The Dark Knight Rises Discussing the Third Movie and 3D

[Anita18]

I am no film expert and therefore i cant judge Pfister's work, so i'll only say this. I was mesmerized by Begins but indifferent to TDK's images apart from the white sailing boat on the Caribbean waters and the whole Hong Kong scene. If someone liked the pitch dark alleys that you couldnt see your own nose, the climax on a dusty skyscraper full of crap, and the Two Face scene in a dusty and dark warehouse, then its fine by me. I just didnt.

Lets get back on topic which is 3D.

Well I'm just saying that not only there are fans who disagree with you, there are fellow accomplished cinematographers who disagree with you.

And 3D is sorta on topic with cinematography.

 

[redfirebird2008]

Well I'm just saying that not only there are fans who disagree with you, there are fellow accomplished cinematographers who disagree with you.

American Society of Cinematographers nominated Pfister/TDK for their highest honor in 2009. And obviously it was nominated for an Oscar as well. I tend to take the ASC award a little more seriously though because it's strictly cinematographers voting on it and not a bunch of other movie industry professionals who are just as clueless about the technical aspects of cinematography as we are.

 

[Anita18]

American Society of Cinematographers nominated Pfister/TDK for their highest honor in 2009. And obviously it was nominated for an Oscar as well. I tend to take the ASC award a little more seriously though because it's strictly cinematographers voting on it and not a bunch of other movie industry professionals who are just as clueless about the technical aspects of cinematography as we are.

IIRC the Oscar technical nominations are from people in that particular industry. The winners are chosen by everybody.

 

[redfirebird2008]

IIRC the Oscar technical nominations are from people in that particular industry. The winners are chosen by everybody.

OK, I suppose they're on the same level then. Either way, it got nominated by both (probably cuz it was the exact same people voting haha).

 

[akfj]

did they said that it wouldnt be in 3D or that they wouldnt film in 3D?

They said they wouldn't film it in 3D. Warner Bros. wants to release it in 3D, so they'd have to convert it.

 

[FlawlessVictory]

Christopher Nolan's dim view of a Hollywood craze: 'I'm not a huge fan of 3-D'
June 13, 2010 | 1:04 pm

HERO COMPLEX FILM FESTIVAL

Night 2 of the Hero Complex Film Festival was a great success as Christopher Nolan took time from applying the finishing touches to "Inception" to sit for a lively Q&A session. There's plenty to tell you about, but I've broken out an entire article on his enlightening comments on the 3-D craze of the moment.

Christopher Nolan, speaking at the Hero Complex Film Festival, was cheered loudly by the audience when he made a moviegoer confession: "I'm not a huge fan of 3-D."

The director of "The Dark Knight" added that, after doing 3-D tests, his new film "Inception" will not be released in the trendy stereoscopic format because "we didn't have time to do it to the standards that I would be happy with."

Then, the professorial 39-year-old filmmaker, who burst on the scene a decade ago with "Memento," launched into a clinic on the entire topic of 3-D conversion and filmmaking that left some fans in the audience scratching their heads even as the film-school crowd leaned forward to catch every word. First off, he said, he resented the suggestion that cinema was somehow flat without those special glasses.

"The truth is, I think it's a misnomer to call it 3-D versus 2-D. The whole point of cinematic imagery is it's three-dimensional. ... You know, 95% of our depth cues come from occlusion, resolution, color and so forth, so the idea of calling a 2-D movie a '2-D movie' is a little misleading."

Nolan was speaking at the Los Angles Times-sponsored festival, staged at the Mann Chinese 6 in Hollywood, between screenings of his 2002 thriller "Insomnia" and "The Dark Knight."

The festival is continuing Sunday with an appearance by Ridley Scott and screenings of "Alien" and "Blade Runner."

On Friday, the special guest was Leonard Nimoy and the film was "Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home."

