Les Miserables: Even the thread will make you cry - Part 2

[JP]

Ah, I almost forgot about Phoenix. Just goes to show how unfair Oscar season can be. Not a single person remembers his performance, and he'll likely be overlooked. Shame.


See the poll was added. I would have given this an 8 or a 9 last week. After second viewing, definitely a 10.

 

[The Guard]

Facepalm all you want. Lincoln was an overrated slog. The whole movie plays like an 8th Grade History video, filled with superfluous exposition right from the beginning when black and white soldiers started reciting the Gettysburg address to each other. The whole movie feels so scripted– too much telling and not enough showing– even then, the telling isn't even historically accurate

Come to think of it, what exactly is the point of Lincoln? It doesn't dwell into Lincoln's personal relationships with his family. It doesn't dwell into the evolution of Lincoln's stance on African Americans. It doesn't dwell into how he outwitted his political rivals within the Republican Party in the 1860 Convention (which by far was the closest Primary in American History). All it does is tell us what we already know and sugarcoating it with needless dramatization– over an amendment that was poised to pass after a landslide defeat of the Peace Democrats in 1864. The whole movie is Oscar baiting at it's finest.

One of my favorite biopics of all time was Der Untergang because it portrayed Hitler as a human being (a deeply flawed one) and not the spawn of Satan. Lincoln is no Der Untergang. DDL is no Bruno Ganz.

I'm not sure why you replied to my facepalm about your specific thoughts on an individual's performance in relation to a mechanical attraction with a diatribe about the film as a whole...but:

"This compared to DDL who just feels like an empty caricature from Disney's Hall of Presidents", may be the most absurd thing I've heard all year.

Which is why I facepalmed.

I've made no statements as to the quality of the film as a whole...I simply found your statement ridiculous.

If Jackman is going to win an Oscar, I'd much prefer him to win the Oscar because he's better or as deserving than others who gave amazing performances, not to see the other amazing performances reduced to...whatever that was.

 

[Drizzle]

thanks.

Spoiler

so it's just Fantine in the film? I couldn't really tell just listening to the soundtrack.

I guess that makes more sense since Valjean never had a connection with Eponine.

It makes even more sense in the context of the film because [BLACKOUT]Valjean doesn't meet Eponine[/BLACKOUT] as he does in the show.

 

[danoyse]

It makes even more sense in the context of the film because [BLACKOUT]Valjean doesn't meet Eponine[/BLACKOUT] as he does in the show.

Exactly, in the show she was the one who brought the note from Marius to Valjean. In the film, it was Gavroche, which was also the way it happened in the book. Marius sent Gavroche not only to get the letter to Cosette, but he wanted to get Gavroche off the barricade. Which sadly, didn't work.

 

[X Knight]

ah, I see. thanks.

speaking of Gavroche:

Spoiler

what's this I'm hearing of Javert placing some kind of medal on Gavroche's body?

 

[JP]

ah, I see. thanks.

speaking of Gavroche:

Spoiler

what's this I'm hearing of Javert placing some kind of medal on Gavroche's body?

See the film! No more spoilers!

 

[danoyse]

ah, I see. thanks.

speaking of Gavroche:

Spoiler

what's this I'm hearing of Javert placing some kind of medal on Gavroche's body?

You really need to see the movie.

Spoiler

After the barricade falls, Javert sees Gavroche's body with the others and pins his star on his chest.

 

[danoyse]

Speaking of seeing the film...

Oh my god, I loved it. I was smiling like an idiot (my mother can attest to this, since she was laughing at me) as soon as those first notes started, I was so excited.

As far as the movie's whipping boy, I have to say that I didn't mind Russell Crowe. No, he doesn't sing it like we're familiar with it, but he's got decent enough pipes, and more importantly, he nailed the character, so it worked well enough for me. And the aforementioned Gavroche scene? Jesus...

After hearing so much about Anne Hathaway, I thought her performance wouldn't surprise me...but dear god, she shattered my soul. That was the most brutal version of "I Dreamed a Dream" I've ever heard. I just listened to it again off the soundtrack, and nearly fell to pieces in the middle of my living room. She was incredible.

Hugh was wonderful. No, he doesn't have Colm Wilkinson's voice (as someone on another forum I read keeps whining about), but he's still got a beautiful voice, and like Crowe, just played that character so beautifully. My mom's reaction after the Soliloquy was "Holy ****!"

I'm definitely a convert to the Aaronjolras fan club, as well as Eddie Redmayne's. All of the barricade boys were really terrific. And little Gavroche? Dear god, did they have to make that worse by casting the most adorable kid on the planet?

