Doctor Who - Not a Hugging Type of Thread

[Manic]

Don't forget Five shooting a Cyberman in the chest

And I seem to remember Four dropping a bomb into somebody's pocket

 

[Llama_Shepherd]

The only Doctors who I think are genuinely averse to violence are Eight, Nine and Eleven. Eight because I subscribe to the same interpretation that Moffat does in that he is genuinely just not that kind of man, he can be pragmatic, but he'd not be cruel. Nine would avoid violence because of his recent actions in the war and Eleven because his life was like that of a fairytale character, and he surrounded himself with children.

 

[Manic]

Eleven also surrounded himself with the Paternoster Gang, a big game hunter, and a gun-toting wife. He also fitted his sonic screwdriver to knock people down, and hypnotized the entire human race into killing the Silence on sight.

 

[Mr_336]

The only Doctors who I think are genuinely averse to violence are Eight, Nine and Eleven. Eight because I subscribe to the same interpretation that Moffat does in that he is genuinely just not that kind of man, he can be pragmatic, but he'd not be cruel. Nine would avoid violence because of his recent actions in the war and Eleven because his life was like that of a fairytale character, and he surrounded himself with children.

You can exclude 8 seeing as the novels had him kill a guy execution style, kicked another to his watery grave and whailed on another one after seeing his daughter die in front of him. Plus had to used some Venusian Akkido to restrain Destrii (while in Izzy's body) albeit briefly

 

[Manic]

Here's something incredibly messed up Nine did once...

He got on the phone, told Mickey how to access the UK's missiles and target Downing Street, then conveniently decided the decision to use the missiles was out of his hands now that he told everyone else what to do and how to do it.

 

[Mr_336]

Here's something incredibly messed up Nine did once...

He got on the phone, told Mickey how to access the UK's missiles and target Downing Street, then conveniently decided the decision to use the missiles was out of his hands now that he told everyone else what to do and how to do it.

This especially!

 

[OriginalMiles]

Spoiler

If the moon doesn't hatch in 2049, I will be disappointed.

 

[Upset Spideyfan]

The only Doctors who I think are genuinely averse to violence are Eight, Nine and Eleven. Eight because I subscribe to the same interpretation that Moffat does in that he is genuinely just not that kind of man, he can be pragmatic, but he'd not be cruel. Nine would avoid violence because of his recent actions in the war and Eleven because his life was like that of a fairytale character, and he surrounded himself with children.

Eleven seemed actually pretty okay with violence. He blew up Solomon for one with missiles, intentionally caused a crossfire between the Headless Monks and Anglican army, for starters just off the top of my head.


EDIT:

Spoiler

For all the references to Pertwee and the such, the 12th Doctor reminds me most of Six and the First Doctor with a touch of Seven.

The scene where Clara told him to shut up was electrifying. I don't know if these types of deconstructions (such as when Danny addressed him as Sir) will be able to sustain Capaldi's entire tenure but they are certainly making for something unique. Also humanity was really lucky that there was a second egg there otherwise Earth would have been pretty boned.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

This reminded me of "The Girl Who Waited."

The Doctor does something so a-holish that it breaks the faith of the companion. Doctor: "That is how I travel."
Rory: "Well then, I do not want to travel with you!"

So I guess Clara is definitely outgrowing the Doctor. Hopefully she gets to leave on a strong note that Amy and Rory didn't.

Danny seemed really supportive though I know they are going to release what happened to him pretty soon I guess.

I wonder if he is from the Netherspere and apart of Missy's plan to keep them together.

 

[TheNextNolan22]

Clara really is outgrowing the Doctor and coming into her own. Clara is already an all-time favorite companion of mine and this episode, nay, this series has cemented that.

 

[Spade]

The Caretaker's problem was a weak outside conflict; the love triangle had clever writing and direction, while the Blitzer's displayed threat level never matched the Doctor's distress. Kill the Moon's problem is the reverse. The holes in the plot are even bigger than the craters made in the Moon, and it doesn't give the difficult decisions it presents the respect of a decent conclusion. The good parts lean heavily on Coleman and Capaldi's acting chops. Jenna particularly; she conveys that sense of betrayal so well it overshadows the bad judgment Clara shows in chasing off the Doctor.

