Comics So JMS and Joey Q know they screwed up...

[Hoban]

Exactly.

You know what gets me the most? How fickle some fanman/fanwomen can be. Jenkins had a groundbreaking run, which paved the way for JMS. Until he got really sick, worked from bed/hospital, and his writing quality decreased.

Fans 4got how he started, and started insulting him from right and left, and hailed JMS a god, while he started his 'totem' stuff. People proudly stated, it's just a new direction, that doesn't change Spidey, and Jenkins should go to hell. Naturally, he now had to leave.

Now look at the mess Spidey's in. NO ONE can disagree with the fact that if Marvel stuck to Jenkins ideas, and direction, that Spidey comics right now would be MUCH more like great Spider-Man stories. Not saying that he should've been writing ASM, but whoever was tackling ASM, should've been told to take a note from him

Human, passionate, moralistic, heart wrenching, comedic, action packed super hero comics. That's what Spidey comics should be

This post brought a smile to my face. Jenkins is my all time favorite writer. Back when I started reading comics(back in 2001) I was picking up strictly Spider-Man comics at my local grocery store. I rememberfinnishing reading A PP:SM comic and loving it(it was Jenkins' Fusion arc) and for the first time, I checked to see who wrote it, (because prior to that point I was just picking up anything that said Spider-Man on the cover) I remember seeing Jenkins' name. From that point on, no matter what comic I read, Jenkins has been my favorite writer.

I had no idea that he got sick, though. Or that fan reaction was the reason he left the title. That's kinda dissapointing.


I've got an off topic question, whatever happened to Jenkins' comic he was doing with Humberto Ramos about the Vatican? Did I miss it? What was it called?

 

[Upset Spideyfan]

I miss Fusion.... Am I the only one?

 

[Gregatron]

I miss Fusion.... Am I the only one?

Fusion is a step-up from F-listers like Morlun. At least Fusion is a science-based villain...

 

[Hoban]

I miss Fusion.... Am I the only one?

I do as well. But there's really nohing that can be done with spider-man, because he knows that all those things he can do aren't real, and what isn't real can't hurt him.(at least that's what I gathered from the ending of the arc, but I haven't read it in a while.)


...that, and I've heard him reffered to as a second rate Mysterio.

 

[Captivated]

I read that interview in Wizard yesterday. It made me laugh a bit.

1)Joe Q seems to be infatuated with attracting a mythical 9yr. old reading audience that doesn't exist.

2)Joe and JMS both complain about the lack of a supporting cast, but JMS hasn't tried to use them in his nearly 5 yr run on the book. The only two people who play a prominent role in the book are MJ and May. From what I've read, JMS gets a lot of creative control. Why didn't he use Betty, Jonah, Liz, Robbie, Randy, etc. Why didn't he try to create someone new for him to interact with? He had no problem adding OTHER NEW CONCEPTS (pun intended). Peter's works at a school. We don't know ANY of his co-workers.

3) They want the book to be like the Stan Lee era. Who ultimately signed off on the mystical totem crap, Sins Past, and the other? Their intials are JQ and JMS! Those stories took Peter much farther away from his core concept than his marriage to MJ...

...This recent interview basically says, "we know the books aren't good right now. We made some bad decisions. If we can get rid of MJ we'll make it right".

I can't help but be very cynical.

Eye Doc

Boy, I wish I had time to make all the comments I want to on this subject (pesky job)...

I agree. The pre-teens I know are more interested in computer games than comics... and I wouldn't even let them read stories like Sins Past and the Other anyway. The only CONSISTANTLY enjoyable element of JMS' run has been the way he writes Aunt May and MJ. I love the marriage.

If they screw up that up by 1) making MJ suddenly act like a stupid jerk (like they did with Peter pre Clone Saga) or 2) try to create a "love triangle" with Gwen (Peter/MJ should NOT be confused at all about their feelings at this point) or 3) insert some convoluted reason they have to part, or 4) kill MJ... I will not only stop spending my hard earn money on anything Marvel (and in two short years I've already spent hundreds), I will do everything I can to fill their lives with the ridicule and censure they deserve.

I just don't get the leap of logic they have expressed... fans are complaining about a lack of supporting cast, disrespect to continuity, too much mystic mumbo jumbo, and dumbing Peter down... and wonders of wonders, the "powers that be" have figured out that something might be "off." But how the HELL did they translate all those compaints into "the problem is the marriage"??!! Not even the people who could take or leave the marriage think it's THE PROBLEM with Spidey. Poll have REPEATEDLY shown a vast majority support it... Really make me wonder about their thought processes... I mean, where ARE their heads? Just how FAR up their... No. I'm a lady. I'll think it, but not say it.

