Superman in 3D

Exactly.

This film may actually have a chance at being shot with 3D IMAX cameras...Hmm?

Who knows though. Regardless, if they can shoot the film using 3D cameras, I would prefer that far more than seeing it post converted to 3D.

It's not quite as simple as using a 3D camera the same way you would a regular camera, though. While you're shooting, you have to think about convergences, and certain wide-angle lenses won't work stereoscopically...stuff like that. It can set up limitations that aren't there when shooting with a regular single camera, and some filmmakers don't want that, understandably. It can also affect editing if you're changing convergence ratios and all sorts of things with faster cuts that are invariably going to hurt the eyes of the viewers in 3D.

So to shoot 3D or not should probably still be left to the sole decision of the filmmaker until those issues can be worked around or eliminated. As for post-conversions...there are some very good ones out there if the studio wants to take the time and money to utilize it, instead of just rushing it out there to charge higher ticket prices.
 
I don't know if filming Superman using Digital 3D is going to give us the best quality.

A lot of the digital cameras being used still have that ghosting feel when you see people move on the screen. I think even Green Lantern is using Digital and not film. The Green lantern footage looks a bit too glossy for my taste.

Digital quality is stunning, but it still isn't perfect enough like 35mm film. The reason digital video is used for 3D is because they don't have to wait to process any film, they can see results straight away.

A prime example of awful digital video is the Star Wars Attack of the Clones prequel, that digital filming was awful, you could tell it was all green screen, and it had zero warmth in its quality.

Even Superman Returns didn't have the warmth of 35mm film with the Genesis camera. Then again, maybe Synder can suprise us all.

Its one of the reasons why Nolan only uses 35mm film or 70mm IMAX film for his movies. He doesn't accept digital video as good enough to match film.
 
JAK®;19998955 said:
No, you're just on the 'I hate 3D' bandwagon instead.
No, I just prefer watching films without it.

How's that?
 
I get quadruple vision and headaches about 15 minutes into any 3D movie. I loathe the format, I loathe it's popularity, and if it was up to me, I would be able to see every big blockbuster in imax without having to suffer from such a poor gimmick.

I would much rather hollywood focus on developing the technology to film everything in imax.
 
No, I just prefer watching films without it.

I'm the same mate, I find 3D to be pretty annoying and should only be used on special short projects. For me it takes me out of the movie.
 
I'd be all for 3D if they use the Epic system from Red that is being used for Spider-Man and also The Hobbit. The resolution on those babies is incredible. I'd want the film actually filmed that way, otherwise I've never been all that impressed by the conversion-style 3D that I've seen (Superman Returns, Clash of the Titans, etc.). If they aren't going to film it in 3D, then I'd be beyond stoked to see it done with select scenes in IMAX. I'm about even on true 3D and full IMAX from a spectacle standpoint. The IMAX scenes in Dark Knight were every bit as impressive (in a full IMAX theater) as the 3D stuff for Avatar. If it just comes out in 2D, I'll probably be impressed, either way. Snyder doesn't make movies that are boring visually. At least it'll look pretty.


Shooting the movie in 3d means that they'll have to use digital cameras , be it the Red ONe currently being used for Hobbit, Spider-man and the Alien Prequel or the Pace-Fusion system ( Avatar , Tron Legacy , Resident Evil ).
ANd while the cameras are getitng better , the problem lies with the framerate. I've bought the most recent issue of CINEFEX which has an article on Sucker Punch. Snyder explained that while he had considered using digital cameras , he also wanted to shoot superslomo shots and he couldn't do that with digital cameras. There are certain scenes in Sucker Punch that were filmed with 600 FPS.



IMAX , while visually impressive , presents a MAJOR challenge. Rendering images at that resolution is simply impossible right now. If i'm not mistaken IMAX has a resolution of 18K whereas the maximum resolution at which CG images can be redendered is 8-10 K.
Nolan has the advantage that he shoots alot of stuff practicaly meaning that there is very little CG work to be done and therefore "large portions of the ,movie can beshot in that format ".. It's a different beast when you have to create complex CG images at that resolution. Just ask the guys at ILM. The forest fight between Optimus and the decepticons as well the devastator sequence really pushed that tech. to the limit.
 
Exactly.

