Comics Official X-MEN: LEGACY Discussion Thread

[UraniaChang]

Everyone always thinks the things he had when he was little are better.

We're all getting old.

 

[EvilClareToo]

Basic storyline: Proteus shows up. Proteus pwns some people. Rogue somehow borrows his powers and narrowly defeats him. The other X-Men get cameo level roles.

Call me a cynic and a Carey-hater if you want (seriously, both are true, so feel free...), but that's precisely how I feel that book will go. We're dealing with a writer who probably conceived this whole story without ever going back and re-reading the Proteus bit just to make sure he could accurately portray the character... He just wanted another uber-powered villain for Rogue to beat down.

And to EvilClareToo:

The Gambit "hate" among writers is simple: In the late 90s we had a lot of former 70s readers in the office, and now it's 80s readers. Those readers despised the 90s and considered everything about them trash. And while Marvel in the 90s was certainly bad, a lot of good characters/stories are forgotten by mindless 90s thrashers.

Well I'm a 80's reader (I was an adult when Gambit, Deadpool, Cable and Bishop appeared in the comics) but it doesn't stop me from liking newer characters and wanting them in good storylines. The 90's had its ups and downs (from mid-90's onwards there was a lot of poor writing, I have to admit-I lost interest in X Men for a time) but there were some good stories and characters there. If I can see that, then I don't see why others can't... and isn't Emplate a 90's character BTW? Carey seems to really like him!

Oh Lord, why are they dredging up the Magneto/Rogue thing again? I'm so tired of the Romy soap opera now...Just end it already!

 

[Mystic]

Oh, I totally agree. I read in an interview with Mike Carey that sparks will be flying between Rogue and Magneto.....again! Sigh. Talk about treating Gambit like dirt. It's so unfair on him. He really has become Rogue's "lap-dog" by now. I'm a big Romy fan but geez! Give the guy some credit. I want to see somebody else write X-Men for a while if it continues like this.

 

[squeekness]

Hey, if it stops Remy from being Rogue's b*tch, I'm all over it. He needs to be his own man again.

 

[iamlegend]

Hey, if it stops Remy from being Rogue's b*tch, I'm all over it. He needs to be his own man again.

Who are you kidding? Any male that's ever met Rogue will forever pine over Rogue. She's the perfect woman!

It's very apparent that Carey's only using Gambit here and there because the character's fans (like me, sadly... though that officially ended after this month's bait and switch) will continue to buy books in hopes that Remy will finally get an actual story. No matter what garbage Carey spews, he's shown zero interest in Gambit as a character - just as an accessory to make Rogue look better/stronger/more independent.

 

[OutcryX]

i tire of this book, i never really noticed before..but that cover with Rogue and mags makes Rogue look a bit like trailer trash...that skunk streak or something....it just seems off.

 

[Mike555]

My god is carey bad i swear remy is rogue's purse for god's sake.

 

[squeekness]

Everyone has their faves I guess. If I was writing Legacy, it'd be a Gambit heavy book.

 

[Mike555]

If i was writing this it would switch between rogue AND gambit.Like one issue be about remy and then the next issue would be about anna.

 

[Manic]

I'd just use a revolving cast. A true revolving cast, not like Uncanny X-Men's revolving cameos. Since the X-office no longer believes in using squads, I'd pick 3-7 characters for a 4-issue arc, then pick another 3-7 characters for the next arc and repeat with all different characters each time (okay, maybe I'd end up using Iceman and Nightcrawler multiple times).

 

[OutcryX]

i agree with manic..that's how I'd write it, and you would see such random characters that Carey's fan-fic team would seem like mainstays

 

[Manic]

I know exactly what my first story arc would be. I'd gather Charles, Iceman, Cloak & Dagger (why not? I love 'em, and they're part of the team now), Colossus, and maybe one of the Young X-Men just for fun, and pit them in a fight against Juggernaut in Charles' effort to turn his brother back into a good guy.

Of course, which is more fan fictiony: Me reversing Mike Carey's recent story that turned Juggernaut back into a bad guy, or Mike Carey sloppily reversing Juggernaut's reformation just because?