Nodding to the movie screen behind him, Nolan told the audience of 500 that he, literally, had a dim view of the 3-D releases he'd watched: "The truth of it is when you watch a film in here, you're looking at 16 foot-lamberts, When you watch through any of the conventional 3-D processes you're giving up three foot-lamberts. A massive difference. You're not that aware of it because once you're 'in that world,' your eye compensates, but having struggled for years to get theaters get up to the proper brightness, we're not sticking polarized filters in everything."

After the massive success of James Cameron's "Avatar" and Tim Burton's "Alice in Wonderland" (they have a staggering $3.7 billion in combined worldwide grosses since December), there is a studio stampede toward 3-D, which is seen as the type of singular spectacle now needed to lure consumers away from the comfort of their home-theater sofas.

But filmmakers have reservations. The sword-and-myth adventure "Clash of the Titans" -- which, like "Inception," was produced by Legendary Pictures and distributed by Warner Bros. -- was quickly converted into a 3-D film, and in the eyes of many critics, the post-production "rush job" showed. "Clash" director Louis Leterrier was beside himself as his movie came under fire, and he won't be back to direct the sequel; still, "Clash" has made $487 million worldwide and, domestically, stands as the fifth-highest-grossing release of 2010.

Leterrier chose his public comments on the 3-D issue carefully for the simple reason that it won't be easy to make another studio blockbuster without a studio. Nolan, who scored a billion-dollar success with "The Dark Knight," is as secure as any director in Hollywood at the moment. But he made it clear Saturday night that although he was captain of his own destiny, it was the studios that built the ship.

"Well, let me put it this way: There is no question if audiences want to watch films in stereoscopic imaging, that's what the studios will be doing, and that's what I'll be doing."

Nolan said "Inception," the July 16 dream-world heist film starring Leonardo DiCaprio, could have ended up as a 3-D release. "We did tests on 'Inception' with the different post-conversion processes, and they all went very well. It's quite easy to do, in fact. But it takes a little time, and we didn't have time to do it to the standards that I would be happy with."

Nolan said the craft of making a modern big-budget blockbuster with visual effects involved many of the same approaches needed for 3-D conversion. So, as a technical exercise, he finds it compelling but, as moviegoer, he has little interest in sitting in the dark with the finished product -- at least in most cases so far.

"It's all based on all the visual-effects technology, you know, that we're currently most engaged in with match moving, so forth, and rendering 2-D imagery into a 3-D space. ... On a technical level, it's fascinating, but on an experiential level, I find the dimness of the image extremely alienating."

What about shooting in 3D -- as opposed to the post-production conversion approach? Nolan said that approach necessitated shooting in video, with big, bulky gear and a beam-splitter that required trade-offs with optics he was not eager to make. "There are a lot of problems with it ... the idea of shooting a whole film through a massive beam-splitter and so forth -- there are enormous compromises. Post-conversion technologies probably, for me, are definitely the future, but really it is up to the audiences what they want to see and how they want to watch their films."

Nolan is due to start filming a third Batman film in March, and he and Emma Thomas, his producing partner and wife, will be the producers of a Superman film, adding a new cinematic chapter to the superhero property that launched the comic-book industry in the summer of 1938. Nolan didn't say it, but it wasn't a leap to infer that Warner Bros. would be putting pressure to make those movies into 3-D releases for 2012 and beyond -- and that the filmmaker was hoping new 3-D advances would come to light by then.

"I'm certainly quite pleased with 'Inception' as presented -- it's very bright and very clear, so as the technology improves, those differences may change, and that is what I hope for."

-- Geoff Boucher

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/her...nolan-inception-3d-dark-knight-hollywood.html

 

[Timstuff]

I would much rather see Batman 3 filmed 100% in Imax than see it in 3D.

 

[Anita18]

Judging from his answers this weekend, Nolan isn't technically against 3-D, but of course being the film aficionado that he is, if he were to do it he'd shoot on film and convert to 3-D in post. Which is normally the recipe for disaster, but we're talking about Chris "puts all of the VFX guys in therapy" Nolan here.

So if Batman 3 is in 3-D, I trust that it wouldn't be a rush job and it'd look pretty good.

