Homecoming Robert Downey Jr IS Tony Stark / Iron Man

[Flint Marko]

Glad you like what they're doing here. Just not for everybody's taste.

Unlike you, I'm simply trying to look at the glass half full. There are a multitude of ways in which they could potentially drop the ball, but I don't see the point in freaking out at every decision and getting worked up over what could go wrong for no reason.

Spidey overshadows Iron Man with a fraction of his screentime in Civil War. Get a grip people. If there's one thing Marvel always gets right, it's their heroes.

 

[JOE]

You're missing the point entirely. It's not about "sharing the spotlight" it's more like "letting Spider-Man shine in his own film without being overshadowed by another hero." Iron Man himself has already stolen the spotlight in 6 MCU films (7 if he defeats Spidey's villain.), he doesn't need to have a huge role in this film and he especially shouldn't fight any of Spidey's iconic rouges 1-on-1 unless it's a Sinister Six film.

Oh, and i'd feel the same way about Daredevil, but then again, he wouldn't overshadow Spidey because he isn't the third most powerful hero in the MCU.

Well what did you expect by wanting Spider-Man in the MCU?

Think about it, that's what the deal was. Spider-Man was allowed to be in Civil War (and other potential movies?) and Sony is allowed to use MCU characters in their solo movie. Do you think Sony is just going to have RDJ come in and give Peter some advice then leave? Not a chance. They're paying a pretty penny for him and you bet your ass they're going to have him suit up.

There's a reason Sony wants RDJ, he fills theatre seats. Which is exactly what this solo needs after the disappointing TASM and TASM 2.

I'm so pumped to see them team up on screen together! t:

 

[ImSGirl95]

I'm so pumped to see them team up on screen together! t:

Ditto! This time against a real villain and not the Captain.

 

[PeterBenParker]

Yeah, I find it hillarious bashing RDj on his yet to be figured at as a small role in Homecoming, when in fact Spider-man overshadowed everyone in Civil War LOL

Hard to believe they'd pay RDJ so much money just for a 'small' role.

 

[ImSGirl95]

Hard to believe they'd pay RDJ so much money just for a 'small' role.

How much money did they exactly paid him for Homecoming?

 

[harryoscop]

Well what did you expect by wanting Spider-Man in the MCU?

What did I expect? hmm... I expected him to stand on his own, in his own corner where Feige would establish Spidey's own huge Mythos and universe in the MCU. I thought Spidey would only crossover with other heroes in Avenger/Event films) but I hated the idea of Iron Man being in the movie more than anybody else. (go back to my February-March 2015 post-history) Of course I don't now, but some of my fears about Marvel stuffing him into the movie might be coming to fruitation. ****ing too early to tell.

Think about it, that's what the deal was. Spider-Man was allowed to be in Civil War (and other potential movies?) and Sony is allowed to use MCU characters in their solo movie. Do you think Sony is just going to have RDJ come in and give Peter some advice then leave? Not a chance. They're paying a pretty penny for him and you bet your ass they're going to have him suit up.

I don't exactly have a problem with him just 'suiting up' I have a problem with him taking on and defeating Spider-Man's main villain. I wouldn't have a problem with a) Stark showing up in the suit to train Peter b) Stark having an Iron Man cameo to Oscorp (since they likely will be competitors) c) At the worst, him trying to fight Spidey's villain but getting knocked the **** out by an EMP or something letting Peter deal with whoever it is by himself like he should.

I really don't want to give up on this version of Spidey after his perfect portrayal in Civil War.

There's a reason Sony wants RDJ, he fills theatre seats. Which is exactly what this solo needs after the disappointing TASM and TASM 2.

No, he really does not. Spidey needs a good movie not more Iron Man. Spidey has already been rejuvenated amoungst the GA, he doesn't need Iron Man to sell tickets.

I'm so pumped to see them team up on screen together! t:

Good for you.

 

[Iron_Stark]

You're missing the point entirely. It's not about "sharing the spotlight" it's more like "letting Spider-Man shine in his own film without being overshadowed by another hero." Iron Man himself has already stolen the spotlight in 6 MCU films (7 if he defeats Spidey's villain.), he doesn't need to have a huge role in this film and he especially shouldn't fight any of Spidey's iconic rouges 1-on-1 unless it's a Sinister Six film.

