MCU vs thread....controversy and chaos

[Docker2.0]

It's ok.....doubt me now. But when Eternals comes out, you will call me Doc-stradomus!

 

[Batmannerism]

It's ok.....doubt me now. But when Eternals comes out, you will call me Doc-stradomus!

Given how so many people are up the garbage of FATWS and Loki ( and the end of WV) I'm not sure it's possible for an MCU film to completely bomb....yet. although at the moment BW is looking to bomb.

However, I am nearly certain that Eternals will underperform at the box office.

 

[Docker2.0]

Given how so many people are up the garbage of FATWS and Loki ( and the end of WV) I'm not sure it's possible for an MCU film to completely bomb....yet. although at the moment BW is looking to bomb.

However, I am nearly certain that Eternals will underperform at the box office.

Yeah but those were established characters in the MCU. Shang Chi and Eternals are not those dudes. I do think Shang Chi will do a VERY modest number but despite Eternals having pretty much an all star cast, I just don't see it doing well at all. I'm actually expecting around Hulk numbers.

 

[InCali]

It's ok.....doubt me now. But when Eternals comes out, you will call me Doc-stradomus!

We might just keep calling you what we call you now.

Given how so many people are up the garbage of FATWS and Loki ( and the end of WV) I'm not sure it's possible for an MCU film to completely bomb....yet. although at the moment BW is looking to bomb.

However, I am nearly certain that Eternals will underperform at the box office.

Box office numbers are really tricky right now. I heard BW did a S*** ton of money on D+ and that all goes to the mouse. I don't think we can really evaluate the numbers we're seeing during the pandemic. We certainly can't compare them to a couple of years ago. Also, BW was the one movie I wasn't looking that forward to. While I liked it, it seemed sort of anticlimactic. They should have released it pre Endgame.

 

[metaphysician]

1. He Who Remains vs Dr Strange:

This is one of those "Probably shouldn't be done" fights. In a direct confrontation, based on the material we actually have, Strange should probably win. However, based on what we know of He Who Remains/Immortus, a direct confrontation really shouldn't be *possible* unless he wants it, and if he does want it, he should have more than enough resources to make it unwinnable. Its kind of like having a fight with Alexander Pierce- easy to beat in a fist fight, but a fist fight completely misses the entire point of his character and capabilities.

2. Taskmaster vs Proxima Midnight:

Proxima should take this comfortably. Taskmaster had the advantage over Natasha, but it wasn't an overwhelming advantage. Meanwhile, when not completely blindsided, Proxima managed to at least stalemate both Natasha *and* Okoye at the same time. She may be the weakest of the Black Order, but that still seemed to mean supersoldier level physical stats, decent skills, and useful weapons. I wouldn't count on trying to even things out with guns either, Proxima's staff probably hits harder than any ranged weapon Taskmaster is likely to be carrying. . . and I doubt his shield is vibranium.

3. Upcoming movies:

Obviously, I can't see the future and thus can't make detailed predictions about box office totals. However, I would remind everyone here who seems to want to blame Black Widow not doing a billion on the Disney+ premium streaming, that we are *still in a pandemic*. The fact that theaters are not open at all in many places, only open with capacity limits in many others, and patronized by audiences that have both disease-related risks and pandemic-induced economic damages influencing their entertainment choices? Almost certainly has much more of an impact on total revenue than the ability to spend $30 to stream via Disney+.

 

[Docker2.0]

Hey I wanted Black Widow to do well but I'm also a realist. Marvel seems to have slacked off in phase 4 and that's the one phase that they can't because the OG Avengers are leaving. And again, I'm a diehard Marvel fan saying this. I have numerous videos on Youtube about the MsheU and reading the comments, it is getting a lot of backing. Especially the way Loki was played in his own show, a female Thor replacing Helmsworth(rumors), female Black Panther way to early, characters no one heard of(Eternals) and that's those extremists channels. There are people like us who WANT to like Marvel but I'm just being honest, they are going in a weird direction right now with top characters just sitting on the sideline right now.

 

[Docker2.0]

Proxima Midnight wins. Next up:

The Juggernaut

vs Venom

Who you got peeps?!

 

[Batmannerism]

We might just keep calling you what we call you now.



Box office numbers are really tricky right now. I heard BW did a S*** ton of money on D+ and that all goes to the mouse. I don't think we can really evaluate the numbers we're seeing during the pandemic. We certainly can't compare them to a couple of years ago. Also, BW was the one movie I wasn't looking that forward to. While I liked it, it seemed sort of anticlimactic. They should have released it pre Endgame.

Tricky? Even with its Disney plus numbers it hasn't broken anywhere near even. It hasn't cleared $350m against a $200m budget, which it needs to triple to make some money.

