Mission: Impossible - Fallout - Part 2

[DyeLorean]

Can we at least agree that the masks in M:I II were flawlessly done?

 

[Loki882]

They used those masks so much in II that it became laughable after awhile.

They're most effective when they're used sparingly and at the right moments.

 

[James.B]

Christopher McQuarrie Reveals Why Jeremy Renner Didn't Return In Fallout

“Jeremy had his commitment to Avengers, which ironically they ended up not exercising, and we didn’t know what the [sixth Mission] movie was, so we couldn’t provide a schedule. We needed absolute freedom” he explained. “The unfortunate thing for Jeremy is that he got caught in this perfect storm of, one can’t use you and one doesn’t know how to, given the massive complications they had with Avengers.”

McQuarrie added that he did come up with an option for Brandt to return, but it involved killing the character off. SPOILERS FOR MISSION: IMPOSSIBLE – FALLOUT FOLLOW.

Spoiler

A possible plan for Brandt’s untimely death would have seen him perish in the film’s opening plutonium deal-gone-wrong – but Renner turned down the idea.

“I had this whole idea that the movie would start with the death of a team member,” McQuarrie said. “And of course the first team member that’s always the first guy we talk about killing is Luther. Luther died in the first movie, and he quite famously said to Tom Cruise, ‘Hey man, how come the brother’s always gotta die?’ And Tom said, ‘You’re right.’ He was like, ‘Why do I gotta be the bad guy?’ And they made Luther nefarious and then suddenly a good guy, and six movies later it was the smartest question anybody’s ever asked Tom Cruise […] So I said to Jeremy, look we can’t kill Ving, it’s never going to work. No matter how many movies into it, it’s always going to be the same thing. You killed the black guy. And we didn’t think the movie could recover if you killed Benji.

“So I said to Renner, ‘Hey listen, I have this idea for an opening sequence where you sacrifice yourself to save the team, and that the mission-gone-wrong not only involves losing the plutonium, but involves the death of a team member.’ And Jeremy was like, ‘Thanks, but no thanks’ […] He was smart not to take the short paycheck for three days of work and getting blown up.”

https://www.empireonline.com/movies/news/mission-impossible-director-christopher-mcquarrie-reveals-jeremy-renner-return-f/

 

[samsnee]

They used those masks so much in II that it became laughable after awhile.

They're most effective when they're used sparingly and at the right moments.

I did like that the villains used the mask for once. That was a nice way of mixing it up.

MI-2 had good action but the story was just weak overall. I know they wanted a different tone for every movie but it really felt like just a generic action movie and not a Mission: Impossible type movie.

 

[DyeLorean]

They used those masks so much in II that it became laughable after awhile.

They're most effective when they're used sparingly and at the right moments.

I agree. But I meant the execution. The FX.

 

[Hunter Rider]

Hunter man, we saw it on the same day.

Glad you loved it and I agree on it being the best in the series. A goddamn triumph. t:

A blessed Tuesday for the franchise!


It's amazing the way this series is aging like fine wine, and I like your point about the connectivity of the arcs across the last 4 films and even linking in to the first Mission Impossible, only Mi:2 is treat as the red headed stepchild lol.

Well written review. I agree 10/10 maybe one of my top 3 movies. The film does such a good job putting you in a subjective viewpoint. You aren't watching a fight occur. Mcquarrie puts you in the fight. It's as if we are a part of ethans team along for the adventure.

Yes, you almost need a seatbelt for the chase sequences, the way everything is shot feels like it's happening for real due to the locations, McQ's camerawork and the fact Cruise enables the camera to get right inside the action.

One of my favorite parts of rogue nation was the ethical dilemma. That ethan is essentially a rogue agent attempting to apprehend rogue agents. No one trusts him, yet somehow he trusts illsa. It's a very overlooked part of that film.

