Poorly Written Script

[Killgore]

Pretty good, but they should have went this way.

For 25 years he’s been a marked man, living on borrowed time. A daredevil that seemingly can’t die. Anticipating at any second that the Boogie Man, Satan was just behind him, sneaking up closer and closer. Perhaps a tap on the shoulder where there is nobody. There in the stands, no, wasn’t him. He travels the world – surviving accidents that can’t have been survived. Proving to himself over and over that on that night, at those crossroads in no man’s land… he had a date with Old Scratch, and some day, he’s gonna get (screwed).

 

[Movies205]

I don't know I found it kind of lame that he's a stunt rider racing death... Mainly because later on that persona does nothing for the character since the demon is completely seperate from Johnny. Like if I was actually to sit down and pen a story, the most important aspect is what the demon is and why it needs to be bound to Johnny. However... I'm not so I can play with the abstracts without dealing with the rigourous but oh so lovely torment of writing...

 

[Demon Within]

I don't know I found it kind of lame that he's a stunt rider racing death... Mainly because later on that persona does nothing for the character since the demon is completely seperate from Johnny. Like if I was actually to sit down and pen a story, the most important aspect is what the demon is and why it needs to be bound to Johnny. However... I'm not so I can play with the abstracts without dealing with the rigourous but oh so lovely torment of writing...

Seemed to me they were NOT seperate after he learned to "control" the fire.

 

[Theweepeople]

Mad props to killgore. That was a wonderful analysis of how GR sucked ass. Since you appear to be very good at noticing plotholes I was wondering what your opinion of X3 is. If you hated that film then I would encourage you to post in the "If you don't like the movie post here" thread for the X3 forum. We X3 haters could use another opinion to continue motivating us to bash that hideous piece of crap until Fox fixes the mess they created.

 

[Demon Within]

Mad props to killgore. That was a wonderful analysis of how GR sucked ass. Since you appear to be very good at noticing plotholes I was wondering what your opinion of X3 is. If you hated that film then I would encourage you to post in the "If you don't like the movie post here" thread for the X3 forum. We X3 haters could use another opinion to continue motivating us to bash that hideous piece of crap until Fox fixes the mess they created.

Sorry but the mess started with leather costumes in X1. "They were going for realizm" is a coppout so they didnt need to be creative.

 

[crazy sock]

Sorry but the mess started with leather costumes in X1. "They were going for realizm" is a coppout so they didnt need to be creative.

yea, because everyone would much rather have seen them all wearing blue and yellow spandex. right?

 

[Fried Gold]

People like you are the biggest problem when it comes to movies. You are like one of those pompous hollywood critics who swear they know whats best for everyone. This movie was made to do nothing more than be an entertaining, special effects pop corn fest. Thats it, it wasnt going for an oscar or any other lame ass un-deserved trash award. Its a comic book film, you and the rest of hollywood are just reading WAYYYY to much into it.

Dude, just because it's a comic book film, it doesn't necessarily follow that the quality of the product should be sacrificed in any way. If anything, you're the biggest problem when it comes to these movies.

 

[FlameHead]

You guys know there are already threads here to trash the movie right? Another one wasn't needed. Sure, you wanted to start off by focusing on the script alone but, everything else you seem to hate about the movie came out as well. Regardless, your opinions are surely noted.

 

[FlameHead]

No it's not fun if it makes no friggin coherent sense. Perhaps we were to turn off our brain, but why should we? Mindless does not equal fun.

Unfortunatly, some people only turn on their brain long enough to see their own point of view, and nothing else.

I agree completely with your assessment Movies205. The script was an abysmal mess. The caretaker has one last burn in him so he uses it to take Johnny to the town and then fade into the desert? WTF? Doesn't the chopper from hell come equipped with GPS? Why not just use Mapquest? Or how about just riding on the back of the motorcycle and then flaming up when it came time to battle?

The way I see it is that Caretaker waited many years to finally have the new Ghost Rider on earth so that he can have his last ride and finally rest, knowing he doesn't have the burden of concealing the contract. The final ride wasn't for the new Ghost Rider, to help him find where he was going. It was for himself.

And why did Hydro-demon attack Ghost Rider when he was delivering the scroll to Blackheart just like he was instructed to do?

I'm not sure what you're getting at here....

And why does Satan need a piece of paper to own someone's soul? And why does he need a bounty hunter on a friggin motorcycle when he can just teleport to where he is going?

Meph needs a piece of paper because he didn't get the soul under normal circumstances (you know, death). It's simple really. It's all business to Meph and all good businesses have contracts.