Of course, I'd still prefer it natively shot in IMAX and provided in 2-D in that form as well. We'll just have to see.....

 

[doctorkenyon]

Only seen one 3D film and that was Alice in Wonderland.

I ended up taking off the glasses... the film looked better with them off.

 

[Boom]

I would much rather see Batman 3 filmed 100% in Imax than see it in 3D.

This. This. A million times this.

 

[Superboy-Prime]

Last movie I saw in a theatre in 3D? Jaws 3. In 1983 it was goofy.

I'm sorry but I'm not putting on no silly 3D glasses in no movie theatre...even for Batman. Batman is an action series, but it's heavy in drama. They can't be serious.

yeah its not like technology has changed in nearly 30 years

 

[Gamma Ray]

I'll see the non-3D version.

 

[terry78]

Comic book fans back in the day would have given a literal left nut to see Bats in 3D. Now suddenly because it's the in-thing you're complaining? Shut the **** up. I can't wait to see him swoop down on a ****er in 3D.

 

[Doc Holliday]

yeah its not like technology has changed in nearly 30 years

It's still the same concept. His point is that it's silly and out of place.

Avatar was a marathon to watch in 3D. It was gorgeous, but that was all the colors and stuff. That movie was designed for 3D. This movie needs to be designed to be in the same visual style as the first two, which I don't think would lend well to 3D. Not enough bright colors and visual pop.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

I am no film expert and therefore i cant judge Pfister's work, so i'll only say this. I was mesmerized by Begins but indifferent to TDK's images apart from the white sailing boat on the Caribbean waters and the whole Hong Kong scene. If someone liked the pitch dark alleys that you couldnt see your own nose, the climax on a dusty skyscraper full of crap, and the Two Face scene in a dusty and dark warehouse, then its fine by me. I just didnt.

Lets get back on topic which is 3D.

The 50 best-shot films from 1998-2008 according to American Cinematographer


http://www.movieline.com/2010/06/was...ast-decade.php


1. Amélie: Bruno Delbonnel, ASC, AFC (2001)
2. Children of Men: Emmanuel Lubezki, ASC, AMC (2006)
3. Saving Private Ryan: Janusz Kaminski (1998)
4. There Will Be Blood: Robert Elswit, ASC (2007)
5. No Country for Old Men: Roger Deakins, ASC, BSC (2007)
6. Fight Club: Jeff Cronenweth, ASC (1999)
7. The Dark Knight: Wally Pfister, ASC (2008)
8. Road to Perdition: Conrad L. Hall, ASC (2002)
9. Cidade de Deus (City of God): César Charlone, ABC (2002)
10. American Beauty: Conrad L. Hall, ASC (1999)
1. The Assassination of Jesse James by the Coward Robert Ford (Deakins)
12. Tie: In the Mood for Love (Christopher Doyle, HKSC, and Mark Li Ping-bin) and Pan’s Labyrinth (Guillermo Navarro, ASC)
13. The Lord of the Rings trilogy (Andrew Lesnie, ASC, ACS)
14. Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind (Ellen Kuras, ASC)
15. Gladiator (John Mathieson, BSC)
16. The Matrix (Bill Pope, ASC)
17. The Thin Red Line (John Toll, ASC)
18. The Diving Bell and The Butterfly (Kaminski)
19. Slumdog Millionaire (Anthony Dod Mantle, BSC, DFF)
20. Tie: Eyes Wide Shut (Larry Smith, BSC) and Requiem for a Dream (Matthew Libatique, ASC)
21. Kill Bill (Robert Richardson, ASC)
22. Moulin Rouge (Donald M. McAlpine, ASC, ACS)
23. The Pianist (Pawel Edelman, PSC)
24. Hero (Doyle)
25. Black Hawk Down (Slawomir Idziak, PSC)
26. O Brother, Where Art Thou? (Deakins)
27. Babel (Rodrigo Prieto, ASC, AMC)
28. Lost In Translation (Lance Acord, ASC)
29. Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon (Peter Pau, HKSC)
30. The Curious Case of Benjamin Button (Claudio Miranda, ASC)
31. The Man Who Wasn’t There (Deakins)
32. The New World (Lubezki)
33. Sin City (Robert Rodriguez)
34. Atonement (Seamus McGarvey, ASC, BSC)
35. Munich (Kaminski)
36. The Prestige (Pfister)
37. Memoirs of a Geisha (Dion Beebe, ASC, ACS)
38. The Aviator (Richardson)
39. Zodiac (Harris Savides, ASC)
40. The Insider (Dante Spinotti, ASC, AIC)
41. Gangs of New York (Michael Ballhaus, ASC)
42. Tie: Brokeback Mountain (Prieto) and The Fountain (Libatique)
43. The Fall (Colin Watkinson)
44. The Passion of the Christ (Caleb Deschanel, ASC)
45. Snow Falling on Cedars (Richardson)
46. House of Flying Daggers (Xiaoding Zhao)
47. Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow (Eric Adkins)

