Civil War Sharon carter A.K.A. Agent 13 - Part 3

[Spiderine]

It doesn't appear she will ever get a much bigger role. Cap has had his trilogy and they have barely scratch the surface with this relationship. IW is almost upon us and Im not sure Cap will get anymore solo films. Even if Cap appears in another film before IW like BP he won't be as prominent.

 

[Voltron]

No Emily Blunt for BW for me, she looks too old and even though a good actress at times she lacks charisma for the part of playing a seductive spy.

EB seems to show plenty of charisma and seduction in this ad vid.

[YT]vok4F7DFbAE[/YT]

 

[Voltron]

I'm not saying Blunt should have been BW (although if she was, my guess is she would have at least ATTEMPTED to do a Russian accent, unlike ScarJo, though there's no way of knowing for sure). But fans acting like she sucks and shouldn't ever bee cast in one of these movies are ridiculous. Just because you think ScarJo is hotter than her doesn't mean Blunt is bad or uncharismatic or whatever. She was the best part of the critically acclaimed Edge of Tomorrow; so much so that people said the movie might have actually been even better had it centered completely around her character rather than Tom Cruise's character. So she's played a memorable and believable action hero, she's done drama, she's done comedy. I'm sure she could also tackle a Marvel character as well. Let's be honest here, they're not THAT deep and complex.

Also, I like ScarJo, but her default action hero mode seems to be "speaking in monotone and glare." Have any of you seen LUCY? She was awful in that movie. She seemed like she was just playing Widow without any personality.

I agree 10000000000% especially the sentence in bold.

If I had my way I'd have Emily Blunt as Black Widow, Charlize Theron as Captain Marvel, and maybe Rebecca Ferguson as Sharon Carter. All kickass women with commanding presence, acting chops, and believable athletic physicality.

 

[BullMcGiveny]

so why, just for the sake of speculation do you guys think her role was reduced.

Russos care far, far, far more about the Avengers than they do about Cap and his supporting cast.

 

[Voltron]

so why, just for the sake of speculation do you guys think her role was reduced.

Because the Russos said that they love Scarjo and Black Widow. So they pushed for her to be co-lead in TWS by interchanging BW in Sharon's role resulting in Sharon being reduced to a minor character. They probably thought, hey, Sharon and BW are both spies let's put BW in Sharon's role. Now I want to know if this script change was done before or after EVC was cast. I now suspect that it was done before the role of Sharon was cast because Sharon was the last character cast I think which explains why they cast EVC because they didn't want to spend big money on a proven actress for a minor role, on top of that they didn't give EVC a chance to shine in the role.

So thanks Russos for screwing over Sharon .

 

[DanielFM]

Russos care far, far, far more about the Avengers than they do about Cap and his supporting cast.

Cap's supporting cast:
Falcon: They made him awesome, nailed him. A minor character turned into a charismatic supporting character loved by the fans.
Bucky: The same for him.
Sharon:...

The Russos indeed cared for 2/3 of traditional/comic book Cap's crew. Not to mention they completely understood Steve's character and made him shine compared to Whedon's Cap.

The only character they seem to not care about is Sharon. Tough luck for her fans.

 

[Abudefduf]

Yeah, I'm not one for dumb conspiracies against fictional characters but it seems pretty obvious that the Russos (and maybe MS as whole) don't really know what to do with Sharon. They added her because she's an important part of the Cap's lore, and to prove that he's not just Peggy-sexual I guess.

It also doesn't help that the actress seems kind of weak, especially compared to Johansson (who's also a far bigger name than her), so of course they'd prefer to focus on the latter.

EB seems to show plenty of charisma and seduction in this ad vid.

[YT]vok4F7DFbAE[/YT]

Sexy Blunt, now that makes me uncomfortable. It's like... watching your aunt or big sis trying to be sexy, I don't know. I think it's sort of funny, and disturbing.
She's shown way more charisma in other roles that didn't simply require walking around and petting leopards, anyway.