Meph needs a bounty hunter because he doesn't have the same power on earth as he does in his own realm. Plus, he's a really busy guy and doesn't have time to collect these escaped souls. Again, a very simple explanation.

And you made a great point about the knife. Why can a knife hurt him, but not cop bullets?

This is probably the strongest case you have for a 'poor' script. Now, because I only seen the movie once (so far) I can't really be certain that it was the knife that caused that wound but, it seems that it was yes. If that is the case, the bullets should definitely affected him.

And why are the souls in thatwestern town so much more important than say, the millions of Nazi's that were killed in WWII? Seems that 1000 souls are pocket change when compared to the millennia of evil bastards that have died?

The people of that town sold their souls and are bound by a similar contract that Blaze was under. The Nazi's were just evil bastards and are already being feasted on by Meph or one of the other rulers of the many hells.

And why would Satan give his bounty hunter the ability to stare into sinners' eyes and turn the pain they've caused against them? What purpose does that actually fulfill in Satan's grand scheme?

What difference would it be if Satan took their soul to hell and made them feel the burning pain of their sins for the rest of eternity? Why does satan do that?

Parts of the movie were beautiful, but the entire movie was vapid and pointless.

I wasn't really aware that any movie (beyond a documentary) had a 'point'. It's there to sit back and enjoy, not to have a 'point'.

 

[Killgore]

You wouldn't happen to be biased now would you? The moderator for the Ghost Rider forum apologizes for a piss poor script? Imagine that.

 

[FlameHead]

I'm not apologizing for anything and, in fact, see no need for anyone to apologize.

 

[Demon Within]

yea, because everyone would much rather have seen them all wearing blue and yellow spandex. right?

Because everyone would rather see Superman in his costume,Iron man in his, Ghost Rider be a flaming skull, Spiderman in his.

You dont find it odd that all of the ones I listed above use there costumes from the comics an people like the movies still? Save Iron man since its not out yet. What a piss poor argument that was.

 

[Killgore]

Unfortunatly, some people only turn on their brain long enough to see their own point of view, and nothing else.

And others are predisposed to love something no matter how retched it is. I'm always willing to concede if I am given adequate reason to change my POV.

The way I see it is that Caretaker waited many years to finally have the new Ghost Rider on earth so that he can have his last ride and finally rest, knowing he doesn't have the burden of concealing the contract. The final ride wasn't for the new Ghost Rider, to help him find where he was going. It was for himself.

That's just a weak excuse, not a legitimate motivation. Besides, why would we want to watch that? For as much of both a time and emotional investment we are expected to have in the Caretaker, that’s a really weak character arc, not to mention lack of a payoff.

I'm not sure what you're getting at here....

Precisely. It’s an illogical, pointless fight for the sake of having a fight.

Meph needs a piece of paper because he didn't get the soul under normal circumstances (you know, death). It's simple really. It's all business to Meph and all good businesses have contracts.

Meph needs a bounty hunter because he doesn't have the same power on earth as he does in his own realm. Plus, he's a really busy guy and doesn't have time to collect these escaped souls. Again, a very simple explanation.

So Satan can bestow fantastic powers ON a mortal but cannot use those powers himself? Who’s making these ridiculous rules? The movie makes Satan out to be a bureaucrat rather than the Prince of Darkness.

This is probably the strongest case you have for a 'poor' script. Now, because I only seen the movie once (so far) I can't really be certain that it was the knife that caused that wound but, it seems that it was yes. If that is the case, the bullets should definitely affected him.

I’m sure you’ll come up with something.

I wasn't really aware that any movie (beyond a documentary) had a 'point'. It's there to sit back and enjoy, not to have a 'point'.

Every movie has a point or a theme or a world view. Just because you refuse to look for it doesn’t mean it’s no there.

 

[deathshead2]

I don't know but bright yellow and blue looks very very silly.

 

[Demon Within]

I don't know but bright yellow and blue looks very very silly.

No more silly then blue,red, yellow that Superman wears in his movies. Why does no one ever have a problem with that?

If Bryan singer made Wolverine into a female would you also say "well him being a male is pretty silly IMO".

 

[deathshead2]

No because thats ******ed and a bad example.

 

[Demon Within]

No because thats ******ed and a bad example.

So is saying COMIC BOOK characters shouldnt wear COSTUMES because its SILLY.

 

[jrd550]

So was the script good? Could it have been better? If so then it's fair to criticize it. To me, Batman Begins script was perfect, where Superman Returns was less than stellar. Ghost Rider's script - could it hold up on it's own as a book? Without the imagery? Every great script should.