Truth be told, I didn't always get the animosity around Moffat. The man has a ear for the poetic and a talent for dense narratives. But as I get more into this series, it's become annoying how often these stories resort to plot conveniences thinly veiled in optimistic overtones. Finding light at the end of dark tunnels is one thing. Using beautiful thoughts to mask flimsy logic is another. I don't get the "it's just a kid's show" excuse, either. It's been written for teens and upwards for a while now.

 

[SpideyFan866]

Clara really is outgrowing the Doctor and coming into her own. Clara is already an all-time favorite companion of mine and this episode, nay, this series has cemented that.

This. These past three episodes almost completely made up for my feelings towards 'Listen' (as far as Clara is concerned), and made me fall in love with Clara again.

[YT]UPw-3e_pzqU[/YT]

And I really feel like modern day Clara is gaining a definitive identity outside of being "The Impossible Girl". And I must say, [BLACKOUT]I've never seen a companion lay into the Doctor, and call him out on his ******** the way Clara did in this episode. And even though it came from a place of anger, there was some real malice to it. Which, is something I've never seen a companion have for the Doctor. She basically told him to "Get the **** off our planet, and don't come back". And for a minute, you REALLY believe she meant it. But of naturally, she regretted it immediately afterward. [/BLACKOUT]

 

[Primal Slayer]

I loved the dynamic between the Doctor and Clara in this episode. I know they will eventually kiss and make up but I kind of don't want them to. I would be ok with Clara staying pissed at the Doctor and have him gain another companion only to run across Clara a little later and have them patch things up and move on.

 

[TheVileOne]

and Danny wasn't as obnoxious with HIS behavior towards the Doctor?

"YES SIR!"

"OBEYING YOUR ORDERS, SIR!'

"RIGHT AWAY, SIR!'

he was just as much a dick as the Doctor was at that moment...

That was remarkable restraint considering how the Doctor spoke to him. The Doctor should've been slapped.

Clara wouldn't have yelled at the Doctor like this if he looked like Matt Smith.

 

[Two-Face=Badass]

That was an appallingly bad episode, but at least there was Clara's epic smackdown on the Doctor's hypocrisy and paternalism at the end there.

 

[RetroNaz]

Did you guys actually watch the same episode as me? A bad episode? You've got to be kidding me.

 

[Matt]

Eleven also surrounded himself with the Paternoster Gang, a big game hunter, and a gun-toting wife. He also fitted his sonic screwdriver to knock people down, and hypnotized the entire human race into killing the Silence on sight.

Yeah, Eleven definitely was not adverse to violence. He preferred not to use it, but no matter what Llama's revisionist painting of Eleven is, he had no problem using violence when necessary (or even if he was pissed off enough...what he did to Solomon for example).

 

[TheComicbookKid]

Anyone think the next companion should be some form of a soldier? Medical or otherwise?

 

[THUNDERSTRIKE]

My favorite line of Kill the Moon coming from Clara...

"tell what you knew, Doctor, or else I'll smack you so hard, you'll regenerate..."

that's one pissed companion...

 

[Two-Face=Badass]

Did you guys actually watch the same episode as me? A bad episode? You've got to be kidding me.

It was pretty awful, even by Doctor Who standards. Lots of moral weirdness, odd abortion debate stuff that even if unintentional was so everpresent that something should have been there to mitigate it, a premise so laughably terrible (humanity will never ever go to space if we don't see a giant butterfly lay another moon) that it manages to snap belief (and it takes a lot to snap belief in Doctor Who). Worst of all is that it present Clara's choice - to screw over humanity's own choice and let the thing live - as a good thing, despite there being no evidence or known possibility that millions or even billions of people wouldn't die from the resulting loss of the moon and the enormous pieces of moon-egg crashing down to Earth. The fact that it worked out all dandy well came out of nowhere and was completely unearned.