 

[rscal]

Which is a ****ing lie! JMS has more power than most writers, I can promise you that, or he wouldn't of done what he has done nor even taken Spidey on board in the first place. HE has control, passing the buck is cowardly and pathetic. JMS WROTE it, if he didn't want to then he could have refused and he would have done. He likes to brag about how incorruptable he is, how he faces down the suits in TV world every five seconds, to say he bent over and said 'spank me big boy' all of a sudden is sheer crap. JMS needs to find his balls and stop hiding, or just piss off for good.



actually I have heard that JMS wanted the kids to be pete's to begin with. and sorry if the boss wants it changed he could always change it before it goes to print Joe Q could just write that part in. the many drawbacks of writing liscensed characters that you don't own you don't have the final say.

 

[WOLVERINE25TH]

That's very true. That's why JMS left The Real Ghostbusters.

 

[rscal]

Fusion is a step-up from F-listers like Morlun. At least Fusion is a science-based villain...

actually i didn't mind morlun the first time but his resurrection was dumb ( no explanations) to be just a vehicle for peter to evolve (something that didn't need to happen and his new powers are lame anyway) had very lil to do with the story line. Morlun just become morbius from the cartoon series the second time. silly. JMS should a stop after that 9 11 issue which was good except for that damn villian page. Like JMS dialogue just can't stand his story ideas.

 

[rscal]

That's very true. That's why JMS left The Real Ghostbusters.

Did he leave "murder she wrote" too? or was that cancelled before he quit or was let go?

 

[WOLVERINE25TH]

Dunno, didn't know he was on there.

 

[rscal]

I agree. The pre-teens I know are more interested in computer games than comics... and I wouldn't even let them read stories like Sins Past and the Other anyway. The only CONSISTANTLY enjoyable element of JMS' run has been the way he writes Aunt May and MJ. I love the marriage.

If they screw up that up by 1) making MJ suddenly act like a stupid jerk (like they did with Peter pre Clone Saga) or 2) try to create a "love triangle" with Gwen (Peter/MJ should NOT be confused at all about their feelings at this point) or 3) insert some convoluted reason they have to part, or 4) kill MJ... I will not only stop spending my hard earn money on anything Marvel (and in two short years I've already spent hundreds), I will do everything I can to fill their lives with the ridicule and censure they deserve.

I just don't get the leap of logic they have expressed... fans are complaining about a lack of supporting cast, disrespect to continuity, too much mystic mumbo jumbo, and dumbing Peter down... and wonders of wonders, the "powers that be" have figured out that something might be "off." But how the HELL did they translate all those compaints into "the problem is the marriage"??!! Not even the people who could take or leave the marriage think it's THE PROBLEM with Spidey. Poll have REPEATEDLY shown a vast majority support it... Really make me wonder about their thought processes... I mean, where ARE their heads? Just how FAR up their... No. I'm a lady. I'll think it, but not say it.[/QUOTE]


Thats because Joey Q has no idea about spider-man he prbbly only knows that character from the electric company, no MJ or supporting cast in that version of spidey.

 

[3dman27]

Thats trucking refarted!

Ok they know the screwed up....GREAT! Marvel should realize how much these two suck for the spider-man franchise and GET THEM THE HELL AWAY BEFORE THEY SCREW IT UP EVEN MORE!!!!!

amen to that

 

[deemar325]

^ Ditto like a heart attack!

 

[SpideyInATree]

And yes indeed, we did tell them. Even now people are telling us to wait and see, as if seeing a tiger running at you full pelt requires you to wait and see if it is hostile. Haven't seen SIAT in a bit, in hiding? Frankly though, I don't much care about being legitimized... I just want the 'badness' gone.

Why is my name being brought up? Because I don't share the same common opinion on these boards?

I enjoyed the Ezekiel character and the totem aspect. The Book of Ezekiel was an excellent Spidey story arc, in my opinion.

Sins Past wasn't good. Good story for what it was about but just a horrible idea. I've said this like a million times on these boards.

The Skin Deep arc was mediocre. Charlie Wiederman just reminded me of a really deeply disturbed nerdy Molten Man.

The New Avengers arc was top notch. JMS wrote a better New Avengers than Bendis did. I enjoyed this arc heavily, especially where Pete tossed Wolverine through UNBREAKABLE GLASS!!!

The Other was rather horribly put together. Hudlin's portion of The Other was tough to get through. David's and JMS' were all right. It was a pretty dull story for something that spawned so many new and interesting things to Spidey. I've gone on the record, many times, saying this on these boards as well.

I like the new costume. And I'm enjoying the Road to Civil War.

So, you told me so? Told me so about what? That Peter is going to go public with his identity in Civil War. Mary Jane is probably going to die. JMS and Quesada sound like they are going to retcon all the bad stuff, like Sins Past.

