The Dark Knight In your mind, what IS the origin of this version of the Joker?

I was going to write this theory about him being ex-military but felt too lazy. just felt like throwing that out there to maybe spark the thoughts of other people.

It would explain the extensive specific knowledge of weaponry. I've toyed with this idea in the story I'm working on; I did make one of his principal henchmen an ex-military guy, but so far the Joker has been fairly circumspect about his background, partly because I'm still wrestling with it.
 
lol nice one!!
But in all seriousness i think he was a nomadic stick-up guy before he took on the persona of Joker. I compare him to Omar from The Wire. But he was obviously unstable and liked blood-shed a little too much, like Mr Blonde. Maybe he did receive the scars from his "Bosses" after he turned too many jobs into bloodbaths.
 
One day a vagrant walked into Gotham and decided to take it.
That's brilliant.

The Joker never had an origin. Because no matter what he was before, in the movie, he IS the joker.
Here's what I mean.

JokerBatman.jpg

See that right there? It isn't the joker. It's Jack Napier who's been twisted into a bizarre persona, so people call him the Joker. It's Jack Napier as the joker.

Culture%20Shock%20-%20The%20Joker-thumb.jpg

Now look at that. No matter who that man was before, it doesn't matter. Because right now, that person is the joker. No persona. Just the joker.
 
lol nice one!!
But in all seriousness i think he was a nomadic stick-up guy before he took on the persona of Joker. I compare him to Omar from The Wire. But he was obviously unstable and liked blood-shed a little too much, like Mr Blonde. Maybe he did receive the scars from his "Bosses" after he turned too many jobs into bloodbaths.

Yeah, I agree, and this is why I'm more apt to make the henchman a military guy. Crime bosses don't always want their underlings to be too creative, might make them feel too powerful and ambitious.

God, I love Reservoir Dogs.
 
I like this thread. It's fun to speculate about this kind of thing.
 
Yea but if the "ripping off mob dealers" alluded to just the opening of the movie do you really think he would talk about it as though he is bored of doing that? IMO he has been doing that sorta stuff for a while, i mean how could he find it "soooooo boring" after just ONE job?
From the first conversation Bats had with Gordon it was mentioned the Joker had been operating for weeks or months before the opening scene, so maybe that was what he meant, not necessarily to his pre-joker life. But that's my take on it. Sorry, I just don't buy your mobster scenario.
 
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I mentioned it even before it came out, I would compare Joker to Mr Blonde. A proffesional bank robber who was really phychotic and sadistic. Too many jobs turned into blood-baths because of him so his "bosses" taught him a lesson by having his face slashed and leaving him for dead. Then he becomes a nomadic "stick-up" guy similer to Omar Little, hijacking drug-deals and robbing safe-houses and what not. Then the mysterious "Batman" comes onto the scene and inspires this twisted individual to take on the persona of the "Joker", highlighting his disfigurments with make-up to make himself more than just a man, a symbol just like Batman but obviously for the wrong reasons.
 
I also think he gave himself the scars, but I like this idea about him being left for dead by his bosses..
I can´t imagine what his payback to them, might be.

Because he's The Joker, and nobody can mess with him!
 
I absolutly HATE the idea he gave himself both the scars. Having looked at the scars one of them looks like an exit wound of something. The scar on his right looks like its possible he did it himself.
 
The origin of the Joker?
Gary Oldman in The Fifth Element! :D
All kidding aside i was watching that movie and heard a very familiar line said by the man himself: What doesn't kill you makes you stranger

Now did Nolan and his brother put that comment in there as a tongue in cheek or is it really a mainstream saying?
 
Well its an altered version of "what doesn't kill you makes you stronger." which I am sure you knew. But it was a clue to his past, that something happened to him almost near fatal and it made him..well stranger.
 
My personal theory is that he came to being as a result of the events in Batman Begins.