This film may actually have a chance at being shot with 3D IMAX cameras...Hmm?

Who knows though. Regardless, if they can shoot the film using 3D cameras, I would prefer that far more than seeing it post converted to 3D.

3d IMAX cemras don't even exist.
IMAX cameras require film and whereas 3d cameras are digital cameras.
 
I don't know if filming Superman using Digital 3D is going to give us the best quality.

A lot of the digital cameras being used still have that ghosting feel when you see people move on the screen. I think even Green Lantern is using Digital and not film. The Green lantern footage looks a bit too glossy for my taste.
Ghosting could be the result of a lot of different things...but isn't inherent to digital cinema cameras shooting in their proprietary formats. You can get it from DSLR's shooting AVC/H.264 compressed codecs, as well as some HDV/DCCProHD camcorders. Or it could be something with the projector.

What can also happen is you get 'motion artifacts' if you start messing with a digital camera's 'shutter angle'. In some cameras, it's not as intuitive as it is with a physical film camera...so if you're going for a narrow-shutter-angle, 'choppy' look like in Saving Private Ryan...or if you're doing speed processing...digital can sting you. And a large screen can amplify that.

But if shot well, chances are that most people would have a hard time distinguishing digital from 35 these days if they didn't already know which was which.

Digital quality is stunning, but it still isn't perfect enough like 35mm film. The reason digital video is used for 3D is because they don't have to wait to process any film, they can see results straight away.

A prime example of awful digital video is the Star Wars Attack of the Clones prequel, that digital filming was awful, you could tell it was all green screen, and it had zero warmth in its quality.

Even Superman Returns didn't have the warmth of 35mm film with the Genesis camera. Then again, maybe Synder can suprise us all.
Star Wars was shot on the earliest CineAltas...I'm not sure what kinds of lenses they were able to use, but I assume they had PL-mount adapters. Most high-end digital cinema cameras now come with standard PL-mounts so that you can use the full range of 35mmm camera lenses with the right focal-lengths. And lenses are a huge part of giving 35mm it's 'look'.

Superman Returns' look was more a result of the final color timing than the camera itself. That Genesis is capable of shooting things just as bright and clear as any system...the Red, the Arri Alexa. That dark, muddled look was what they went for...why, it still boggles the mind.


Its one of the reasons why Nolan only uses 35mm film or 70mm IMAX film for his movies. He doesn't accept digital video as good enough to match film.
Some of it depends on taste, but I'll agree that film still has a certain 'texture' to it...and often when I'm working with digital, I find it too clinical in its base/raw form and feel the desire to add some 'grain' when doing color-timing. I liken 35 to painting on a 'canvas', as opposed to airbrushing a smooth surface, or even photoshopping.

But it does keep advancing, and even today, it's capable of getting a '35mm-quality' image if you put the work into it....and especially if you light well. There's still stuff that happens in the blue channel that's inherent to the process and is pretty technical, especially in low lighting conditions, but it's improving. 3D almost has to be shot in digital because it's the only way to keep the dual-camera or dual lens rigs controllable....and not spend twice as much on film stock. Plus, you can at least preview the footage on-set, so you have specific 3D technicians checking convergence and stuff right there. Can't really do that with 35.
 
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No, I just prefer watching films without it.

How's that?
Okay, then accept that maybe, just maybe, people like 3D because they enjoy it and are excited about the technology, and are not just on a bandwagon.
 
I don't know if filming Superman using Digital 3D is going to give us the best quality.
True.


A lot of the digital cameras being used still have that ghosting feel when you see people move on the screen. I think even Green Lantern is using Digital and not film. The Green lantern footage looks a bit too glossy for my taste.
It depends on the camera as well as how as well as who is using it.
GL is shot on film , not digital cameras.
I still don't know if it's being going the route of Clash of the Titans /Potter , which is to create the movie in 2d and once that's finished , convert it to 3d , or the route of Alice in Wonderland , which to shoot live-action plates in 2d and convert them whereas the CG footage is created in 3d from the start.
Plus the RED ONE camera has made huge advances. Why else would it be used on projects like Spider-man or Hobbit or Prometheus. Guys like Peter Jackson or Ridley Scott know their **** and they aren't going to use half assed cameras on their projects.
As for the GL footage looking to glossy , i think that the images need to have some grain to sell that realism. Snyder often does just that.