 

[Demon Within]

So was the script good? Could it have been better? If so then it's fair to criticize it. To me, Batman Begins script was perfect, where Superman Returns was less than stellar. Ghost Rider's script - could it hold up on it's own as a book? Without the imagery? Every great script should.

I would say no.

 

[Movies205]

PAD pokes holes at hte same thing I was talking about earlier

GHOST WITH THE MOST
Just came back from the advance screening of "Ghost Rider." Discussion with some minor spoilers below.

Long story short: Entertaining eye candy with some great action set pieces, nifty FX, decent acting from Nic Cage and a plot that doesn't make a lick of sense.

Short story long: And by not a lick of sense, I mean tons of no sense. Internal rules that don't remain consistent (Satanic beings can't enter a cemetery because it's consecrated...but they CAN enter a church?). The concept that, like Slayers, every generation has a Ghost Rider, except later we learn there's been 150 years since the last one. Characters who appear and disappear for no reason. Elemental demons who conveniently attack Ghost Rider one at a time over three successive nights, thus allowing themselves to be dispatched without much trouble, rather than attacking him en masse.

But the film has a lot of energy, moves along briskly, and features a solidly tongue in cheek performance from Nic Cage (his halting explanation of his current status quo to his disbelieving girlfriend is a stitch.) It's an hour and forty five minutes of entertainment, and--sadly--even with enough holes to drive a truck fleet through, the plot STILL makes more sense than "Superman Returns."

PAD

http://peterdavid.malibulist.com/archives/005179.html

For those who don't know Peter David, he wrote one of the longest runs on Incredible Hulk, along with Captain Marvel Vol. 3 and 4, and currently I believe is writing Fallen Angel in the comic world.

 

[TheVileOne]

Peter David has also written at least several novelizations of Marvel Comic based movies including Spider-man and Spider-man 2. He was also the writer on Friendly Neighborhood Spider-man I believe.

 

[Chaos Bringer]

it wasnt going for an oscar or any other lame ass un-deserved trash award. Its a comic book film

what are you doing here?

know what site this is ?

 

[Movies205]

Peter David has also written at least several novelizations of Marvel Comic based movies including Spider-man and Spider-man 2. He was also the writer on Friendly Neighborhood Spider-man I believe.

Where have you been, long time, no see...

 

[Killgore]

PAD pokes holes at hte same thing I was talking about earlier

GHOST WITH THE MOST
Just came back from the advance screening of "Ghost Rider." Discussion with some minor spoilers below.

Long story short: Entertaining eye candy with some great action set pieces, nifty FX, decent acting from Nic Cage and a plot that doesn't make a lick of sense.

Short story long: And by not a lick of sense, I mean tons of no sense. Internal rules that don't remain consistent (Satanic beings can't enter a cemetery because it's consecrated...but they CAN enter a church?). The concept that, like Slayers, every generation has a Ghost Rider, except later we learn there's been 150 years since the last one. Characters who appear and disappear for no reason. Elemental demons who conveniently attack Ghost Rider one at a time over three successive nights, thus allowing themselves to be dispatched without much trouble, rather than attacking him en masse.

But the film has a lot of energy, moves along briskly, and features a solidly tongue in cheek performance from Nic Cage (his halting explanation of his current status quo to his disbelieving girlfriend is a stitch.) It's an hour and forty five minutes of entertainment, and--sadly--even with enough holes to drive a truck fleet through, the plot STILL makes more sense than "Superman Returns."

PAD

http://peterdavid.malibulist.com/archives/005179.html

For those who don't know Peter David, he wrote one of the longest runs on Incredible Hulk, along with Captain Marvel Vol. 3 and 4, and currently I believe is writing Fallen Angel in the comic world.

Good find. As usual Peter David is right on target. Now I gotta go out and find his Superman Returns review.

 

[Theweepeople]

This movie had many plotholes. I just wanted to comment on a few of them.

1. Why did GR need Blackheart to take control over all those souls for his penance stare to work? Blackheart is a demon and most religions suggest they spend all of their time torturing souls in hells when they're not causing trouble in our reality. Also, Blackheart killed plenty of people in the movie before GR uses his penance stare on him the first time. There's no rational way for anyone to explain away this gigantic plothole.

2. How could the devil be deceptive enough to trick GR into signing his will, take his dad's life, and yet be too stupid to not add something to the will that would take GR's power away once Satan didn't need him anymore?!!!!

This is not a plothole but, I was wondering why Blackheart's goons were either wimps or complete morons. Fire guy was way too overconfident in thinking he had killed GR with the truck. Wind guy burned up by getting too close to GR's chain. Water guy already saw what GR did to Fire and Wind guy so I thought his plans for taking down GR would be more strategic.