MCU vs thread....controversy and chaos

[Docker2.0]

Cable and Deadpool....maximum effort !

Cable has the firepower to put big holes in Groot, and Deadpool is pretty much unkillable.
I can't see Rocket and Groot taking this.

Rocket took out a whole squad alone. You seriously underestimating him.

 

[metaphysician]

Rocket and Groot vs Deadpool and Cable:

Rocket and Groot take this fight most of the time. Don't underestimate how bricky and powerful Groot is, the only things I can recall causing him significant injury were "Gamora's sword of doom" and "being in a giant battleship as it crashed to the ground while protecting his companions". Deadpool has nothing that will even phase him, and I'm not at all sure Cable has demonstrated anything with that much oomph, either. Meanwhile, Rocket Racoon is a similar highly skilled weapon fighter, who definitely *does* have the firepower to take out either of them.

I won't say its impossible for Deadpool and Cable to win, but its long odds that depend on getting lucky and taking out Rocket early, and possibly ganking weapons off his fallen body. And that isn't really likely to happen with a big Groot-shaped tank that they absolutely do need to pay attention to, because given a moment he could tear either of them apart.

 

[InCali]

I'll say Rocket and Groot. If they put Deadpool's various limbs and so forth in some extra strength, sealable plastic baggies, he won't be able to heal up. His little hands will be walking around in circles trying to find their way out.

 

[Batmannerism]

I'll say Rocket and Groot. If they put Deadpool's various limbs and so forth in some extra strength, sealable plastic baggies, he won't be able to heal up. His little hands will be walking around in circles trying to find their way out.

No way man, Deadpool's head will just grow a new body, and then it's on.

 

[InCali]

No way man, Deadpool's head will just grow a new body, and then it's on.

Then I'd fill it with the anti-grow serum Rocket stole from that professor.....man I like this thread......

 

[Batmannerism]

Rocket took out a whole squad alone. You seriously underestimating him.

Ummmm, so have Deadpool and Cable, without any traps or prep time - Deadpool did it with just a brick. It's a superhero trope that a name character can take out a squad of nobodies.

 

[Luigi]

Rocket and Groot

Deadpool and Cable pose no threat to Groot, who's far more durable than them and can take immobilize them quickly with his limbs. As for Rocket, he would be too busy trying to buy Cable's gun.

 

[Batmannerism]

Rocket and Groot

Deadpool and Cable pose no threat to Groot, who's far more durable than them and can take immobilize them quickly with his limbs. As for Rocket, he would be too busy trying to buy Cable's gun.

Cable's rifle sent Juggernaut flying and blasted holes through metal, whereas Groot is made of wood......

 

[metaphysician]

Cable's rifle sent Juggernaut flying and blasted holes through metal, whereas Groot is made of wood......

Hulk is made of flesh. Doesn't mean weapons that can blast through metal can hurt him. Same deal with Groot, "made of wood" is irrelevant compared to his actual showings of durability.

Also, Team Rocket hardly needs to take special measures against Deadpool. He doesn't heal *that* quickly. Blow him to pieces, and he's out of the fight.

 

[Batmannerism]

Hulk is made of flesh. Doesn't mean weapons that can blast through metal can hurt him. Same deal with Groot, "made of wood" is irrelevant compared to his actual showings of durability.

Also, Team Rocket hardly needs to take special measures against Deadpool. He doesn't heal *that* quickly. Blow him to pieces, and he's out of the fight.

So you are suggesting that Groot's wood body is stronger than steel. Interesting- under some circumstances plant material can be stronger than steel ( such as stretching).

But what are Groot's durability feats like ? How often do we see him get hit ?

We know he is highly resistant to projectile weapons because we see him getting shot by multiple bursts from the Kyln drones and that not having too much effect.

We see Gamora hack off both his arms - how special is her sword ? Well, since it came from Thanos it's probably quite advanced tech ( the only time she uses it against Thanos is an illusion, so it's hard to tell) although it does kill the pink monster at the start of GOTG vol 2.

We see both Gamora and Drax being capable of breaking his vines/tendrils, and Drax pinning him down and battering him.

But other than that how often do we see Groot tank physical impacts ( other than crashing spaceships) or energy blasts ? I've seen GOTG more than a few times and in my recollection....we don't.

As such, I don't think it's possible to completely discount Deadpool and Cable's weapons - maybe Deadpool's guns ( and probably his swords), but not Cable who has high explosives, powerful projectiles and energy blasts.