 

[OutcryX]

turn him back good

 

[Manic]

I really don't know what Mike Carey was smoking when he wrote that issue where Juggernaut turned bad again. The last time Charles had seen Cain, he was leaping to his rescue against Green Scar Hulk. Next thing you know, for no particular reason, Cain wants to crush Chuck's head in. Nice writing, Carey.

 

[iamlegend]

I really don't know what Mike Carey was smoking when he wrote that issue where Juggernaut turned bad again. The last time Charles had seen Cain, he was leaping to his rescue against Green Scar Hulk. Next thing you know, for no particular reason, Cain wants to crush Chuck's head in. Nice writing, Carey.

I'll credit them a TEENY bit because they planted the seeds to Juggy's return to the bad guy team in WWH - when he had to give in to the power of Cytorrak in order to save Charles and the X-Men from the Hulk.

See, that had the beginnings of a legitimate story... and legitimate stories obviously offend Mike Carey greatly.

So he went and did his stupid "Do I want to be good or evil?" bit... and went evil.

The real kicker, though, is how they had Xavier decide that redemption will never find Cain in Legacy.

Seriously?!? Never?!? Calling a character irredeemable just a really, really cheap way of ignoring everything Juggernaut had been doing for a decade.

Moral of the story: Carey's a menace.

 

[UraniaChang]

It reduced the great story in X-Men Unlimited of Cain trying so hard to prove he can care for others.

They should have let Sabretooth remain a homicidal psychopath; and make Juggernaut change for the better.

 

[Havok83]

Juggernaut should have never been made a hero. Best thing Carey did was bringing him back to the dark side

 

[Mike555]

Juggernaut should have never been made a hero. Best thing Carey did was bringing him back to the dark side

I agree i was like you got to be kidding me when they made the juggernaut good.

 

[OutcryX]

Juggernuat as a good guy was a good change of pace. I mean, why stay mad at ya brother for 80 years? Grow up, get laid. He was turned from a one dimensional tool of destruction into an actual character, only to be like..'naahh, he was just playing'

 

[UraniaChang]

Maybe not a hero, but drop off the unnecessary anger and hatred for your stepbrother who didn't really do you wrong in your childhood and try to walk on the road of a normal human being isn't so far from realistic.

 

[squeekness]

Juggernuat as a good guy was a good change of pace. I mean, why stay mad at ya brother for 80 years? Grow up, get laid. He was turned from a one dimensional tool of destruction into an actual character, only to be like..'naahh, he was just playing'

This was the only time period where I actually liked Juggs. For the most part I just thought he was plain stupid. But when he started to really look out for Sammy the fish boy, it made him more three dimensional. Now he's back to being lame again.

 

[Manic]

You know who should never be made into good guys? Apocalypse and Sinister.

Juggernaut, on the other hand, was just an overgrown thug with a senseless grudge against his brother. Once his partner in crime turned against him and he finally made up with his brother, there was no reason for him to stay bad.

 

[iamlegend]

This was the only time period where I actually liked Juggs. For the most part I just thought he was plain stupid. But when he started to really look out for Sammy the fish boy, it made him more three dimensional. Now he's back to being lame again.

Precisely. Juggernaut as a villain was a one trick pony. Oh look, a guy that's super strong and yells like flipping idiot!

It worked every now and then when the writers need a good filler issue or two (big fight scene, etc.) but after, ya know 30 years or so of it... it got old. Transforming the character was a good thing. And now that's gone.

I don't understand how so many fans get upset if Magneto ISN'T portrayed as a three-dimensional character... but enjoyed Juggernaut when he was a mindless thug.

 

[Specter313]

"Legacy," by its own definition, is a word with one foot in the past and one in the present. It describes something of an earlier time that is still relevant in the here and now. As such, the word is perfectly suited to serve as part of the title for the comic written by Mike Carey – "X-Men: Legacy."