Oh, and i'd feel the same way about Daredevil, but then again, he wouldn't overshadow Spidey because he isn't the third most powerful hero in the MCU.

Which ones?

Iron Man 1-3 were HIS movies. There was no "stealing the spotlight" in those.

Avengers? Ofcourse he had to star in that one. Complete nonsense if you think otherwise. BUT Captain America had the most screen time and Hulk was the one that stole the show in that one. So no he didn't steal anyone's spotlight in those.

Age of Ultron? See Avengers. Except this time people left the theater talking about the twins and Vision. No stealing the spot light there.

Civil War? Same as the Avengers movies. Except this one, people left talking about Spider-Man and Black Panther.

RDJ has gone on record saying he could've had the most screen time in the Avegers movies and been the leader, but chose not to.

You're over thinking this.

 

[Neno_Kos]

I personally want to see Tony Stark as Norman Osborn rival and Oscorp as Stark Industries long time competition for weapon technology and government contracts. And personally dont want to see much of Tony Stark teaching Peter anything, cause that would really give away his identity away. Stark is celebrity persona. And personally on other hand I dont see point of using Iron Man in movie. Unless really villain (Vulture) of Homecoming has somehow ties into Falcon's suit. That would also be another nice take in tying universe together. See Tony, Norman and Toomes, all together and all of them for their own reasons pulling strings their way. Tony wanting to retrieve stolen Avengers equipment, Norman stealing original Toomes research and Toomes wanting get back his research from Norman, but in same time in between them comes Spider-Man.

 

[harryoscop]

Which ones?

Iron Man 1-3 were HIS movies. There was no "stealing the spotlight" in those.

Avengers? Ofcourse he had to star in that one. Complete nonsense if you think otherwise. BUT Captain America had the most screen time and Hulk was the one that stole the show in that one. So no he didn't steal anyone's spotlight in those.

Age of Ultron? See Avengers. Except this time people left the theater talking about the twins and Vision. No stealing the spot light there.

Civil War? Same as the Avengers movies. Except this one, people left talking about Spider-Man and Black Panther.

RDJ has gone on record saying he could've had the most screen time in the Avegers movies and been the leader, but chose not to.

You're over thinking this.

A1 - He's the one closes out the final battle by directing the nuke into the portal destroying the Chitari
A2 - Wins the Hulkbuster fight (which he never wins in the comics) by somehow fricking sucker punching the Hulk and knocking him out
- Civil War.. Well, you got me on that one. Obviously nerfed because Cap/Bucky wouldn't have stood a chance against him.

"He could've had the most screen time, coud've been the leader but he chose not to"? Wat? This is the first i'm hearing about this.

I personally want to see Tony Stark as Norman Osborn rival and Oscorp as Stark Industries long time competition for weapon technology and government contracts. And personally dont want to see much of Tony Stark teaching Peter anything, cause that would really give away his identity away. Stark is celebrity persona. And personally on other hand I dont see point of using Iron Man in movie. Unless really villain (Vulture) of Homecoming has somehow ties into Falcon's suit. That would also be another nice take in tying universe together. See Tony, Norman and Toomes, all together and all of them for their own reasons pulling strings their way. Tony wanting to retrieve stolen Avengers equipment, Norman stealing original Toomes research and Toomes wanting get back his research from Norman, but in same time in between them comes Spider-Man.

This sounds great.

 

[SuperAl]

RDJ has gone on record saying he could've had the most screen time in the Avegers movies and been the leader, but chose not to.
.

I really hope RDJ doesnt have a say in how much screentime he gets. That shouldn't be up to him.

 

[ImSGirl95]

"He could've had the most screen time, coud've been the leader but he chose not to"? Wat? This is the first i'm hearing about this.

Yeah, I remember him saying that in an interview.
He said that Whedon had the idea for A1, the movie to open with IM and be the source for the connection of the heroes coming together. Or somehing like that. Can't remember. Really old interview.

