Fantasy Buffy the Vampire Slayer and Angel the Vampire - Part 3

[Teelie]

Also one of my favorite understated actors.

 

[Havok83]

Well you're doing better than I did at that point. I was kinda hating the show for most of the first season, and was basically forced by my friends to continue, lol. "Angel" (episode 7) was the first one to even keep my interest. I enjoy the season more on re-watches though because it's fun to see how these characters were before all the epic **** that happens to them, haha. The most interesting character to watch in this 1st season to me now is actually [blackout]Darla[/blackout]. Talk about not judging a character on first impressions, lol.

I cant remember her being all that interesting in season 1 but she was definitely a breakout character in

Spoiler

Angel

 

[ComicChick]

As in your first time watching? I am envious.

yes

Well you're doing better than I did at that point. I was kinda hating the show for most of the first season, and was basically forced by my friends to continue, lol. "Angel" (episode 7) was the first one to even keep my interest. I enjoy the season more on re-watches though because it's fun to see how these characters were before all the epic **** that happens to them, haha. The most interesting character to watch in this 1st season to me now is actually [blackout]Darla[/blackout]. Talk about not judging a character on first impressions, lol.

I cant remember her being all that interesting in season 1 but she was definitely a breakout character in

Spoiler

Angel

i really didn't like the Bug Lady (ep 4) and the hyena one (ep 6) but the others have been pretty okay. as for everything else, i like it alright.

for what it's worth, i've seen almost every episode of Angel, and i knew its a spinoff. so it's nice to see some characters from there and how they started off. especially the one you put in blackout lol. i recognized her in the the first episode and was like "whaaaat?!"

 

[Primal Slayer]

That's an interesting way to be introduced through the show, almost backwards lol. What are your thoughts on S1 Cordelia vs. her on Angel?

 

[flickchick85]

I cant remember her being all that interesting in season 1 but she was definitely a breakout character in

Spoiler

Angel

That's what I mean. You see her in S1 of Buffy and there's no impression. But then once you get to know her later and have a handle on what her personality's like - the way she adapts her persona [blackout]to whatever companions/culture she's inhabiting at the time, that ditzy schoolgirl vibe becomes a total performance. And that line to Angel about the last time they saw each other in "kimonos" gets a lot more weight once we see the context for it a few seasons later. Same with Angel "killing" her, of course[/blackout]. They like retroactively made her S1 version interesting for me, because of all we learned about her later.

i really didn't like the Bug Lady (ep 4) and the hyena one (ep 6) but the others have been pretty okay. as for everything else, i like it alright.

for what it's worth, i've seen almost every episode of Angel, and i knew its a spinoff. so it's nice to see some characters from there and how they started off. especially the one you put in blackout lol. i recognized her in the the first episode and was like "whaaaat?!"

Ok I think you're the first person I've ever talked to that watched all of Angel first, lol. That's certainly an interesting way to do it. Are you gonna re-watch Angel along with it once you get to S4? They really did run in parallel and crossed over with companion episodes many times.

Also, I didn't like the hyena one either, but I appreciate its existence because my favorite line from S1 in a later episode is a reference to it, lol.

 

[ComicChick]

That's an interesting way to be introduced through the show, almost backwards lol. What are your thoughts on S1 Cordelia vs. her on Angel?

i really liked Cordelia on Angel. and seeing her now as a vapid, stuck up "popular girl" as opposed to only hearing her talk about her hs days is a big change. i know i have like 130+ episodes to go, but its great to see how much she had grown between s1 where i am now, and where i left her on Angel

 

[Sithborg]

Some thoughts:

1) We should collectively lose the equivalence between Buffy and Whedon. I loved Buffy myself, and still love it, and I know that Whedon is the most important contributor... but aside from his skills as a writer-director, he also clearly has skills hiring people. He hired some very good people to work on the Buffyverse such as Minear, Espenson, Noxon, etc. They contributed to Buffy being great as well.

The same applies to other Whedon shows.

All of this is independent of how he is to women personally.

2) There's an epidemic of men who are awful to women personally but who are feminists in public. We're discussing Joss Whedon now, but we also know of Devin Faraci in the past year, he was definitely one of the loudest feminists on the internet, has a history of ... you can look it up. In my own field, a man who was on the shortlist for a Nobel prize, who apparently went to women's marches, recently lost his career because he sexually assaulted young female scientists. Separately, all the time I see on FB people brag about what feminists, woke, tolerant, pro-LGBQTI, progressive people they are while at the same time they are awful people in real life, full of bigotry and darkness.

I think that part of the issue is that feminism and progressivism in general are cool. People want to believe that they're nice, so they strive to have that image, both in terms of how others see them, and in terms of their own self-image.

I like to think of them as the "nice guy nerd". They are blind to their own behavior towards women. And Whedon clearly has his issues, given how he treats relationships in his shows.

 

[DA_Champion]

I like to think of them as the "nice guy nerd". They are blind to their own behavior towards women. And Whedon clearly has his issues, given how he treats relationships in his shows.