Currently, the Marvel Comics book revolves around the character of Rogue. This is someone who began as an enemy to the X-Men, joined the team in order to get help with controlling her powers, and then, surprisingly, became one of the biggest proponents of Xavier's dream for mutantkind. Presently, she is taking all that she's learned and experienced and is sharing it with a new generation of homo superiors that have been placed under her charge by Cyclops. The dream, it seems, goes on…

As for you X-readers, well, you probably dream of getting some answers to those burning questions you have about Carey's book. Luckily, X-POSITION is here and eager to help! We've sifted through all your emails, reached out to the astonishing Mike Carey, and doled out your queries in big scoops. Let's see if he has an even bigger scoop he can share with us in return.

Uncanny Madman kicks off our post-Thanksgiving fun by letting us know what he was grateful for this past Thursday before getting to his questions:

First, I want to say that I'm absolutely loving your work on "X-Men Legacy"! You seem to find every character's voice effortlessly and your stories are refreshing and exciting, yet you still retain the essential elements of nostalgia with regards to the best parts of X-continuity. I haven't enjoyed X-Men stories this much since the 90's animated show which first got me into these mad mutants!

Thanks, Madman. There's a sense in which you're spoiled for choice in the X-verse. Whenever you have to think about who would be a cool character for a particular scene or arc, there are usually two or three who'd all be great in different ways…

Here are my questions:

1) Jubilee is slated to return to the X-Men soon. Is there any chance that she may appear in "X-Men: Legacy?" She has had previous interaction with Rogue and is of an age where she is between student and graduate – she could bridge the gap perfectly!

I think that would be a lot of fun to do. No concrete plans, but every chance.

2) Jubilee was also bought back to life by Archangel's Apocalypse-tainted blood. With the recent revelations that Chamber is some kind of descendant of Apocalypse – and since he, Jubilee and Husk were all on Generation X together – it seems that there is a story just waiting to be told that would tie in nicely with everything you have going on in "Legacy." What do you think?

I think you're right! When you consider how far Apocalypse's influence spreads through the X-Men and beyond, and then you look at the recent indications of how deeply he's got his hooks into some of the X-Men's prime movers, it's clear that there's something huge looming. The links you mention are all definitely relevant and in play.

Joshua Hetherington is pretty much an X-POSITION regular by now, always sending in some thought-provoking emails. Let's see what he's got for us this week…

1) Thank you so much for bringing Husk back! Any chance of seeing her appear in "X-Men: Legacy" beyond "Necrosha?" Like in "X-Men: Second Coming?" Or even becoming a core part of Legacy's cast? I know you're a fan of her, and you're really good at capturing the character as seen in "X-Men: Divided We Stand," so can we possibly get more Husk in the future? I always wished that she was in "Messiah CompleX" fighting with the X-Men. Also Rogue and Husk are both from the south, and that could be a good reason to promote Paige to main or supporting cast. Please?

Paige is one of the characters I really enjoy writing, Joshua, so she'll tend to come into the mix every so often when I'm in the luxurious position of assembling a team. I think, as you do, that she should be a front-liner. She has a great, versatile, unpredictable power that could be built on in lots of cool ways. I think that's going to get her into the core cast sooner or later – especially now that Sam is back in New Mutants.

2) Destiny wanted to see her daughter in "Necrosha" #1, so why did she appear to Blindfold? Could Blindfold share more with Destiny than similar powers? Like…genetics?

Interesting question. Someone answers it in "Legacy" #233.

3) In "Necrosha" #1, Destiny tells Blindfold a message that shocks Ruth, and then Warpath tells her to get out. Then in "X-Force" #21, she says she has a message for Cyclops, and at the end, he sees the mutant population rising into the millions. Are all these two things connected?

They're connected, but not in a cause-and-effect way. Blindfold's message relates to a specific part of Selene's plan. The rise in the mutant population ties in separately, but very directly.

4) In theory, wouldn't Rogue be able to permanently absorb the powers of her respective teammates now that she has full control of her ability?

At the moment, the increased control relates to how deeply she "samples" and whether she activates her power at all. But you're right that that can't be the whole story: we're seeing Rogue's powers develop into their mature form for the first time ever.

5) For the student cast of "X-Men: Legacy," it seems you're shying away from using "New X-Men" members like Surge, Hellion, Mercury and Dust in favor of characters that don't get utilized much – like Bling, Indra and Trance. Would this be an accurate assumption? And if so, why? Who else can we expect to see coming up? Maybe Cipher or Greymalkin from "Young X-Men?"

