World How to make the spiderman web shooters.

[Human Spider]

This is kind of important. The reason is because there are four properties that make it wonderful. Adhesion, strength, sheer thinning, and expansion. Polyurethane matches three of them. If only we could get all four.

But polyurethane aside, if we used tanks in a backpack, we can reduce the expansion factor.

Actually, that Peter Parker is 5'6 in height. It was mentioned in Spectacular Spider-Man Season 1 Episode 3. But I don't think that's important.

 

[UnlimitedSpidey]

The main thing wrong with a tank would be that it will add more weight to what the web will have to hold.

 

[White_widow]

Actually, that Peter Parker is 5'6 in height. It was mentioned in Spectacular Spider-Man Season 1 Episode 3. But I don't think that's important.

Really... dang. I wonder how much that affected it. It would either expand more or less. so I guess the rate is an expansion between 6000-8000x.

As for the adhesive, I scrapped the fishing line thing a while ago. A couple of scientists have created reusable gecko tape that can hold your weight, and the mythbusters created an ascension rig.

http://www.gizmag.com/gecksin-adhesive/21504/

 

[WebShooterGuy]

Hi guys. Newbie here. I was thinking about this idea, and I remembered something about nylon 6,10. It sticks when cooled. I was thinking if you had the brace around your wrist holding the seperate components(Hexanediamine and sebacyl chloride) on either side and then a mixing chamber above your wrist that they would go into, and then they would come out of a tube which has a cooling system, and then the components would come out in the form of sticky nylon. This way it would become sticky as its being fired out. Also, have a small compartment at the back for the fishing line, and you have something that can hold your weight, because the nylon would wrap around the fishing line as it's being fired out. (Maybe a second of a delay to create a small web then the fishing line so it will stick) This compartment would be adjustable, so you could block it off if you just wanted a web to come out. I did a design in school, so I might show you that.
And also have an adjustable nozzle, so you can change from a big web for catching to a small strand for swinging.

Problem is: Not biodegradeable. Correct me if I'm wrong, but other than that I see no other faults.
(Gecko tape has the same problem)

 

[WebShooterGuy]

However, we could use the gecko tape as an adhesive for some Spider-man gloves, which would allow you to stick/climb on any surface.... (Or is that a topic for a different thread?)

 

[Wadaltmon]

Hi guys. Newbie here. I was thinking about this idea, and I remembered something about nylon 6,10. It sticks when cooled. I was thinking if you had the brace around your wrist holding the seperate components(Hexanediamine and sebacyl chloride) on either side and then a mixing chamber above your wrist that they would go into, and then they would come out of a tube which has a cooling system, and then the components would come out in the form of sticky nylon. This way it would become sticky as its being fired out. Also, have a small compartment at the back for the fishing line, and you have something that can hold your weight, because the nylon would wrap around the fishing line as it's being fired out. (Maybe a second of a delay to create a small web then the fishing line so it will stick) This compartment would be adjustable, so you could block it off if you just wanted a web to come out. I did a design in school, so I might show you that.
And also have an adjustable nozzle, so you can change from a big web for catching to a small strand for swinging.

Problem is: Not biodegradeable. Correct me if I'm wrong, but other than that I see no other faults.
(Gecko tape has the same problem)

We had, early on in the process, discussed Nylon 6,10. However, would this not mean you would have to have the substance constantly heated in order for it to cool later?

Also, everyone here, I noticed something interesting.... in one of the posters, we can see that the web is actualyl still attached to the shooter when he fires it. This brought something to mind: how is the web going to break away from the shooter, if it is so strong and cut-resistent?

 

[White_widow]

there is another issue with the nylon. It's biproduct is a strong acid.

The thing about the web being produced and being attached to the shooter: The solenoid valve closing cuts off the solvent from the web. Whenever the web stays connected to the shooter, he has to open the valve again. It's not too big a deal.

 

[WebShooterGuy]

We had, early on in the process, discussed Nylon 6,10. However, would this not mean you would have to have the substance constantly heated in order for it to cool later?

Not necessarily. It sticks when cooled. When it is fired out, it would be warm, and due tothe cooling system, would become sticky. However the acid is a problem.... And I think having a tank would add holding weight needed...
What's this polyurethane idea? If we could somehow have a polyurethane foam or liquid in the container, the heated/cooled when being shot out...

But I still think we should start with the Nylon idea, because it's the closest thing we have right now... It fits the 2 liquid formula theory... Just as a start...

 

[White_widow]

ok. Well, welcome to the forums. the polyurethane idea would be ok if it were nanoglue. It's not though, and it will take a catalyst to cause the expansion to work. As far as we know, there is no catalyst that allows for an instant polyurethane bond.