 

[Flint Marko]

At the beginning, RDJ and Whedon approached the Avengers as being a Stark-centric story where the audience was basically going along for the ride through his eyes, but halfway through writing it they both realized it didn't work that way so they switched it up.

 

[JOE]

What did I expect? hmm... I expected him to stand on his own, in his own corner where Feige would establish Spidey's own huge Mythos and universe in the MCU. I thought Spidey would only crossover with other heroes in Avenger/Event films) but I hated the idea of Iron Man being in the movie more than anybody else. (go back to my February-March 2015 post-history) Of course I don't now, but some of my fears about Marvel stuffing him into the movie might be coming to fruitation. ****ing too early to tell.

I don't exactly have a problem with him just 'suiting up' I have a problem with him taking on and defeating Spider-Man's main villain. I wouldn't have a problem with a) Stark showing up in the suit to train Peter b) Stark having an Iron Man cameo to Oscorp (since they likely will be competitors) c) At the worst, him trying to fight Spidey's villain but getting knocked the **** out by an EMP or something letting Peter deal with whoever it is by himself like he should.

I really don't want to give up on this version of Spidey after his perfect portrayal in Civil War.
No, he really does not. Spidey needs a good movie not more Iron Man. Spidey has already been rejuvenated amoungst the GA, he doesn't need Iron Man to sell tickets.
Good for you.

Right, because that's a deal Sony would offer. "Here's Spider-Man for all your team up MCU movies, but don't worry, we're not going to use any of your characters for our solo movie."

Who says that he's going to defeat Spider-Man's villain? The guy has JUST been cast in the movie and already it's an Iron Man movie now? Cause that's what you're implying if he's going to defeat the villain with or for Spidey. We don't know the context of his appearances in or out of suit. Maybe it's something Peter can't handle so he calls in for assistance? Oh wait, that would be terrible considering it brings down Peter Parker's ability to be a "lone wolf".

Let me stop you RIGHT there where you start spitting out nonsense about not needing Iron Man to sell tickets.

MCU box office average with RDJ: 1.07B
MCU box office average without RDJ: 533M

The numbers are a bit skewed because of the Avengers movies, but they are what they are. Oh and by the way that number is going to climb after Civil War makes over 1.07B, just saying.

It's pretty naive to say that Spider-Man is good on his own because of 10 minutes in Civil War. It takes more than just that for him to have a successful box office draw (assuming the movie is good). I'd say without RDJ the movie would do Winter Soldier/GOTG numbers, slightly higher. In the 800M range, maybe SM3 numbers with good WOM and a decent RT score. With RDJ this becomes a billion dollar movie, period. That's why he's in it, and I can't wait!

 

[Shikamaru]

Can't say any of that bothered me personally. The good far outweighs the bad, or in this case the nitpicks IMO. I'm at a point where no matter what Marvel may do that differs from my preferred version, it is undoubtedly better than the alternative. I shudder to think of what Sont would have done.

In my opinion, it's not a nitpick when one of the core aspects of Spidey was that he never had a mentor. It was kinda the big thing that separated him from the X-Men and the DC sidekicks back then. We don't think of it that way now, especially now that we have similar popular archetypes like Static and Danny Phantom, but back then he really was the only one. He was to teen superheroes exactly what Superman was to superheroes.

It also ties in with Peter's loneliness IMO. That's another trait I found to be very relatable as a kid. I don't think Sony no longer having (relevant) control means we should accept essentially anything Marvel does with the character.

Unlike you, I'm simply trying to look at the glass half full. There are a multitude of ways in which they could potentially drop the ball, but I don't see the point in freaking out at every decision and getting worked up over what could go wrong for no reason.

You're missing the point. No one's saying we know for sure what they'll do with Spidey. The point is I don't like the fact Marvel gave me more reasons to be cautious than I had prior to seeing the film. That's not something they ever did before, and I don't like the idea of them doing that to their fans (I know they didn't literally sit in a boardroom and say "Muahaha, let's make them worry!", but I hope you get what I meant).

 

[harryoscop]

At the beginning, RDJ and Whedon approached the Avengers as being a Stark-centric story where the audience was basically going along for the ride through his eyes, but halfway through writing it they both realized it didn't work that way so they switched it up.

