Comics Is there really any "good" way to get rid a MJ

[Joker]

first, they shouldnt get rid of MJ...second, if they do, some third string villain should kill her...like, Shocker...

 

[JesusOfNazarath]

MJ killed by a Shocker.LOL

 

[3dman27]

ormaybe killed while fighting off a mugger or an attacker during the civil war mistakeing her for an unregistered mutant or super

 

[The Shadow]

have read the latest wizard yall would notice that the Marvel House of Ideas has a very stern and gut wrenching plan for Spidey by the end of civil war. My assumption or my theory rather, is that Spids will indeed reveal his identity...at first...thinking it the correct thing to do...only to have the worst possible outcome affect him.

According to the writers..and I quote "By the end of all of this...there wont be a dry eye among any of our readers"...'it'll really be heart wrenching...emotionally devastating...and will change Spidey for years to come.'

Oh, yeah.....That's just frigg'n wonderful. More changes on top of the other changes they've already made like Gwen, the suit, origin and powers that no one can stand.

They've almost built themselves a whole new character using Peter's name and history. Might as well have kept the clone or really killed him and replaced him with someone new. No, Peter is Spider-Man. Well, this is THEIR Spider-Man not MINE.

I made this suggestion in the other thread and for the most part I think it could work if their so He11 bent on making Peter single again. I'd prefer them not killing her off because of the more than likely chance some hack will bring her back. Here's what I suggested as solution #2.

Here's another "idea" I had that wouldn't involve anything really that would warp continuity and might get things back to where the majority of us would be happy.
Peter is outed during the Civil War by another hero who knows who he is. Mj and May become targets right away for every villain he's ever faced. In an attack Mj is seriously injured or posioned (take your pick) while trying to save May. Mj is either put into suspended animation (like Betty Ross in the Hulk book) OR ends up in a deep coma. Peter and Mj never split up. Peter however is now "single" after an acceptable period of grieving. Mj is not dead and she does go "out" a hero.
Peter learns after the Civil War that the changes he's gone through are a curse. Some new villain behind Morlun and all of the "totem" stuff appears. The situation is finally resolved with the help of Dr. Strange. Peter appears to loose his powers. Through a series of events that unfolds Peter uses this to prove that he was never Spider-Man and that he was set-up to try and protect May and his friends. Another hero helps Peter out by appearing in public as Spider-Man. During or shortly after this Peter's original powers come back because of the curse being "lifted". The original origin of his powers turns out to be true after all. Peter even looses the "organic shooters" and goes back to the old mech. shooters. Because of being outed as Spidey during the Civil War Peter looses his job as a teacher. Ironically after all is said and done Jonah, feeling guilty for how he treated Peter during the Civil War, gives Peter a job at the Bugle as senior photographer.

Now I've also thought that maybe instead of the "coma" thing MJ could still get hurt but develop Amnesia and wouldn't remember Peter or them being married. I know "technically" that would lead probably to a "divorce" of sorts but it still doesn't take away the fact that they did love each other. I mean it wouldn't be like they both of all of a sudden just decided to say the heck with it because we know they've been through so much all ready that they wouldn't leave each other unless something this major happens.

Mj would just eventually develop a whole new personality and life for herself. May and Peter would be the only ones besides some other heroes that Peter was Spidey. Peter would still love Mj but he would realize it's probably for the best that she doesn't remember anything.

 

[Dragon]

Here's what Joe Q recently said about the marriage at Newsarama http://www.newsarama.com/JoeFridays/JoeFridays49.html . It's totally self-contradictory. Which means, he basically doesn't know what to do:

Joe Quesada: Hang on, before we get started on Civil War, I wanted to address something from last week with respect to the whole Spider marriage.

First, a poster by the name of “ThatTalkingGuy” made what I thought was a very good point. He really encapsulated the whole marriage for me.

“What made the Marvel Universe was a bunch of cool, new heroes that had flaws and spoke to people. Spider-Man's flaw wasn't that he was married to a supermodel. And Reed and Sue can get married because Reed and Sue were together since the beginning. They were always a couple, adding a ring doesn't change anything because they are the same. And the kids don't grow. Nor should they ever.

