Fast and the Furious 9: The Fast Saga

[Hunter Rider]

This is all going around in circles, and honestly not a fan of the idea of what sexism is today.

But I do want to discuss this one a bit more. The movie is built around Brian and his undercover job. It follows him, and his interaction with Dom and his sister. The arc of the film belongs to him. The finale is Brian making a choice, one showing a change in him.

I am not saying Dom isn't cool. But how is Han Solo the main character of that movie?

Well I personally have more interest in the first line of this post as you misunderstand me. In my view women not getting equal pay for doing the same job as a man is a disgrace and sexism, the double standards regarding women when it comes to their sex life choices is foul and sexist, and a real issue, actresses turning 35 suddenly being deemed "unattractive" and no longer being offered leads is utter ******** and sexist.....claiming this cartoony movie franchise is sexist because it's killed off a couple of female characters and has more prominent male characters is nonsense and a case of bandwagoning to be cool and diluting the real topics of merit regarding the issue IMO. Ramsey in the Fast & Furious being written like Luther from Mission Impossible is not sexism, Gillian Anderson not being paid equal to David Duchovny is sexism.

Michelle Rodriguez is prostituting a real issue to bump up her paycheck IMO, now I don't begrudge her the money and hope she is in Fast 9, but I am going to call it how I see it, as I do believe sexism is an issue and shouldn't be cheapened by being tossed around in a half baked manner where it's not applicable, it cheapens the true fight.

As for the Dom vs Brian, who is the lead in the first film, I again say that just because it's told from Brian's viewpoint does not make him the main character, by the end we know nothing more about him than we do about Keanu in Point Break, Brian is the same character, he simply gives us a pair of eyes into the world of this larger than life character who is the real main character of the film.

I already said the Han thing wasn't directly correlated to my central point.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Well I personally have more interest in the first line of this post as you misunderstand me. In my view women not getting equal pay for doing the same job as a man is a disgrace and sexism, the double standards regarding women when it comes to their sex life choices is foul and sexist, and a real issue, actresses turning 35 suddenly being deemed "unattractive" and no longer being offered leads is utter ******** and sexist.....claiming this cartoony movie franchise is sexist because it's killed off a couple of female characters and has more prominent male characters is nonsense and a case of bandwagoning to be cool and diluting the real topics of merit regarding the issue IMO. Ramsey in the Fast & Furious being written like Luther from Mission Impossible is not sexism, Gillian Anderson not being paid equal to David Duchovny is sexism.

Michelle Rodriguez is prostituting a real issue to bump up her paycheck IMO, now I don't begrudge her the money and hope she is in Fast 9, but I am going to call it how I see it, as I do believe sexism is an issue and shouldn't be cheapened by being tossed around in a half baked manner where it's not applicable, it cheapens the true fight.

I don't think the quality and size of roles for women in comparison to their male counterparts is bandwagon sexism. This is a topic brought up a lot, and I feel it is more then valid. And blockbusters matter, a lot. Because that is how actors and directors raise their profile and get other films financed.

I think the portray of women and how they are discarded consistently in this series to be a problem.

As for the Dom vs Brian, who is the lead in the first film, I again say that just because it's told from Brian's viewpoint does not make him the main character, by the end we know nothing more about him than we do about Keanu in Point Break, Brian is the same character, he simply gives us a pair of eyes into the world of this larger than life character who is the real main character of the film.

I already said the Han thing wasn't directly correlated to my central point.

That doesn't mean Johnny Utah isn't the main character of Point Break. At best you can say Utah and Bodhi share that role. But the divide is more obvious in the first Fast film imo.

My point with the Han topic is saying Dom stole the show. If you are the main character, you don't steal the show. It is your show. Gal Gadot can't steal Wonder Woman.

 

[Hunter Rider]

I don't think the quality and size of roles for women in comparison to their male counterparts is bandwagon sexism. This is a topic brought up a lot, and I feel it is more then valid. And blockbusters matter, a lot. Because that is how actors and directors raise their profile and get other films financed.

I think the portray of women and how they are discarded consistently in this series to be a problem.

Yes it's a topic brought up a lot, but not always with genuine merit, and in this case I feel it has zero merit, this constant complaining about characters being killed off that goes on across franchises I don't feel has any merit at all, the writers and directors should be free to kill off any character of any gender or race if they want to in their story and not have the crusaders throwing ism's at them.