I admit I was keen to turn the spotlight on some of the characters who'd seen least screentime in recent months; it just seemed to make sense to do that, especially since these were all characters who I was interested in writing and whose powers and personalities I wanted to explore. But they're all up for grabs, and I want to keep adding new characters into the mix. Dust is a fantastic character, and I'm definitely aiming to bring her in at some point. Anole, likewise. And I'd also like to take a look at Onyxx, and see if he can become more than just Rockslide-lite.

Mugiwara enjoys looking at the potential of various characters as well and points out one in need of attention (in their humble opinion):

Prodigy was appointed as a substitute instructor by Cyclops just before "Messiah CompleX." Will he still play this role and help Rogue handle the other X-Kids?

I think a lot of those job descriptions have become problematic because of all the moves and upheavals, Mugiwara, but David's insights will always be useful – and Rogue is too smart not to call on him.

Maybe Psylocke should call on David too. That way, she could get an answer to the following query sent in by Saul Veenstra…

I have a very specific question about Psylocke's powers. I know she now is both a telepath and a telekinetic, and that Jamie Braddock enhanced Psylocke's telekinesis to a level even Rachel Summers could not match. He also made her immune to reality-warpers like Proteus, telepaths like the Shadowking, and highly resistant to magic. However, since her return and body-switch at the hands of "the Red Queen," this no longer seems to be the case.

In "Uncanny X-Men" #512, she even seemed to be unable to fly as Angel had to fly her into the Sentinel. For a telekinetic who was supposed to be able to "shatter mountains," she should have been easily able to deal with this primitive Sentinel on her own. Have Jamie's manipulations been undone (or have worn off) by the Red Queen? Or does this mean that Jamie lost his fight to the First Fallen?

I'll chime in here, Mike. Hi! X-Editor Nick Lowe, here! Your assumptions are correct, Saul. She didn't come back the same way that you last saw her. The way I look at it, she's got the same amount of power, but it's spread in different ways, between the telepathy and the telekinesis. Her TK is a lot more limited than it was, but it's still there, as you'll see in X-MEN: LEGACY #231.

Saul, you may also want to check out the "Psylocke" limited series currently on the stands written by Christopher Yost. It reviews her past, present, and other Psylocke-ological aspects of her powers and personality. Okay, X-plug over.

Hunter Lambright is next, and he's a bit foggy about the appearance of a recent character. Can you clear things up for him?

How does your "Necrosha" Proteus story work in light of the "House of M" Proteus resurrection? Are you working on the theory that the "House of M" Proteus was an alternate version?

That's how I see it, Hunter. But there's something about the way Proteus is resurrected in our story that would also allow them to be two aspects of the same being. It's hard to discuss this without spoilers, but you'll see what I mean when you read issue #231.

While you've had many mutants under your pen lately, there is one in particular that Colin would like to see you write soon.

You've mentioned in the past that you wanted to use Stryfe in "Messiah CompleX" but couldn't. Now that the character is "out of the penalty box" and will be appearing with Apocalypse for "Second Coming," will you get your chance? And do you have any hints as to what his role will be now that Stryfe knows who Hope is?

I don't know where you're getting your information from, Colin, but… short answer, no. I won't be getting to write Stryfe in "Second Coming." The big bad in "Second Coming" is someone else entirely.

Fi sent in some thoughts on Gambit's status and Rogue's past romantic entanglements. Do you have a notion or two you'd like to offer in return?

1) We haven't seen too many specifics about how Death-Gambit's returned powers or mentality work? Will this be answered anytime soon? And is this something he's going to hide from the X-Men, or will he be seeking help from more unconventional sources? Cyclops, Angel and Wolverine all have firsthand experience with this stuff, and Rogue is no stranger to malign possession herself.

Very good points, Fi. So far, at least, Remy seems to be keeping the whole situation very much to himself. I think he's still trying to come to terms with its implications himself, as the close of #230 will show…

2) Will Gambit's (stupid, awful, out-of-character) reasons for joining Apocalypse ever be revisited? He did seem to be getting a certain amount of info on the future from Mystique during "Messiah CompleX"…

I think his reasons – however misguided – were as stated, Fi. There may be things we don't know, but I don't have any major revelations in store in that respect.