I like the way he treats relationships actually.

There's little nonsense about "the one" in Whedon shows. Relationships start, get problems, fizzle out, and the characters move on to other relationships. It's more realistic than a lot of Hollywood.

 

[AndrewGilkison]

For a long time I was baffled by what Whedon saw in the Banner/Widow relationship in Avengers AOU. It seemed weird and tone death that both of those characters were suddenly having an unrequited love for each other out of nowhere, with nothing in Avengers to support it.

But now I am beginning to wonder if Whedon was just projecting himself into the Banner character and was crushing so hard on Scarlett Johannson that he used Mark Ruffalo as a surrogate for himself, living out a fantasy that Johannson longed for him and wanted to be with him.

Its hard not to see that in a new light after what his ex-wife said of their marriage. But why he wrote that relationship suddenly makes more sense.

 

[Sithborg]

I like the way he treats relationships actually.

There's little nonsense about "the one" in Whedon shows. Relationships start, get problems, fizzle out, and the characters move on to other relationships. It's more realistic than a lot of Hollywood.

I was referring to his tendency to kill a significant other...

 

[Slick]

I still can't believe that we don't have a blu ray for Buffy and Angel yet. It's most likely going to happen I guess. Just a matter of time.

.

 

[Sithborg]

I think they might have the same issues that getting DS9 on blu ray has.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

[blackout]Why is it that we mask spoilers in a thread discussing a show that is over a decade old? And its predecessor that is near two decades of age?[/blackout]

Spoiler

The idea of a vampire seeking atonement for the all the innocent blood he shed starting with that of his father having a relationship with a woman who is tasked and empowered to kill his kind is an interesting dynamic, I'm glad it had mostly good execution.


To think that Stephanie Meyer took the creepy idea of the centuries old vampire falling in love with a female in high school newly moved to the town he's in and pulled the knob a few levels up in creepy makes me debate whether I should be applauding for these shows for making an idea as creepy as it sounds easier to take or be happier that I did not watch or read any of the entries in the Twilight saga.

 

[ComicChick]

because some of us have mentioned we recently started watching it for the first time. it respect

 

[Havok83]

because some of us have mentioned we recently started watching it for the first time. it respect

yeah it scommon courtesy. Anyone that comes in here should be aware that spoilerish material will be discussed but if they say they are just watching for the first time, its a jerk move to quote them directly and spoil somethng

 

[Spider-Aziz]

So I should remember not to repeat the mistake I made with the Sliders TV club thread. Comprende, no biggie.

 

[ComicChick]

it's not even the same thing. that thread was blatantly for people who had never watched the show before, mentioned that, and mentioned that spoilers should be tagged as such.

i dont really get why you're even bringing it up?

 

[flickchick85]

Up to episode 9 of season 1 now. "I, Robot...You, Jane" just gets more hilariously dated on every re-watch. But now I've gotten to the string of eps from S1 that I actually like, so yay.

 

[Dr.]

Up to episode 9 of season 1 now. "I, Robot...You, Jane" just gets more hilariously dated on every re-watch. But now I've gotten to the string of eps from S1 that I actually like, so yay.

In terms of Buffy straying from horror/fantasy into sci-fi/robots, I found “Ted” and Warren’s fembots to be more conceptually problematic.

 

[Donner]

It does amaze me that North American society sees teenage/adult relationships to be wrong and immoral and creepy, but applauds shows like Buffy and the Vampire Diaries even though the main characters are a 16 year old high school girl and a 25+ year old vampire.

 

[SiegePerilous]

It does amaze me that North American society sees teenage/adult relationships to be wrong and immoral and creepy, but applauds shows like Buffy and the Vampire Diaries even though the main characters are a 16 year old high school girl and a 25+ year old vampire.

I've always gotten the impression that, when they were doing the early seasons, Angel was meant to be in the 18-21 range when he was turned into a vampire. Which is still a gray area, but less so.

This obviously became a problem when they kept Angel around, and David Boreanaz kept aging. When they finally confirmed his human age in season 1 of his show, the "he was 18 years old!" ship had loooooooong sailed.

 

[ComicChick]

finally finished Season 1 and on to Season 2

 

[flickchick85]

S2 takes a few eps to get going, but once it does, it's quite a ride. My favorite seasons are S5 and S3, but halfway through S2 is where the show first hooked me.

 

[ComicChick]

well i'm finishing up the first ep of season 2 and it wasn't too bad. i like how at the end of season 1, buffy showed her age and freaked out about the prophecy. she didn't want to die! who can blame her? i liked the way SMG played that

 

[flickchick85]

well i'm finishing up the first ep of season 2 and it wasn't too bad. i like how at the end of season 1, buffy showed her age and freaked out about the prophecy. she didn't want to die! who can blame her? i liked the way SMG played that

Yeah, at least S1 finished strong. That moment in "Prophecy Girl" was beautifully done.