 

[Mr. Earle]

So? That refers to the technique, doesnt it?

 

[The Joker]

The 50 best-shot films from 1998-2008 according to American Cinematographer


http://www.movieline.com/2010/06/was...ast-decade.php


1. Amélie: Bruno Delbonnel, ASC, AFC (2001)
2. Children of Men: Emmanuel Lubezki, ASC, AMC (2006)
3. Saving Private Ryan: Janusz Kaminski (1998)
4. There Will Be Blood: Robert Elswit, ASC (2007)
5. No Country for Old Men: Roger Deakins, ASC, BSC (2007)
6. Fight Club: Jeff Cronenweth, ASC (1999)
7. The Dark Knight: Wally Pfister, ASC (2008)
8. Road to Perdition: Conrad L. Hall, ASC (2002)
9. Cidade de Deus (City of God): César Charlone, ABC (2002)
10. American Beauty: Conrad L. Hall, ASC (1999)
1. The Assassination of Jesse James by the Coward Robert Ford (Deakins)
12. Tie: In the Mood for Love (Christopher Doyle, HKSC, and Mark Li Ping-bin) and Pan’s Labyrinth (Guillermo Navarro, ASC)
13. The Lord of the Rings trilogy (Andrew Lesnie, ASC, ACS)
14. Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind (Ellen Kuras, ASC)
15. Gladiator (John Mathieson, BSC)
16. The Matrix (Bill Pope, ASC)
17. The Thin Red Line (John Toll, ASC)
18. The Diving Bell and The Butterfly (Kaminski)
19. Slumdog Millionaire (Anthony Dod Mantle, BSC, DFF)
20. Tie: Eyes Wide Shut (Larry Smith, BSC) and Requiem for a Dream (Matthew Libatique, ASC)
21. Kill Bill (Robert Richardson, ASC)
22. Moulin Rouge (Donald M. McAlpine, ASC, ACS)
23. The Pianist (Pawel Edelman, PSC)
24. Hero (Doyle)
25. Black Hawk Down (Slawomir Idziak, PSC)
26. O Brother, Where Art Thou? (Deakins)
27. Babel (Rodrigo Prieto, ASC, AMC)
28. Lost In Translation (Lance Acord, ASC)
29. Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon (Peter Pau, HKSC)
30. The Curious Case of Benjamin Button (Claudio Miranda, ASC)
31. The Man Who Wasn’t There (Deakins)
32. The New World (Lubezki)
33. Sin City (Robert Rodriguez)
34. Atonement (Seamus McGarvey, ASC, BSC)
35. Munich (Kaminski)
36. The Prestige (Pfister)
37. Memoirs of a Geisha (Dion Beebe, ASC, ACS)
38. The Aviator (Richardson)
39. Zodiac (Harris Savides, ASC)
40. The Insider (Dante Spinotti, ASC, AIC)
41. Gangs of New York (Michael Ballhaus, ASC)
42. Tie: Brokeback Mountain (Prieto) and The Fountain (Libatique)
43. The Fall (Colin Watkinson)
44. The Passion of the Christ (Caleb Deschanel, ASC)
45. Snow Falling on Cedars (Richardson)
46. House of Flying Daggers (Xiaoding Zhao)
47. Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow (Eric Adkins)

Nice

That's based on thousands of voters from around the world, too.