He was a poor art student, desperate for cash, and convinced to do a break-in to make ends meet. The break in was to steal records from a dentist's office. It happened to be the night of the narrows attack. The office happened to be between the narrows and Wayne tower, and thus the water mains burst, unleashing the fear toxin which is what warped his mind initially. My thought is that either the microwave weapon either also made a canister of 'laughing gas' burst, or that it got opened while going nuts from the toxin - swung it around to smash hallucinations. As a result, the two combined and had an unusual effect on him. In this warped drugged state, he either decided he couldn't laugh well enough, or he had to stop laughing, or whatever else, and fan of Van Gogh, took a sharp dental tool to his mouth. He lost conciseness due to the blood loss or what not, got taken to a hospital and stitched up, but awoke amidst the confusion of so many people being treated and such, and slipped away. He had no prior record before the incident and thus, didn't exist in any police database.
 
In my mind, the origin of the joker can be summed up in one quote

"Do you wanna know how I got these scars?"
 
I like the idea of him just being......there, like a devil or something like Jonah suggested. But i also really favour the idea that he was a nomadic stick-guy or whatever. I think this is testement to the Nolans, I think they purposly left his history unknown so us fans could discuss it and throw ideas out there. Thats why i think this portrayal is so unique, it lets the viewer decide for their self.
 
The origin of the Joker?
Gary Oldman in The Fifth Element! :D
All kidding aside i was watching that movie and heard a very familiar line said by the man himself: What doesn't kill you makes you stranger

Now did Nolan and his brother put that comment in there as a tongue in cheek or is it really a mainstream saying?

It is in both cases a pun on the English translation of a famous adage by the German philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche, which is roughly "that which does not kill you only makes you stronger".
 
I would have to say that, for me, his past would be a blend of the Killing Joke (his wife part) and his scar stories. But I am happy that they left that ambiguous.
 
Heath took one-too-many Ambien and took the knife to his own face.

The scares were real. :cmad:
 
For any other villain Id go with the troubled childhood but for the joker I think he was actually a good guy with a good life and then "one bad day" happened. He also has somewhat fighting skills (like when turned on Gambol's bodyguard and Detective Stephens)and knows how to deal with explosives so perhaps he was in the military during sometime in his life.
 
For any other villain Id go with the troubled childhood but for the joker I think he was actually a good guy with a good life and then "one bad day" happened. He also has somewhat fighting skills (like when turned on Gambol's bodyguard and Detective Stephens)and knows how to deal with explosives so perhaps he was in the military during sometime in his life.
See thats what I am saying. He could easily be ex military. Seeing things in war could have easily made him snap. War brings people down to their primal nature.
I say that shrapnel caused one side of his scars and he could have done the other. I think though that mob did the other side.
 
I think he was simply a small time criminal who fell out with the mob at some point, which would explain his disdain for them and all their petty trappings like money and status. Either criminals, or he himself, are to blame for the scars, and after hearing of the "theatrical" Batman, he took it upon himself to design a "look" and start knocking off the mob banks.

The more interesting aspect of his origin I think is where exactly does his philosophy on human nature come from? He seems to me, like someone who was betrayed at some point by another's dishonesty. Somewhere along the way he appears to have lost faith in human beings ability for good, and in order for that to happen, he had to have that faith to begin with IMO. Something happened, perhaps the event that eventually scarred him, where he felt betrayed and taken advantage of by his faith in good people, or someone being "a man of their word." The Greatwun suggested a military past, and to me, that makes alot of sense potentially, war brings out the worst in people and you see up close and personal how terrible we can be. It's also an environment where you have to depend on the word of the next man, that they have your back. Some kind of incident in a situation like that can change your perception of human beings pretty fast. His life's mission is to prove that noone is beyond corruption and evil, and that has to come from some kind of trauma he experienced in his life
 
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I still don't buy the insistence on "one bad day" for this Joker. I do for Alan Moore's, but he's a different character (but I hope all those little goth-emo girls with their horrid fanfiction don't get started on him). I don't see this one as the sort of profile mad killer either, psychotic from childhood. However, his cynicism is far too deeply entrenched and permeating to derive from some tipping point for an essentially nice guy. Even not so nice guys can see the abyss. And even people with fairly "normal" lives can grow up with relatively little faith in human nature (all you have to do is watch the news). I'm sure all of you probably knew in junior high or high school someone very intelligent but standoffish, the sort who might sit at the back of the room with a sneery sardonic smile, probably knowing they were brighter than anyone else there. I do see him as someone who probably has been clinically disturbed for quite a while, and not all forms of clinical disturbance are the result of trauma.

Though I suppose it is encouraging that people are capable of this degree of desire for empathy.
 

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