Digital quality is stunning, but it still isn't perfect enough like 35mm film. The reason digital video is used for 3D is because they don't have to wait to process any film, they can see results straight away.
Again , depending on the camera. Plus if you have a Oscar winning cinematographer like Roger Deakins raving about digital , i do think digital cameras are coming very close to what you can achieve with 35 mm .

A prime example of awful digital video is the Star Wars Attack of the Clones prequel, that digital filming was awful, you could tell it was all green screen, and it had zero warmth in its quality.
I blame that on Lucas
 
I don't know if filming Superman using Digital 3D is going to give us the best quality.

A lot of the digital cameras being used still have that ghosting feel when you see people move on the screen. I think even Green Lantern is using Digital and not film. The Green lantern footage looks a bit too glossy for my taste.

Digital quality is stunning, but it still isn't perfect enough like 35mm film. The reason digital video is used for 3D is because they don't have to wait to process any film, they can see results straight away.

A prime example of awful digital video is the Star Wars Attack of the Clones prequel, that digital filming was awful, you could tell it was all green screen, and it had zero warmth in its quality.

Even Superman Returns didn't have the warmth of 35mm film with the Genesis camera. Then again, maybe Synder can suprise us all.

Its one of the reasons why Nolan only uses 35mm film or 70mm IMAX film for his movies. He doesn't accept digital video as good enough to match film.
i think you should tell this to Roger Deakins because it looks like he didnt do hes homework.

http://www.slashfilm.com/roger-deakins-digital-35mm-im-ill-film/
 
Shooting the movie in 3d means that they'll have to use digital cameras , be it the Red ONe currently being used for Hobbit, Spider-man and the Alien Prequel or the Pace-Fusion system ( Avatar , Tron Legacy , Resident Evil ).
ANd while the cameras are getitng better , the problem lies with the framerate. I've bought the most recent issue of CINEFEX which has an article on Sucker Punch. Snyder explained that while he had considered using digital cameras , he also wanted to shoot superslomo shots and he couldn't do that with digital cameras. There are certain scenes in Sucker Punch that were filmed with 600 FPS.
The Phantom is pretty-much specifically designed for high-speed shooting and is in pretty wide use. Especially nature programs. It can get up to 1000 fps. the only thing is that it has a max resolution of 1920x1080 for 1000fps....only 1280x720 @ 1500 fps. Fine for broadcast/hdtv if you're just transferring the shot over. But for heavy keying/greenscreening..you'd like to start with more. Although even Star Wars and SR were shot @ 1920x1080, and they did okay with greenscreen...albeit not at those frame rates. You can also get some 'pulsing' as you start shooting really high framerates in digital, because of the heat buildup on the sensor, so that may be another reason why it didn't lend itself to effects work...since the brightness of the image would seem to oscillate. the Red is still kinda' f'd up in the way it handles high-speed stuff.

Plus the RED ONE camera has made huge advances. Why else would it be used on projects like Spider-man or Hobbit or Prometheus. Guys like Peter Jackson or Ridley Scott know their **** and they aren't going to use half assed cameras on their projects.
As for the GL footage looking to glossy , i think that the images need to have some grain to sell that realism. Snyder often does just that.
The newer Mysterium sensor on the Red has really helped that camera's image. With the older one, you got more noise in the blue channel and some other artifacts. The first Red Epics are out there ow (Spiderman, I think), so I look forward to seeing how those turn out.
 
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i find it funny how everyone who is complaining about digital cameras is always ignoring the last Fincher movies. of course its hard to be a fan of Fincher and complain about digital right? i guess the best way is to just ignore hes digital movies.
 
i find it funny how everyone who is complaining about digital cameras is always ignoring the last Fincher movies. of course its hard to be a fan of Fincher and complain about digital right? i guess the best way is to just ignore hes digital movies.
It really comes down to the comfort/taste of the filmmaker, and what he and his DP are more comfortable using. If a filmmaker wants to use 35 over digital, it's not because he's behind the times or what have you. He may have a look in mind that's inherent to celluloid without having to add it in post.

Heck, even looking at that Planet Earth series....there's nothing in there that was shot on HD that makes you say "it would have looked so much better if shot on film".