“Peter Parker never was a family man. It perverts the character to make him so. Peter Parker being young and having girl trouble, school problems, work problems, and feeling guilty about the death of his father figure and constantly lying and not being there for his mother figure is relatable. Peter Parker being old, married, with money problems and whining about his luck is pathetic. And Peter Parker being old, married, and content is boring.

“And I think it is kind of funny people are complaining about the status quo. The marriage is the very DEFINITION of the status quo. You can't get rid of the damn thing. It just sits there, adding literally NOTHING to the stories. If anyone can tell me ONE good story that requires Peter and MJ to be married instead of living together or engaged, go ahead. If you can tell me that Spider-Man would have survived if he had married Betty Brant in the early issues of Spider-Man, go ahead”

Well said.

Let me add a few things to this. At the core of the FF, what makes them unique as a superhero team is that they’re a family. That is what lies at the heart of their construction. Now, while it’s nice to see things go well for Peter from time to time, don’t be under any delusion, we write good things into his life only to eventually take them away because that is what makes his stories work. It’s by taking those things away and watching him triumph and do the right thing regardless that really make his character special. Make his life comfortable PERMANANTLY and you hurt the character. The marriage to MJ is a permanent good thing that we added to Peter’s canon. It would be like having Peter win the lottery and not having the ABILITY to have him lose it all.

Here’s a very simplistic off the top of my head idea of how the wedding could have gone down while keeping in character to what Spider-Man stories should be. So Peter and MJ are engaged to be married, everything’s going perfectly for Pete and he’s anxiously awaiting to get married but MJ stands him up at the alter. We think it’s just cold feet or just plain old cruelness on her part and then we find out that one of Spidey’s villains captured her. As MJ’s at death’s door Spidey comes and rescues her and comes to the conclusion that his life is just way too dangerous so he has to let the girl go and break, not only the wedding off, but the relationship. Now, not only is this in keeping to the character of Spidey, it sets us up for Peter and MJ to find each other once again.

Also, Just for the record, because people seemed concerned, killing Mary Jane is not an option, zero zilch, that is one of the reasons why this whole marriage thing is such a tough thing to ever even imagine changing. Let me try to clearly explain what I mean.

First, lets talk about why I feel a youthful Peter Parker is something that was so important. Sure, some people here may say I like Peter married, just write him young and all will be okay. Let me ask you all this, do you remember when you were young, I mean 8, 10 years of age, maybe even 12 or 14. To me when I was that age, it didn’t matter if the person was 21 or 61, a married person always seemed very adult and older to me. It was something that big people did and then they became mommies and daddies. You have to put yourself back in that mind set to understand where I’m coming from.

So, let’s get ourselves in a younger frame of mind for this.

If the goal were to have a more “youthful feeling” Peter Parker, killing MJ is not an option. First of all, she is a major player in the Spider-Man Universe of Aunt May caliber. I will argue until I’m blue in the face that too many of the original cast members were killed off over the years to the point were so much was lost from the world of Spider-Man.

Please don’t get me started on killing Harry, that was just plain dumb. But also, killing MJ would only serve to make Peter feel older and matters worse. Now he’s a widower. Put yourself in that youthful mind set folks, think about it.

While we’re at it, divorce isn’t an option either. Look at it from my perspective, back in the day one of the things that I made clear to my writers who were going to work on Spider-Man was to please for the love of god, let’s show them as a happy loving couple. I wanted to have a title that showed how a strong loving couple could work things out like having Spider powers and just life in general.

In all frankness, it’s been really nice to see. So, divorcing them to me sends out completely the wrong message. Imagine you’re a mom and you’re buying little Bobby or little Betty Spidey Adventures or maybe Spidey Loves MJ and you’re watching the news one day and the broadcaster looks right at you and says, “Spider-Man is getting divorced, more on that after these messages.” Let’s just say that as a parent, I’d be upset by the sound bite, I could only imagine how the rest of the world would feel. And, once again, divorcing Peter would only serve to make him feel older.