 

[FN-2187]

Yeah, I'm not one for dumb conspiracies against fictional characters but it seems pretty obvious that the Russos (and maybe MS as whole) don't really know what to do with Sharon. They added her because she's an important part of the Cap's lore, and to prove that he's not just Peggy-sexual I guess.

No, just Carter-sexual.

It also doesn't help that the actress seems kind of weak, especially compared to Johansson (who's also a far bigger name than her), so of course they'd prefer to focus on the latter.

Bingo. ScarJo is one of the MCU's biggest names, commanding $20 million dollars a picture. So obviously, if they have the chance to make her "the girl" of one of their movies, they're going to use her.

And yeah, Sharon's window of opportunity has definitely passed. The Russos have already announced that the three most important interpersonal relationships they're developing in Infinity War are (1) Scarlet Witch and Vision, (2) Steve and Tony, and (3) Steve and Bucky.

 

[BullMcGiveny]

Cap's supporting cast:
Falcon: They made him awesome, nailed him. A minor character turned into a charismatic supporting character loved by the fans.
Bucky: The same for him.
Sharon:...

The Russos indeed cared for 2/3 of traditional/comic book Cap's crew. Not to mention they completely understood Steve's character and made him shine compared to Whedon's Cap.

The only character they seem to not care about is Sharon. Tough luck for her fans.

Crossbones: Killed off after one outing.
Bucky: He got less lines than even Sharon in TWS. And for all he's said to be important to CW, he's really there so BP, IM and CA can fight about him. And gets shelved just because.
Sam: Never gets a storyline. He just does what Cap does. Thank god for Mackie's charisma.

Natasha: Not a member of Cap's supporting cast, still gets huge storylines, and was the co-lead of TWS.
Tony: Not a member of Cap's supporting cast but he's the co-lead.
Black Panther: Not a member of Cap's supporting cast, for some reason we get his origin story here.

 

[BullMcGiveny]

It also doesn't help that the actress seems kind of weak, especially compared to Johansson (who's also a far bigger name than her), so of course they'd prefer to focus on the latter.

People keep blaming EVC for not being high profile or talented enough and honestly. Those are the people who shouldn't call anything dumb, ever.

No one held a gun to their head and told them to pick her.

 

[Abudefduf]

Not even Dumbo? Come on, that's his name.

And I don't blame VanCamp for anything, it's not her fault. I think most of the blame should definitely be placed, as I already said, on the Russos and MS for their lack of foresight and/or for letting their preferences interfere with the story.
I undertand why they'd want to focus more on Johan$$on but still, had they planned this properly from the start, the lead female role of the Captain America movies would've been Agent 13, maybe played by a stronger actress, and not Widow, as much as I enjoy hers and Steve's friendship.

This is all my opinion of course.

No, just Carter-sexual.

You know, when you put it that way it does actually sound kind of creepy.

And yeah, Sharon's window of opportunity has definitely passed. The Russos have already announced that the three most important interpersonal relationships they're developing in Infinity War are (1) Scarlet Witch and Vision, (2) Steve and Tony, and (3) Steve and Bucky.

Oh they said that? Hardly surprising but yeah, it doesn't bode well for Sharon's future. I honestly don't really care for the Agent 13 character but I can understand the frustation of her fans.

 

[MadVillainy]

Because the Russos said that they love Scarjo and Black Widow. So they pushed for her to be co-lead in TWS by interchanging BW in Sharon's role resulting in Sharon being reduced to a minor character. They probably thought, hey, Sharon and BW are both spies let's put BW in Sharon's role. Now I want to know if this script change was done before or after EVC was cast. I now suspect that it was done before the role of Sharon was cast because Sharon was the last character cast I think which explains why they cast EVC because they didn't want to spend big money on a proven actress for a minor role, on top of that they didn't give EVC a chance to shine in the role.

So thanks Russos for screwing over Sharon .

Before.
Look at the names they were looking at for Sharon at first: Anna Kendrick, Felicity Jones, Imogen Poots, Teresa Palmer, Alison Brie, Emilia Clarke, Mary Elizabeth Winstead, Elizabeth Olsen and Jessica Brown Findlay
I doubt many of them, especially the bolded would talk a role as small as Sharon had in TWS, nor would Marvel even consider spending the money on casting them for such a small role.
So they cast an actress who was the lead in an ABC, owned by Disney, show

Oh they said that? Hardly surprising but yeah, it doesn't bode well for Sharon's future. I honestly don't really care for the Agent 13 character but I can understand the frustation of her fans.