That doesn't mean Johnny Utah isn't the main character of Point Break. At best you can say Utah and Bodhi share that role. But the divide is more obvious in the first Fast film imo.

We'll just go around in circles with this, so you think Johnny Utah and Brian were the main characters, I think they just held the camera up for the audience to view the main characters, Bodhi and Dom, agree to disagree.

My point with the Han topic is saying Dom stole the show. If you are the main character, you don't steal the show. It is your show. Gal Gadot can't steal Wonder Woman.

Ok, I used the Han line as purely a device to emphasize how much more Dom stood out than Brian, it was never meant to define my argument, it was a throwaway hype line, I retract it.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Yes it's a topic brought up a lot, but not always with genuine merit, and in this case I feel it has zero merit, this constant complaining about characters being killed off that goes on across franchises I don't feel has any merit at all, the writers and directors should be free to kill off any character of any gender or race if they want to in their story and not have the crusaders throwing ism's at them.

I don't think it is idea that it is sinister, but I do think it says something about how obvious disposable the female characters are. They are a throwback like the series. to a time where they are the simply the love interest. Its like Bond without Vesper or Dench's M.

We'll just go around in circles with this, so you think Johnny Utah and Brian were the main characters, I think they just held the camera up for the audience to view the main characters, Bodhi and Dom, agree to disagree.

Ok, I used the Han line as purely a device to emphasize how much more Dom stood out than Brian, it was never meant to define my argument, it was a throwaway hype line, I retract it.

I just did a slide across my living room, and in classic Ole fashion injured my knee. I will never be the same.

 

[dude stannis]

Gal Gadot absolutely stole the show in Wonder Woman. Johnny Depp did as Jack Sparrow. Bruce Willis did as John McClane. Just because they where the protagonists of the story, it doesn't mean they can't be heads and shoulders above their co-stars. Film is a collaborative effort, not just the main character standing on a stage.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Gal Gadot absolutely stole the show in Wonder Woman. Johnny Depp did as Jack Sparrow. Bruce Willis did as John McClane. Just because they where the protagonists of the story, it doesn't mean they can't be heads and shoulders above their co-stars. Film is a collaborative effort, not just the main character standing on a stage.

Jack Sparrow isn't the main character of the first PotC. Thus show stealing.

Also I'd say Willis, while awesome as John, didn't stand heads and shoulders above Rickman. Hans is equally as amazing. I also think Pine gave the best performance in WW, even though I thought Gal was great.

A better example would be something like Daniel Plainview. But again, I don't see that as stealing the show. You are there to watch the tour de force that DDL is. Like how you wouldn't say the main event of a fighting card stole the show, or LeBron James stole the show when he has the best game.

 

[Hunter Rider]

I don't think it is idea that it is sinister, but I do think it says something about how obvious disposable the female characters are. They are a throwback like the series. to a time where they are the simply the love interest. Its like Bond without Vesper or Dench's M.

That's certainly possible but there have only been the same amount of female deaths as male in this franchise, 4 characters disposed of, 2 from each gender, yes there are more male than female characters but that is the nature of a franchise like this, I'd expect it to be that way, I don't think it means they value women in general less though, they just don't see them as an endangered species in the Fast franchise and therefore need to not kill them off so there can be equal amounts of each gender, they are just making a creative call. To me Dom, Letty, Brian and Mia are the 4 Horsem.....people? of this thing, the rest are enhancement talent brought into the territory to pad out the roster!

Y'know it's pretty hilarious when you think about it, this thing started off being about street racing and jacking DVD players, now it's about saving the world from nuclear destruction, absolutely ludicrous trajectory of development, but it's still, at it's core, sparked a fairly interesting little debate tonight.

I just did a slide across my living room, and in classic Ole fashion injured my knee. I will never be the same.

I know you mean Ole Solskjaer but I've been watching a lot of old NWA so initally thought of Ole Anderson..........yet I feel the need to post this Gif!

 

[dude stannis]

Jack Sparrow isn't the main character of the first PotC. Thus show stealing.

Also I'd say Willis, while awesome as John, didn't stand heads and shoulders above Rickman. Hans is equally as amazing. I also think Pine gave the best performance in WW, even though I thought Gal was great.

A better example would be something like Daniel Plainview. But again, I don't see that as stealing the show. You are there to watch the tour de force that DDL is. Like how you wouldn't say the main event of a fighting card stole the show, or LeBron James stole the show when he has the best game.