And then there’s all the great stories that get inhibited by the marriage. But if you still want to argue about it, let me give you the single simplest and most compelling reason I can give you. Knowing that having a child or getting divorce, annulled, separated, or widowed and all those sorts of things aren’t an option, there is not a single story of a married Peter Parker that can’t be told with a single Peter Parker. On the other hand, the exact opposite isn’t true.

So, these are the obstacles that I look at ever day. Sure there are other ways to go back in time and start all over again, but then you basically tell people that the stories they’ve been reading since the wedding don’t count, not a good thing to do.

Now, I noticed that some folks were saying that they got into Spidey when he was married and it’s been cool with them and they enjoy it. So, to that I would argue that Marvel almost made a huge mistake years ago and Peter and MJ almost ended up with child. Imagine if this had come to fruition in the pages of the regular Universe. Now imagine me years later telling folks that giving Peter and MJ a child was a terrible mistake because it makes him seem even older and completely separated from what was at the core of making the character great. I would have folks telling me that I was wrong, that the kid was a good thing for Spider-Man to have as part of the canon.

So, I would argue that the marriage is exactly the same thing. You have to keep things in perspective; we tend to forget so easily. When Stan and company created the Marvel Universe; they aged Peter very quickly, in real time. But no one then knew that this was still all going to be around 40 plus years later. Back then the prevailing thought was that maybe they’d get four or five years out of a character, max. Somewhere along the line they realized they had to put on the breaks because if they kept going in the manner that they were going, well you can figure it out for yourself.

Okay, I’m done [laughs]

 

[The Joker]

"Peter Parker never was a family man. It perverts the character to make him so. Peter Parker being young and having girl trouble, school problems, work problems, and feeling guilty about the death of his father figure and constantly lying and not being there for his mother figure is relatable. Peter Parker being old, married, with money problems and whining about his luck is pathetic. And Peter Parker being old, married, and content is boring."

Peter Parker can't be all the things he was in Stan Lee's days forever.The character has to mature in some respects.How long could he have school problems or money problems,especially the kind of money problems he had when his only job was being freelance for the Bugle.

Geez if Joe Q had his way,Spidey would be stuck in that same time frame forever.He'd never progress as a character.

And since when has he stopped feeling guilty about Uncle Ben's death??

"Please don’t get me started on killing Harry, that was just plain dumb"

LOL! The guy who gave Sins Past and the Other the green light is dissing one of the greatest deaths in Spidey's history

If Joe Q had a brain cell it would die of lonliness.

 

[LobokDaikon]

They should change the titles of the comics then. Amazing can be The Pathetic Spider-Man and Sensational can be The Boring Spider-Man.

 

[regalredstar]

Have her give up the acting and make her like the MJ from spider-girl would probably be a good idea for the rest of spidey world

~®®§

 

[Citizen_Kaine]

So Joey Q has gone on a recent tirade about the Spider Marriage, because, he's trying to soften us up for whats going to happen real soon in Civil War?

Mr Quesada let me reiterate, If MJ dies or Peter loses the Mask. The Spider comics will be ****ed, you'll be ****ed, and your company will be ****ed. If this indeed happens this portion of the hype will become a No Man's Land because every thread will be about one of those two topics

 

[stillanerd]

So Joey Q has gone on a recent tirade about the Spider Marriage, because, he's trying to soften us up for whats going to happen real soon in Civil War?

Mr Quesada let me reiterate, If MJ dies or Peter loses the Mask. The Spider comics will be ****ed, you'll be ****ed, and your company will be ****ed. If this indeed happens this portion of the hype will become a No Man's Land because every thread will be about one of those two topics

Well, to his credit, Joe Q say that making Peter a widower would be worse, but I sure wouldn't put it past him to have Spidey unmask during Civil War.

Interestingly enough, his "story idea" for how Peter and MJ could not have married not only sounds like what Tom DeFlaco originally wanted, but does seem too complete to be just a random idea (although he does say "time travel" would create additional problems by saying certain stories wouldn't count). Also, it should be noted that (despite implying months earlier that he only had one "last genie" to put back in the bottle) he talks about "three wishes."

Genies usually give you three wishes, I’ve had three wishes for the Marvel Universe for a very long time. House of M covered one of them, Civil War will cover the second.