Yeah, I remember him saying that in an interview.
He said that Whedon had the idea for A1, the movie to open with IM and be the source for the connection of the heroes coming together. Or somehing like that. Can't remember. Really old interview.

Oh, lol. That would've been interesting. Basically IM3-esque story.

@Joe fair enough about the numbers. But if Peter can't defeat the fricking Vulture, what the hell is he gonna do when ****ing Ock, Venom or Goblin comes knockin'

 

[ImSGirl95]

@Joe fair enough about the numbers. But if Peter can't defeat the fricking Vulture, what the hell is he gonna do when ****ing Ock, Venom or Goblin comes knockin'

He will grow up.

 

[SuperAl]

Right, because that's a deal Sony would offer. "Here's Spider-Man for all your team up MCU movies, but don't worry, we're not going to use any of your characters for our solo movie."

Who says that he's going to defeat Spider-Man's villain? The guy has JUST been cast in the movie and already it's an Iron Man movie now? Cause that's what you're implying if he's going to defeat the villain with or for Spidey. We don't know the context of his appearances in or out of suit. Maybe it's something Peter can't handle so he calls in for assistance? Oh wait, that would be terrible considering it brings down Peter Parker's ability to be a "lone wolf".

Let me stop you RIGHT there where you start spitting out nonsense about not needing Iron Man to sell tickets.

MCU box office average with RDJ: 1.07B
MCU box office average without RDJ: 533M

The numbers are a bit skewed because of the Avengers movies, but they are what they are. Oh and by the way that number is going to climb after Civil War makes over 1.07B, just saying.

It's pretty naive to say that Spider-Man is good on his own because of 10 minutes in Civil War. It takes more than just that for him to have a successful box office draw (assuming the movie is good). I'd say without RDJ the movie would do Winter Soldier/GOTG numbers, slightly higher. In the 800M range, maybe SM3 numbers with good WOM and a decent RT score. With RDJ this becomes a billion dollar movie, period. That's why he's in it, and I can't wait!

RDJ doesnt guarantee your movie makes money. The Judge was a box office failure.

I think its dangerous for the MCU/Sony to start thinking they need to shoehorn RDJ into every marvel film in order for it to be successful.

 

[harryoscop]

He will grow up.

Vulture is probably gonna be slightly buffed but Peter should still be able to defeat him. He's gonna be used for the reason that he's not as powerful as Spidey's other villains (therefore allowing them to progressivly up the ante) and he lends himself well to a smaller-scale story that this is movie suppose to be. But if he can't defeat a smaller-scale villain, he'll never gain the experience necessary to take on personal/highly dangerous villain like Goblin/Ock/Venom. He can't just 'grow up', he has to have some experience points under his belt.

 

[JOE]

@Joe fair enough about the numbers. But if Peter can't defeat the fricking Vulture, what the hell is he gonna do when ****ing Ock, Venom or Goblin comes knockin'

Again, we don't know the context of his role. You guys are stressing over NOTHING.

How do we know that Tony won't try to mould him and Peter decides he wants to take his own path. Maybe he wants to give Peter money to help his Aunt May pay the rent? Remember what he said about football? I didn't play before, so I shouldn't play now. He wouldn't have got the money from Stark if he wasn't Spider-Man, so why should he now? Maybe that's the catalyst to him being a man and getting a part time job? Similar to Spider-Man 1 he might see ads in the paper about wanting pics of Spider-Man. Voila.

It's really that simple guys, Peter can still be independent. He can still be different from the rest, just give it a chance to develop.

 

[ImSGirl95]

RDJ doesnt guarantee your movie makes money. The Judge was a box office failure.

RDj the random guy doesn't ... But RDj "The Iron Man" sure does.

 

[harryoscop]

Again, we don't know the context of his role. You guys are stressing over NOTHING.

How do we know that Tony won't try to mould him and Peter decides he wants to take his own path. Maybe he wants to give Peter money to help his Aunt May pay the rent? Remember what he said about football? I didn't play before, so I shouldn't play now. He wouldn't have got the money from Stark if he wasn't Spider-Man, so why should he now? Maybe that's the catalyst to him being a man and getting a part time job? Similar to Spider-Man 1 he might see ads in the paper about wanting pics of Spider-Man. Voila.