Given the choice, and budget nothwithstanding...I'd still choose film over digital for some projects. But I wouldn't feel handicapped in any way if I had to shoot on Red or the Arri, either. 35mm and above is starting to become a sort of 'badge of honor' for some filmmakers...and that's a bit dubious with how far things have developed, and will continue to.
 
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The point is, with every new technology, everyone points out when it fails and ignores when it succeeds.

You can make an ugly film with 35mm as well.
 
JAK®;20001139 said:
The point is, with every new technology, everyone points out when it fails and ignores when it succeeds.

You can make an ugly film with 35mm as well.

Like with CGI.
 
The best was when Superman Returns came out, and people were blaming the camera....or Singer's decision to use the Genesis...for it looking so bad. When there's films like Apocalypto that were shot on the same camera...and with DP's like Spinotti and Tattersall. They wouldn't use an inferior tool.
 
but there is a difference betwen the design and the camera. was someoene complaining that Superman Returns looked digital?


i am now realizing that Superman will be post converted. i am now 95% sure.
 
Superman returns was ugly because Bryan Singer decided to go with a soft lens throughout the entire movie and gave the entire thing that über-desaturated look that made the whole movie look like foggy mud.
 
Shooting the movie in 3d means that they'll have to use digital cameras , be it the Red ONe currently being used for Hobbit, Spider-man and the Alien Prequel or the Pace-Fusion system ( Avatar , Tron Legacy , Resident Evil ).
ANd while the cameras are getitng better , the problem lies with the framerate. I've bought the most recent issue of CINEFEX which has an article on Sucker Punch. Snyder explained that while he had considered using digital cameras , he also wanted to shoot superslomo shots and he couldn't do that with digital cameras. There are certain scenes in Sucker Punch that were filmed with 600 FPS.

Didn't Snyder imply that Superman would have less slo-mo than his other movies though?

Also, even though I hate to cite the Resident Evil movies as an example, the 3D cameras certainly did not stop Paul WS Anderson from filming 3/4 of Resident Evil Afterlife in slow-motion.
 
Superman returns was ugly because Bryan Singer decided to go with a soft lens throughout the entire movie and gave the entire thing that über-desaturated look that made the whole movie look like foggy mud.

It wasn't the lens...and it wasn't a fog/mist filter. It was how it was color-timed and image-adjusted for final. You don't shoot foggy/muddy images if you're going to combine them with special effects later on in post.
 
but there is a difference betwen the design and the camera. was someoene complaining that Superman Returns looked digital?


i am now realizing that Superman will be post converted. i am now 95% sure.

It's was more like people blaming digital for it looking bad.

Snyder may change his mind by the time he starts filming...but from the sounds of it, he's not a fan of shooting 3D, so it'll have to be post-converted.

Also, even though I hate to cite the Resident Evil movies as an example, the 3D cameras certainly did not stop Paul WS Anderson from filming 3/4 of Resident Evil Afterlife in slow-motion.
It depends on just how slow you want to go. In a lot of films, just going 1/2x speed is very noticeably slow-motion....and that's only 48 fps. Even going up to 1/3x speed, most digital cinema cameras can handle that okay, although some have to do it at a lower resolution. But when you're talking about 300 fps +, you need some specialized digital cameras to do that....and it starts to effect the image. 600 fps is 1/25x speed! We're talking being able to see a fly's wings beating. By that point, the digital super-high-speed camera starts to introduce some weird image artifacts that causes the image to look different than your regular-speed stuff. A super-high-speed film camera doesn't suffer from those kinds of artifacts because it's not using an electronic sensor to capture the image.

So even if other movies have shot digital and done some slo-mo, it may not be the super-slo-mo that someone else needs to capture.
 
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no news on 3D cameras means that they will film with normal cameras. and this means that it will be post-converted. and since i found out that i will only get Thor in 3D i am now f... up for Superman.
 
no news on 3D cameras means that they will film with normal cameras. and this means that it will be post-converted. and since i found out that i will only get Thor in 3D i am now f... up for Superman.

I saw Thor last night in 3D.
I was blown away.
Even with a predictable and just average story, the movie was amazing.

They have to do Superman in 3D!
They just have to!
Even the classic costume will look awesome in 3D!
 

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