Agreed, they are such an interesting combination, Ilsa presents a more enigmatic and cooler front than Ethan, but from the way they met I think Ethan feels they share a very similar moral code in a business without a code for many. It's really the best live action incarnation of the Bruce/Selina dynamic.

Here we had the ethical dilemma of the hammer and the scalpel. Which the more I think about it is something that sets ethan very far apart from the james bond character. The scene with the police officer might be one of my favorites ever. It shows us that throughout all this violence ethan hasn't lost the most important thing he has, his heart.

I love the way he treats women and really life in general. Completely setting him apart from james bonds "the jobs done, the ***** is dead". I need to see it again [BLACKOUT]but I think that the whole John Lark manifesto is implied as the logical conclusion of the hammers philosophy. [/BLACKOUT]

Throughout the series Ethan has crossed paths and worked with strong women, Max, who was a formidable woman, kinda set the tone and even Nyah in II was a fighter, taking on an undercover mission she wasn't trained for and then sacrificing herself, even Julia who could have been more of a damsel in distress ended up saving Ethan's life. Then of course we've reached the pinnacle with Ilsa and now the White Widow, and lets not forget Jane who I'd like to see return. The series has always presented the female characters in a stronger light than Bond or Bourne for examples.

My view of Ethan Hunt vs. James Bond is a lot like my view of Superman vs. Batman. Bond is the Batman, aka, the adolescent fantasy character - the "edgier," ruthless, suave womanizer spy who's inherently cooler and the one every teenage boy would aspire to be, despite being a bit of tool, while Hunt is the more modest, low-key, grown-up of the two, not hung up on his issues, doesn't use them as excuses to behave like an a-hole, and is generally more pure of heart. Hunt's the one people SHOULD aspire to be.

That's an interesting comparison despite throwing some shade at 2 of my favourite characters. Ethan still being popular in this day and age is like the success of Captain America, a franchise a lot of people didn't think could work in a climate where Batman, Bourne and Logan were more the kind of heroes people were responding to, but it's proof the full on good guy hero can still work, which is another reason to hope McQ takes on Superman, he has shown he can put the boyscout hero in modern scenarios and make it work perfectly by using the complex moral conflict of the hero as a positive rather than a negative.


Perhaps a more interesting comparison with Ethan would be Jack Bauer, a guy who often made ugly choices for the bigger picture as opposed to be cool, and whether that is more resonant as in this world maybe you can't take Ethan's route and still save the day, for instance the pivotal Luther choice.

 

[Doctor Jones]

Honestly, Ethan Hunt's portrayal in the past three movies, something I noticed when seeing the fourth film, is how Ethan Hunt is closer to the Batman I want to see from the comics on screen. This balance of a very capable and highly skilled guy that's part of the fun watching him accomplish these feats while those skills root back to his inner flaws. How Brad Bird portrayed and even shot Hunt as this guy totally in deep into his job that's sort of mysterious. Even little things like Hunt drawing a perfect picture of the villains face on his hand with a pen is the type of attribute I'd always wanted to see in a Batman movie.

Not to mention Ilsa and Ethan dynamic is more like Batman and Catwoman than the two times we've seen it. So yeah, these movies would serve as a solid inspiration when making a Batman movie. You combine these elements with a more detective noir and I'd have gotten my ideal Batman film.

 

[DyeLorean]

Another big part of why M:I is better than Bond lately (and most other action franchises) is because since the 4th one, everything usually doesn't work as it should, and the characters have to improvise and struggle. The script doesn't make things easy for the team, and the fun in watching flaws in this type of movies is very welcomed.

 

[Mysteryman]

A blessed Tuesday for the franchise!


It's amazing the way this series is aging like fine wine, and I like your point about the connectivity of the arcs across the last 4 films and even linking in to the first Mission Impossible, only Mi:2 is treat as the red headed stepchild lol.



Yes, you almost need a seatbelt for the chase sequences, the way everything is shot feels like it's happening for real due to the locations, McQ's camerawork and the fact Cruise enables the camera to get right inside the action.