Loved Samantha Barks too. Her first "I love him," at the end of "On My Own" was a killer. Sacha Baron Cohen and Helena Bonham Carter were hilarious, much more than I expected them to be.

There was so much audible sobbing in the final scenes that my entire theater sounded like a group therapy session (my mother and I were virtually throwing tissues at each other at this point). Amanda Seyfried's reaction to everything in that scene -including the moment where it looked like [BLACKOUT]she may have even heard her mother[/BLACKOUT] - was amazing.

I liked the additions from the book - especially the convent, and the way the barricades were done. And I loved the new placement of "On My Own". Now when she sings her part in "One Day More", she knows she's going to the barricade to die, she's not just pining for him. Also loved the "Do You Hear the People Sing?" change.

But I loved it. I need to see it again, so I can watch it more on its own instead of noticing changes from the stage version. But I'm thrilled with how it turned out.

 

[X Knight]

thanks!!

I'm hoping to see it this Saturday.

I've got my box of tissue ready!

 

[JP]

There's many scenes in this film that will go down in movie-musical history.

- Valjean's Soliloquy.
- I Dreamed a Dream
- On My Own
- One Day More
- Empty Chairs

 

[narrows101]

I just got back from seeing it also. Went with another couple. Heard her sniffling a bit, but she did complain she was getting "fidgety" and they both said it was "a tad long" (and they both have seen the musical!). I think I was spoiled a little too much since I kinda knew what was coming when.

Of course I loved it. Don't know why they bothered to give the "barricade boys" names because they didn't say any of them - all I heard was Courfeyrac and Enjolras. I thought I knew them all intimately from their tweeting but their scenes went by so fast I hardly got to "know" them.

Hubby LOVED Aaron - he actually thought he was the best part of the movie. He didn't like Eddie as Marius at all (I wanted to smack him!) - he thought Aaron would have made a better Marius. I LOVED Eddie - Empty Chairs killed me. And I also loved Aaron.

I thought Russell was fine. I see what some people mean by the "cuts" - I thought some of the shots could have been held longer onscreen, like Enjolras' death scene.

There were a lot of photos/scenes that I've seen that didn't make it to the final cut of the movie. One that comes to mind is JVJ hiding under a pier after he jumps in the water at Confrontation. And of course lots of cuts from the screenplay.

Theater was packed and I did hear quite a few sniffles.

 

[danoyse]

And now that I'm finally free to listen to the soundtrack...where the hell is the rest of it? There are a crazy amount of songs missing.

 

[Drizzle]

You really need to see the movie.

Spoiler

After the barricade falls, Javert sees Gavroche's body with the others and pins his star on his chest.

Oh, that moment....

I thought it was a great moment of redemption for Javert's character.

 

[danoyse]

Oh, that moment....

I thought it was a great moment of redemption for Javert's character.

It was. Another thing I noticed was that sort of tightrope walk he did on the roof during "Stars", he was doing again during his last song. It was like the first time he did it with a confidence that he couldn't fall. But the last time, he wasn't so sure of those steps anymore.

 

[Drizzle]

And now that I'm finally free to listen to the soundtrack...where the hell is the rest of it? There are a crazy amount of songs missing.

I was wondering the same thing, but I realized that the complete soundtrack would pretty much be the whole movie since it's all singing. Practically all 157 minutes of it. They're probably holding off until the DVD/Blu-ray release. It'll also probably be at least $30.

 

[Quasimod0]

It was. Another thing I noticed was that sort of tightrope walk he did on the roof during "Stars", he was doing again during his last song. It was like the first time he did it with a confidence that he couldn't fall. But the last time, he wasn't so sure of those steps anymore.

Wonderfully played by Crowe, I might add

 

[danoyse]

Another change I noticed: with the addition of Marius' grandfather, the lyric in "Red & Black" changed from "is this simply a game for rich young boys to play?" to Enjolras calling out Marius with "is this simply a game for a rich young boy to play?" That was an interesting change.

 

[Kansiov]

I'm not sure why you replied to my facepalm about your specific thoughts on an individual's performance in relation to a mechanical attraction with a diatribe about the film as a whole...but:

"This compared to DDL who just feels like an empty caricature from Disney's Hall of Presidents", may be the most absurd thing I've heard all year.

Which is why I facepalmed.

I've made no statements as to the quality of the film as a whole...I simply found your statement ridiculous.

If Jackman is going to win an Oscar, I'd much prefer him to win the Oscar because he's better or as deserving than others who gave amazing performances, not to see the other amazing performances reduced to...whatever that was.