Perhaps it wouldn't be much of a wild guess to wonder what the "third" wish is.

EDIT: Also, the idea that Spidey being married makes his life comfortable is ridiculous when you consider that it takes lot of hard work on both spouses part to keep a marriage together.

 

[LobokDaikon]

Interestingly enough, his "story idea" for how Peter and MJ could not have married not only sounds like what Tom DeFlaco originally wanted, but does seem too complete to be just a random idea

There are problems with that idea anyway. He breaks up with MJ because his life is too dangerous, ok. But then shouldn't he have to avoid all women after that, at least until he's done being Spider-Man? Peter ends up with absolutely no romance, which is worse than the marriage, or he just ends up as a hypocrite or a moron for going back on his decision.

 

[Dragon]

Peter changing his mind about marrying MJ is silly from the end of, since Gwen died, if Peter was of that mind set, he'd never have proposed to MJ in the first place. Not to mention that the villain kidnapping MJ is about as cliche' as anything one could conceive.

Also, Joe makes it clear that Peter should be romantically involved with MJ, so them not being married changes nothing. That's what I mean in that his ideas are completely self-contradictory.

 

[LarryLegend]

Well, to his credit, Joe Q say that making Peter a widower would be worse, but I sure wouldn't put it past him to have Spidey unmask during Civil War.

Interestingly enough, his "story idea" for how Peter and MJ could not have married not only sounds like what Tom DeFlaco originally wanted, but does seem too complete to be just a random idea (although he does say "time travel" would create additional problems by saying certain stories wouldn't count). Also, it should be noted that (despite implying months earlier that he only had one "last genie" to put back in the bottle) he talks about "three wishes."

http://www.superherohype.com/forums...one of them, Civil War will cover the second.

Perhaps it wouldn't be much of a wild guess to wonder what the "third" wish is.

EDIT: Also, the idea that Spidey being married makes his life comfortable is ridiculous when you consider that it takes lot of hard work on both spouses part to keep a marriage together.

What the hell were these three wishes? Ways to get away with ****ty stories?

 

[TheVileOne]

Are they going to break up the marriage then? Why didn't they just do it during Amazing Spider-man #500?

 

[Dragon]

Let's be clear: Joe Q is a moron.

First off to assume that only "Old" people are married etc is absurd, since people are getting married regularly in their early 20's. Kids don't associate Marriage, divorce, or being a widower with any specific age range. And let's not get statred about kids. I doubt at this point in history that teens don't know of at least one other teen that's had children.

Secondly- since when is Marvel directing their comics to 12-14 year olds? Was it before or after Peter's eye got ripped out and eaten? Was it before or after he ate Morlun's head? Before or after he tore through his own skin?

Joe Q is either really, really stupid, or he's just making up BS excuses for wanting the marriage ended.

 

[JesusOfNazarath]

Pretty soon he's just going to say well I'm in charge and so I want it my way.LOL Like when he said my design my colors about the iron spidey suit.

 

[The Infernal]

Let's be clear: Joe Q is a moron.

First off to assume that only "Old" people are married etc is absurd, since people are getting married regularly in their early 20's. Kids don't associate Marriage, divorce, or being a widower with any specific age range. And let's not get statred about kids. I doubt at this point in history that teens don't know of at least one other teen that's had children.

Secondly- since when is Marvel directing their comics to 12-14 year olds? Was it before or after Peter's eye got ripped out and eaten? Was it before or after he ate Morlun's head? Before or after he tore through his own skin?

Joe Q is either really, really stupid, or he's just making up BS excuses for wanting the marriage ended.

I agree, Joe Q is an idiot. None of his arguments really make sense. I'm sure most people who have read his interview on the subject can see that. They just seem to be a long list of weak and vain excuses to validate what he wants to do and gloss over the mistakes he's made. There doesn't seem to be a single statement that holds enough truth for it not to be argued with.

 

[3dman27]

I agree, Joe Q is an idiot. None of his arguments really make sense. I'm sure most people who have read his interview on the subject can see that. They just seem to be a long list of weak and vain excuses to validate what he wants to do and gloss over the mistakes he's made. There doesn't seem to be a single statement that holds enough truth for it not to be argued with.

he needs to be pink slipped asap

 

[The Infernal]

he needs to be pink slipped asap

Perhaps when Marvel sets up its own Message boards we can see who is the first set up a 'Joe Q is an idiot' thread. I'm sure it will be a hot topic.