It's really that simple guys, Peter can still be independent. He can still be different from the rest, just give it a chance to develop.

Good point. Tom did say that Homecoming would be about 'Peter finding his place in the world' so yeah, kinda makes sense.

 

[Flint Marko]

In my opinion, it's not a nitpick when one of the core aspects of Spidey was that he never had a mentor. It was kinda the big thing that separated him from the X-Men and the DC sidekicks back then. We don't think of it that way now, especially now that we have similar popular archetypes like Static and Danny Phantom, but back then he really was the only one. He was to teen superheroes exactly what Superman was to superheroes.

It also ties in with Peter's loneliness IMO. That's another trait I found to be very relatable as a kid. I don't think Sony no longer having (relevant) control means we should accept essentially anything Marvel does with the character.

I believe you can still get across how lonely and isolated Peter is with Tony wanting to take him in under his wing. You can play up that character trait within this dynamic if need be. It's just one relationship that I don't think undermines who the character is and what he's about, if handled properly. I honestly don't think that a "core aspect" of Spidey is that he doesn't have a mentor. It's not like he's going to be a sidekick, or relegated to Stark's "kid buddy".
I'm not saying we should blindly accept anything Marvel does, but nearly everything they've cranked out so far has been good to great. Whatever trepidations I may have, I'm more than willing to give them the benefit of the doubt. Everything we've seen so far seems like a smart way to get him introduced into this universe, and again, we are just now seeing the character at the beginning. Ostensibly this will be the start of a long, storied career where we will grow with Peter and all the necessary character beats will be hit along the way.

You're missing the point. No one's saying we know for sure what they'll do with Spidey. The point is I don't like the fact Marvel gave me more reasons to be cautious than I had prior to seeing the film. That's not something they ever did before, and I don't like the idea of them doing that to their fans (I know they didn't literally sit in a boardroom and say "Muahaha, let's make them worry!", but I hope you get what I meant).

That specific post you were responding to was directed at Harry:

Ugh, they might try to do some bullcrap where Spidey can't even defeat his own villain without Stark's help or a scenario where Peter is about to be killed and surprise, surprise you know who shows up to save the day. Hard not to be pessimistic given MCU history with their Golden boy.

Here's to hoping none that happens. Getting increasingly cautious about this movie every time I think about it.

Don't you think this is a little much?

 

[Iron_Stark]

A1 - He's the one closes out the final battle by directing the nuke into the portal destroying the Chitari
A2 - Wins the Hulkbuster fight (which he never wins in the comics) by somehow fricking sucker punching the Hulk and knocking him out
- Civil War.. Well, you got me on that one. Obviously nerfed because Cap/Bucky wouldn't have stood a chance against him.

"He could've had the most screen time, coud've been the leader but he chose not to"? Wat? This is the first i'm hearing about this.

This sounds great.

A1 who else was going to fly it up there? Thor didn't have an ear piece and Cap doesn't have wings. It was a combined effort that saved the day. It's not like he beat up Loki, got the scepter and shut down the portal and sent the nuke up the portal. They ALL had a part in saving the day. He's not Alice from the Resident Evil movies that has stolen the scenes from Chris, Jill, Leon and Claire. Now there's a real scene stealer and not in a good way.

Part 2, That was barely a win. And that's hardly scene stealing. So he fought the Hulk, ok so what? It's not like that was the final battle.

Like the first one, it was a combined effort to save the day.

And btw, Iron Man with the Hulkbuster and Hulk have only fought twice in the comics, once with the original Modular armor (Vol 1, 305) it was a stand still with the Hulk actually being the one that wanted to talk it out. The second one, during WWH, yeah he won but it was against King Hulk. Nobody was going to beat him in that run.

Iron Man has beaten him before, without the Hulkbuster, using his brains.

He and Joss Whedon were going to make him the unofficial leader, and they both agreed it wasn't going to work.

 

[NotSoLongAgo]

It's lit fam

 

[craigaat]

I'm so sick of RDJ as Iron Man now. Can't wait until he gets killed off.