racism in hollywood - and how far it has come.

[jmc]

I often wonder if part of the success of the Fast and Furious franchise is down to it being the most multicultural blockbuster series. I think just about every major race is represented in the film, especially the last couple of films.

 

[Pink Ranger]

I often wonder if part of the success of the Fast and Furious franchise is down to it being the most multicultural blockbuster series. I think just about every major race is represented in the film, especially the last couple of films.

The multiculturalism angle is interesting in those films (not a fan of TFATF myself, but I recognize the appeal) but overall this film series has become a cultural touchstone for the millennial generation, I think.

 

[JJJ's Ulcer]

What about messing with other traits besides race? Can we make Sherlock Holmes morbidly obese, and make Daredevil an orthodox Jew? Just throwing it out there. Don't hate, appreciate.

 

[Teelie]

They've inched into that with an asian woman for Watson in Elementary and making Moriarty [blackout]a woman who used Irene Adler as an alias[/blackout] (blacked out for those who don't know). Although I'm not sure if an Orthodox Jewish Daredevil makes any sense I don't think it would be a problem necessarily unless it interfered with him being Daredevil.

 

[JJJ's Ulcer]

Yeah, I was joking. My point was that it's not about racism, but changing the character IS changing the character whether its race, gender, religion or ..... fatness.

 

[Ant-manic]

They've inched into that with an asian woman for Watson in Elementary and making Moriarty [blackout]a woman who used Irene Adler as an alias[/blackout] (blacked out for those who don't know). Although I'm not sure if an Orthodox Jewish Daredevil makes any sense I don't think it would be a problem necessarily unless it interfered with him being Daredevil.

it'd certainly be stepping on Moon Knight's toes.

 

[Doctor Evo]

In terms of adaptation, if the race of the character matters, don't change it. I really can't see Bruce Wayne ever being black, and Black Panther would never be white.

 

[SV Fan]

Personally I miss the good old days when we get stuff like this

[YT]PGJfruLLiyk[/YT]

 

[Thundercrack85]

They've inched into that with an asian woman for Watson in Elementary and making Moriarty [blackout]a woman who used Irene Adler as an alias[/blackout] (blacked out for those who don't know). Although I'm not sure if an Orthodox Jewish Daredevil makes any sense I don't think it would be a problem necessarily unless it interfered with him being Daredevil.

Well actually I think part of the reason they did that, was to make it less obvious that they were trying to capitalize / rip off of Sherlock.

 

[Manic]

Does anyone else find it weird that Captain Nemo from 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea is usually played by white actors?

Scratch that, new question. How many of you knew the main character of 20,000 Leagues Under The Sea was Indian?

 

[Doctor Evo]

I must be remembering the book incorrectly, because I was under the impression that, while he wasn't white, his ethnic origin remained a mystery.

 

[Manic]

His backstory is revealed in Verne's The Mysterious Island.

Captain Nemo identifies himself as Prince Dakkar, son of the Hindu Raja of Bundelkund, and also a descendant of the Muslim Sultan Fateh Ali Tipu of the Kingdom of Mysore, famous for the Anglo-Mysore Wars. After the First Indian War of Independence of 1857, in which Dakkar lost his family and his kingdom, he devoted himself to scientific research and developed the Nautilus, wherein he and a crew of followers cruise the seas, battling injustice, especially imperialism.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captain_Nemo

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

Yeah, I was joking. My point was that it's not about racism, but changing the character IS changing the character whether its race, gender, religion or ..... fatness.

This is true, but since I can't tell if you're for or against this, I'll start by saying I think it's okay to change a character's race/gender/religion to a certain extent.

For ex. Ra's al Ghul isn't pronounced correctly in the nolan trilogy, however, there are a couple of things with that. They never fully denied that he didn't have any Arab heritage; hell there are some Middle Eastern peoples that look as caucasian as Liam Neeson. But it even helps in dkr, during the flashbacks scenes around the area he was exiled, and all those prison inmates in the lazarus pit talking and chanting Moroccan, so his Arab heritage is hinted at. Could call him a british arab.

that's race, as for gender, I heard that a character in mos was changed to female and ended being the sister of the actual character changed, but she just takes his place. If it's a supporting character like that, I think it's fine as long as the plot can't get sticky.

with religion, I once started writing a fanfic of nightcrawler as a Muslim instead of Catholic but I thought it was interesting since his part of his character arc is being very faithful, so I thought it would be interesting to have another take on the character being devoted to something else like that.

with fatness, i'll use bb as another example - flass is supposed to be handsome in the comics but a lot of people think he's unattractive and again since it's like a supporting character I think it's fine.

but as for not agreeing with this, bane's one example where I really wasn't fond of the approach for heritage. I couldn't understand why they had to change his heritage at all. they made it more complicated than it should. first of all, people are divided about whether or not he was born in the lazarus pit, and if he was born there, he should have sounded like the rest of the people that lived there.

His voice, many would say, sounded like a mechanized sean connery, which is as most have heard a british/scottish accent. but if he really was born there it doesn't make sense. period. I've been called nitpicky before for accent issues like this but honestly, bane was the second most important character imo in dkr and he had a very thought provoking and unique origin in the comics so I really wished they'd have done it and done it right.

What about messing with other traits besides race? Can we make Sherlock Holmes morbidly obese, and make Daredevil an orthodox Jew? Just throwing it out there. Don't hate, appreciate.