Agreed, they are such an interesting combination, Ilsa presents a more enigmatic and cooler front than Ethan, but from the way they met I think Ethan feels they share a very similar moral code in a business without a code for many. It's really the best live action incarnation of the Bruce/Selina dynamic.


Throughout the series Ethan has crossed paths and worked with strong women, Max, who was a formidable woman, kinda set the tone and even Nyah in II was a fighter, taking on an undercover mission she wasn't trained for and then sacrificing herself, even Julia who could have been more of a damsel in distress ended up saving Ethan's life. Then of course we've reached the pinnacle with Ilsa and now the White Widow, and lets not forget Jane who I'd like to see return. The series has always presented the female characters in a stronger light than Bond or Bourne for examples.



That's an interesting comparison despite throwing some shade at 2 of my favourite characters. Ethan still being popular in this day and age is like the success of Captain America, a franchise a lot of people didn't think could work in a climate where Batman, Bourne and Logan were more the kind of heroes people were responding to, but it's proof the full on good guy hero can still work, which is another reason to hope McQ takes on Superman, he has shown he can put the boyscout hero in modern scenarios and make it work perfectly by using the complex moral conflict of the hero as a positive rather than a negative.


Perhaps a more interesting comparison with Ethan would be Jack Bauer, a guy who often made ugly choices for the bigger picture as opposed to be cool, and whether that is more resonant as in this world maybe you can't take Ethan's route and still save the day, for instance the pivotal Luther choice.

The turning point for Captain America were the last two films, they had more of a Bourne type of feel to them.
The first film was straight up Pro America and it made the least amount of money in the trilogy.

 

[Deck Rickard]

Honestly, Ethan Hunt's portrayal in the past three movies, something I noticed when seeing the fourth film, is how Ethan Hunt is closer to the Batman I want to see from the comics on screen. This balance of a very capable and highly skilled guy that's part of the fun watching him accomplish these feats while those skills root back to his inner flaws. How Brad Bird portrayed and even shot Hunt as this guy totally in deep into his job that's sort of mysterious. Even little things like Hunt drawing a perfect picture of the villains face on his hand with a pen is the type of attribute I'd always wanted to see in a Batman movie.

Not to mention Ilsa and Ethan dynamic is more like Batman and Catwoman than the two times we've seen it. So yeah, these movies would serve as a solid inspiration when making a Batman movie. You combine these elements with a more detective noir and I'd have gotten my ideal Batman film.

I couldn't agree more. There is a methodical aspect of Batman that none of the movies thus far have tackled perfectly. Some of my favorite interpretations of the character are ones in which his approach to crime solving is very procedural and not just fueled by rage and pain.

 

[Quasimod0]

It’s making me so happy to read all these posts appreciating the finer things about this film. I really loved it. This is absolutely my favorite franchise after MCU, Star Wars, LotR.

 

[InvisibleWoman]

Just saw this. I literally can't fault it. I am a massive Tom Cruise apologist and will happily watch anything he's in, but even if you don't like the guy... you'd be hard pressed to call this anything other than a near perfect - if not perfect - action movie. It had everything... plus Henry Cavill's moustache. What more can a person want??

 

[Mysteryman]

Just saw this. I literally can't fault it. I am a massive Tom Cruise apologist and will happily watch anything he's in, but even if you don't like the guy... you'd be hard pressed to call this anything other than a near perfect - if not perfect - action movie. It had everything... plus Henry Cavill's moustache. What more can a person want??

I think the moustache has the best chance for a spinoff.

 

[Mandon Knight]

Just saw this. I literally can't fault it. I am a massive Tom Cruise apologist and will happily watch anything he's in, but even if you don't like the guy... you'd be hard pressed to call this anything other than a near perfect - if not perfect - action movie. It had everything... plus Henry Cavill's moustache. What more can a person want??