When have we seen Rocket blow an enemy to pieces ? We've seen him use a bunch of nonlethal booby traps that slowed down the ravages, ravager pistols, two collapsible rifles - one which tasered Quill and one which blasted Ego's tendrils - although not that effectively, and a rifle against the big pink monster which didn't do a lot. I'm not convinced that he can simply blast Deadpool into bits , because we haven't seen him do that to any other humanoids. He does gun down a bunch of Thanos' monsters during the Infinity War and Endgame battles, but they're disposable goons and even Hawkeye can slice them to bits with his sword.

The most significant advantage Rocket does have is flight - if he can stay at a distance and blast away, maybe pick off Cable from behind ( force field) before he blasts Groot into splinters.

I summary, I think people are vastly underrating Cable and Deadpool and overrating Rocket and Groot. However, I suspect I will be on the wrong side of the votes again.

 

[Docker2.0]

Rocket and Groot win. Next up:
Iron Fist

Vs Bucky Barnes in zombie mode(no guns)

Who you got peeps?

 

[Schlosser85]

Probably Iron Fist. Bucky is a good hand-to-hand fighter and faster and stronger than a normal human, enough to go toe-to-toe with Captain America in a fight, but he's not literally superpowered the way Iron Fist is. Plus I think a lot of Bucky's power in a fight comes from his robotic arm, so if that's disabled it takes away his biggest advantage.

 

[Batmannerism]

Rocket and Groot win. Next up:
Iron Fist

Vs Bucky Barnes in zombie mode(no guns)

Who you got peeps?

Bucky 9/10.

Not sure the Iron Fist is enough to put Bucky down, but Danny's body is only human whereas Bucky has taken full on punches to the face from Iron Man.

 

[metaphysician]

Probably Iron Fist. Bucky is a good hand-to-hand fighter and faster and stronger than a normal human, enough to go toe-to-toe with Captain America in a fight, but he's not literally superpowered the way Iron Fist is. Plus I think a lot of Bucky's power in a fight comes from his robotic arm, so if that's disabled it takes away his biggest advantage.

Um, have you watched the movies? Bucky is *absolutely* superpowered, just like Cap is. Non-superpowered people don't use motorbikes as thrown weapons to total jeeps. And they both are considerably more superpowered than Iron Fist, who has a magic punch attack and otherwise normal human physical attributes. Having one super powers which happens to produce a visible glowy special effect does not automatically override other super powers that don't happen to reveal themselves with an anima banner.

Bucky takes it, because ultimately he's a better martial artist than Danny, has a major physical advantage, and frankly I'm kind of dubious whether the actual punching power of Danny's iron fist is much higher than the horsepower Bucky can crank out of his metal arm, anyway. Yes, Bucky is actually limited by that his arm has to follow ( comic book ) physics, and so he can't do stuff like "cause everything breakable nearby to magically explode", but in terms of pure "punch this thing and cause it damage", its a lot hazier a difference.

 

[InCali]

I would say Bucky most likely. While Iron Fist can hit harder, he has to hit something in order to be effective. I don't think he can take a punch from Bucky and Bucky would certainly be the first person to land one.

 

[Docker2.0]

Bucky wins 3-1. Next up:

Crusher Creel, the Absorbing Man

vs Black Panther

Who you got peeps?

 

[Luigi]

Never seen AOS so I can't comment on this one. I'm more familiar with the Nolte version, who's quite OP in that film. He would probably wipe the floor with most of the Earth-based Avengers.

 

[Batmannerism]

Bucky wins 3-1. Next up:

Crusher Creel, the Absorbing Man

vs Black Panther

Who you got peeps?

Hmmm....comic book wise Black Panther would get crushed.

However, in the MCU vibranium is a magic element that can pretty much do anything the story needs it to. As such, Panther might be able to cut Creel to shreds before Creel can smush him.

I'll say Creel wins 7/10.

 

[metaphysician]

Absorbing Man vs Black Panther:

. . . huh. I actually think this one might go to Absorbing Man. See, here's the thing: Black Panther is powerful and skilled, but ultimately, he's a melee fighter. This is a problem, because while Creel is probably going to start with some kind of steel and concrete brick form, he's actually smarter than the comic version, and is absolutely going to absorb the properties of vibranium pretty much the first time T'Challa hits him. At which point, he is functionally invulnerable, and that is that.

