Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. Iain de Caestecker is Leo Fitz

[drod1985]

Could saving Fitz from whatever trauma he's suffered be a major plot point in the beginning of Season 2? Coulson and Skye's blood hold the key to GH325, and Raina has some knowledge of it now as well.

Or, will they let GH325 die with that last vile used on Garrett? Because if they don't, then it opens up way the door to try and heal any team member who gets hurt with the GH325.

 

[Heretic]

They should just let the GH325 go. They've made it a point of blowing up the alien corpse and explaining that Raina only had one vial of serum. They can't leave it out there that there is a Get Out Of Death Free card that can be used on anyone at any time.

 

[Whiskey Tango]

'Agents Of SHIELD' Season 2: FitzSimmons' Future On The Line, Jed Whedon Hints At Fitz's Upcoming Problems

 

[Mask&Cape]

You paint with such a broad brush. "They can defend themselves" describes SO MANY characters...from Rocky Balboa to Godzilla. Yet you think that this one quality makes everyone who has it so similar that you can't tell them apart?

My assumption here (since I have no first hand knowledge) is that everyone goes through basic training, then they branch off into their own areas of interest. It's all about aptitude and desire. A Navy Seal would get more field training and be a better fighter than a Navy mechanic, but both would have gone through basic training. In a fight, there shouldn't be much confusion about who would win.

Basically what you're saying is that there is no difference between the Navy Seal who stormed Bin Laden's compound, and the guy who was the mechanic of the helicopter back at the base, because they both went through basic training. You're suggesting that the guy piloting a drone could pick up a long range weapon and be just as good as our military's best sniper.

I'm not painting with any brush and I never made any "suggestions" any type of navy seal.

And your first paragraph is way off what I said.

S.H.I.E.L.D. is not the navy seals, marines, air force or any of the like.

To the best of my knowledge (open to correction here), at no point in the MCU movies and this series has it ever been stated the every S.H.I.E.L.D. agent or employee is trained itself defense or combat..

The point is made in first episode that FitzSimmons is not suited nor cleared for combat situations.

The show is made more interesting by the fact that only half of them can handle themselves in a fight.

If FitzSimmons were expert marksmen and kung fu champions then Coulson wouldn't need Ward and May.

To be honest, I don't even understand why it is an issue.

It is like criticizing George Lucas for not giving C-3PO a rocket pack and laser cannon.

He isn't that type of character, just like FitzSimmons isn't that type of character.

 

[Heretic]

True...he isn't that type of character. He is an untrained, unprepared for combat agent who has no business being in the field yet has been in the field many times with the fate of the world on his shoulders.

Ward was able to beat up/kill a gang of SHIELD agents...all of which with training. He had more training. He was better than all of them combined. He is not the same as those now dead agents. Fitz has repeatedly been asked to save the world with far less training than those dead agents ever got. I know that this is what the show is saying...and I'm saying that it is no wonder SHIELD was taken over by Hydra.

 

[Mask&Cape]

True...he isn't that type of character. He is an untrained, unprepared for combat agent who has no business being in the field yet has been in the field many times with the fate of the world on his shoulders.

Ward was able to beat up/kill a gang of SHIELD agents...all of which with training. He had more training. He was better than all of them combined. He is not the same as those now dead agents. Fitz has repeatedly been asked to save the world with far less training than those dead agents ever got. I know that this is what the show is saying...and I'm saying that it is no wonder SHIELD was taken over by Hydra.

You've lost here -

I don't recall any moment in the show where combat training would have been any use in one of Fitz's moments of saving the world. Fitz uses his intellect.

I don't get what the problem is.

Fitz does belong in the field because of how many times he has saved the world.

you say it is because having guys like him that HYDRA took over but you're wrong.

it is having guys like him that HYDRA has been stopped.

having guys like Ward is how HYDRA took over.

Sorry, but I don't see any valid agreement against Fitz.

He helps save the world and is not evil. He does not need martial arts or to be a sniper.