...A Justice League un-affected by that moustache.

 

[Mandon Knight]

I think the moustache has the best chance for a spinoff.

Moustache : Impossible : Chin by Trim

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

A crackerjack action fest that this time out might be reaching a bit far for some kind of real emotional impact but that doesn't blunt the overall slam bang grab you by collar and bring you along for the ride sheer entertaining spectacle. For sure the last 30 minutes delivers as an extremely well done chase sequence that is over the top and visceral.

I am surprised at all the praise for the CHARACTER of Hunt since I have to say from the start and throught these last two films as good as they were he and really all the reoccurring characters are to me mostly inoffensive cyphers. At best what's been added is a knowing, almost fourth wall breaking humor (thankfully used sparingly) to the proceedings but I can't see much there, there so to speak. In terms of characterization I feel we are firmly in Saturday morning cartoon territory. Which is fine. I haven't expected much in terms of meaningful development for the character of Hunt or others. It's just odd hearing that people view him as something even worthy of analysis. If I'm being brutally honest... It feels like projection to me.

 

[BatLobster]

I buy into Ethan's character, but a lot of that comes down to Cruise and how much of himself he puts into the role.

What I think really makes it work is he is not fearless. For all the crazy death-defying feats he pulls off, he isn't some cold, indifferent badass type of action hero. You can see the fear in his eyes, especially when innocent people are in danger. That adds to the stakes of the action scenes, but it makes him so much more likable and human. The way this movie explores his commitment to "saving the one life" felt appropriately superhero-ish, because let's face it- for all intents and purposes he is one. I think this movie touched on why it matters that he has a good heart.

I'm not saying he's some uber-deep character, but Ethan, Benji and Luther are all incredibly easy to root for.

 

[Hunter Rider]

A crackerjack action fest that this time out might be reaching a bit far for some kind of real emotional impact but that doesn't blunt the overall slam bang grab you by collar and bring you along for the ride sheer entertaining spectacle. For sure the last 30 minutes delivers as an extremely well done chase sequence that is over the top and visceral.

I am surprised at all the praise for the CHARACTER of Hunt since I have to say from the start and throught these last two films as good as they were he and really all the reoccurring characters are to me mostly inoffensive cyphers. At best what's been added is a knowing, almost fourth wall breaking humor (thankfully used sparingly) to the proceedings but I can't see much there, there so to speak. In terms of characterization I feel we are firmly in Saturday morning cartoon territory. Which is fine. I haven't expected much in terms of meaningful development for the character of Hunt or others. It's just odd hearing that people view him as something even worthy of analysis. If I'm being brutally honest... It feels like projection to me.

 

[kguillou]

Another big part of why M:I is better than Bond lately (and most other action franchises) is because since the 4th one, everything usually doesn't work as it should, and the characters have to improvise and struggle. The script doesn't make things easy for the team, and the fun in watching flaws in this type of movies is very welcomed.

I think the MI films are not only better written but they are MUCH better paced than all of the recent Bond movies. All of the Bond films have their slow lulls in them where it draaagggs and all that happens is the plot just overly convolutes itself.

I'm gonna go right and say this for risk of being banished from these boards forever, people RAVE about Skyfall the way the Dark Knight is ravef about and to this day I dont see why. Granted, i hear you have to be a Bond purist to really appreciate the story and details but as a casual Bond movie watcher, that movie bored me. It wasnt nearly as viscerally exciting as Casino Royale and even that movie's pacing comes to a screeching halt once the casino stuff started happening. I feel like all of the Bond movies have some degree of plot and pacing problems whereas the MI movies keep you interested and keep the plot moving for the entire runtime.

But, you know, just my opinion.