The acid thing is going to be an issue, and the price will certainly play a factor. The final thing that gives me pause about the nylon formula is where to get the components. Seriously, the only companies that sell this stuff sells it to companies and college.

 

[WebShooterGuy]

I think a formula someone posted was styrofoam, and rubber cement melted together and shot out of the canister. I don't know the details, but check out the other thread about the web formula for more info and a few pics.

It looks like it works, it just needs reinforcement, like the fishing line idea, or something else to add degeadeability, such as a catalyst of some sort that activates after an hour....

 

[White_widow]

It looks like it works, it just needs reinforcement, like the fishing line idea, or something else to add degeadeability, such as a catalyst of some sort that activates after an hour....

Again fishing line wouldn't do us any good. You should try to build a grapnel gun instead with that stuff.

Now as for biodegradability, there is no material that will degrade in an hour, no matter how many dots you put after it. (add degeadeability, such as a catalyst of some sort that activates after an hour....) There are materials that will degrade in the light and become brittle, and there are materials that bacteria eat, but that takes days at least.

1.)What you are talking about is done by making a binding agent in the webbing that evaporates at room temperature.

2.)Another way to do that is to make it water soluble. when exposed to the moisture in the air or when it rains, it will be washed away.

3.)You can make it so that it oxidizes and becomes brittle.

4.) Finally you can make it so that the adhesive loses power at room temperature. There are very few glues that fit this category, but it shouldn't be too hard if you can modify the melting point.

 

[WebShooterGuy]

I would say the best bet would be the binding agent. But how fast would that work?

 

[White_widow]

I don't really know. It's not the method I'm using. I prefer to go by solvents.

 

[WebShooterGuy]

Fair enough. Was it you that suggested the rubber cement and styrofoam idea?

 

[White_widow]

yeah. It's one of the only three ideas we can start with. As far as tensile strength goes, polystyrene is the only one that we can personally manipulate... even if it is brittle... very brittle. I'm hoping that we can use the contact cement to readjust the property. Who knows? Anyway, if that fails, I bet I could find a decent plasticizer. Also, being that people want to swing on this thing, we need a glue that is instant and good on concrete. Contact cement should be good. They bond to oils in the rock that build up.

If things were ideal though, we would be using cellulose. Even in it's non-nanotech form, cellulose could provide us with a polymer that is strong enough to get the job done. Unfortunately, we need a reagent that is kind of a pain in the rear to get.

 

[Wadaltmon]

yeah. It's one of the only three ideas we can start with. As far as tensile strength goes, polystyrene is the only one that we can personally manipulate... even if it is brittle... very brittle. I'm hoping that we can use the contact cement to readjust the property. Who knows? Anyway, if that fails, I bet I could find a decent plasticizer. Also, being that people want to swing on this thing, we need a glue that is instant and good on concrete. Contact cement should be good. They bond to oils in the rock that build up.

If things were ideal though, we would be using cellulose. Even in it's non-nanotech form, cellulose could provide us with a polymer that is strong enough to get the job done. Unfortunately, we need a reagent that is kind of a pain in the rear to get.

It is entirely possible that I will be able to get some cellulose; depending on how much we need.
Also, could you post the graphene obtaining experiment again? I'd like to try it.

 

[WebShooterGuy]

So, we have the idea, we just need the materials?

 

[White_widow]

Where on earth are you going to get cellulose acetate?

The experiment you are looking for is this one.

http://www.chem.umn.edu/services/lecturedemo/info/Magnesium_and_dry_ice.html

You have to make sure that it bonds with the formula though. It can't just float in it.

 

[Wadaltmon]

1. I may be able to get it from my chemistry teacher. Mind you, I can't make any promises, but I can at least try.
2. Thank you for the experiment. I did a bit of research on graphene today, and it looks like it will be very helpful! Thank you!

 

[White_widow]

sounds cool bud. ^^

 

[SilverScarlet]

White widow don't be afraid if its really bulky! Peter Parker failed many times before getting his web shooters to work correctly.

 

[White_widow]

Why would I be afraid if it's bulky? We want it to be big. If it's not, it can't hold all the fluid that we need.

 

[nolder]

I'm new to the forum. I joined just to reply to this thread. This seams super interesting! I wish there was something I could do to help, but I don't remember a lot from high school chemistry. I'm currently a sophomore undergrad at suny purchase. Nice to meet you all.

 

[White_widow]

Welcome Nolder. Nice to meet yah. You might find that this forum is kinda empty. We've split it into the shooters and the webbing on two other forums. You're welcome to join us.

 

[HAVIK]

I'm new to this forum, I joined because it sounds interesting, I would not be good with the formular for the web but I have a lot of good ideas on the design for the shooter