You know I'm not even a big fan of Sharon. I just Cap to get a love interest because it makes me said he's had like 3 kisses in 100 years lol.

But I wouldve been ok if they didn't include Sharon, but they half assed it. So bad.

Also can I say: I know it's comic accurate but Scarlet Witch/Vision is way creepier to me than Cap/Sharon. Come to think of it though they didnt really handle the SW/Vision relationship that well either

 

[FN-2187]

Oh they said that? Hardly surprising but yeah, it doesn't bode well for Sharon's future. I honestly don't really care for the Agent 13 character but I can understand the frustation of her fans.

Also can I say: I know it's comic accurate but Scarlet Witch/Vision is way creepier to me than Cap/Sharon. Come to think of it though they didnt really handle the SW/Vision relationship that well either

This is what they had to say when asked about relationships to be explored in Infinity War:

Joe Russo: Certainly Scarlet Witch and Vision. It’s a very compelling story. Obviously, it’s one ripped from the comics that, for many years, there was some very interesting storytelling and characters. One character is searching for how to identify with humanity, another who is on a journey away from her humanity towards becoming a very powerful being.


Anthony Russo: I would also say Captain America and Iron Man is central. Can those guys ever repair their relationship? What is their relationship ever going to be like moving forward from this?


Joe Russo: Should they repair it?


Anthony Russo: That’s as complicated as anything. The other relationship that’s still exciting to us is, again, Cap and Bucky. The wonderful thing about this movie, which started in Winter Soldier, is that Cap had a belief in him, that there’s still a human being inside the Winter Soldier that he can save and that he can reach, and he’s gone to incredible lengths now, with incredible faith, that that’s waiting for him if he goes there. He’s found that human being inside Bucky Barnes, but who is that guy going forward? Just because he’s found and he’s there, he’s still this crazy, bastard hybrid of who he used to be in The First Avenger and this killing machine.


Joe Russo: If he’s not Bucky Barnes or The Winter Soldier, then who he is?


Anthony Russo: He’s somebody new now. What kind of relationship will him and Cap have moving forward?


​

And Steve is probably not going to make it out of Phase 3 alive, so yeah, I'd say Sharon's chance at the spotlight has passed.

 

[Rote]

Crossbones: Killed off after one outing.
Bucky: He got less lines than even Sharon in TWS. And for all he's said to be important to CW, he's really there so BP, IM and CA can fight about him. And gets shelved just because.
Sam: Never gets a storyline. He just does what Cap does. Thank god for Mackie's charisma.

It's the same situation as with all the other supporting characters. One could argue, that even Pepper is there just to be Tony's love interest. So is Jane. War Machine never gets any storyline. Marvel villains get killed within one movie, at least Rumlow was in 2 movies, had a decent role in TWS. The difference is in the details. The Russos obviously care about Falcon and obviously love Bucky's character more than many avengers.

And as for the Bucky's lines in TWS, his role was a mindless, DEAD-EYED killing machine, why even give him much to talk? Russos said they were very impressed that Stan could convey so much with so little amount of words thats why they gave him such important role in CW.

Oh they said that? Hardly surprising but yeah, it doesn't bode well for Sharon's future. I honestly don't really care for the Agent 13 character but I can understand the frustation of her fans.

Well, I wouldn't be surprised if after #GiveCaptainAmericaABoyfriend they will feel the need to push "NO HOMO" flag even more in IW, because, apparently, even that kiss was very far from enough.

I just Cap to get a love interest because it makes me said he's had like 3 kisses in 100 years lol.

Well, it's totally on Cap and only on him. He had TWO YEARS to call Sharon and even more years to find himself a girlfriend, but he did nothing. And all these "he's just shy" excuses now sound ridiculous. Evans said that at the time of CW's events Cap is no longer a virgin, so not having a long-term girlfriend is only his choice.