 

[DyeLorean]

I think Bond is an extremely interesting franchise to think about and analyze. It is very dated, and while Casino Royale and Quantum of Solace tried to modernize the character (Casino being an astonishing piece of action/spy film in my opinion and probably the best Bond film), Sam Mendes with Skyfall and SPECTRE went backwards trying to be more like the Bond of the 60-70's. They are well made movies, but they quite didn't work for me. They felt dated.
And also, what makes M:I different is the "team" aspect. Bond is more of a solo vehicle, which makes it even harder to make compelling stories around him.

 

[kguillou]

I think Bond is an extremely interesting franchise to think about and analyze. It is very dated, and while Casino Royale and Quantum of Solace tried to modernize the character (Casino being an astonishing piece of action/spy film in my opinion and probably the best Bond film), Sam Mendes with Skyfall and SPECTRE went backwards trying to be more like the Bond of the 60-70's. They are well made movies, but they quite didn't work for me. They felt dated.
And also, what makes M:I different is the "team" aspect. Bond is more of a solo vehicle, which makes it even harder to make compelling stories around him.

Phew, glad I'm not alone. Skyfall in particular is considered the Holy Grail of spy movies by a lot of people. Maybe the "dated" aspect is what keeps me from connecting with them. And yes, the team dynamic in the MI movies always makes things interesting. Plus, Ethan is an everyman. You naturally like him. Bond has always been kind of a womanizing jerk thats entertaining to watch but maybe not connect with on an emotional level.

 

[godisawesome]

A crackerjack action fest that this time out might be reaching a bit far for some kind of real emotional impact but that doesn't blunt the overall slam bang grab you by collar and bring you along for the ride sheer entertaining spectacle. For sure the last 30 minutes delivers as an extremely well done chase sequence that is over the top and visceral.

I am surprised at all the praise for the CHARACTER of Hunt since I have to say from the start and throught these last two films as good as they were he and really all the reoccurring characters are to me mostly inoffensive cyphers. At best what's been added is a knowing, almost fourth wall breaking humor (thankfully used sparingly) to the proceedings but I can't see much there, there so to speak. In terms of characterization I feel we are firmly in Saturday morning cartoon territory. Which is fine. I haven't expected much in terms of meaningful development for the character of Hunt or others. It's just odd hearing that people view him as something even worthy of analysis. If I'm being brutally honest... It feels like projection to me.

I'm mostly with you: arguably, the newer a character is in this franchise, the more developed and unique they are. I'd say Laine, Ilsa, the White Widow and Walker are all actual characters in Fallout, with Benji being a bit more of a character than just an archetype to project on because he's the "nerd," Luthor getting at least some uniqueness from Ving Rhames having become the older brother character on the team, and Ethan as arguably the most broad character.

Not that there's anything wrong with that; Ethan arguably works better as the engine fed by Tom Cruise's charisma than the SUPER DUPER SPECIAL SPY of MI2. I'd say he had some serious characterization in the first film, and a bit of some in Ghost Protocol thanks to the mystery they added to him.

 

[DACrowe]

I think Skyfall is a nearly perfect movie if not for how unintentionally goofy some of the traps in the third act are. It is probably the best spy movie of this decade. But I had more fun watching Rogue Nation, probably Fallout, and maybe even the first Kingsman.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

If you wanna see more than what's there that's your prerogative. And it's mine to say I think you and others are projecting a level of depth that just isn't there and I say this as a guy that loved these last three movies as incredibly well done action films that contain some of the best set pieces in Hollywood history. If there is some hypocrisy in what I'm stating please elaborate beyond a smiley face.

 

[BatLobster]

As I said, I don't think Ethan Hunt is an uber-deep character, but I think Ghost Nation gets into what makes him tick a bit and lets him show a bit more vulnerability. It just makes for a likable character that you root for. Which makes you care all the more about the action and the peril he throws himself into.

I've always been a casual fan of the franchise, but I really felt myself giving a sh** majorly this time around. It felt like this one really honed in on the things that made the series/Ethan great in the first place and brought that all to the fore in a big way.