 

[Heretic]

Even in grocery stores employees are trained to do other things than what they are usually tasked with doing. They do this in case someone needs assistance, the other person has a basic idea of what to do. SHIELD doesn't have that sort of back-up plan. The "he's never needed to know how to fight at all" excuse doesn't work because no organization worth half a crap would rely on it.

 

[Mask&Cape]

Even in grocery stores employees are trained to do other things than what they are usually tasked with doing. They do this in case someone needs assistance, the other person has a basic idea of what to do. SHIELD doesn't have that sort of back-up plan. The "he's never needed to know how to fight at all" excuse doesn't work because no organization worth half a crap would rely on it.

it isn't an excuse - it's a fact he hasn't needed to know as was proven time and again in the season - he has been in situations where he should have been killed and yet was saved by using his brain (his job on the team) or been saved by Ward, May, etc. (their job)

he has also saved others, including Ward

it wasn't until the episode RAGTAG that he ended up in an inescapable problem, and no amount of basic training would have been any use in a fight against Ward

to face off against Ward in a physical conformation would have meant he would have had to equally trained

there would then be no need for Ward or May if the scientists on the team are also the warriors

that is not this show

 

[Roadkill]

I believe the point Heretic is making is that all SHIELD agents of whatever eventual function would be run through a basic course of instruction including some time on the range familiarizing themselves with firearms. If I'm not mistaken, all FBI agents are run through a type of basic training at Quantico even if they are fated to hang out in a CSI type lab somewhere. This by no means implies that Fitz's skill level would be expected to be at all comparable to specialists like Ward.

 

[Matarreyes]

I agree, Fitz should be able to at least fire a weapon without flinching - I am not expecting him to even hit the target, he is not Ward, but I expect him to be able to try, because at some point every SHIELD agent would learn this absolutely basic thing. He is shown to be more useless in a fight than an average civilian, which is idiotic writing.

 

[reddog271]

I agree, Fitz should be able to at least fire a weapon without flinching - I am not expecting him to even hit the target, he is not Ward, but I expect him to be able to try, because at some point every SHIELD agent would learn this absolutely basic thing. He is shown to be more useless in a fight than an average civilian, which is idiotic writing.

but he can't. its' not who he is. he was special enough that even though he can't even fire a gun shield/Hydra wanted him. that's really the bottom line. we may want him to be one thing but he isn't. I want sky to do most of her scenes topless... but she just won't do it. yeah sucks I know.

 

[SonOfIvaldi]

I agree, Fitz should be able to at least fire a weapon without flinching - I am not expecting him to even hit the target, he is not Ward, but I expect him to be able to try, because at some point every SHIELD agent would learn this absolutely basic thing. He is shown to be more useless in a fight than an average civilian, which is idiotic writing.

He doesn't need a gun, Fitz is SHIELD's MacGyver!!!!

 

[Mask&Cape]

I believe the point Heretic is making is that all SHIELD agents of whatever eventual function would be run through a basic course of instruction including some time on the range familiarizing themselves with firearms. If I'm not mistaken, all FBI agents are run through a type of basic training at Quantico even if they are fated to hang out in a CSI type lab somewhere. This by no means implies that Fitz's skill level would be expected to be at all comparable to specialists like Ward.

I understand his point but the simple fact is that, as red dog says, this is not who Fitz is - and that is just not the way S.H.I.E.L.D. works

S.H.I.E.L.D. is not the FBI, navy seals, etc.

 

[Mask&Cape]

I agree, Fitz should be able to at least fire a weapon without flinching - I am not expecting him to even hit the target, he is not Ward, but I expect him to be able to try, because at some point every SHIELD agent would learn this absolutely basic thing. He is shown to be more useless in a fight than an average civilian, which is idiotic writing.

no it isn't - Fitz is exactly the character they created - it is not bad writing if the character functions as he was envisioned

 

[Mask&Cape]

He doesn't need a gun, Fitz is SHIELD's MacGyver!!!!

Precisely

 

[Whiskey Tango]

I mentioned the basic training thing on the last page if anyone could be bothered to read it instead of arguing at each other. To sum up, even if Shield made all scientists and accountants and whatnot take a firearms course (and it's pretty likely) that still doesn't translate into handling a combat situation without panicking or making rookie mistakes.