In order for Black Panther to win, he would need some kind of ranged attack that can take Creel out *without* allowing him in melee range, or else some kind of supertech power nullifier doohickey. And while T'Challa certainly has the resource base to acquire either of those, they are not anything close to everyday carry.

 

[Docker2.0]

Crusher Creel wins. Next up:

Scarlet Witch

Vs the Ancient one

Who you got peeps?

 

[Batmannerism]

Crusher Creel wins. Next up:

Scarlet Witch

Vs the Ancient one

Who you got peeps?

Ordinarily I would go with the Ancient One, as she's powerful, very experienced and has a wide variety of mystic abilities - including the " astral palm strike" which literally disconnects your mind and your body.

However, MCU Wanda is incredibly OP, not just telekinesis that can crush Thanos and throw giant machines around with little effort. She has telepathic powers, that the writers have forgotten about since Age of Ultron, and Wanda Vision suggests that she might be able to rewrite reality itself.

As such, she might have too much raw power for someone as skilled as the Ancient One or Dr Strange to overcome.

I'm going to say Wanda, but only by a slim margin, owing to an edge in raw power over the Ancient One's range of powers so out of 10 fights Wanda wins 4 and the Ancient One wins 3, with at least 3 ending in a draw.

 

[Docker2.0]

Ordinarily I would go with the Ancient One, as she's powerful, very experienced and has a wide variety of mystic abilities - including the " astral palm strike" which literally disconnects your mind and your body.

However, MCU Wanda is incredibly OP, not just telekinesis that can crush Thanos and throw giant machines around with little effort. She has telepathic powers, that the writers have forgotten about since Age of Ultron, and Wanda Vision suggests that she might be able to rewrite reality itself.

As such, she might have too much raw power for someone as skilled as the Ancient One or Dr Strange to overcome.

I'm going to say Wanda, but only by a slim margin, owing to an edge in raw power over the Ancient One's range of powers so out of 10 fights Wanda wins 4 and the Ancient One wins 3, with at least 3 ending in a draw.

Weak answer!! You give us the meat we want!!!

 

[metaphysician]

Wanda vs The Ancient One:

Okay, so upfront, I haven't seen the latest episode of WandaVision. So, no spoilers.

Anyway, I give this fight to the Ancient One. Wanda is powerful, really really powerful. However, the Sorcerer Supreme is *also* really really powerful. The best benchmark so far is mutual performance against Thanos. Wanda absolutely destroyed Thanos, in a way nobody else did. However, Dr Strange actually lasted for an extended period in a fight with Thanos *who had and used multiple infinity stones*. Its a judgement call, but I think the latter is a better performance. Now, that is Strange, not the Ancient One, but I do not see sufficient evidence to believe that Strange has exceeded the thousand-year-old sorceress in a scant few years of training and practice. He's good, but I lean to the Ancient One still being significantly better.

Basically, the fight would go something like: Wanda tosses around god level energy and psychic and reality warping effects. The Ancient One counters and evades and contests them. This continues for a bit, and then the Ancient One completely blindsides Wanda with some kind of magical attack that she can barely comprehend and has no idea how to counter. The end.

 

[Luigi]

Ancient One

I've yet to watch Wandavision but from the sounds of it, she hasn't had any major upgrades in the show. Wanda always takes a while to get going in battles and is quite the glass cannon, so my vote goes for the Ancient One, who's far more powerful.

 

[metaphysician]

Ancient One

I've yet to watch Wandavision but from the sounds of it, she hasn't had any major upgrades in the show. Wanda always takes a while to get going in battles and is quite the glass cannon, so my vote goes for the Ancient One, who's far more powerful.

Spoiler: WandaVision feat commentary

So, I've seen the first five episodes now, and I'm comfortable saying the show so far doesn't provide *any* useful feats for the purpose of benchmarking Wanda. Not only does 95% of everything happen within the Westview Anomaly, which has an unclear origin and source and nature, but even the one scene so far with Wanda "outside" the Anomaly is sketchy. Both because she was still within walking distance of it and we don't actually know the limits of the Anomaly, but its not even 100% certain that was Wanda. Plus, even if you take it as representative of her power, she didn't do anything when confronting SWORD that she couldn't have done before.

Basically, the current takeaway is that Wanda can do all kinds of crazy reality warping inside the Anomaly, but its a complete unknown how much this is dependent on some local circumstance or extra power source or Secret Demonic Big Bad.