 

[owenstar]

Doesnt spiderman have enough titles to flesh out multiple aspects and time frames of the character?

Seriously, MJ is a huge part of the character....Joe Q needs to not live in the past...Characters need some change over 50 years...while the grass in the past may look greener, sometimes it really isnt...

Its terrible when the people on top think they know everything and how the fan really feels...take a look in this thread...

I dont read many "hero" comics for the simple fact of all the lame-o gimmics that they use....people need to stay dead...some people need to never die...dont treat your readers like idiots

 

[3dman27]

I dont read many "hero" comics for the simple fact of all the lame-o gimmics that they use....people need to stay dead...some people need to never die...dont treat your readers like idiots

i'm afraid thats what mr quesada is doing though

 

[Venom Drool]

Eddie Brock should kill her.. awesome

 

[Kool-Aid]

Perhaps when Marvel sets up its own Message boards we can see who is the first set up a 'Joe Q is an idiot' thread. I'm sure it will be a hot topic.

Most likely it'll be deleted and the person will be banned. Thats what happend to me on newsarama cuz they're Marvel's ****.

 

[The Infernal]

Most likely it'll be deleted and the person will be banned. Thats what happend to me on newsarama cuz they're Marvel's ****.

That's a shame. Sorry to hear that dude. Though I would hope that when Marvel set theirs up that they allow complaints.

Though failing that I would make a thread here and maybe on other forums encouraging members to sign up there and start similar threads. Then hopefully we would have enough people there for the threads to be taken seriously.

 

[stillanerd]

Peter changing his mind about marrying MJ is silly from the end of, since Gwen died, if Peter was of that mind set, he'd never have proposed to MJ in the first place. Not to mention that the villain kidnapping MJ is about as cliche' as anything one could conceive.

Also, Joe makes it clear that Peter should be romantically involved with MJ, so them not being married changes nothing. That's what I mean in that his ideas are completely self-contradictory.

Very good points, as always, Dragon. The more I read Joe Q's comments, the more I think that he just wants an excuse for Peter to start dating all kinds of women like he did during the late 70s/early 80s which I contend is very wrong for the character and how every one of those potential love interests he went through are barely memorable--except for the Black Cat, and even THAT was just a rip-off of the Batman/Catwoman relationship. If Joe Q even contends that MJ is the right girl for Peter, then what's the point in having them date other people just to prove this? It's already been proven.

First off to assume that only "Old" people are married etc is absurd, since people are getting married regularly in their early 20's. Kids don't associate Marriage, divorce, or being a widower with any specific age range. And let's not get statred about kids. I doubt at this point in history that teens don't know of at least one other teen that's had children.

Secondly- since when is Marvel directing their comics to 12-14 year olds? Was it before or after Peter's eye got ripped out and eaten? Was it before or after he ate Morlun's head? Before or after he tore through his own skin?

Joe Q is either really, really stupid, or he's just making up BS excuses for wanting the marriage ended.

Right on, again. If he's so interested in attracting the 9-year olds back, then he'd really ought to start on the CONTENT of the stories themselves, especially since their new rating system--like most rating systems--are pretty much worthless anyway. Also, as I stated earlier, his comment that marriage makes Peter's life more "comfortable" is ridiculous when you consider how much hard work is put into marriages to make it work, much less all the marriage counsellors and the self-help book market to help such couples work out their problems--and considering the divorce rate, there is a risk of failure.

I agree, Joe Q is an idiot. None of his arguments really make sense. I'm sure most people who have read his interview on the subject can see that. They just seem to be a long list of weak and vain excuses to validate what he wants to do and gloss over the mistakes he's made. There doesn't seem to be a single statement that holds enough truth for it not to be argued with.

It all comes down to simple nostalgia, in that these creators believe they can recapture and at the same time write "better" stories than Stan Lee's run on Spider-Man. Plus the fact that most comic book creators really don't like continuity.