I agree, Fitz should be able to at least fire a weapon without flinching - I am not expecting him to even hit the target, he is not Ward, but I expect him to be able to try, because at some point every SHIELD agent would learn this absolutely basic thing. He is shown to be more useless in a fight than an average civilian, which is idiotic writing.

he fired a gun and successfully killed a guy so I guess he met your expectations.

 

[Mask&Cape]

I mentioned the basic training thing on the last page if anyone could be bothered to read it instead of arguing at each other. To sum up, even if Shield made all scientists and accountants and whatnot take a firearms course (and it's pretty likely) that still doesn't translate into handling a combat situation without panicking or making rookie mistakes.

don't be offended - I read it and it is a valid point

I agree that it is possible

to the best of my knowledge it has never been stated in the show or the MCU THAT all agents receive defense or combat training

nor has it been stated that they don't

he fired a gun and successfully killed a guy so I guess he met your expectations.

clearly he didn't meet the expectations - so,me people seem to think being a secret agent means being a fearless adventurer and trained killer

I think having a set of characters who are all trained fighters and full of daring-do would make for a very dull show

 

[marcvader]

Fitz is a rarer commodity than some field agent that are a dime a dozen. I'll take his flinchshot any day of the week if he can get me out of a tight situation with one of his creations.

 

[Mask&Cape]

Fitz is a rarer commodity than some field agent that are a dime a dozen. I'll take his flinchshot any day of the week if he can get me out of a tight situation with one of his creations.

Amen, brother.

 

[Whiskey Tango]

Not offended, just posts at the bottom of a page often get overlooked. No biggie.

Anyway Fitz didn't fumble around with the safety or some crap like that and they even established in the very first ep that they weren't cleared for combat so I'm satisfied with the way it went down.

I think having a set of characters who are all trained fighters and full of daring-do would make for a very dull show

True, plus it makes the non-combatants look all the more heroic when they do pull off something out of their wheelhouse.

 

[Mask&Cape]

Not offended, just posts at the bottom of a page often get overlooked. No biggie.

Anyway Fitz didn't fumble around with the safety or some crap like that and they even established in the very first ep that they weren't cleared for combat so I'm satisfied with the way it went down.



True, it makes the non-combatants look all the more heroic when they do pull off something out of their wheelhouse.

exactly

never heard wheelhouse used to describe the brain new word of the week

 

[marcvader]

exactly

never heard wheelhouse used to describe the brain new word of the week

Wheel house = area of expertise, a particular skill

 

[Mask&Cape]

Wheel house = area of expertise, a particular skill

understood.

cheers

 

[Heretic]

it isn't an excuse - it's a fact he hasn't needed to know as was proven time and again in the season - he has been in situations where he should have been killed and yet was saved by using his brain (his job on the team) or been saved by Ward, May, etc. (their job)

he has also saved others, including Ward

it wasn't until the episode RAGTAG that he ended up in an inescapable problem, and no amount of basic training would have been any use in a fight against Ward

to face off against Ward in a physical conformation would have meant he would have had to equally trained

there would then be no need for Ward or May if the scientists on the team are also the warriors

that is not this show

Most cops go their entire career without discharging their weapon. By your logic, it makes perfect sense to send a cop out on the streets without training.

I'm not arguing about what the show presented...I'm just lamenting the fact that SHIELD had such low standards for things. As I mentioned before...a SHIELD agent shot a superior officer in the Hub while hacking into the organization's computer system to steal secret information....and she faced no consequences for her act. I know that this is how SHIELD operates...and I think it's a shame. It appeared to be a much more serious organization in the films.

 

[Roadkill]

I understand his point but the simple fact is that, as red dog says, this is not who Fitz is - and that is just not the way S.H.I.E.L.D. works

S.H.I.E.L.D. is not the FBI, navy seals, etc.

Seriously? You think that SHIELD agents would be held to a lesser standard than the FBI? Especially agents assigned to an allegedly elite unit that is sent into dangerous situations as a matter of course?