I made a comment to the film because... guess what? The name of the film is Lincoln; It revolves around DDL's performance. Could the script have been better? Maybe. But the fact of the matter is, DDL's performance did nothing to alleviate the heap of garbage that was the film- there is nothing but endless exposition that the film spouts, and all DDL did was play along with it with endless theatrics. Even his scenes with Mary Todd Lincoln felt so contrived and unnatural, never once did I believe anything of it was real- this is unlike the better biopic performances by Bruno Ganz or Marion Cotillard who brought heart and soul to the people they were playing- DDL only brought physique.

To put it bluntly, I felt Jackman made Valjean more grounded than DDL did with Lincoln. This despite the fact that Jackman was singing almost all of his lines. That is why I feel Jackman deserves recognition over DDL.

 

[Gort Baringa]

danoyse, you have made some excellent comments about Russell Crowe. He is such a good actor that any deficiency he may have vocally was well compensated for by his acting. His 'dance of death' on the bridge was full of drama and feeling, and seeing the stone structure in the water below one knows this will end tragically.

I wonder if Ann Hathaway could be in line for Best Actress? Even though she does not have a lot of screen time, some of the past Oscar winners have had very little also - Marlon Brando in the Godfather and Anthony Hopkins in Silence of the Lambs.

 

[DACrowe]

It was. Another thing I noticed was that sort of tightrope walk he did on the roof during "Stars", he was doing again during his last song. It was like the first time he did it with a confidence that he couldn't fall. But the last time, he wasn't so sure of those steps anymore.

I also liked it because it shows that the character always could cross that line. His duty gave him reason not to, but it's always there. It explains his actions later better. It was an actually really nice touch by Hooper in terms of character building. So, I can pay some compliments to his direction.

Still does not explain the weird angles during Empty Chairs and On My Own. Nor does it explain why everything has to have a wide lens so close. Oh well.

 

[DACrowe]

I made a comment to the film because... guess what? The name of the film is Lincoln; It revolves around DDL's performance. Could the script have been better? Maybe. But the fact of the matter is, DDL's performance did nothing to alleviate the heap of garbage that was the film- there is nothing but endless exposition that the film spouts, and all DDL did was play along with it with endless theatrics. Even his scenes with Mary Todd Lincoln felt so contrived and unnatural, never once did I believe anything of it was real- this is unlike the better biopic performances by Bruno Ganz or Marion Cotillard who brought heart and soul to the people they were playing- DDL only brought physique.

To put it bluntly, I felt Jackman made Valjean more grounded than DDL did with Lincoln. This despite the fact that Jackman was singing almost all of his lines. That is why I feel Jackman deserves recognition over DDL.

You are going way off topic. But I will bite. The movie did more than exposition. It did a very good job of creating a small but crucial moment of American history that illustrated how tortuous Lincoln's tenure was on the man and how he deftly weaved so many rivals and political, as well as militaristic, opponents into cooperating with his bold, but patient agenda. It is a movie about politics, so of course there will be a lot of talking. But if you think it is a "garbage heap" or that DDL was a caricature you either didn't watch it or couldn't pay attention.

Sorry, but after several of your rants in this thread, I had to say it.

 

[danoyse]

Hey, everyone having a Lincoln argument: we have a Lincoln thread. Take it there. Thank you.

 

[narrows101]

Am I deaf? Obviously, because at the IMDB they are talking about

Spoiler

the "cracking sound" Javert makes as he hits the water.

I didn't hear a damn thing, just a splash!

 

[narrows101]

I wonder if Ann Hathaway could be in line for Best Actress? Even though she does not have a lot of screen time, some of the past Oscar winners have had very little also - Marlon Brando in the Godfather and Anthony Hopkins in Silence of the Lambs.

It's already been confirmed Anne is in the Supporting category. The only one who would be up for Lead is Hugh.

 

[narrows101]

Another change I noticed: with the addition of Marius' grandfather, the lyric in "Red & Black" changed from "is this simply a game for rich young boys to play?" to Enjolras calling out Marius with "is this simply a game for a rich young boy to play?" That was an interesting change.

A lot of lyric changes in the songs, for the better fitting the circumstance. I just wish some of the songs weren't cut but the movie already being 2:40 if we want all the songs it can't be helped. By the time we got out of there I was sitting three hours and fifteen minutes.

Hugh's death scene slayed me. He should get a nom for that and Soliloquy alone. I loved Anne's performance, but IMO Hugh's was just as powerful. When his voice cracked when he sang "upon the rack" I nearly lost it. Also his voice cracking and eyes reddening at the end.