So...I mean...what are you telling me so about? I know JMS and Quesada didn't do too great of a job with Spidey the past few years. There were duds. And there were aspects that I really enjoyed. I'm sorry that I don't just blindly hate everything that those guys did like the general population here does.

 

[Marc]

No drink love for the Doc. Le sigh.

Well if we can get rid of the hacks, I think we should have a party. Drinks for everybody!

Logan - As above, beers all round.

Upset spidey - I'm with you on the retcon, I want a purposely bad issue dedicated solely to destroying everything JMS has done to spidey. With ridiculous BS reasoning comparable to JMS's; explaining it all away. With ironic comments about how it feels to have someone come along and take a piss on your work.

rscal - Except JMS has creative control, its why he isn't working for DC as they wouldn't allow him to do what he wants. Besides, Joe Q is a ******... how hard is it to make him do what JMS wants. A shiney object, a doughnut and you could get him to commit murder.

 

[b0bb33z3r]

****ING JOE Q!! WHAT A FAT ****ING BASTARD!!!! **** HIM!!! ARRGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG!!!!!!!!!!!!


I can't even begin to tell you how mad I am.

 

[b0bb33z3r]

So let me get this straight... kill Gwen, kill Mary Jane... his two love of loves dead... this is going to allow this broken man to be the swinging single again!? God forbid they let the character GROW, and not make him the 70 year old single fart with no love, no companionship, nothing in his empty life, sitting in the club still sporting his polyester threads and getting laughed at by everyone in the room.

 

[Herr Logan]

No drink love for the Doc. Le sigh.

What's yer poison, Doc? The thread-maker deserves some drink love.

 

[Doc Destruction]

Whoo! Scotch neat or Gin and juice. I'm pretty tanked right now, so I could use another!

 

[gildea]

.....gin?

 

[Flonk]

That's because they are useless, mindless cowards.

Or it could be because the abuse you guys pour on people who have different opinions makes them not want to post. What's the point of trying to have a discussion, if you are trying to make a point and instead of debating you are called a mindless follower and a looser.

 

[Flonk]

Exactly.

You know what gets me the most? How fickle some fanman/fanwomen can be. Jenkins had a groundbreaking run, which paved the way for JMS. Until he got really sick, worked from bed/hospital, and his writing quality decreased.

Fans 4got how he started, and started insulting him from right and left, and hailed JMS a god, while he started his 'totem' stuff. People proudly stated, it's just a new direction, that doesn't change Spidey, and Jenkins should go to hell. Naturally, he now had to leave.

Now look at the mess Spidey's in. NO ONE can disagree with the fact that if Marvel stuck to Jenkins ideas, and direction, that Spidey comics right now would be MUCH more like great Spider-Man stories. Not saying that he should've been writing ASM, but whoever was tackling ASM, should've been told to take a note from him

Human, passionate, moralistic, heart wrenching, comedic, action packed super hero comics. That's what Spidey comics should be

Jenkin's run on Peter Parker was fantastic.

 

[Herr Logan]

Or it could be because the abuse you guys pour on people who have different opinions makes them not want to post. What's the point of trying to have a discussion, if you are trying to make a point and instead of debating you are called a mindless follower and a looser.

As if there hasn't been even more hostily to the tune of "haters" and "whiners" and so forth directed at us critics in the last two years.

Hmm... there's a lesson in there somewhere, but the hostility... it's so damn seductive and... fun!

 

[Gregatron]

I'm tired of all this.

I'm tired of all these immature fanboys and writers talking down to the medium.

I'm tired of all the winks to the audience in today's stories that say "We all know how dumb this material is! Let's make it kewl, instead!".


Regardless of how simplistic and/or corny one sees old stories (from the Golden and Silver Ages, in particular), the stories weren't used as tool to mock the characters or the medium. The creators banged this stuff out for a living, and treated the material as what it was, without condescending or "inside jokes" or pandering to whiny fanboys.


Back in the day, fans LIKED the material and the characters. Today's "fans" and "professionals" like to read sexual innuendo into a shot of the Sandman punching Spider-Man in the back--

http://www.superherohype.com/forums/showthread.php?t=229304

--because that kind of grade-school humor represents the overall maturity level of today's fans.

I don't see mocking the characters and the material as any kind of love or respect. Just what kind of "fan" relentlessly mocks that which they profess to "like"?


Why is it that back when comics were aimed at younger people (and written as all-ages friendly), the material had so much more dignity and class?

UGH.

 

[Flonk]

Back in the day, fans LIKED the material and the characters. Today's "fans" and "professionals" like to read sexual innuendo into a shot of the Sandman punching Spider-Man in the back--

http://www.superherohype.com/forums/showthread.php?t=229304

--because that kind of grade-school humor represents the overall maturity level of today's fans.

Wow. You really need to lighten up.