 

[FlawlessVictory]

Exclusive: 'Batman 3' Cinematographer Hopes To Shoot 'Whole Movie In IMAX'

'I like IMAX more than I like 3-D,' says Wally Pfister, Christopher Nolan's director of photography.

By Eric Ditzian

Early on in the "Inception" preproduction process, director Christopher Nolan and director of photography Wally Pfister had a conversation that dragged on for weeks: After shooting a portion of "The Dark Knight" in IMAX, would they also shoot their Leonardo DiCaprio-starring thriller in the large-scale film format?

"Finally I had to tell Chris that the way he was describing the film, so much of it wanted to be with a handheld camera and kind of running around," Pfister told MTV News. "That's just not physically possible with the IMAX camera. We ruled out shooting in IMAX."

Their thinking on how to shoot "Batman 3," however, might turn out to be vastly different. "I can't say until I read the script, but it would certainly be my preferred, amazing goal to shoot the whole movie in IMAX," Pfister said.

That sentiment jibes with rumors from last summer that suggested the next "Batman" could indeed be shot all in IMAX. At this point, though, Pfister is waiting to get his hands on the script and to find out when the threequel will shift into production. When it does, he's hoping to work with IMAX cameras and hoping to avoid 3-D ones.

"I must say I'm a huge IMAX fan. I like IMAX more than I like 3-D," he explained. "Chris' films are so densely layered and have so much going on visually in every way that IMAX helps enhance that because of the scope and the scale of it — it becomes a much larger canvas to paint on. That's what we found on 'Dark Knight.'

"I'm not a big fan of 3-D," he continued. "I liken it to my View-Master I had 40 years ago. Are you really getting more out of the story with 3-D? When you separate those different planes and you're creating artificial depth, it looks phony to me."

Nolan hasn't jumped on the 3-D bandwagon either, saying in June, "I'm not a huge fan of 3-D." Still, any decisions about how to shoot "Batman 3" will ultimately involve Warner Bros. and will certainly wait until Nolan and Pfister sit down and have a discussion similar to the one they had in the run-up to "Inception."

"We usually have lunch and he asks me, 'Tell me what your thoughts are,' " Pfister said. "It's very casual. It's not very technical. And then we start to build toward, 'How are we going to shoot this? Where are we going to shoot this?' My preproduction is about four months long before principal photography begins.

"I can't imagine how we're going to step it up [after 'Inception']," he added. "But we will."

http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1644026/20100720/story.jhtml

 

[Anita18]

http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1644026/20100720/story.jhtml

Go Wally, you can do it!

 

[Crook]

Even if they got the IMAX cameras down to a reasonable weight, which was always a big concern, isn't the loudness still a problem? I recall that Nolan isn't a fan of ADR. This would be required for practically all non-action scenes would it not?

 

[jmc]

I guess it would depend on the sounds guys. Perhaps some technique is possible to reduced the noise.

 

[acid bath]

I'm glad they're not really considering 3D as an option. To me, 3D in films seems more like a distraction than something to enhance the experience. I don't think Batman is the right kind of film for it anyway.

 

[Anita18]

I guess it would depend on the sounds guys. Perhaps some technique is possible to reduced the noise.

I think the only real way to do it I think is to muffle the camera itself, add things to the body to decrease the sound of the film coming out.

Maybe we'll see some production photos of the camera covered in foam.

 

[Jokers_Wild]

I would so hit that up in IMAX over and over. Love to see it without the shifting formats.

 

[Brother Jack]

I think the only real way to do it I think is to muffle the camera itself, add things to the body to decrease the sound of the film coming out.

Maybe we'll see some production photos of the camera covered in foam.

They could end up inventing something similar to that, if they are adamant about shooting in all IMAX.