3) The whole Magneto/Rogue "relationship" always seemed faintly unhealthy to me; like Rogue was confusing her gratitude to him for freeing her of Carol with something more profound. Almost as if, having no father figure herself, she was very impressed by a strong, older man. To me – as a fellow young woman – she always looked naive, silly and impressionable when they had their little moments. Is the interaction between these two something we can expect to see more of? Is there any way to see Rogue in a better light with regards to this relationship?

We will definitely see more of it. And we'll see a different angle on it, in some important ways.

Your analysis of Rogue's motivations is an interesting and convincing one. I think I'd agree that – because of what Magneto had just done for her – Rogue was in no position to see him clearly and objectively. When he killed Zaladane shortly afterwards, she re-assessed her feelings and backed off.

But that still leaves the sense of a sort of chemistry between them: a mutual interest that might be revisited. Bear in mind, though, that they're both older now, and Rogue in particular has both toughened and matured in recent years. If she was naïve during that particular encounter, now she's anything but.

In addition to a fondness for your first name, "Mike" wanted to know where 'Legacy' fits with respect to the X-books – past, present, and future…

Not a criticism, but it feels like "X-Men: Legacy" has been stuck as a tie-in book ever since you finished your Xavier story. On one hand, I find that great. It extends a lot of stories with other characters, and at the same time, your book is doing its own thing. I was wondering, though, if this trend is going to continue or are there plans for you to take the book in a direction that seems more independent of the other X-books?

There's always a cyclical aspect to these things, Mike. At the moment, there's a huge convergence towards "Second Coming," with "Utopia" and "Necrosha" as important stages on that pilgrimage. Afterwards, as with "Messiah CompleX," you can expect the books to fall into a new configuration and to follow their own paths for a while. It's like big bang – big crunch – big bang…

Sounds…combustible! That concludes the letters from this week's email bag, so now it's my turn for a "Behind the X" question, which is my attempt at a little "getting to know you"-type fun.

Mike, in addition to the fantastic work you're doing on "X-Men: Legacy," you're also writing another comic I greatly enjoy – "The Unwritten." This book is about a young man who may or may not be a fictional character made flesh (on top of the other plot points you're juggling with this tale).

As a continuation of this idea, my question is this: if you could have dinner with any fictional literary character (non-comic related), who would it be, what would the meal be, and why?

I'd probably have dinner with Jay Gatsby, over at his place in West Egg. I'd love to experience one of those incredible hedonistic banquets instead of just reading about how cool they were.



Legacy #230:

COVER BY: Daniel Acuna
WRITER: Mike Carey
DUANE SWIERCZYSNKI
PENCILS: Daniel Acuna
Steve Dillon
INKS: Daniel Acuna
COLORED BY: Daniel Acuna
THE STORY:
It’s Rogue and Trance vs. Emplate -- a villain who has single-handedly taken down teams of X-Men A-Listers. Do they stand a chance? We sure hope so as X-MEN LEGACY #231 is on sale two weeks later! Don’t miss the killer climax to the huge first arc of the new direction on X-MEN LEGACY! Plus, a Cable backstory! Rated T …$3.99

PRICE: 3.99
IN STORES: December 16, 2009


Legacy #231:

COVER BY: Adi Granov
WRITER: Mike Carey
PENCILS: Clay Mann
THE STORY:
The NECROSHA event hits X-MEN: LEGACY! Selene’s masterplan is clicking into place, but she got something she didn’t plan for when Destiny was brought back to life. A major X-Villain came back with Destiny and a who’s who of X-Men are sent to Muir Island to deal with them. Join Nightcrawler, Colossus, Psylocke, Rogue (if she makes it through #230 alive) and a new member (who’s so secret we can’t mention him here) as they dive into NECROSHA. Part 1 (of 3) Rated A …$2.99

PRICE: 2.99
IN STORES: December 23, 2009

 

[Manic]

I love Acuna, but it looks like he's drawing the wrong Proudstar brother.