Hey I wanted Black Widow to do well but I'm also a realist. Marvel seems to have slacked off in phase 4 and that's the one phase that they can't because the OG Avengers are leaving. And again, I'm a diehard Marvel fan saying this. I have numerous videos on Youtube about the MsheU and reading the comments, it is getting a lot of backing. Especially the way Loki was played in his own show, a female Thor replacing Helmsworth(rumors), female Black Panther way to early, characters no one heard of(Eternals) and that's those extremists channels. There are people like us who WANT to like Marvel but I'm just being honest, they are going in a weird direction right now with top characters just sitting on the sideline right now.

Same page. I mean, how pumped are you for
"The Marvels" ?
Maybe you and I aren't the target audience. But in the same way we weren't the target audience for Birds of Prey - surprise surprise their planned target audience didn't exist! You can't label a piece of crap feminist and expect people to eat it up.

I was pretty skeptical about the MSheU idea....until I saw Loki , and noticed that all the male characters are completely subordinate, mostly incompetent ( except Classic Loki and Alligator Loki) and the "main character" has turned into a pathetic version of himself, while the female characters take the lead.

Nothing wrong with having a show with a female protagonist ( e.g. WandaVision, although making her the villain as well possibly wasn't a great way to go).... but if the premise of the show was that it was about Sylvie- and that was what they intended it seems very disingenuous to market it with images of Tom Hiddleston.

Anyway, I also feel the MCU has gone along an odd path. Hope that Shang Chi and Spider Man are good but.......



And probably Venom, as movie Juggernaut is seriously nerfed. Comic book Juggernaut would probably find an electric cable up his bum mildly ticklish.

 

[Docker2.0]

Tricky? Even with its Disney plus numbers it hasn't broken anywhere near even. It hasn't cleared $350m against a $200m budget, which it needs to triple to make some money.




Same page. I mean, how pumped are you for
"The Marvels" ?
Maybe you and I aren't the target audience. But in the same way we weren't the target audience for Birds of Prey - surprise surprise their planned target audience didn't exist! You can't label a piece of crap feminist and expect people to eat it up.

I was pretty skeptical about the MSheU idea....until I saw Loki , and noticed that all the male characters are completely subordinate, mostly incompetent ( except Classic Loki and Alligator Loki) and the "main character" has turned into a pathetic version of himself, while the female characters take the lead.

Nothing wrong with having a show with a female protagonist ( e.g. WandaVision, although making her the villain as well possibly wasn't a great way to go).... but if the premise of the show was that it was about Sylvie- and that was what they intended it seems very disingenuous to market it with images of Tom Hiddleston.

Anyway, I also feel the MCU has gone along an odd path. Hope that Shang Chi and Spider Man are good but.......



And probably Venom, as movie Juggernaut is seriously nerfed. Comic book Juggernaut would probably find an electric cable up his bum mildly ticklish.

Shang Chi is not opening in China so it's pretty much guaranteed to underperform now. And I COMPLETELY forgot about the Marvels. I'm sorry but Phase 4 is the weakest phase thus far and it's not even close.

 

[InCali]

Tricky? Even with its Disney plus numbers it hasn't broken anywhere near even. It hasn't cleared $350m against a $200m budget, which it needs to triple to make some money.




Same page. I mean, how pumped are you for
"The Marvels" ?
Maybe you and I aren't the target audience. But in the same way we weren't the target audience for Birds of Prey - surprise surprise their planned target audience didn't exist! You can't label a piece of crap feminist and expect people to eat it up.

I was pretty skeptical about the MSheU idea....until I saw Loki , and noticed that all the male characters are completely subordinate, mostly incompetent ( except Classic Loki and Alligator Loki) and the "main character" has turned into a pathetic version of himself, while the female characters take the lead.

Nothing wrong with having a show with a female protagonist ( e.g. WandaVision, although making her the villain as well possibly wasn't a great way to go).... but if the premise of the show was that it was about Sylvie- and that was what they intended it seems very disingenuous to market it with images of Tom Hiddleston.

Anyway, I also feel the MCU has gone along an odd path. Hope that Shang Chi and Spider Man are good but.......



And probably Venom, as movie Juggernaut is seriously nerfed. Comic book Juggernaut would probably find an electric cable up his bum mildly ticklish.

When I say box office numbers are tricky, I mean it’s an odd time and they’re difficult to predict. They’re going to be low for a while I believe and I think that’s across-the-board.

 

[metaphysician]

Juggernaut vs Venom:

Juggernaut should take this. I'm dubious Venom can hurt him in any way.

 

[Binary10]

Shang Chi is not opening in China so it's pretty much guaranteed to underperform now. And I COMPLETELY forgot about the Marvels. I'm sorry but Phase 4 is the weakest phase thus far and it's not even close.

I doubt it will underperformed, I think this movie will definitely make over 600 million without China. And has it been confirmed it won't open in China?

 

[Binary10]

Shang Chi is not opening in China so it's pretty much guaranteed to underperform now. And I COMPLETELY forgot about the Marvels. I'm sorry but Phase 4 is the weakest phase thus far and it's not even close.

