously? Pretty long winded stuff. I've got things to do. Maybe later.

 

[The Guard]

I see.

 

[BigSams50]

I loved those scenes too. But how can they beat out the getting stabbed by your own bone scene? I can't see how anyone could ever top that in the bad ass department.

Tht was badass. THt movie just had so many scenes of just pure ownage

 

[S. Grundy]

Right. "To get to people". To kill them. To punish them. Not get them to kill eachother and all that. It was completely out of character. He does recon. But to figure out the best way to get in there and kill everyone, or get close to kill someone like you said.

The Force of Nature one-shot actually has him turning people against one another. It's a more recent example, but he still does it.

 

[The Guard]

I fail to see what's wrong with him punishing people...and then punishing them some more.

 

[DACMAN]

Because it has never shown him to want to make people suffer. Or some how make them want to turn over a new leaf. He has never been shown to want to make the bad guy scream out in pain (unless he needed info or something. He wants one thing, to kill people that deserve killing. He loves killing people. He has become obsessed with it. Makeing them suffer has nothing to do with it.

 

[Fresh Prince]

So he actually would not mind having a villian turn a new leaf?

 

[DACMAN]

What? No. I said the exact opposite. He just wants to kill people. He doesn't want anything else. Nothing. Just to kill.

Edit: Oh. I think you were being sarcastic. It's kind of hard to get that over the internet and even more so because you didn't use the smiley.

 

[S. Grundy]

Because it has never shown him to want to make people suffer. Or some how make them want to turn over a new leaf. He has never been shown to want to make the bad guy scream out in pain (unless he needed info or something. He wants one thing, to kill people that deserve killing. He loves killing people. He has become obsessed with it. Making them suffer has nothing to do with it.

Well, in the case of the 2004 film, he was going after the people directly responsible for his families death. He wanted to utterly destroy Saint and take his time. Now, was it perfect in the film, no, it could have been done a little better. In the end, the movie was a Year One story, and the portrayal of Castle was fairly accurate to it, the biggest change in regards to motivation is instead of Castle investigating what happened, he's plotting revenge.

Also, The Cell one-shot, he sets up a prison riot so that when he kills the people behind his families death he can take his time and make them suffer. And that's straight from Ennis.

 

[Fresh Prince]

I want a more expierence Punisher not a rookie. I want a Punisher who is a pro like Keaton's Batman was.

 

[[A]]

The best scene is the shotgun to Pittsy's head.

Avvy material. If the Hype wasn't PG13, that is.

 

[S. Grundy]

I want a more expierence Punisher not a rookie. I want a Punisher who is a pro like Keaton's Batman was.

And that's what the sequel would have been, they made an origin movie with the 2004 one. And honestly I thought the Jane Punisher was more of a pro in that he was a tactician and seemed to think things out before he did them and had contingency plans.

 

[Fresh Prince]

Yeah true but the Punsiher do not think things out he is a cowboy, he just goes ahead and do things. He is not Batman planning out how he gonna strike, he just strike!

 

[S. Grundy]

Yeah true but the Punsiher do not think things out he is a cowboy, he just goes ahead and do things. He is not Batman planning out how he gonna strike, he just strike!

No he's a soldier, and soldiers think things out. He's done it plenty of times in the comics.

 

[Fresh Prince]

Oh....I heard people say he suppose to be a cowboy and gun slinger.

 

[DACMAN]

No. We were saying that the Jane movie had a western flare to it. It had things in it that made it feel like an old western film.

 

[BigSams50]

I also thought tht stevensons punisher suit was alot more badass than jane's