As for Sharon, she has served her function to screw up Cap's character and show that he's unable to move on from Peggy. Evans confirmed that Cap is interested in Sharon because of Peggy. So he's projecting and it's very sad that even in the end of his trilogy Steve still can't let Peggy go. It would be much better to just leave his romantic life for the viewer's imagination and off-screen. Or get him with Wanda. But it got all screwed up because of comic-book fans and their desire to make it "just like in the comics".

 

[MarvelMayhem]

This is what they had to say when asked about relationships to be explored in Infinity War:

Joe Russo: Certainly Scarlet Witch and Vision. It’s a very compelling story. Obviously, it’s one ripped from the comics that, for many years, there was some very interesting storytelling and characters. One character is searching for how to identify with humanity, another who is on a journey away from her humanity towards becoming a very powerful being.


Anthony Russo: I would also say Captain America and Iron Man is central. Can those guys ever repair their relationship? What is their relationship ever going to be like moving forward from this?


Joe Russo: Should they repair it?


Anthony Russo: That’s as complicated as anything. The other relationship that’s still exciting to us is, again, Cap and Bucky. The wonderful thing about this movie, which started in Winter Soldier, is that Cap had a belief in him, that there’s still a human being inside the Winter Soldier that he can save and that he can reach, and he’s gone to incredible lengths now, with incredible faith, that that’s waiting for him if he goes there. He’s found that human being inside Bucky Barnes, but who is that guy going forward? Just because he’s found and he’s there, he’s still this crazy, bastard hybrid of who he used to be in The First Avenger and this killing machine.


Joe Russo: If he’s not Bucky Barnes or The Winter Soldier, then who he is?


Anthony Russo: He’s somebody new now. What kind of relationship will him and Cap have moving forward?


​

And Steve is probably not going to make it out of Phase 3 alive, so yeah, I'd say Sharon's chance at the spotlight has passed.

It is so bizarre. If they wanted Sharon to really be important to Cap why not just have them dating off screen for the past 2 years. It seems pretty irrelevant, I am thinking we get a phone call from Agent 13 in IW and thats it.
If Marvel Studios was serious about furthering Agent 13 on screen I think they would have shelled out more money for an actress with more notoriety, thats my opinion.
It does sound like Bucky is getting out of cryo for sure. Its hard to become more invested in a relationship when 1 party is frozen.

 

[Rowsdower!]

I agree 10000000000% especially the sentence in bold.

If I had my way I'd have Emily Blunt as Black Widow, Charlize Theron as Captain Marvel, and maybe Rebecca Ferguson as Sharon Carter. All kickass women with commanding presence, acting chops, and believable athletic physicality.

Yeah, those casting choices could work. Though I do think EVC could be great as Sharon if... They'd just let her DO something. As I said before, I have no idea why they even needed Maria Hill in TWS; if they gave her scenes to Sharon, then we could have seen the relationship between her and Steve begin to blossom.

Anyway though, back to Lucy for a second... I laughed so hard at some of Scarlet's dialogue in that movie once she gets her powers and starts spouting all that technical jargon. It was like she was saying to herself, "just say your lines really fast and emotionless and people won't realize you have no idea what you're talking about!"

 

[JB33]

Yeah, those casting choices could work. Though I do think EVC could be great as Sharon if... They'd just let her DO something. As I said before, I have no idea why they even needed Maria Hill in TWS; if they gave her scenes to Sharon, then we could have seen the relationship between her and Steve begin to blossom.

Anyway though, back to Lucy for a second... I laughed so hard at some of Scarlet's dialogue in that movie once she gets her powers and starts spouting all that technical jargon. It was like she was saying to herself, "just say your lines really fast and emotionless and people won't realize you have no idea what you're talking about!"

The ending of that movie was lame. I didn't get it at all. I have to watch it again though.

 

[MadVillainy]

Well, it's totally on Cap and only on him. He had TWO YEARS to call Sharon and even more years to find himself a girlfriend, but he did nothing. And all these "he's just shy" excuses now sound ridiculous. Evans said that at the time of CW's events Cap is no longer a virgin, so not having a long-term girlfriend is only his choice.