Literally all of that is besides my point.

 

[Greens]

I think the portray of women and how they are discarded consistently in this series to be a problem.

Why? Why is it a problem? I really don't get why people nowadays feel the need to put some quota on popular movie franchises. If Universal and the film makers want F&F to be male dominated it can be male dominated and there's nothing wrong with that. Let people make the **** they want to make. They don't have to be "forces for change" if they don't want to.

 

[Silvermoth]

You talk like having women on the team is a burden or something they're forced to do. They're not being forced but why would you ignore half your potential customer base?

I reckon she has a point. The franchise has some great women characters. It's a good opportunity to give them a chance to shine

 

[Greens]

You talk like having women on the team is a burden or something they're forced to do. They're not being forced but why would you ignore half your potential customer base?

Fast & Furious is the most testosterone driven franchise out there. Not every film has to hit all demographics equally. I figure their racial diversity already does wonders for the box office.

 

[dude stannis]

It is kind of like saying The Expendables don't have enough female members. If you do load the cast with female stars it becomes something else. Not saying it becomes something worse, but it becomes different.

 

[Roose Bolton]

I know plenty of women who go see these films, not for some kind of representation, but because of all the beefcake on display. It's a shallow draw for the female audience, but these are ultimately pretty shallow films.

 

[Greens]

I hear Diesel hangs dong in FF9.

 

[dude stannis]

Michelle has hanged more dong than the rest of the cast.

 

[The Chris]

And here i was thinking the series did right by women. Bad ass women like Letty and Gisele. Showcase fights for female characters in Furious 6 and 7. Genius hacker characters like Ramsey. The most evil villain (& arguably the best since Shaw isn't a villain anymore) in the series was a woman. Even with deaths haven't as many male favorites gotten killed off as female in this series. I'm counting Vince. I thought for a series that began as pure male fantasy fury they've done women well since the series resurgence.

Could this be a behind the scenes thing?

 

[#root]

They had to remove Gisele as they had no way to explain why she wasn't in the movies that took place after Han's death.

Gisele was only absent in one movie after her introduction and that was Tokyo Drift. There was no need for a retcon. Honestly, it was just dumb to kill her off and then finally deciding to deal with Han's death in the next one. Wouldn't it have been better to have her be there and deal with his death?

As for Letty, she's never really been a good character to be honest. She's just a 'tough chick' who is the romantic interest of Dom. I mean they already killed her off once as a reason for Dom to get back into the racing world.

And it's not like they're just singling out the women, Vince and Han kicked the bucket too. Roman is far less competent than Letty or Ramsey.

Yeah but Han was in 3 more movies after he died .

 

[dude stannis]

Yeah but Han was in 3 more movies after he died .

Yes and it was dumb.

And is Dom really that much deeper than just "tough chick" Letty. This isn't Black Sails we're dealing with here.

 

[Rowsdower!]

Yes and it was dumb.

And is Dom really that much deeper than just "tough chick" Letty. This isn't Black Sails we're dealing with here.

Since you mentioned Black Sails, now I want Toby Stephens to show up as the next "Fast" villain.

 

[Symbiotic]

Edit.

 

[Symbiotic]

New interview with Chris Morgan. Open to the possibility of seeing Brian again, says that there *are* plans for Lucas Black's character Sean Boswell, and promises again to address "Justice for Han."

http://www.torontosun.com/2017/07/10/fate-of-the-furious-writer-says-a-digital-paul-walker-could-return-to-fast-franchise

 

[Silvermoth]

I bet they give Han a brother. Cosmic fast and the furious would be awesome

 

[Mysteryman]

I have not watched Fast And the Furious in the theater since the original.
But if they go into space, I am SO THERE!

 

[Marvolo]

[Yt]g0dg7BVLRAU[/MEDIA]

 

[samsnee]

http://www.vulture.com/2017/08/your-family-is-gonna-love-vin-diesels-fast-and-furious-tour.html

According to Variety, Universal Studios will produce the tour, set to kick off in January, which will feature “re-creations of some of the stunts and cars in the eight-film franchise.”

Maybe they'll recreate the scene where whip a bank vault through public streets, killing innocent bystanders. Or where the tank rolls and pancakes people in their cars. Or a giant wrecking ball smashes police officers who are chasing them.

I enjoy these movies, but family friendly they are not.