In effect, it was like an awful bizarro mirror version of the Beast Below - where Amy chose a third option that let the beast live, because she saw from evidence that things were not what they seemed. Here, that things were not as they seemed was entirely unforeseeable, and rather than find a third option or be clever Clara instead gives a great screw you to democracy and humanity on the off chance that she won't wipe out the entire planet. It's the moral equivalent of a character deciding whether or not to nuke Russia for 40 minutes, only for it to turn out that when they chose to launch the nukes they accidentally hit the UFOs which were preparing to invade and were the real enemy all along.

It was a story that rewarded the protagonists for entirely unforeseeable events, that otherwise would have gone terribly, founded on a premise so ridiculous and ill-thought out that it didn't work as a Doctor Who episode - think about that for a moment - and instead posited a dilemma that is revealed to have no consequences whatsoever, except some ridiculous spiel that without humanity seeing a giant butterfly create moon 2.0, we would have been apparently 'uninspired' and retreated inwards, which again, even by Doctor Who standards, is insane.

 

[THUNDERSTRIKE]

Kill the Moon was creepy and certainly an eye-opener with Clara not taking s**t from the Doctor any longer and giving him unholy hell at the end... yeah, I believe this might be the beginning of the end of their relationship... and even though I actually dislike Courtney, I was kind of pissed at the Doctor's 'kill her first' attitude... he seems to have a sh**ty attitude about other's lives at times... this IS a darker Doctor... and a bit scatter-brained, at times... whether it's real or an act put on by him, I'm not sure... he almost seems dismissive of people and their feelings, as in the case of Courtney and seems to be more Time Lord than ever... I don't like Courtney along with aspects of her behaviour, but then I don't like how the Doctor is dismissive in trying to make Courtney in feeling better about herself in feeling more confident and special... did you see how she was when she was sitting all slumped over?... she was feeling so depresses and bad because of the Doctor... originally I felt that Courtney should leave the TARDIS, but if Clara leaves, I think Courtney should stay so that she can travel with the Doctor so that they both can help each other to grow up, because they both need help, of a sort... but I don't think Clara and Danny will allow it, ultimately... and as the the concept of the Moon actually being an egg, somehow I find that concept a bit offish and ridiculous... all these years, an egg that now hatches and then lays a new egg?... I just can't accept the idea... it's different, but TOO unbelievable... ... I thought Kill the Moon might have involved Strax, Jenny and Vastra... I thought Strax had something there when he said in a mini-episode, a while ago, "Damn Moon"... maybe he really DID know something there or had a subconscious feeling about it...

 

[Mr_336]

http://drwhocontinuityzone.blogspot.com/2014/10/fantasy-writing-for-dummies-kill-moon.html

 

[Llama_Shepherd]

A lot of what people listed as "violent" I wouldn't class as such. Such as Nine allowing Mickey access to missiles, that isn't an act of cruelty or just wanton violence. We see who he really is in The Parting of the Ways, someone who just can't kill innocents. Or Eleven with Solomon or the Silents, he gave humanity the ability to defend itself and Solomon killed himself really, Eleven just manipulated him, that's not violence. You can like violent people without yourself being violent.

Anyway, I think Clara overreacted at the end of the episode. The Doctor shouldn't be forced to manipulate EVERY situation. Would Clara feel it appropriate when the Doctor went back to the War, she intervened by pushing him away from The Moment? He made her his equal by giving her the decisions that he makes. Something not afforded to very man people. After briefly finding her interesting up to Time Heist, I'm starting to dislike her again.

 

[Upset Spideyfan]

See the thing is the Doctor left her in that situation without all of the information he had (namely that the creature wouldn't be hostile) where millions upon millions of lives were in balance all while leaving her to think she had been abandoned (and therefore would die either way she chose).

She is totally right, that is not respect or how you behave to someone who is supposedly your friend. If he didn't want to make the call then fine but that doesn't justify the pretty terrible way he treated Clara.

 

[Llama_Shepherd]

She had all the information that was available to other humans. If she knew what he knew, he may as well have made the decision.

The Doctor was a dick, but she overreacted.