I don't agree with it being the weakest phase thus far but each to their own.

 

[Luigi]

Juggernaut

Yeah, I don't see Venom doing much damage to him. Juggernaut could easily rip him apart.

As for Phase 4, I'm still very excited for GOTG Vol. 3, especially with the reception that The Suicide Squad is receiving.

 

[Docker2.0]

I doubt it will underperformed, I think this movie will definitely make over 600 million without China. And has it been confirmed it won't open in China?

It's been confirmed that China is offended by it because they didn't use a Chinese guy but a guy from Canada. Go figure!! And time will tell with the box office. You say $600M WW, I say $250M WW but time will tell.

 

[Another_Fool]

It's been confirmed that China is offended by it because they didn't use a Chinese guy but a guy from Canada. Go figure!! And time will tell with the box office. You say $600M WW, I say $250M WW but time will tell.

Even if/when Shang-Chi opens in China it very likely won't make much money anyway. There's an understandable aversion from Chinese audiences to Hollywood films about China or led by Chinese/Asian characters like Mulan.

 

[Docker2.0]

Even if/when Shang-Chi opens in China it very likely won't make much money anyway. There's an understandable aversion from Chinese audiences to Hollywood films about China or led by Chinese/Asian characters like Mulan.

Facts! But time will tell. I stand by my statements and we will see when it comes out soon. I say that thing will really struggle to reach $300M WW IF it even does it.

 

[Batmannerism]

I doubt it will underperformed, I think this movie will definitely make over 600 million without China. And has it been confirmed it won't open in China?

Yeah, I'm sure it will do great.....just like Black Widow.

Having said that it might be a good movie- which is pretty ****ing rare at the moment.

 

[Fosterson]

Next fight needs to be: Black Widow vs The Mouse

 

[InCali]

Next fight needs to be: Black Widow vs The Mouse

BW wins!!! Her attorney uses a truth ray on the Mouse's lawyer. Game over.

 

[Batmannerism]

BW wins!!! Her attorney uses a truth ray on the Mouse's lawyer. Game over.

Ummmm maybe not. A lot of folks have made noises like " a deal is a deal" that's true, subject to legal interpretation of the terms, so it's not a simple question.

Also lots of people have jumped on the bandwagon that Disney have tried to screw over Scarjo, but I don't think that's the issue at all.

In all honesty, it's much more likely that they did the simultaneous release to mitigate their losses, given that the cinemas are still feeling the effects of Covid. This is not about an intent to cheat, but a business decision to make as much money as possible.

As for whether Scarjo has a case, she has some problems

1) Has Disney actually breached the contract ?

From what I've seen the contract did NOT state there would be an "EXCLUSIVE " cinematic release, instead that there would be a "WIDE CINEMATIC RELEASE" ( on which her payment would be based) in the past this has literally meant a run in the cinema. Of course Covid has changed what is actually possible.

On the face of it this does not prevent Disney from making a D+ release, although there is a question of good faith, maybe even of misrepresentation.

The question the court will consider is whether Disney has substantially performed its end of the deal. It has released BW in cinemas.

2) To get damages you have to show loss. The movie is performing poorly - and how much it would have made, had there not been a D+ release, is purely speculative.

Sure, Scarjo can argue that the D+ option has cut into people going for repeat views, but how much ? Also, there's Covid, and the reluctance of people to see a film in a cinema, and the cinemas that are still shut.

As such, I don't think there's a principled way to quantify how much she's actually lost .

What she could argue is that there should be an implied term that the cinematic release contemplated the D+ release and she be paid based on the total receipts ( cinematic and D+).

But this would require a generous reading by a judge - so who knows.

The best thing for both parties is to settle.

 

[InCali]

But, but, but.....who WINS?

If you call it a draw, you're going to be getting a GIF from, well, you know who.....he who remains as threadmaster.

 

[Fosterson]

2) To get damages you have to show loss. The movie is performing poorly - and how much it would have made, had there not been a D+ release, is purely speculative.

Sure, Scarjo can argue that the D+ option has cut into people going for repeat views, but how much ?
settle.

Theres also the piracy problem. On day 1, you had countless websites with HD copies of the movie available for free.

The damage from that must be significant.

 

[Batmannerism]

But, but, but.....who WINS?

If you call it a draw, you're going to be getting a GIF from, well, you know who.....he who remains as threadmaster.

If they settle, then in a sense Scarjo wins.

 

[Batmannerism]

Theres also the piracy problem. On day 1, you had countless websites with HD copies of the movie available for free.

The damage from that must be significant.

Significant yes, but quantifiable enough to factor into an award of damages ? Probably not, which is yet another reason that the implied term is a better way to go. Still, I'm uncertain of the relevant Californian jurisprudence and precedent on implied terms, but it seems a reasonable solution.