Okay, well are you saying it's fine to mess with character traits or you prefer they stick to it as much as possible?

Maybe I can put it context for you, Tanin. I'll write about something important then use ALL CAPS TO DISCUSS IT AND SEE HOW WELL EVERYONE ENJOYS READING THIS.

WHAT DO YOU THINK SO FAR? DO YOU FIND THIS EASIER AND MORE RELAXED TO READ OR DOES IT ANNOY THE **** OUT OF YOU YET?

listen man I don't have any ill will here but first off, I would never do that, that's terribly different to read, and second, if other posters can look past my wording issues then I don't know why you can't be a little more reasonable.

ahh who am i kidding. my thread is fail.

 

[JJJ's Ulcer]

I don't know. It depends how integral certain traits are to a character's identity. I think sometimes it works (making Kingpin black) and other times it doesn't (like when they thought of recasting James Bond as an American in the 70's after Sean Connery left).

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

I don't know. It depends how integral certain traits are to a character's identity. I think sometimes it works (making Kingpin black) and other times it doesn't (like when they thought of recasting James Bond as an American in the 70's after Sean Connery left).

I'm not very familiar with james bond. is the character himself english?

wat do you make of the examples i presented?

 

[craigdbfan]

Hyde is right. Bruce Wayne can't be anything other than a white male. I would even go as far as to say that it has to be an actor of Anglo-Saxon descent.

It's an inherent part of the Wayne family that they are of a WASP origin thus the billions of dollars the estate has. That wouldn't be able to be replicated by a black, Asian or even a white Hispanic actor, even someone who is white but not of any Germanic descent wouldn't be appropriate. There would be a loss of authenticity when approaching the character in my view.

That's who the character is. I had the same view when it came to Kaneda and the rest of the characters and setting of Akira too. Turning them into white characters and changing the setting to Manhattan completely undermines the significance of the characters, story and setting.

 

[jmc]

I think characters like Superman, James Bond, etc, are too ingrained in pop culture to have their races changed. The supporting cast is fair game however in most cases. Miss Moneypenny is now of Jamaican decent, Perry White is African American, as is Electro in AMS2, there's really few rules to say these characters couldn't be played by people of non-European decent. I've heard rumour of Denzel Washington as Lex Luthor which would blow my freakin' mind if it turned out true.

 

[Goshdarn Batman]

I want this movie to be made:

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=tGkWY2RAorA

 

[Manic]

I think characters like Superman, James Bond, etc, are too ingrained in pop culture to have their races changed. The supporting cast is fair game however in most cases. Miss Moneypenny is now of Jamaican decent, Perry White is African American, as is Electro in AMS2, there's really few rules to say these characters couldn't be played by people of non-European decent. I've heard rumour of Denzel Washington as Lex Luthor which would blow my freakin' mind if it turned out true.

I think a bigger fuss was made at Lois Lane's hair color in Man of Steel than Perry White's race change. So I agree, I think it really boils down to how popular the character is.

 

[Teelie]

Well actually I think part of the reason they did that, was to make it less obvious that they were trying to capitalize / rip off of Sherlock.

If that were true, he wouldn't be named Sherlock Holmes and have a partner surnamed Watson.

 

[Doctor Evo]

Hyde is right. Bruce Wayne can't be anything other than a white male. I would even go as far as to say that it has to be an actor of Anglo-Saxon descent.

It's an inherent part of the Wayne family that they are of a WASP origin thus the billions of dollars the estate has. That wouldn't be able to be replicated by a black, Asian or even a white Hispanic actor, even someone who is white but not of any Germanic descent wouldn't be appropriate. There would be a loss of authenticity when approaching the character in my view.

That's who the character is. I had the same view when it came to Kaneda and the rest of the characters and setting of Akira too. Turning them into white characters and changing the setting to Manhattan completely undermines the significance of the characters, story and setting.

I hope you're being facetious. This is beyond absurd.

 

[craigdbfan]

I hope you're being facetious. This is beyond absurd.

I'm not. How is it absurd? Go ahead and explain yourself instead of just dropping that little comment without bothering to explain how you think turning Wayne into an African-American man wouldn't inherently change the character. That's far more absurd. I hold the exact same view when it comes to Akira by the way with its Japanese characters and settings unless you think that turning all the characters white and then changing the setting to Manhattan doesn't change the story either.

Go ahead and explain yourself.

 

[Victarion]

Isn't Akira an allegory for the bomb we dropped in WWII? So yeah, it makes sense that you maintain their racial identity because they'd have a different perspective on that event than a caucasian.

Now, a big-screen adaption of the Malazan Book of the Fallen would be great, because the main cast is a pretty diverse group, racially speaking. I think Lord of the Rings meets Apocalypse Now / Full Metal Jacket would draw in a sufficiently large audience, as would the casting diversity.

 

[Goshdarn Batman]

I'm not. How is it absurd? Go ahead and explain yourself instead of just dropping that little comment without bothering to explain how you think turning Wayne into an African-American man wouldn't inherently change the character. That's far more absurd. I hold the exact same view when it comes to Akira by the way with its Japanese characters and settings unless you think that turning all the characters white and then changing the setting to Manhattan doesn't change the story either.

Go ahead and explain yourself.

I agree.

Another example would be the planned american remake of "Trollhunter". It makes no sense if the movie takes place in the US. Trolls are not a part of American folklore.

 

[Teelie]

Trolls are not a part of American folklore.

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