As for Sharon, she has served her function to screw up Cap's character and show that he's unable to move on from Peggy. Evans confirmed that Cap is interested in Sharon because of Peggy. So he's projecting and it's very sad that even in the end of his trilogy Steve still can't let Peggy go. It would be much better to just leave his romantic life for the viewer's imagination and off-screen. Or get him with Wanda. But it got all screwed up because of comic-book fans and their desire to make it "just like in the comics".

My point about Cap's lack of action was more of a joke. I don't take it seriously at all.

I also think Cap/Wanda would be creepy too because, while the actors arent that far off in age, they're relationship seems very big bro-little sister like. Especially with Cap saying things like: "She's just a kid". The Wanda character is probably barely American drinking age.

 

[MadVillainy]

This is what they had to say when asked about relationships to be explored in Infinity War:

Joe Russo: Certainly Scarlet Witch and Vision. It’s a very compelling story. Obviously, it’s one ripped from the comics that, for many years, there was some very interesting storytelling and characters. One character is searching for how to identify with humanity, another who is on a journey away from her humanity towards becoming a very powerful being.


Anthony Russo: I would also say Captain America and Iron Man is central. Can those guys ever repair their relationship? What is their relationship ever going to be like moving forward from this?


Joe Russo: Should they repair it?


Anthony Russo: That’s as complicated as anything. The other relationship that’s still exciting to us is, again, Cap and Bucky. The wonderful thing about this movie, which started in Winter Soldier, is that Cap had a belief in him, that there’s still a human being inside the Winter Soldier that he can save and that he can reach, and he’s gone to incredible lengths now, with incredible faith, that that’s waiting for him if he goes there. He’s found that human being inside Bucky Barnes, but who is that guy going forward? Just because he’s found and he’s there, he’s still this crazy, bastard hybrid of who he used to be in The First Avenger and this killing machine.


Joe Russo: If he’s not Bucky Barnes or The Winter Soldier, then who he is?


Anthony Russo: He’s somebody new now. What kind of relationship will him and Cap have moving forward?


​

And Steve is probably not going to make it out of Phase 3 alive, so yeah, I'd say Sharon's chance at the spotlight has passed.

I doubt Steve will be dead, or at least dead for long after phase 3. I don't see why people keep thinking this.

 

[Rowsdower!]

Because he died in the comics and never came back!

 

[ScarlettW]

It is so bizarre. If they wanted Sharon to really be important to Cap why not just have them dating off screen for the past 2 years. It seems pretty irrelevant, I am thinking we get a phone call from Agent 13 in IW and thats it.
If Marvel Studios was serious about furthering Agent 13 on screen I think they would have shelled out more money for an actress with more notoriety, thats my opinion.
It does sound like Bucky is getting out of cryo for sure. Its hard to become more invested in a relationship when 1 party is frozen.

Because Joss Whedon decided to show Steve still thinking in Peggy in AOU.

You know, I think there is a possibility that it will happen in Avengers 3, it may be that Sharon joined Steve and the Secret Avengers. That would be two years of them together in an established relationship without wasting time developing their relationship.

 

[FN-2187]

It is so bizarre. If they wanted Sharon to really be important to Cap why not just have them dating off screen for the past 2 years. It seems pretty irrelevant, I am thinking we get a phone call from Agent 13 in IW and thats it.
If Marvel Studios was serious about furthering Agent 13 on screen I think they would have shelled out more money for an actress with more notoriety, thats my opinion.
It does sound like Bucky is getting out of cryo for sure. Its hard to become more invested in a relationship when 1 party is frozen.

I don't think they were ever any more serious about Sharon's character than they were about Pepper's or Jane's.

I bet Bucky's going to be unfrozen during the Black Panther movie. Whether they will have solved his winter soldier problem by then is another question.

I doubt Steve will be dead, or at least dead for long after phase 3. I don't see why people keep thinking this.

Because Chris Evans' contract will be up after Infinity War. He's already talked about retiring from acting and embarking on a career as a director. Even if he changes his mind and decides he wants to re-up with Marvel, the studio may decide it will be cheaper to let him go and pass the shield on to another actor who still has several movies left in his contract (Stan).

 

[Voltron]

Before.
Look at the names they were looking at for Sharon at first: Anna Kendrick, Felicity Jones, Imogen Poots, Teresa Palmer, Alison Brie, Emilia Clarke, Mary Elizabeth Winstead, Elizabeth Olsen and Jessica Brown Findlay
I doubt many of them, especially the bolded would talk a role as small as Sharon had in TWS, nor would Marvel even consider spending the money on casting them for such a small role.
So they cast an actress who was the lead in an ABC, owned by Disney, show

Exactly, before. Sharon was going to be the co-lead in TWS as indicated by M/M in TFA interviews which is why they started auditioning proven actresses (also no way to Anna Kendrick she's not Sharon material). But then as stated by the Russos themselves they pushed for the changes that sidelined Sharon into a minor character a la Maria Hill in the MCU. As mentioned by a few people here, Sharon/Steve would've won many people over if she was the co-lead working with Cap in TWS and if they already started dating towards the end of the movie like in the comics before the Peggy revelation/twist in CW. But Russos/Marvel don't care about one of Cap's most important relationships since 1966. And this is Sharon's 50th year anniversary.

It is so bizarre. If they wanted Sharon to really be important to Cap why not just have them dating off screen for the past 2 years. It seems pretty irrelevant, I am thinking we get a phone call from Agent 13 in IW and thats it.
If Marvel Studios was serious about furthering Agent 13 on screen I think they would have shelled out more money for an actress with more notoriety, thats my opinion.
It does sound like Bucky is getting out of cryo for sure. Its hard to become more invested in a relationship when 1 party is frozen.

I would've preferred if they indicated that they were friends hanging out in the last 2 years which would explain why Sam knew Sharon at the funeral. Yeah I already pointed it out earlier that if Sharon was going to be co-lead in TWS then they would've cast a proven actress like Elizabeth Winstead. After seeing Lily James and Bella Heathcote kickass in P&P&Z it would've been great if one of them was cast as Sharon. But Marvel never gave Sharon a chance. Correction, they shafted Sharon for BW and to add insult to injury they gave what resembled Sharon's role, dialogue, and dynamics with Cap in the comics to her.

 

[Voltron]

Yeah, those casting choices could work. Though I do think EVC could be great as Sharon if... They'd just let her DO something. As I said before, I have no idea why they even needed Maria Hill in TWS; if they gave her scenes to Sharon, then we could have seen the relationship between her and Steve begin to blossom.

Anyway though, back to Lucy for a second... I laughed so hard at some of Scarlet's dialogue in that movie once she gets her powers and starts spouting all that technical jargon. It was like she was saying to herself, "just say your lines really fast and emotionless and people won't realize you have no idea what you're talking about!"

Like what another poster said earlier, that aunt Peggy bought me my first gun holster was just bad writing. The problem with EVC is that her performance can be on the inconsistent side. But like I said I thought the eulogy and elevator scene was good. Her whisper-talking and this tight-lip-jaw thing she does at times bugs me. You'd think that her acting would've improved and gained range like Chris Pratt's has since Everwood. I agree they should've just given her Hill's parts in TWS because Sharon/Fury in the comics were close anyway.

I could only watch half of Lucy before I finally gave up. Watch Under the Skin or don't, which is Scarjo playing emotionless Black Widow talking with a British accent.

Because Joss Whedon decided to show Steve still thinking in Peggy in AOU.

You know, I think there is a possibility that it will happen in Avengers 3, it may be that Sharon joined Steve and the Secret Avengers. That would be two years of them together in an established relationship without wasting time developing their relationship.

Thanks a lot Joss . Instead of a Peggy nightmare it should've been a Bucky nightmare Steve has in AoU.

 

[ScarlettW]

Peggy wasn't in the scene in the original script. Hayley Atwell read the script and asked Joss to be in the nightmare scene. He changed the scene because of her.